[i]. If you want to blow your nose, you get a Kleenex -- not a "facial tissue" or a "Puffs." [/B]
i actually use a hanky...
As for Microsoft, Apple, iPod arguement:
a few things.
-Microsoft are rubbish: you ask any number of people what they're thoughts on Microsoft are; most will agree
-the iPod is a brilliant music player. It really has changed things so much, similarly to how the original walkman did. I recently bought a 5G 60Gb iPod, and i didn't even look at the competition.
I wanted 60GB of space, plenty of battery life... but most importantly: a SIMPLE-TO-NAVIGATE system. That's where the iPod is the real winner.
My 2¢ (i really just wanted to make the hanky comment)
And most of the market doesn't appear to care that Windows is mediocre.
Well, in my opinion, Windows is medicore (doesn't mean I am right). But, that said, apparently, 90% of the market either doesn't agree with me or doesn't care. One of the two.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tidelwav
Are you now comparing Apple buyers to Windows buyers?
Yes and no. You claim iPod is mediocre. That is your opinion. All I am saying is that either 80% of the market agrees but doesn't care enough to buy a different product, or they don't agree with you.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tidelwav
The fact is that just because the sheeple buy it doesn't make it the best. An 80% market share doesn't make it more than mediocre.
I never claimed it did. Though, personally, I do believe that iPod is better than its competitors (overall).
Quote:
Originally posted by Tidelwav
i don't base my judgments on silly things like "market share" when i know that most consumers are clueless.
I am not judging the quality of the product based on market share. I am simply pointing out to you that most of the market either doesn't agree with your valuation (mediocrity) or they simply don't care.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tidelwav
The fact is that the iPod is overpriced and mediocre. Half the people who have commented on it are buying it for the looks (fashion statement) and the other half are buying it because Jobs told them to (sheeple).
These are your opinions. Everything you have said is subjective and not (easily) objectively discernable as "fact". I realize that you may be so convinced of your own opinion that, in your mind, it has become fact (not an uncommon malady...especially here at Apple Insider).
Quote:
Originally posted by Tidelwav
I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how having five songs is somehow better than having a million of them for the same price.
You need to be careful in your question. What you mean to ask is "how is having 5 songs for a lifetime better than having access to 5 millions songs (and that number sounds inflated to me...perhaps 1-2 million?) for a month?"
I can only answer for myself. This is just me...others will have other reasons.
First, I prefer to have it and own it and I'm done. Sometimes this will cost more. I am okay with that. Same reason I don't rent my TV, furniture, car, house, clothing, computer, etc.
Second, I don't listen to 5 million (or even a million) songs. Those millions of songs cover a range of musical genres and artists that I am not even remotely interested in. So, for any given individual, it really isn't X million, it is only the subset of that they are actually interested in listening to, which I suspect, for most people, is a significantly smaller number.
The iPod is a GREAT digital music player, whether or not you buy a single song from iTunes. If we're going to knock the iPod, let's knock it on its own merits or lack thereof.
But the problem is that it's so married to iTunes that you can't judge one without the other. IF the iPod would play other formats, then it might be the best overall, although still overpriced in my opinion. For $50 less, you can get the same specs on another player... with more features.
But the problem is that it's so married to iTunes that you can't judge one without the other. IF the iPod would play other formats, then it might be the best overall, although still overpriced in my opinion. For $50 less, you can get the same specs on another player... with more features.
Why are you afraid to mention a specific player with same specs and more features?
ANd the reason the iPod is great is because its married to iTunes. THat's a GOOD thing. That's why all the commercials say iPod + iTunes. It's impossible to get that experience with any other player, and everybody knows it, (75% percent to be exact )
If the iTunes Music Store offered a subscription service, would you have anything left to argue about? That's what this is all about, right?
And the $50 extra you'd claim to pay for an iPod could be justified with the (better) iPod interface, seamless integration with iTunes, VIDEO PLAYBACK capability, and more.
You're running out of complaints, unless you can show us this mp3 player that blows iPod out of the water.
Anyway, I reckon the main 3 issues that turn people off iTunes & iPod are these:
1. The DRM.
Buying and owning music is great, I love the notion. But having restrictions on music I've bought is not my cup of tea. After all, I can go out, buy a CD, rip the songs and do whatever I want with them, and I still own them.
2. The quality.
iTMS encodes with 128kb AAC. Which is fine, unless you're a real quality buff. I happen to be. I rip songs from my CD's at 192kb. The difference is noticable. But honestly, the difference doesn't turn me off. The songs sound great to me, which is all that matters.
3. Being locked in.
This is a strange statement for me to make, but in a way it's true.
Regardless of what % of the market like the iPod and iTunes, or use it, you are still stuck using iTMS purchases on an iPod. I could see where this would irk some people.
However, again, not me. I will never use other music stores because I believe that iTMS is a far superior service. It is easier, more integrated and cheaper than many other services, which is all I care about, plus I would never buy another device (player) because nothing else is good enough, no matter how many FM tuners and whistles they smack onto them.
Plus, I can use any music I physically buy on iTunes and my iPod. So I don't need to worry about it not playing on other devices.
Pay out Apple all you like, but the one thing they are excellent at is giving a proper and superior user experience, and iTunes & the iPod are second to none in my opinion.
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
I think you're reading into this whole thing a little too deeply..
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
Someone gets it.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
Hey buddy, now you are just plain trolling!
The reason why renting music is not a good idea is this:
Unless you swap your music over each and every month, the music you keep from month to mont is going to cost you a fee every single month (till the day you die, to use your own words). If you download and listen to 200 songs every month, you probably only keep a small amount. Say 20 songs.
Now, you can argue that 20 songs a month is better than 5 songs per month. But the fact is you are paying for these songs each month.
And for the months you do not download any songs (you might be on holiday, have too much work, get a child, etc, etc) you _still_ pay for the songs you've downloaded, but you are not getting anyting new.
The only advantage is that you are able to preview _whole_ songs before you purchase them. I could see Apple implementing a yearly subscription service (say. $20 a year) that would let iTunes users preview songs in their entirety 2-3 times each.
Now. As you call us sheeples. Name ANY MP3 player that has more features than the iPod with an equal or lower price. You have yet to do this, so I'm assuming you're talking out of your a$$.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
You're a sad little boy.
Stop arguing on an Apple fan site and go outside and get some fresh air, your moon-tan is starting to fade.
I could see Apple implementing a yearly subscription service (say. $20 a year) that would let iTunes users preview songs in their entirety 2-3 times each.
im not talking about renting it. I'm talking about a better previewing system. Basically if I go to a record store, I can listen to the WHOLE album before I buy it. But at all the online stores, its 30 seconds. Record companies are paranoid about loosing money, so they will only agree to such an arangement based on financial RETURN.
I'm nto talking about renting it at all... You never download the song to you computer, you stream it directly. In my oppinion, Apple could implement such a system for free, if they get permission from the record companies. They could give you one free full-length preview of each song for registered customers.
Now that you've had your fun, show us your super-great MP3 player thats better and cheaper than the iPod. If not, we're all going to assume that it doesn't exist.
This is not an Apple fan site - it's an Apple news site. Because it's riddled with Apple fanboys, doesn't mean it's an Apple fan site.
Your point is clear though: it is how apologists say, and not the way it actually is. Though I wasn't arguing for or against the iPod as a leader.. or whatever. I was just pointing out to that poor soul that he has become part of the herd.
Tidelwav! Do you have any idea how ridiculous you look? You're giving completely ridiculous arguments that have no basis in anything and insulting those who have valid, intellectual opinions. Give it up! The iPOd is a better player, deal with it ok!
I think we're dealing with a case of sour grapes, because you can't play your subscription music on an iPod.
If iTunes DID get a subscription service, and I were dishonest, it would be great news. Audio Hijack Pro, rent the music and keep it. I remember reading somewhere that Jobs went to the record companies with this flaw didn't he?
And Gene, you're right. The iPod IS a culture, and the only way to get in that culture is to buy into it, which means money for Apple and a great experience for the end user. I'm just trying to figure out who loses in this situation \
Comments
[i]. If you want to blow your nose, you get a Kleenex -- not a "facial tissue" or a "Puffs." [/B]
i actually use a hanky...
As for Microsoft, Apple, iPod arguement:
a few things.
-Microsoft are rubbish: you ask any number of people what they're thoughts on Microsoft are; most will agree
-the iPod is a brilliant music player. It really has changed things so much, similarly to how the original walkman did. I recently bought a 5G 60Gb iPod, and i didn't even look at the competition.
I wanted 60GB of space, plenty of battery life... but most importantly: a SIMPLE-TO-NAVIGATE system. That's where the iPod is the real winner.
My 2¢ (i really just wanted to make the hanky comment)
Originally posted by Tidelwav
And most of the market doesn't appear to care that Windows is mediocre.
Well, in my opinion, Windows is medicore (doesn't mean I am right). But, that said, apparently, 90% of the market either doesn't agree with me or doesn't care. One of the two.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
Are you now comparing Apple buyers to Windows buyers?
Yes and no. You claim iPod is mediocre. That is your opinion. All I am saying is that either 80% of the market agrees but doesn't care enough to buy a different product, or they don't agree with you.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
The fact is that just because the sheeple buy it doesn't make it the best. An 80% market share doesn't make it more than mediocre.
I never claimed it did. Though, personally, I do believe that iPod is better than its competitors (overall).
Originally posted by Tidelwav
i don't base my judgments on silly things like "market share" when i know that most consumers are clueless.
I am not judging the quality of the product based on market share. I am simply pointing out to you that most of the market either doesn't agree with your valuation (mediocrity) or they simply don't care.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
The fact is that the iPod is overpriced and mediocre. Half the people who have commented on it are buying it for the looks (fashion statement) and the other half are buying it because Jobs told them to (sheeple).
These are your opinions. Everything you have said is subjective and not (easily) objectively discernable as "fact". I realize that you may be so convinced of your own opinion that, in your mind, it has become fact (not an uncommon malady...especially here at Apple Insider).
Originally posted by Tidelwav
I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how having five songs is somehow better than having a million of them for the same price.
You need to be careful in your question. What you mean to ask is "how is having 5 songs for a lifetime better than having access to 5 millions songs (and that number sounds inflated to me...perhaps 1-2 million?) for a month?"
I can only answer for myself. This is just me...others will have other reasons.
First, I prefer to have it and own it and I'm done. Sometimes this will cost more. I am okay with that. Same reason I don't rent my TV, furniture, car, house, clothing, computer, etc.
Second, I don't listen to 5 million (or even a million) songs. Those millions of songs cover a range of musical genres and artists that I am not even remotely interested in. So, for any given individual, it really isn't X million, it is only the subset of that they are actually interested in listening to, which I suspect, for most people, is a significantly smaller number.
The iPod is a GREAT digital music player, whether or not you buy a single song from iTunes. If we're going to knock the iPod, let's knock it on its own merits or lack thereof.
But the problem is that it's so married to iTunes that you can't judge one without the other. IF the iPod would play other formats, then it might be the best overall, although still overpriced in my opinion. For $50 less, you can get the same specs on another player... with more features.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
But the problem is that it's so married to iTunes that you can't judge one without the other. IF the iPod would play other formats, then it might be the best overall, although still overpriced in my opinion. For $50 less, you can get the same specs on another player... with more features.
Why are you afraid to mention a specific player with same specs and more features?
ANd the reason the iPod is great is because its married to iTunes. THat's a GOOD thing. That's why all the commercials say iPod + iTunes. It's impossible to get that experience with any other player, and everybody knows it, (75% percent to be exact
If the iTunes Music Store offered a subscription service, would you have anything left to argue about? That's what this is all about, right?
And the $50 extra you'd claim to pay for an iPod could be justified with the (better) iPod interface, seamless integration with iTunes, VIDEO PLAYBACK capability, and more.
You're running out of complaints, unless you can show us this mp3 player that blows iPod out of the water.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
For $50 less, you can get the same specs on another player... with more features.
That is, quite frankly, total bollocks.
Come on Tidelwav, show us the player that is $50 cheaper with the same specs and more features.
And tell us which player you own.
Apple make far superior products its a culture that rocks
Screw MS
ANd the reason the iPod is great is because its married to iTunes. THat's a GOOD thing.
Sure, if you like to be ripped off.
Originally posted by Hiro
Let's just stop feeding the troll.
hear hear!
Anyway, I reckon the main 3 issues that turn people off iTunes & iPod are these:
1. The DRM.
Buying and owning music is great, I love the notion. But having restrictions on music I've bought is not my cup of tea. After all, I can go out, buy a CD, rip the songs and do whatever I want with them, and I still own them.
2. The quality.
iTMS encodes with 128kb AAC. Which is fine, unless you're a real quality buff. I happen to be. I rip songs from my CD's at 192kb. The difference is noticable. But honestly, the difference doesn't turn me off. The songs sound great to me, which is all that matters.
3. Being locked in.
This is a strange statement for me to make, but in a way it's true.
Regardless of what % of the market like the iPod and iTunes, or use it, you are still stuck using iTMS purchases on an iPod. I could see where this would irk some people.
However, again, not me. I will never use other music stores because I believe that iTMS is a far superior service. It is easier, more integrated and cheaper than many other services, which is all I care about, plus I would never buy another device (player) because nothing else is good enough, no matter how many FM tuners and whistles they smack onto them.
Plus, I can use any music I physically buy on iTunes and my iPod. So I don't need to worry about it not playing on other devices.
Pay out Apple all you like, but the one thing they are excellent at is giving a proper and superior user experience, and iTunes & the iPod are second to none in my opinion.
Jimzip
Originally posted by jimbo123
its a culture that rocks
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
Originally posted by Gene Clean
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
I think you're reading into this whole thing a little too deeply..
Jimzip
Originally posted by Gene Clean
That's it, right? A marketer has hit the target so well, now he's getting millions in cash. He has made you believe that Apple is a culture. Once you believe its a culture, you're totally hooked and about the only thing you can do to be part of that culture, is to buy... that culture.
Therefore, your argument is flawed on so many levels that its a time-consuming act to try to point it out to you. You'll get it someday, though. Someday.
Someone gets it.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
Someone gets it.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
Hey buddy, now you are just plain trolling!
The reason why renting music is not a good idea is this:
Unless you swap your music over each and every month, the music you keep from month to mont is going to cost you a fee every single month (till the day you die, to use your own words). If you download and listen to 200 songs every month, you probably only keep a small amount. Say 20 songs.
Now, you can argue that 20 songs a month is better than 5 songs per month. But the fact is you are paying for these songs each month.
And for the months you do not download any songs (you might be on holiday, have too much work, get a child, etc, etc) you _still_ pay for the songs you've downloaded, but you are not getting anyting new.
The only advantage is that you are able to preview _whole_ songs before you purchase them. I could see Apple implementing a yearly subscription service (say. $20 a year) that would let iTunes users preview songs in their entirety 2-3 times each.
Now. As you call us sheeples. Name ANY MP3 player that has more features than the iPod with an equal or lower price. You have yet to do this, so I'm assuming you're talking out of your a$$.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
Someone gets it.
Don't bother trying to explain it to the sheeple here. They're so desperate to be part of something, even if it's a fake culture, that they'll buy any kind of mediocre overpriced nonsense... and then defend it to the death.... just to be a part of the "culture".
They're just like the Microsoft sheeple. Kinda sad.
You're a sad little boy.
Stop arguing on an Apple fan site and go outside and get some fresh air, your moon-tan is starting to fade.
Jimzip
I could see Apple implementing a yearly subscription service (say. $20 a year) that would let iTunes users preview songs in their entirety 2-3 times each.
RENTING music you can only play 2-3 times???
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Priceless irony!
Originally posted by Tidelwav
RENTING music you can only play 2-3 times???
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Priceless irony!
im not talking about renting it. I'm talking about a better previewing system. Basically if I go to a record store, I can listen to the WHOLE album before I buy it. But at all the online stores, its 30 seconds. Record companies are paranoid about loosing money, so they will only agree to such an arangement based on financial RETURN.
I'm nto talking about renting it at all... You never download the song to you computer, you stream it directly. In my oppinion, Apple could implement such a system for free, if they get permission from the record companies. They could give you one free full-length preview of each song for registered customers.
Now that you've had your fun, show us your super-great MP3 player thats better and cheaper than the iPod. If not, we're all going to assume that it doesn't exist.
Originally posted by Jimzip
You're a sad little boy.
Stop arguing on an Apple fan site
Jimzip
This is not an Apple fan site - it's an Apple news site. Because it's riddled with Apple fanboys, doesn't mean it's an Apple fan site.
Your point is clear though: it is how apologists say, and not the way it actually is. Though I wasn't arguing for or against the iPod as a leader.. or whatever. I was just pointing out to that poor soul that he has become part of the herd.
Good luck with that one.
Originally posted by Tidelwav
RENTING music you can only play 2-3 times???
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Priceless irony!
Tidelwav! Do you have any idea how ridiculous you look? You're giving completely ridiculous arguments that have no basis in anything and insulting those who have valid, intellectual opinions. Give it up! The iPOd is a better player, deal with it ok!
I think we're dealing with a case of sour grapes, because you can't play your subscription music on an iPod.
If iTunes DID get a subscription service, and I were dishonest, it would be great news. Audio Hijack Pro, rent the music and keep it. I remember reading somewhere that Jobs went to the record companies with this flaw didn't he?
And Gene, you're right. The iPod IS a culture, and the only way to get in that culture is to buy into it, which means money for Apple and a great experience for the end user. I'm just trying to figure out who loses in this situation