Could Apple and M$ get in a bidding war for TIVO?

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
Do you think Apple would be able to buy TIVO unchallenged or do you think M$ could cause a bidding war.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 54
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    This is more like general discussion.
  • Reply 2 of 54
    I want to clarify some of the rumors for everyone since people have been going crazy with this stupid TiVo rumor.



    Apple IF it decides to buy TiVo (and yes they are considering it) Is only buying tivo to shut it down



    Tivo has no technologies worth buying or owning. Any company, especially a computer company can make something better than tivo with available kits, and parts from manufactures. A tivo buy is to shut down possible compeitition from tivo with a new apple product.



    TIVO is NOT worth buying and is a "buy to kill item"
  • Reply 3 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    I want to clarify some of the rumors for everyone since people have been going crazy with this stupid TiVo rumor.



    Apple IF it decides to buy TiVo (and yes they are considering it) Is only buying tivo to shut it down



    Tivo has no technologies worth buying or owning. Any company, especially a computer company can make something better than tivo with available kits, and parts from manufactures. A tivo buy is to shut down possible compeitition from tivo with a new apple product.



    TIVO is NOT worth buying and is a "buy to kill item"




    So could M$ try to by TIVO as well just to kill-it so Apple couldn't get additional leverage in the Media-player biz?



    You can't deny Tivo's 3 million customers (paying either monthly, yearly, or lifetime subscriptions to the service) would be a good starting point for either M$ or Apple when it comes to the trojan horse of the set-top-box.



    TIVO is currently doing business with DirectTV and DirectTV has recently announced a huge increase in HD channels before the end of the year. Apple could push Quicktime/h.264/mpeg4 through Tivo to ensure and guarantee future compatablity with macs and ipods.
  • Reply 4 of 54
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,309member
    That's absurd.



    Name one time Apple has spent over 100 million dollars to kill a competing product?



    Nay, if Apple buys Tivo it's because they see value in appropriating the code, talent and infrastructure.



    I don't expect MS to be a player because 400 million would be better suited getting Media Center PCs running well.
  • Reply 5 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    I want to clarify some of the rumors for everyone since people have been going crazy with this stupid TiVo rumor.



    Apple IF it decides to buy TiVo (and yes they are considering it) Is only buying tivo to shut it down



    Tivo has no technologies worth buying or owning. Any company, especially a computer company can make something better than tivo with available kits, and parts from manufactures. A tivo buy is to shut down possible compeitition from tivo with a new apple product.



    TIVO is NOT worth buying and is a "buy to kill item"




    No offence but that is the most foolish thing I have read all day. "buy to kill" is not logical no matter how you slice it. I think that (and this is my opinion) they are looking into Tivo for the name recognition and the interface patents. Furthermore if they buy Tivo they automatically assume a few million customers. This gives Apple automatic leverage in the multimedia market and one step close to one day being able to sucessfully creating an iMovie or iFilm type store based off of their iTunes store, but rest assured this will not happen for some time (until the right technologies are in place).



    Apple has purchased several products and companies under this same guideline. They purchase proprietary technologies and sometimes a loyal user base, then absorb the product or technology into their line up. A good example of this was when Apple purchased "Shake".
  • Reply 6 of 54
    tednditedndi Posts: 1,921member
    You have been watching too many old '80s Movies.





    If and it is a big if Apple were to buy Tivo it would be for the 3million subscribers. And their temporary deal with direct TV.



    TIVO would be used as a central set top media server for ilife products.



    big if....



    VERY big IF!





    And apple could do the deal with stock only and still have about 5 billion left over.



    Apple would only have to spend about $150 million or so to get a controlling stake in TIVO.



    What does TIVO have that apple can't develop in house or in short order?/



    answer that and that is the reason to buy it...
  • Reply 7 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by TednDi

    You have been watching too many old '80s Movies.





    If and it is a big if Apple were to buy Tivo it would be for the 3million subscribers. And their temporary deal with direct TV.



    TIVO would be used as a central set top media server for ilife products.



    big if....



    VERY big IF!





    And apple could do the deal with stock only and still have about 5 billion left over.



    Apple would only have to spend about $150 million or so to get a controlling stake in TIVO.



    What does TIVO have that apple can't develop in house or in short order?/



    answer that and that is the reason to buy it...




    The Name "TIVO"
  • Reply 8 of 54
    tednditedndi Posts: 1,921member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Playmaker

    The Name "TIVO"



    I was being rhetorical.



    TIVO- that is what is known in the business world as "good will" which is what is left when everything else is accounted for.



    300m for a brand > perhaps



    Apple is a bigger name I would argue.



    300 million subscribers is a better reason.



    or the suitor is a joint venture of APPLE and SONY



    "who knows maybe someday computers and music?"
  • Reply 9 of 54
    M$ is already tied-in in pretty close with cable companies like Comcast so Apple could align themselves with DirectTV since DirectTV will most likely have alot more HDTV content before the end of the year.



    Since DirectTV has a large customer base in conjunction with Tivo 3 million subscribers Apple could take advantage of DirectTv huge push into expanding HDTV and the increase demand for HDTV recording abilities of HD-Tivos.



    Right now it would be easier for a person to build a library of HD content by recording and saving on a TIVO-like device first then send it over to an itunes-like movie app through a next-gen version of Apples Airport then it would to buy and download it directly off the internet.



    I would think Apple would go this Tivo route first then after a few years they could use future Pixar movies (after the Disney/Pixar "Cars" movie comes out summer of 2006) as a trojan horse to launch an itunes-like movie store for buying and downloading HD h.264 movie files by 2007. Since TiVo's current agreement with DirectTV expires in 2007 Apple's additional muscle and money could give TIVO more leverage when it comes to negotiating new contracts.
  • Reply 10 of 54
    Here a new CBS article stating that Apple won't buy Tivo but at this point everything is just speculation-





    CBS Market watch
  • Reply 11 of 54
    I call you 380 mil and then some...



    apple can use the employees, but tivo doesn't have any hardware that is worth paying for. everything is readly available. Motorola has "kits" of boxes like these that could be turned into one with a mac branded interface or even os x. Its' all about the chipsets. Tivo is just like every other box, the interface is different but then apple wouldn't use that.



    the fees paid by members are not enough to keep tivo afloat.





    Quote:

    Originally posted by hmurchison

    That's absurd.



    Name one time Apple has spent over 100 million dollars to kill a competing product?



    Nay, if Apple buys Tivo it's because they see value in appropriating the code, talent and infrastructure.



    I don't expect MS to be a player because 400 million would be better suited getting Media Center PCs running well.




  • Reply 12 of 54
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Even though I think the bidding war thread should be in general discussion.



    It's been somewhat morphed by users to a FH thread.



    If Apple was to buy tivo I think they would support the current tivo box, later to update the OS, again later make a new box with net access to ITMS, and a CD player/burner, and give current customers a discounted price on the new Apple home appliance box that would be it's eventual replacement. That is a minimum. I think there would be more from an Apple home appliance, but this should be included in the deal.
  • Reply 13 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    I call you 380 mil and then some...



    apple can use the employees, but tivo doesn't have any hardware that is worth paying for. everything is readly available. Motorola has "kits" of boxes like these that could be turned into one with a mac branded interface or even os x. Its' all about the chipsets. Tivo is just like every other box, the interface is different but then apple wouldn't use that.



    the fees paid by members are not enough to keep tivo afloat.




    TIVO has the name, patents and etc but limited by its hardware and by Apple purchasing them it could give them resources to solve the problem.



    I remember when Apples stock was in the gutter around $8 and it was the infusement of cash from M$/Gates that got its stock going up again . M$ would have most likely bought Apple back then if they could but the anti-trust (monopoly) lawsuit at the time dictated that it was in M$ interest to keep Apple alive (M$ also got to end patent infringement lawsuit Apple had against them as well) since if Apple went BK at that time it would only give the government more ammunition against M$. My point in this is that TIVO could use an infusement of cash through a partnership or an outright purchase to get the company back on track and TIVO might own some patents that Apple knows they will infringe on in the future.
  • Reply 14 of 54
    I can't see where Apple would want TIVO...



    I'm certain MS doesn't want TIVO.



    M$ already has MediaCenter ... and there's no subscription fee. MediaCenter does everything the TIVO can do and then some, why would MS need to buy TIVO ??? I think you'll find that MS is on the verge of running TIVO out of business without having to spend a dime ... one year from now, max.



    Now, if only Apple would get off thier butt and give us a similiar app !!! Most iMac users would get WAY more use from a TV tuner card than they do from Bluetooth or WiFi.
  • Reply 15 of 54
    If Apple really wanted a device like TiVO, they would probably build one themselves. They would probably be able to make a really good one that would crush TiVO easily.



    The only real reason Apple would buy TiVO is for the name, catchy and something that people already identify with.
  • Reply 16 of 54
    Last quarter was one of Tivo's best, and they lost over 22 million dollars, on 141 million in revenues.



    Cable companies, Microsoft, Elgato (EyeTV), and build it yourself boxes are strong competitors to Tivo. The barriers to entry to the market has been breached thoroughly.



    The millions of customers that would become Tivo's acquirer's responsibility to support would be a nightmare. (TivoToGo support for Windows? For lifetime subscribers? Blech.)



    Why on earth would anyone, let alone a solidly profitable company like Apple, buy a money sieve like Tivo?



    Buying Elgato makes a whole lot more sense, assuming they're profitable, or close to it. Their product is nearly equivalent, and would not have the baggage associated with it.
  • Reply 17 of 54
    tednditedndi Posts: 1,921member
    a more dire prediction:



    Tivo goes into bankruptcy to get the court to stop tivo's responsibility to its lifetime subscribers. Then Tivo comes out of bankruptcy to its next big deal.



    The lifetime thing. Is a drain around Tivo's revenue stream.
  • Reply 18 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by isomething

    If Apple really wanted a device like TiVO, they would probably build one themselves. They would probably be able to make a really good one that would crush TiVO easily.



    The only real reason Apple would buy TiVO is for the name, catchy and something that people already identify with.




    How much do you think it would cost Apple to



    1. Create the DVR software and Hardware.

    2. Market this DVR and obtain 3 million users.

    3. Create a unique and popular identity for the DVR



    Could this be done for less than 350 million? Including staffing and setting up destribution deals. Patents filing etc? I'm not so sure. We all know Apple can make their own but what is the cheapest option?



    Quote:

    Cable companies, Microsoft, Elgato (EyeTV), and build it yourself boxes are strong competitors to Tivo. The barriers to entry to the market has been breached thoroughly



    Elgato? Puhleeze. No one outside of Mac fans know who Elgato is. Elgato's software isn't even close to offering what Tivo's have. Try again here.



    Quote:

    Buying Elgato makes a whole lot more sense, assuming they're profitable, or close to it. Their product is nearly equivalent, and would not have the baggage associated with it.



    Balderdash. Elgato is nice but their not even close to being a player in this genre. They likely don't even have a million users let alone paying subscribers.



    Some of you people have absolutely no creativity or foresight.



    It's not about what Tivo is or isn't doing today. It's about what they can bring to the table. It's about how their product may integrate with the core benefits of Apple's multimedia architecture.



    Of course Apple isn't going buy Tivo and run it like it is ran today. DVR, even by Apple's admission, is becoming a commodity item. It's what Apple could and should add to the DVR which makes the arguement compelling.



    Apple doesn't need to provide the content. They provide the storage for the cable co service of "your" choice. They provide the interface and that's what they do best.



    The issue is simply this people.



    Apple needs a DVR strategy. Thus, they only need to decide on what is cheaper to reach their goals. Buying Tivo or rolling their own system.



    It doesn't matter about what Tivo's performance is today. It doesn't matter that cable co have their own DVRs. What matters is what Apple envisions and how cheaply that vision can reach fruition.
  • Reply 19 of 54
    Quote:

    Originally posted by TednDi

    a more dire prediction:



    Tivo goes into bankruptcy to get the court to stop tivo's responsibility to its lifetime subscribers. Then Tivo comes out of bankruptcy to its next big deal.



    The lifetime thing. Is a drain around Tivo's revenue stream.




    Tivo's problem is that DVRs are quickly becoming commodities. They have no way of directly profitting off of content. Thus the lifetime fees are their only source of profits other than their meager licensing. The lifetime fees have to offset the loss leader hardware they are selling. They're toast and they know it. When Comcast/TW comes through with a STB with DVR functions they lose because DVR capabilities are just a commodity now.



    Apple has the ability to profit off of the content. The run the worlds most popular digital download service. They are poised to be in position to make waves once downloading movies becomes feasible.



    The FCC has made it easy now to piggyback onto the Cable Cos services with CableCARDS. In a couple of years with CableCARD second generation a 2-way card will allow On Demand and PPV programming.



    Do you guys realize what this means?



    Imagine the Macworld San Fran Keynote of 2008 played live on your 55" LCD screen in HD.



    Apple already has a store, what stops them from branching out and selling DVD, Blu-Ray and HD-DVD along with digital downloads?



    What stops an Apple infused Tivo from streaming iSight video in h.264 right to your TV?



    If you can't see why Apple should be "quickly" moving in this direction, Tivo aquisition or not, then you do not understand what "Digital Hub" really is.
  • Reply 20 of 54
    YES. And it's not about creating a DVR. DVR are a dime a dozen. It's about creating a killer box that interfaces with the television. Apple tried this with the pippin back in the day.



    DVR Software? It's "simple". Heh there's even projects to do it on your current computer hardware! Hardware? It's decoder chips tivo is below the curve.



    When Apple "creates" new products they "rock the boat" not "barely fit in" like tivo does. Apple does NOT want the tivo brand name. Apple = Apple and any television product will coming out will be branded APPLE.



    Apple was the #1 brand this year, beating out google. Tivo wasn't even on the list...





    Quote:

    Originally posted by hmurchison

    How much do you think it would cost Apple to



    1. Create the DVR software and Hardware.

    2. Market this DVR and obtain 3 million users.

    3. Create a unique and popular identity for the DVR



    Could this be done for less than 350 million? Including staffing and setting up destribution deals. Patents filing etc? I'm not so sure. We all know Apple can make their own but what is the cheapest option?







    Elgato? Puhleeze. No one outside of Mac fans know who Elgato is. Elgato's software isn't even close to offering what Tivo's have. Try again here.







    Balderdash. Elgato is nice but their not even close to being a player in this genre. They likely don't even have a million users let alone paying subscribers.



    Some of you people have absolutely no creativity or foresight.



    It's not about what Tivo is or isn't doing today. It's about what they can bring to the table. It's about how their product may integrate with the core benefits of Apple's multimedia architecture.



    Of course Apple isn't going buy Tivo and run it like it is ran today. DVR, even by Apple's admission, is becoming a commodity item. It's what Apple could and should add to the DVR which makes the arguement compelling.



    Apple doesn't need to provide the content. They provide the storage for the cable co service of "your" choice. They provide the interface and that's what they do best.



    The issue is simply this people.



    Apple needs a DVR strategy. Thus, they only need to decide on what is cheaper to reach their goals. Buying Tivo or rolling their own system.



    It doesn't matter about what Tivo's performance is today. It doesn't matter that cable co have their own DVRs. What matters is what Apple envisions and how cheaply that vision can reach fruition.




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