4.6 pounds is hardly a brick. Have you actually SEEN those 12-inch PBs? They're small. Extremely portable. Very light.
Sony TR1a light
Apple powerbook 12" heavy!
when trodding around with electronics and luggage every extra pound adds up. I keep my TR1a in a backpack pocket and still have plenty of room for other carry on items and an extra battery which will give me enough juce to run on a trans-atlantic flight. Now, when boeing ramps up that wifi on it's planes I am in heaven at 35,000 feet.
sub notebook good idea!
integrated with apple wifi/gsm phone (fantasy)
iglasses (also fantasy) provides large screen viewing.
iglasses (also fantasy) provides large screen viewing.
Nah, my idea of jacking the machine video out directly into your head and using a portion of your brain as secondary storage is better! Think of the savings in weight, component cost and power consumption!
The Sony TR1a has a nice shape. It has a 10.6 inch widescreen, which is I think the smallest that a screen can really get and still maintain a good resolution. I think that Apple could just refine the shape a bit while adding a slot-loading combo drive, and if it was made of carbon fiber, it would be even lighter.
My biggest concern with a sub-12 portable would have to be related to keyboard size. Place your finger on your keyboard's keys and look. They're not that big, ya know? If they shrink them you'll end up getting hand cramps and typos.
they could do an 11 inch widescreen, also on that note, Apple should make the 17inch keyboard less cramped, they have the space.
Quote:
Now, when boeing ramps up that wifi on it's planes I am in heaven at 35,000 feet.
When is this supposed to roll out? Do any current planes have this yet? Also, how can you tell/find a seat that has a power outlet?
I love this subnotebook discussion! Please keep it up!
Quote:
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
4.6 pounds is hardly a brick. Have you actually SEEN those 12-inch PBs? They're small. Extremely portable. Very light.
Quote:
Originally posted by s_sarinana
Not small enough to be considered a true sub-notebook. Normally, a sub-notebook is 3 lbs or less.
The above exchange just made me laugh. Some people just get subnotebooks. Others simply don't.
I could very well see Apple make a single spindle (HDD but no optical) 2.5 lbs sub-PowerBook. I agree that a Carbon fiber enclosure would be nice. But it would have to be curvier than Sony's X505. That thing looks like you could cut yourself on its sharp edges.
Now that I've finished law school and no longer need to take my 'Book to classes, I have to admit that the 4.6 lbs 12-inch PowerBook does an awesome job as a desktop replacement. I've set it up with an external 17" LCD and run it in clamshell mode with an Apple Wireless (BT) Keyboard and Mouse. Pure goodness!
IMO, any sub-PowerBook weighing less than 3 lbs should have a Duo-style Dock for its home desk. Even if it was just a port-replicator and charging station, such a Dock would be highly convenient. Just think of how nice it is to have a dock for your Palm or iPod! Wouldn't you want a dock for your sub-PowerBook too?
Apple had a story about iChat at 35,000 feet via high speed wireless Internet on Lufthansa. I think this might be the only airline that has it right now. You can read about it here:
IEEE 802.13 (480Mbps wireless standard) opens up some interesting possibilities here.
The problem with subnotes, from an Apple POV, is that it's not a complete, self-contained machine. You have to have at least one thing hanging off a cable, which is fiddly and inelegant.
But 802.13 is fast wireless, easily able to carry the same bandwidth as multiple IDE busses. So what does that mean?
Imagine a laptop with 2GB or 4GB RAM soldered on board (for durability, performance, less need to rely on the battery-sucking hard drive) and an iPod hard drive. How light could that be? Well under three pounds! But how do you get by with so little storage and no optical drive? You don't! You have an 802.13-savvy optical drive, and as many 802.13-savvy hard drives as you want, all of which can operate from the comfort of your carry-on bag if you'd like them to. (And, of course, there would be conventional USB 2 and FireWire and Ethernet connectors.)
With nothing but a motherboard and a tiny hard drive to accomodate, I'd bet Apple could make the machine slimmer and lighter than any of the subnotes discussed here. And with 802.13, it'd still be capable of taking advantage of external drives without the hassle of fishing things out and plugging and unplugging and having cords all over the place.
I think that's perfectly doable. Once Tiger comes out, with its vastly improved synching and .Mac integration, it might even be desirable to people who normally wouldn't accept the compromises that current subnotes make...
Nah, my idea of jacking the machine video out directly into your head and using a portion of your brain as secondary storage is better! Think of the savings in weight, component cost and power consumption!
Good idea the only problem I can see is the apple proprietary plug!
IEEE 802.13 (480Mbps wireless standard) opens up some interesting possibilities here.
The problem with subnotes, from an Apple POV, is that it's not a complete, self-contained machine. You have to have at least one thing hanging off a cable, which is fiddly and inelegant.
But 802.13 is fast wireless, easily able to carry the same bandwidth as multiple IDE busses. So what does that mean?
Imagine a laptop with 2GB or 4GB RAM soldered on board (for durability, performance, less need to rely on the battery-sucking hard drive) and an iPod hard drive. How light could that be? Well under three pounds! But how do you get by with so little storage and no optical drive? You don't! You have an 802.13-savvy optical drive, and as many 802.13-savvy hard drives as you want, all of which can operate from the comfort of your carry-on bag if you'd like them to. (And, of course, there would be conventional USB 2 and FireWire and Ethernet connectors.)
With nothing but a motherboard and a tiny hard drive to accomodate, I'd bet Apple could make the machine slimmer and lighter than any of the subnotes discussed here. And with 802.13, it'd still be capable of taking advantage of external drives without the hassle of fishing things out and plugging and unplugging and having cords all over the place.
I think that's perfectly doable. Once Tiger comes out, with its vastly improved synching and .Mac integration, it might even be desirable to people who normally wouldn't accept the compromises that current subnotes make...
one other consideration, If you wanted to watch dvd's on a plane then that is a huge battery drain. Put the movie on the harddrive (imovie) and you can stretch the battery life further. Perhaps apple is waiting for qt 7 and the new codec? Then it's subnotebook nirvana.
synch to home via wimax? or use online storage (which is reduced in price) at .mac?
I like the idea about 802.13 wireless optical drives. You can carry a swappable drive without worrying about having cables that could break or get in your way. Smart thinking. And if Apple made an all-in-one Base station/optical drive unit, you could have a portable base station with the optical drive built in.
one other consideration, If you wanted to watch dvd's on a plane then that is a huge battery drain. Put the movie on the harddrive (imovie) and you can stretch the battery life further. Perhaps apple is waiting for qt 7 and the new codec? Then it's subnotebook nirvana.
Not unless DVD makers either liberalise CSS licensing or stop using CSS (or any other form of access control mechanism) altogether, which is not going to happen. Most likely CSS will be replaced by an even stronger algorithm.
Right now for Apple top provide some feature that allows you to watch a DVD from your hard drive, it would have to limit its use to the handful of movies that are out unencrypted. Otherwise they'd be violating the DMCA simply by providing a device that circumvents an access control mechanism.
And, with Jobs at the helm of Pixar, I don't see it likely that Apple is going to be the company willing to "fight for the users" when it comes to the DMCA.
Then when and if Apple comes out with the 10 inch PowerBook people will whine that it's not small enough and they'll want a 7 inch PowerBook. "A true subnotebook has to weigh less than 2.4 pounds! It's breaking my back to carry it. Oh the pain..."
I currently have a 15inch 1.5GHz Powerbook with Superdrive.. I also have the Dell D400 with external drive. I just got rid of my 12inch 1GHz PB which I did love. I recently looked at getting the Sony or the Sharp but could not bring myself to switching back to the dark side...... I know that the 15 is big and can be awkward but I love it. Oh, and I have a true sub-sub-notebook. It's called a Sony Clie PEG-UX50 and it rocks! WiFi, Bluetooth, camera, MP3(I like my iPod Mini better) and it weighs ounces!!!
Not unless DVD makers either liberalise CSS licensing or stop using CSS (or any other form of access control mechanism) altogether, which is not going to happen. Most likely CSS will be replaced by an even stronger algorithm.
Right now for Apple top provide some feature that allows you to watch a DVD from your hard drive, it would have to limit its use to the handful of movies that are out unencrypted. Otherwise they'd be violating the DMCA simply by providing a device that circumvents an access control mechanism.
And, with Jobs at the helm of Pixar, I don't see it likely that Apple is going to be the company willing to "fight for the users" when it comes to the DMCA.
right right right, that's what they said about pirated mp3's
apple changed the paradigm.....
think different....
if you are toting a sub notebook on a plane, stuck in the throws of boredom, watching a stored movie or tv show is pleasure. It is a market waiting to blooom.
sony sells hardware to do this now....
apple should take the reigns now and grab hold of an idustry..
Then when and if Apple comes out with the 10 inch PowerBook people will whine that it's not small enough and they'll want a 7 inch PowerBook. "A true subnotebook has to weigh less than 2.4 pounds! It's breaking my back to carry it. Oh the pain..."
right right right, that's what they said about pirated mp3's
apple changed the paradigm.....
No they said nothing of the sort about MP3s. MP3s have always been neutral to the issue of copyright and did not break any non-copyright laws, there were legitimate MP3s and illegally distributed ones. There's no access control mechanism on a CD, so the DMCA doesn't apply to CDs.
The DMCA does apply to DVDs because despite the word "copyright" in the title, it applies to much more than the right to copy. DVDs have an access control mechanism - a legal device specifically envisaged by the creators of the DMCA. It doesn't matter for what reasons you bypass CSS (the ACM for DVDs), if you create a device (which can be software) to circumvent CSS that's not been authorized by the DVD-CCA, then you are breaking the law. And not just civil law either, you're performing a criminal act that can land you in prison.
The only legal open source DVD players at the moment are produced outside of the US (and therefore out of the juristication of the DMCA) for that very reason.
Sucks, doesn't it. If you want this changed, rather than expect Apple to change a paradigm (which they can't without being arrested, and which Jobs himself is unlikely to support), you're going to need to lobby your senators and congressmen.
Comments
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
4.6 pounds is hardly a brick. Have you actually SEEN those 12-inch PBs? They're small. Extremely portable. Very light.
Sony TR1a light
Apple powerbook 12" heavy!
when trodding around with electronics and luggage every extra pound adds up. I keep my TR1a in a backpack pocket and still have plenty of room for other carry on items and an extra battery which will give me enough juce to run on a trans-atlantic flight. Now, when boeing ramps up that wifi on it's planes I am in heaven at 35,000 feet.
sub notebook good idea!
integrated with apple wifi/gsm phone (fantasy)
iglasses (also fantasy) provides large screen viewing.
Originally posted by TednDi
sub notebook good idea!
integrated with apple wifi/gsm phone (fantasy)
iglasses (also fantasy) provides large screen viewing.
Nah, my idea of jacking the machine video out directly into your head and using a portion of your brain as secondary storage is better! Think of the savings in weight, component cost and power consumption!
My biggest concern with a sub-12 portable would have to be related to keyboard size. Place your finger on your keyboard's keys and look. They're not that big, ya know? If they shrink them you'll end up getting hand cramps and typos.
they could do an 11 inch widescreen, also on that note, Apple should make the 17inch keyboard less cramped, they have the space.
Now, when boeing ramps up that wifi on it's planes I am in heaven at 35,000 feet.
When is this supposed to roll out? Do any current planes have this yet? Also, how can you tell/find a seat that has a power outlet?
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
4.6 pounds is hardly a brick. Have you actually SEEN those 12-inch PBs? They're small. Extremely portable. Very light.
Originally posted by s_sarinana
Not small enough to be considered a true sub-notebook. Normally, a sub-notebook is 3 lbs or less.
The above exchange just made me laugh. Some people just get subnotebooks. Others simply don't.
I could very well see Apple make a single spindle (HDD but no optical) 2.5 lbs sub-PowerBook. I agree that a Carbon fiber enclosure would be nice. But it would have to be curvier than Sony's X505. That thing looks like you could cut yourself on its sharp edges.
Now that I've finished law school and no longer need to take my 'Book to classes, I have to admit that the 4.6 lbs 12-inch PowerBook does an awesome job as a desktop replacement. I've set it up with an external 17" LCD and run it in clamshell mode with an Apple Wireless (BT) Keyboard and Mouse. Pure goodness!
IMO, any sub-PowerBook weighing less than 3 lbs should have a Duo-style Dock for its home desk. Even if it was just a port-replicator and charging station, such a Dock would be highly convenient. Just think of how nice it is to have a dock for your Palm or iPod! Wouldn't you want a dock for your sub-PowerBook too?
Escher
http://www.apple.com/hotnews/article.../ichat_at_35k/
The problem with subnotes, from an Apple POV, is that it's not a complete, self-contained machine. You have to have at least one thing hanging off a cable, which is fiddly and inelegant.
But 802.13 is fast wireless, easily able to carry the same bandwidth as multiple IDE busses. So what does that mean?
Imagine a laptop with 2GB or 4GB RAM soldered on board (for durability, performance, less need to rely on the battery-sucking hard drive) and an iPod hard drive. How light could that be? Well under three pounds! But how do you get by with so little storage and no optical drive? You don't! You have an 802.13-savvy optical drive, and as many 802.13-savvy hard drives as you want, all of which can operate from the comfort of your carry-on bag if you'd like them to. (And, of course, there would be conventional USB 2 and FireWire and Ethernet connectors.)
With nothing but a motherboard and a tiny hard drive to accomodate, I'd bet Apple could make the machine slimmer and lighter than any of the subnotes discussed here. And with 802.13, it'd still be capable of taking advantage of external drives without the hassle of fishing things out and plugging and unplugging and having cords all over the place.
I think that's perfectly doable. Once Tiger comes out, with its vastly improved synching and .Mac integration, it might even be desirable to people who normally wouldn't accept the compromises that current subnotes make...
Originally posted by Bancho
Nah, my idea of jacking the machine video out directly into your head and using a portion of your brain as secondary storage is better! Think of the savings in weight, component cost and power consumption!
Good idea the only problem I can see is the apple proprietary plug!
Originally posted by Peter North
they could do an 11 inch widescreen, also on that note, Apple should make the 17inch keyboard less cramped, they have the space.
When is this supposed to roll out? Do any current planes have this yet? Also, how can you tell/find a seat that has a power outlet?
Boeing has already done it it is on Luftansa flights. I think $30.00 for the flight and 80211.g protocol.
Apple hyped it recently as the first ichat at 35,000 feet.
Originally posted by Amorph
IEEE 802.13 (480Mbps wireless standard) opens up some interesting possibilities here.
The problem with subnotes, from an Apple POV, is that it's not a complete, self-contained machine. You have to have at least one thing hanging off a cable, which is fiddly and inelegant.
But 802.13 is fast wireless, easily able to carry the same bandwidth as multiple IDE busses. So what does that mean?
Imagine a laptop with 2GB or 4GB RAM soldered on board (for durability, performance, less need to rely on the battery-sucking hard drive) and an iPod hard drive. How light could that be? Well under three pounds! But how do you get by with so little storage and no optical drive? You don't! You have an 802.13-savvy optical drive, and as many 802.13-savvy hard drives as you want, all of which can operate from the comfort of your carry-on bag if you'd like them to. (And, of course, there would be conventional USB 2 and FireWire and Ethernet connectors.)
With nothing but a motherboard and a tiny hard drive to accomodate, I'd bet Apple could make the machine slimmer and lighter than any of the subnotes discussed here. And with 802.13, it'd still be capable of taking advantage of external drives without the hassle of fishing things out and plugging and unplugging and having cords all over the place.
I think that's perfectly doable. Once Tiger comes out, with its vastly improved synching and .Mac integration, it might even be desirable to people who normally wouldn't accept the compromises that current subnotes make...
one other consideration, If you wanted to watch dvd's on a plane then that is a huge battery drain. Put the movie on the harddrive (imovie) and you can stretch the battery life further. Perhaps apple is waiting for qt 7 and the new codec? Then it's subnotebook nirvana.
synch to home via wimax? or use online storage (which is reduced in price) at .mac?
Originally posted by TednDi
one other consideration, If you wanted to watch dvd's on a plane then that is a huge battery drain. Put the movie on the harddrive (imovie) and you can stretch the battery life further. Perhaps apple is waiting for qt 7 and the new codec? Then it's subnotebook nirvana.
Not unless DVD makers either liberalise CSS licensing or stop using CSS (or any other form of access control mechanism) altogether, which is not going to happen. Most likely CSS will be replaced by an even stronger algorithm.
Right now for Apple top provide some feature that allows you to watch a DVD from your hard drive, it would have to limit its use to the handful of movies that are out unencrypted. Otherwise they'd be violating the DMCA simply by providing a device that circumvents an access control mechanism.
And, with Jobs at the helm of Pixar, I don't see it likely that Apple is going to be the company willing to "fight for the users" when it comes to the DMCA.
if that Sony X505 is anything to go by, bring it on.....
The Sony x505 is pretty amazing when it comes to size. Apple could make it even better! I say bring it on too!8)
Originally posted by peharri
Not unless DVD makers either liberalise CSS licensing or stop using CSS (or any other form of access control mechanism) altogether, which is not going to happen. Most likely CSS will be replaced by an even stronger algorithm.
Right now for Apple top provide some feature that allows you to watch a DVD from your hard drive, it would have to limit its use to the handful of movies that are out unencrypted. Otherwise they'd be violating the DMCA simply by providing a device that circumvents an access control mechanism.
And, with Jobs at the helm of Pixar, I don't see it likely that Apple is going to be the company willing to "fight for the users" when it comes to the DMCA.
right right right, that's what they said about pirated mp3's
apple changed the paradigm.....
think different....
if you are toting a sub notebook on a plane, stuck in the throws of boredom, watching a stored movie or tv show is pleasure. It is a market waiting to blooom.
sony sells hardware to do this now....
apple should take the reigns now and grab hold of an idustry..
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
Then when and if Apple comes out with the 10 inch PowerBook people will whine that it's not small enough and they'll want a 7 inch PowerBook. "A true subnotebook has to weigh less than 2.4 pounds! It's breaking my back to carry it. Oh the pain..."
Escher
sub-PowerBook Lobbyist
Originally posted by TednDi
right right right, that's what they said about pirated mp3's
apple changed the paradigm.....
No they said nothing of the sort about MP3s. MP3s have always been neutral to the issue of copyright and did not break any non-copyright laws, there were legitimate MP3s and illegally distributed ones. There's no access control mechanism on a CD, so the DMCA doesn't apply to CDs.
The DMCA does apply to DVDs because despite the word "copyright" in the title, it applies to much more than the right to copy. DVDs have an access control mechanism - a legal device specifically envisaged by the creators of the DMCA. It doesn't matter for what reasons you bypass CSS (the ACM for DVDs), if you create a device (which can be software) to circumvent CSS that's not been authorized by the DVD-CCA, then you are breaking the law. And not just civil law either, you're performing a criminal act that can land you in prison.
The only legal open source DVD players at the moment are produced outside of the US (and therefore out of the juristication of the DMCA) for that very reason.
Sucks, doesn't it. If you want this changed, rather than expect Apple to change a paradigm (which they can't without being arrested, and which Jobs himself is unlikely to support), you're going to need to lobby your senators and congressmen.
What about legal recorded media. Movies and television recordings and such from cable a la Tivo?
Microsoft is thrusting into this market.
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,116836,00.asp
Jobs, as one of the "users" can influence the market and his movie media peers by showing them a viable secure distribution strategy.
Fully 25% of the UK population has now downloaded a movie illegally. The situation is almost exactly as it was in 2001 before itms and the ipod.