It doesn't suck, it just needs to add some features. Off the top of my head here are some of the ones I would really like to see added for the next release of Pages:
A book function like the one in FrameMaker.
Good Cross referencing.
A cross column paragraph style.
Running Headers.
more choices for image placement.
Basically, I want them to add most of FrameMaker's feature set to Pages so Mac users can have an up to date page layout and content creation solution suitable for long documents.
I personally am fine with Pages feature list. My problems are bugs and interface problems. WRT bugs, it is not like it crashes or anything, but there are problems with tabs (sometimes the tabs you set just don't seem to "take"), and the other day I had this weird thing where the last page of my document would disappear whenever I changed something earlier. The interface issues revolve around the fact that, in order to create all the fancy templates, they had to introduce a bunch of page layout features, but they don't really want to intimidate people by putting these features front and center. As a result, weird things happen like if you chose "delete page" it deletes a whole section. Also, if you are typing along in one text box you can't create another text box without shifting focus to something that isn't a text box. Most Apple apps I find my self thinking "Wow, that just worked like it was reading my mind." With Pages I find my thinking "WTF, why is it doing that?"
This is not to say that Pages "sucks". For $80 it is a very powerful word processor, plus you get Keynote which beats PowerPoint hands down at any price. Think of Pages as a late beta of a really great program.
I had a much easier time making a document with pictures using pages than I did with Word. Word and its autoformat are a huge pain. I also like having the ability to export as PDF.
Um, you can export anything to PDF in any OS X application. Just click on the PDF lozenge in the bottom left of the print dialog. Pages is nothing special in that respect, I'm afraid.
I'd say that Pages is weird... but brilliantly weird, like the idiot savant family member.
It's not a traditional word processor, and it's not a professional layout program. It has a lot of the capabilities of the latter, and can emulate the former pretty well though. There's no 'one way' to use it, which I think bothers some folks. You can use it as a traditional word processor, or you can use it as a layout program - the biggest confusion tends to come from people who want to do both at the same time... it doesn't handle that particularly well.
Luckily, it *does* handle the layout functions themselves rather well if they're used separately from the content editing phase of document production. If you're looking to use it as a layout system, I'd recommend writing up the content first in TextEdit, or in a Blank template document in Pages. Get that right, then set up a layout document in Pages, and cut and paste the text over in the appropriate chunks for the text boxes you arranged in the layout.
In this respect, you're using the content production and stylistic layout portions of Pages separately, which I think is the direction it will go even further. (Rather like CSS vs. HTML4 - pull out the style and layout directives and you can do some neat things.)
I use PAGES all the time, mainly for newsletters and quick design layouts. I think the program (and iWork suite for that matter) has gotten a bad rap...
I love Pages. Sure, it can be quirky, but once you get inside using it for a while it is amazingly simple yet powerful enough to produce VERY professional looking documents. I'm proficient in Quark and InDesign (prefer InDesign) and use both regularly in addition to MS Word, but when it comes time (in my Marketing role) to write a field bulletin/newsletter or proof what a future design might resemble, I go to PAGES first.
It's not bad, it's just not very polished. For an entry level Word processor/ layout app it shows some real promise. Apple really needs to do some major tweaking to the GUI though.
I've just finished a major project at work using Pages and it was far more relaxing than using Word. I did have to convert the final file to a doc format that Word could read - a fairly simple save as.
I'm one that believes that Apple will expand iWork to include a spreadsheet and a junior version of FileMaker to cover the database needs. I also believe that there will be other apps/wizards like AppleWorks has, but with tighter integration and, maybe a personal finance/money management package that won't be called Money.
I had a much easier time making a document with pictures using pages than I did with Word. Word and its autoformat are a huge pain. I also like having the ability to export as PDF.
anything in OSX can be PDFed, same on Windows, (built into OSX, requiers cutePDF (think of it as a hackers version of Distiller, only 100% legal) on Windows)
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
With all due respect you sound like a PCfanboy talking about an Apple Mac computer in the 80s.
Not surprisingly for a first release there are some missing features that make it harder to use in a work environmnet such as merge and better control of capitalisation but other pages features make up for it in spades..
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
With all due respect you sound like a PCfanboy talking about an Apple Mac computer in the 80s.
Not surprisingly for a first release there are some missing features that make it harder to use in a work environmnet such as merge and better control of capitalisation but other pages features make up for it in spades..
It's just Appleworks, I don't think Apple is serious. They basically need to rewrite the thing from scratch, or put some work into Open Office. At least open office exposes it's objects. I had to spec out to four textbooks using word PC and "appleworks" for eight different authors so they could format their manuscripts using styles, etc. There was no comparison.
I'd be interesting in hearing more about this, dmz. What precisely did you have a problem with in Pages? (And if you'd read the threads where the AppleWorks fans were screaming about it, you'd never call it that again. Different focus, different toolset.)
I say this because I've been nothing but impressed with it when it comes to whipping up stylesheets, while Word drives me insane.
I'd be interesting in hearing more about this, dmz. What precisely did you have a problem with in Pages? (And if you'd read the threads where the AppleWorks fans were screaming about it, you'd never call it that again. Different focus, different toolset.)
I say this because I've been nothing but impressed with it when it comes to whipping up stylesheets, while Word drives me insane.
Word will do that, especially if you try to use it on the Mac --- when I run a word processor that NEEDS a dual-proc machine, there's something rotten in Redmond. Otherwise Word comes out of the box with enough stupid features turned on to make your job "unpleasant". But once you make friends, you can really shovel work out the door.
It wasn't just one thing (except for being able to use vB to manhandle the text) -- it was more like it it's 90% able to give you a certain level of control, And after that, you're just out of luck. There are also things like electronic copyeditting features/tracking changes, too that ---let's be honest --- don't show up in most people's daily workflow.
I'd go get a copy of NeoOffice. It's free, and nearly as 'robust' as Word.
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
I could easily make a professional document in apple-"works" and there is NOTHING professional about that app, I could make a professional document in notepad/wordpad, Hell, I remember using txteditor (i think that is what it was called) on MS-DOS 4 to write a book report in grade school...
all that asside, I think iWork is great, but not quite ready for prime time as a "professional" tool, it needs:
*way better export-to-office
*a keynote player for windows with wide propagation (bundle it with QT7) Exporting to movie for windows playback is not an acceptable solution on a professional level.
*spreadsheet app
*basic vector drawing app to allow for easy design and layout of schematics, heirarchial charts and such, and very basic logo design or maybe letterhead layout. Because it would be vector, the resulting output would look great on a 10-foot poster, integrated into a keynote presentation or printed on a business card. This app could also be integrated with the spreadsheet app to render fully vector charts/graphs
* tight filemaker integration - maybe make a filemaker lite or some such thing, integrate it with all apps, use it as a media/document manager(eg Adobe Version Cue) as well as a database tool
*a basic web site design tool would also be nice to compleate the workflow, and with WebObjects going out the door for free now, why not retool it into a friendly drag n drop interface and include it, the back end code generators that adhere to the standards are already there...USE THEM
this would make a professional tookset...but with the i- montra, I dont think pros are what they are shooting for...this would be so great for consumers too though, because with the apple touch, it would make life so much easier than MS office, which MANY home consumers use now-a-days
Comments
A book function like the one in FrameMaker.
Good Cross referencing.
A cross column paragraph style.
Running Headers.
more choices for image placement.
Basically, I want them to add most of FrameMaker's feature set to Pages so Mac users can have an up to date page layout and content creation solution suitable for long documents.
This is not to say that Pages "sucks". For $80 it is a very powerful word processor, plus you get Keynote which beats PowerPoint hands down at any price. Think of Pages as a late beta of a really great program.
I'll bet that Pages v2 or v3 will be a whole lot better. Just give it time.
Look at the difference between Jaguar and Tiger. They are worlds apart. Pages is young and has room to mature.
It's not a traditional word processor, and it's not a professional layout program. It has a lot of the capabilities of the latter, and can emulate the former pretty well though. There's no 'one way' to use it, which I think bothers some folks. You can use it as a traditional word processor, or you can use it as a layout program - the biggest confusion tends to come from people who want to do both at the same time... it doesn't handle that particularly well.
Luckily, it *does* handle the layout functions themselves rather well if they're used separately from the content editing phase of document production. If you're looking to use it as a layout system, I'd recommend writing up the content first in TextEdit, or in a Blank template document in Pages. Get that right, then set up a layout document in Pages, and cut and paste the text over in the appropriate chunks for the text boxes you arranged in the layout.
In this respect, you're using the content production and stylistic layout portions of Pages separately, which I think is the direction it will go even further. (Rather like CSS vs. HTML4 - pull out the style and layout directives and you can do some neat things.)
I love Pages. Sure, it can be quirky, but once you get inside using it for a while it is amazingly simple yet powerful enough to produce VERY professional looking documents. I'm proficient in Quark and InDesign (prefer InDesign) and use both regularly in addition to MS Word, but when it comes time (in my Marketing role) to write a field bulletin/newsletter or proof what a future design might resemble, I go to PAGES first.
I'm one that believes that Apple will expand iWork to include a spreadsheet and a junior version of FileMaker to cover the database needs. I also believe that there will be other apps/wizards like AppleWorks has, but with tighter integration and, maybe a personal finance/money management package that won't be called Money.
Originally posted by Wingnut
I had a much easier time making a document with pictures using pages than I did with Word. Word and its autoformat are a huge pain. I also like having the ability to export as PDF.
anything in OSX can be PDFed, same on Windows, (built into OSX, requiers cutePDF (think of it as a hackers version of Distiller, only 100% legal) on Windows)
Originally posted by dmz
A solid little toy, but still only a toy.
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
With all due respect you sound like a PCfanboy talking about an Apple Mac computer in the 80s.
Not surprisingly for a first release there are some missing features that make it harder to use in a work environmnet such as merge and better control of capitalisation but other pages features make up for it in spades..
Originally posted by Aussie John
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
With all due respect you sound like a PCfanboy talking about an Apple Mac computer in the 80s.
Not surprisingly for a first release there are some missing features that make it harder to use in a work environmnet such as merge and better control of capitalisation but other pages features make up for it in spades..
It's just Appleworks, I don't think Apple is serious. They basically need to rewrite the thing from scratch, or put some work into Open Office. At least open office exposes it's objects. I had to spec out to four textbooks using word PC and "appleworks" for eight different authors so they could format their manuscripts using styles, etc. There was no comparison.
I say this because I've been nothing but impressed with it when it comes to whipping up stylesheets, while Word drives me insane.
Originally posted by Kickaha
I'd be interesting in hearing more about this, dmz. What precisely did you have a problem with in Pages? (And if you'd read the threads where the AppleWorks fans were screaming about it, you'd never call it that again.
I say this because I've been nothing but impressed with it when it comes to whipping up stylesheets, while Word drives me insane.
Word will do that, especially if you try to use it on the Mac --- when I run a word processor that NEEDS a dual-proc machine, there's something rotten in Redmond. Otherwise Word comes out of the box with enough stupid features turned on to make your job "unpleasant". But once you make friends, you can really shovel work out the door.
It wasn't just one thing (except for being able to use vB to manhandle the text) -- it was more like it it's 90% able to give you a certain level of control, And after that, you're just out of luck. There are also things like electronic copyeditting features/tracking changes, too that ---let's be honest --- don't show up in most people's daily workflow.
I'd go get a copy of NeoOffice. It's free, and nearly as 'robust' as Word.
Originally posted by Aussie John
Its hardly a toy if i can write a professional document with it.
I could easily make a professional document in apple-"works" and there is NOTHING professional about that app, I could make a professional document in notepad/wordpad, Hell, I remember using txteditor (i think that is what it was called) on MS-DOS 4 to write a book report in grade school...
all that asside, I think iWork is great, but not quite ready for prime time as a "professional" tool, it needs:
*way better export-to-office
*a keynote player for windows with wide propagation (bundle it with QT7) Exporting to movie for windows playback is not an acceptable solution on a professional level.
*spreadsheet app
*basic vector drawing app to allow for easy design and layout of schematics, heirarchial charts and such, and very basic logo design or maybe letterhead layout. Because it would be vector, the resulting output would look great on a 10-foot poster, integrated into a keynote presentation or printed on a business card. This app could also be integrated with the spreadsheet app to render fully vector charts/graphs
* tight filemaker integration - maybe make a filemaker lite or some such thing, integrate it with all apps, use it as a media/document manager(eg Adobe Version Cue) as well as a database tool
*a basic web site design tool would also be nice to compleate the workflow, and with WebObjects going out the door for free now, why not retool it into a friendly drag n drop interface and include it, the back end code generators that adhere to the standards are already there...USE THEM
this would make a professional tookset...but with the i- montra, I dont think pros are what they are shooting for...this would be so great for consumers too though, because with the apple touch, it would make life so much easier than MS office, which MANY home consumers use now-a-days
Originally posted by Kickaha
(And if you'd read the threads where the AppleWorks fans were screaming about it, you'd never call it that again.
Apple(never)Works had.....fans.....and.....users.....HOLY SHIT!!!