Xbox360 = 970MP? Apparently

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
I was at e3 earlier today and had a discussion with a ms engineer. He claims that they are using the 970 chipset from ibm.



:P Would figure that MS gets a better deal with IBM for cpus ;-)
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 35
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,259member
    Holy Mother of Roman Gods.





    If the 3-Core 3.2Ghz VMX, SMT microprocessor was in fact a 970 based CPU I'd blow a gasket with glee.
  • Reply 2 of 35
    alexluftalexluft Posts: 159member
    How realistic is that???



    If the current power processor is around $350 (i'm assuming here), how would it be that the proc. in the xbox is a 970 AND they keep the price around hmm let's say$300-$400???



    Just doesn't make sence...tooo good to be true
  • Reply 3 of 35
    brendonbrendon Posts: 642member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alexluft

    How realistic is that???



    If the current power processor is around $350 (i'm assuming here), how would it be that the proc. in the xbox is a 970 AND they keep the price around hmm let's say$300-$400???



    Just doesn't make sence...tooo good to be true




    Food point we need to know ball park cost numbers to know what Apple is paying and therefore will to pay in the future. If the XBOX is selling for $400 then the processor should sell below that. I mean that I know that they sell these things at a loss but how much? When the PS2 came out I believe that the cost of the DVD player retail alone was over $100. Sony had at least $250 in something that I bought for $200. So it appears that they are willing to eat $50, but I don't know about $100 to $150. That seems too much to eat, I mean that if they sold 70million of these then they would have lost 7billion or more just to sell games, don't know if that adds up. If the PS3 sells 100million then the cost loss on sales would be staggering if they cannot keep the cost of production down. We can assume that the DVD player will cost about $200 or slightly more. I assuming that Sony wants to send a clear message to Toshiba. I could be wrong here but that camp is counting on Sony not being able to sell bluray at anything close to what the others can sell their DVD players at. If Sony can sell at competative prices then the talks are back on. So if the PS3 sells for $500 then maybe Sony is willing to eat $100, if so then that leaves about 350 for the rest of the box. Maybe $150 for ports support chips controller and other stuff. Leaving about $200 for the chip. Oops I have not even factored in the video card.



    Does anyone have any guess as to what these processors will cost?
  • Reply 4 of 35
    webmailwebmail Posts: 639member
    Is common knowledge that Microsoft and Sony sell the consoles for below cost, because money is made back in game royalities..
  • Reply 5 of 35
    brendonbrendon Posts: 642member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    Is common knowledge that Microsoft and Sony sell the consoles for below cost, because money is made back in game royalities..



    OK, how much loss? That is what I'm asking. I know that they are sold at a loss, but knowing how much could tell us how much the CPU costs.



    Edit I mean does anyone see Sony eating $500 per unit when the number of units sold are to be 100 million? I can hardly see $100 loss per unit but I don't know the market that well.
  • Reply 6 of 35
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member
    XBOX and PS2 cost each company about $125 per unit. But that is only short term really because production costs fall over time, and the hardware isn't upgraded. Kinda like the G5 towers . After about a year, they should stop losing money on them.



    The first year of XBOX sales cost MS around 2 billion. Probably pissed them all to hell seeing geeks buy them to run linux.
  • Reply 7 of 35
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    Is common knowledge that Microsoft and Sony sell the consoles for below cost, because money is made back in game royalities..



    It is a common myth that Microsoft and Sony sell their consoles for below cost.



    http://www.actsofgord.com/Proclamations/chapter02.html
  • Reply 8 of 35
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member
    Well - that's a little silly. Everyone knows the loss is short term only. I mean, how much do you think it costs to build an Xbox now?
  • Reply 9 of 35
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,242member
    Download Microsoft and Sony 10-Q statements for the past 5 years and see just how much each company loses on its systems.
  • Reply 10 of 35
    brendonbrendon Posts: 642member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by the cool gut

    XBOX and PS2 cost each company about $125 per unit. But that is only short term really because production costs fall over time, and the hardware isn't upgraded. Kinda like the G5 towers . After about a year, they should stop losing money on them.



    The first year of XBOX sales cost MS around 2 billion. Probably pissed them all to hell seeing geeks buy them to run linux.




    Forgot add that the bulk of the sales of the consoles are sold in the first year, so much for shrinking costs over time. Wonder what the sales of PS2 units were like last year?



    mdrift: Sony and MS actually break sown the numbers that much? I would have thought that they would report numbers by division, like PlayStation division made $x dollars, not PS consoles made $x dollars while PS games made $x dollars. Are you sure that they break out hardware from software for the PS division or is it all lumped together, which makes more sence to me. I mean the lumping part, WallStreet only needs to know so much, extra info only helps the coppetition get a better handle on the business.
  • Reply 11 of 35
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    If that guy at E3 said they are using the 970MP they are using it in the 3 Mac's they are using to power their show. M$ has already said they don't have a fully running 360 yet, and they are using 3 Macs. They may actually be using more at E3.
  • Reply 12 of 35
    junkyard dawgjunkyard dawg Posts: 2,801member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alexluft

    How realistic is that???



    If the current power processor is around $350 (i'm assuming here), how would it be that the proc. in the xbox is a 970 AND they keep the price around hmm let's say$300-$400???



    Just doesn't make sence...tooo good to be true




    Whatever IBM charges Apple for a PPC 970, they will charge Microsoft less, possibly much less. How many Xboxes will Microsoft sell in a year? Compare that number to the number of G5 Macs sold in a year. See why IBM would fab a bitchin' CPU for M$ and leave Apple with its dick in its hand?



    Does anyone have a good link that explains just what this Xbox processor is? I did a search but just came up with info on the game console. I'd really like to see just what IBM is serving up for the Antichrist.
  • Reply 13 of 35
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Brendon

    Forgot add that the bulk of the sales of the consoles are sold in the first year, so much for shrinking costs over time. Wonder what the sales of PS2 units were like last year?



    Not so. Sony had a hard time ramping up to demand when the PS2 was first released March 2000. It took 2 years to hit 30 million, 6 months later in January 2003 50 million total were sold. Since 2003 they have sold at least another 30 million.



    They probably always lose money on it, do to aggressive price cuts initially, but not nearly as much as when first launched.
  • Reply 14 of 35
    hirohiro Posts: 2,663member
    Given the released specs on the Xbox360 down to instruction issue and number of registers per VMX thread, the guy from MS was full of crap like most booth monkeys at trade shows.



    They are using a PPE derivative which is completely different from a 970 family chip.
  • Reply 15 of 35
    programmerprogrammer Posts: 3,409member
    The MS guy was full of crap. The final hardware is not 970 related, and the development/demo machines are just straight out of Apple's line up. End of story, lock the thread.
  • Reply 16 of 35
    telomartelomar Posts: 1,804member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by ridgeydidge

    It is a common myth that Microsoft and Sony sell their consoles for below cost.



    http://www.actsofgord.com/Proclamations/chapter02.html




    Microsoft lost around $100 per console for the majority of its life. Only more recently has their been any variation from that. They have lost around $1 - 1.5 billion each year on it.



    Sony paid their console development costs off very early on and after that could afford to sell on very thin margins. Nintendo does something similar. Neither of them sell at a loss. The reality is if they are going to sell at a loss it'd be late in the game, but they won't then either.
  • Reply 17 of 35
    henriokhenriok Posts: 537member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by webmail

    I was at e3 earlier today and had a discussion with a ms engineer. He claims that they are using the 970 chipset from ibm.



    This is actually quite correct, for the devloper boxes, not the final product.

    This have been kommon knowledge since quite a while, and the demos that we've seen of Xbox 360 is apparently running on the dev boxes (with a penalty hit) since the final hardware isn't ready yet.
  • Reply 18 of 35
    jabbajabba Posts: 82member
    They call it the XBox 120 (aka PowerMac G5)



    http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/615/...html?fromint=1



    Interesting picture, although the facts are known, as Henriok et al. pointed out in this thread.



    Does anyone which machines MS shipped as 'alpha units' ? Dual G5 2,5 Ghz ?



    webmail: Did the MS guy refer to the *final* XBox 360 ? If so, it may be a new member of the 970 family...



    Edit: I read that the 'Beta Units' should ship in May ? Are these simply 2,7 Ghz machines or something better ?
  • Reply 19 of 35
    xsmixsmi Posts: 127member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by jabba

    They call it the XBox 120 (aka PowerMac G5)



    http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/615/...html?fromint=1



    Interesting picture, although the facts are known, as Henriok et al. pointed out in this thread.



    Does anyone which machines MS shipped as 'alpha units' ? Dual G5 2,5 Ghz ?



    webmail: Did the MS guy refer to the *final* XBox 360 ? If so, it may be a new member of the 970 family...



    Edit: I read that the 'Beta Units' should ship in May ? Are these simply 2,7 Ghz machines or something better ?




    Dual 2.0 GHZ. And judging from the specs on the chip (compare M$ and Sony procs) I agree with Programmer. These are not 970 procs but most likely cells w/o as many cores as the Sony proc.
  • Reply 20 of 35
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Programmer

    The MS guy was full of crap. The final hardware is not 970 related, and the development/demo machines are just straight out of Apple's line up. End of story, lock the thread.



    And, of course, the final hardware does not actually exist yet. The prototypes being shown were empty plastic shells, and the demo software was running on G5 Powermacs.



    So even if, and I know it's unlikely, the XBOX were running on 970's it wouldn't mean that Apple was getting ripped off by IBM. Because we don't know what Apple will be shipping by the time the XBOX actually ships.
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