well if they are doing it for "security issues" it could be that corporate IT departments are much more adept at protecting the computers on their network as compared to your average home user -- something like that.
PS- What Coorporate consumer would want to upgrade to Vista in November when the watered-down home version won't even be ready until January '07? It doesn't make sense to me. Does MSFT have something up their sleeve?
An ounce of crack, maybe.
Quote:
It seems to me that if the cooporate verson was ready, they would be ready to launch the consumer version too. I don't know, I'm not a developer. Maybe someone could help me out.
They know they can "release" the corporate version because exactly zero large companies will buy it, and they won't have to actually deliver. Or, they can take the order, and ship, in 6-8 weeks (pulling a play from the Apple playbook).
MS if under huge pressure from some major corporations to get Vista out to businesses by Dec. 31, 2006. In 2003, MS announced an contract that corporations could sign up for that would include all updates and upgrades for a set amount of money. It was assumed in that cotract that an OS upgrade would be included. I can't remember the name of the program. If anyone knows what I'm talking about, please let me know.
So, if MS does not include an OS update within that time frame, corporations are going to be furious. So, this basically means that Vista will not slip beyond the end of 2006, but the quality is going to massively suffer. Something will be shipping this year, but I sure wouldn't want to touch it.
This is great news for Apple to some degree, but it's not like everyone is suddenly going to go Mac.. and thank all that is good.
Apple will never licence OS X (I hope) and the PC market is way too huge to just pack up and leave and convince everyone to buy a Mac. If they did licence OS X, I think they could gain control down the line (years and years from now), but it would be the ruin of everything I love about the Mac. The problem with PCs, other than Windows, is that there are just too many cooks in the kitchen.
This does, however, allow us Mac users to gloat a bit about the superiority of our preferred OS which, although produced by a significantly smaller team than MS has working on their inferior product, has released outstanding upgrades several times (if not too many).
Perhaps this has something to do with Microsoft wanting to tweek Vista for Merom, Conroe, and Woodcrest. And it has to wait on Dell, HP, or someone else to provide them prototypes of those boxes before doing their tweeking.
Then again maybe not, since MS has officially renounced 64-bit versions out of the initial Vista mix. Or they could be revamping to follow Apple's OS model. Then we would see Vista 1.0 in 2007, followed by Vista 1.1 in 2008, 1.2 in 2009, etc. just like OS X has gone from 10.0 to 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, 10.4. By the time Microsoft got to Vista 1.12 they'd have all the features they origianlly announced for Longhorn finally in place.
Personally, I expect Apple to introduce a hefty chunk of Merom, Conroe, Woodcrest products @ August 2006 WWDC with a balance of the line transitioning to them in January 2007. By WWDC 2007, hopefully Yonah will be completely phased out of the Apple line-up.
What you are talking about is MS's Software Assurance Program... I believe you can get contracts for up to 3 years. However, this usually adds 50%-100% to the cost of the original license.
Every customer with Microsoft Software Assurance receives access to new versions of licensed software released during the term of the agreement. Having new version rights to the latest Microsoft software provides flexibility and simplifies the software procurement process, shortens the business planning cycle, and enables you to deploy solutions at your own pace. With the New Version Rights benefit, you can also lower the costs associated with acquiring new version releases and take immediate advantage of the latest technology.
Quote:
Originally posted by Quevar
MS if under huge pressure from some major corporations to get Vista out to businesses by Dec. 31, 2006. In 2003, MS announced an contract that corporations could sign up for that would include all updates and upgrades for a set amount of money. It was assumed in that cotract that an OS upgrade would be included. I can't remember the name of the program. If anyone knows what I'm talking about, please let me know.
So, if MS does not include an OS update within that time frame, corporations are going to be furious. So, this basically means that Vista will not slip beyond the end of 2006, but the quality is going to massively suffer. Something will be shipping this year, but I sure wouldn't want to touch it.
I dont' see how this will give Apple any real competitive advantage. Most consumers buy based on price point, not which OS is which, as long as Dell can sell 300 dollar computers, they win.
I can see this news benefitting Apple in the High Definition realm with Blu-ray. If Apple can squeeze a Blu-ray drive in the next revision of their Mac Pros coupled with the release of the PS3 in November, there should be millions of Blu-ray players/recorders out there making Microsoft's native support of HD DVD,...well legacy support. Moreover, I think this allows Apple to tout Blu-ray High Definition machines with High Definition software whereas the other PC vendors will have to wait until next year.
will this be the right time to license ( if they ever do ) mac os x? just want to hear your feedback.
They need to do it before OSX for Intel can easily run on a generic PC box via an downloadable hack (and it *will* happen). If they don't license OSX, then perhaps their mindset is to allow for a viral outbreak of OSX on generic PCs - then license it at some point in the future.
This delay will only help Apple if Apple decides to actually advertise its computers. Maybe take 1% of the iPod marketing budget and put it towards their other products ... might be an idea.
Could Apple create a kiosk that it could deploy to most big computer stores that has a Mac Mini, a MacBook Pro and an iPod? Something like the kiosks in every store that have Xboxes and PS2's. Something store managers only need to plug in and perhaps set up to connect to a wifi router and let the products sell themselves!!!!
Put them in as endpieces to the ailes of pc boxes and you could show the "look" of the Mac while people walk by wondering where Vista is... might be an idea.
I don't see how this has anything to do with bluray. Bluray is going to be cost prohibitive to most consumers for atleast a year or two. If you want Apple to add a drive that'll up the price of their systems by 200 to 300 dollars go for it. I'll laugh at you when the company is bankrupt.
I don't see how this has anything to do with bluray. Bluray is going to be cost prohibitive to most consumers for atleast a year or two. If you want Apple to add a drive that'll up the price of their systems by 200 to 300 dollars go for it. I'll laugh at you when the company is bankrupt.
That's where the PS3 part comes in.
If Sony can actually get the thing out the door, you get an abrupt and wide spread up-take of Blueray players into the living rooms of the world.
Which drives studio Blueray DVD releases and gives you an easy way to play the Blueray DVD burns of your HD home movies (HD consumer camcorders are proliferating and dropping in price as we speak) on your HD set (sales of which are exploding). We're very close to the tipping point where SD starts to feel like "obsolete tech", in the way that black and white television did after the introduction of color.
The big hang-up is the cost of blank media, which is in fact prohibitive at the moment; but the speed at which that drops is contingent on volume sales and the PS3 will really help in that area.
Did I miss the big sale on HD TVs and all these HD Camcorders? What was the price of the stand alone Bluray players? 500 dollars and up? I don't know what you expect but in a economy where fuel and energy costs are rising, educations and medical costs are up, you expect mainstream consumers to buy all new media that is expected to cost up to 30 dollars a movie by the end of this year right when the technology comes out? Am I the only one who thinks this is the nonsense or what? The intelligent power users (such as the people who spend 10 grand on home theather, and most of the people of webforums like this) will be sitting on the fence until one format wins, I know I will. Not only that you are hoping for a sucessful world wide launch of the PS3 this November, provided that I doubt we'll get close to even 1 million consols for the US market. You are also hoping that Apple, who has yet to make a media center style PC will sell it at an attractive price point for the mainstream consumer. It was only last year that they considered DVD to be common place with most people. Hell I know people that just got their first DVD players last christmas.
The other suggestions about advertising are far more practical and realistic, you guys need to think these through a bit more before posting them.
Prices are dropping so fast on HD camcorders it's hard to keep track. Manufacturers are getting out new models as fast as they can.
Quote:
What was the price of the stand alone Bluray players? 500 dollars and up? I don't know what you expect but in a economy where fuel and energy costs are rising, educations and medical costs are up, you expect mainstream consumers to buy all new media that is expected to cost up to 30 dollars a movie by the end of this year right when the technology comes out? Am I the only one who thinks this is the nonsense or what?
So I guess these hard hit consumers won't be buying MacBook pros, or new Mac towers, or iMacs, the very models most likely to sport an HD media option, since they are luxury items. By that metric it doesn't really matter what Apple does or does not offer, since the rising cost of living rules out most of the consumer electronics on the market. Oh, and purchase cost of a movie does not equal rental cost. Rental dominates the market, so what's your point?
And are you arguing against the adoption of Blueray, specifically, or the viability of the HD market, in general? I can't tell. At any rate, the latter impacts the former, and sales of HD sets belie your dim view of the usefulness or desirability of HD formats.
Quote:
The intelligent power users (such as the people who spend 10 grand on home theather, and most of the people of webforums like this) will be sitting on the fence until one format wins, I know I will.
Sure. And the PS3 gives a big boost to Blueray "winning". Not sure why "intelligence" is contingent on expensive home theater systems, though. Lots of middle class folks have modest "system in a box" HT set-ups coupled with an HD display.
Quote:
Not only that you are hoping for a sucessful world wide launch of the PS3 this November, provided that I doubt we'll get close to even 1 million consols for the US market.
I'm not "hoping" for anything. You apparently have me confused with some kind of Blueray enthusiast/partisan. I'm merely making the observation that when a major player like Sony starts putting Blueray in what is likely to be a big selling box, it moves the needle towards Blueray.
At any rate, no serious observer doubts that the PS3 will be "successful", and a few months of supply constraints does not equal the "years out" scenario you're proposing.
Quote:
You are also hoping that Apple, who has yet to make a media center style PC will sell it at an attractive price point for the mainstream consumer.
What is it with you and my imaginary "hopes"? I think Apple will offer a Blueray option. Maybe for the people that are running iMovie HD and don't currently have anyway of transferring their movies? Nah, that whole iMovie HD thing is just a random glitch.
And since when is Apple about "attractive price points for the main stream consumer"? Last time I checked, I could buy a no-name PC with a printer and a LCD monitor for $300, after rebates, at Walmart. That's one hell of an attractive price point, and it has absolutely nothing to do with how Apple structures their business.
Quote:
It was only last year that they considered DVD to be common place with most people. Hell I know people that just got their first DVD players last christmas.
OK, now your just making shit up. DVD had the fastest uptake of any consumer electronic device in history, and had become ubiquitous well before "last year". I know people that just got online, I guess this whole internet thing is just starting to show some promise.
See also "HD sets to comprise majority etc" above.
Quote:
The other suggestions about advertising are far more practical and realistic, you guys need to think these through a bit more before posting them. [/B]
And you might refrain from peddling your vague notions as established fact.
Goes on about rental prices, $25 is far too much for me to pay for a rental.
Hadn't seen that. It strikes as the kind of clueless daydreaming that the entertainment industry likes to indulge in.
A 60 day $25 rental is a non-starter. If they're stupid enough to try it they'll find that out quickly enough.
My guess is that rentals will start at under $10 and drop from there. Cheap enough to get the early adopters on board, although still too pricey for really broad, "replaces DVD" action.
Still, my contention is that commercial sales of movie titles doesn't have that much impact on whether or not Apple would choose to add an HD media option to their computers (given the advantages for back-up and getting your home HD stuff on a playable medium), and given the drift of things it looks like Blueray has the upper hand (not just the PS3, but studios signed up, number of player manufacturers committed to the format, etc,)
For what it's worth, I would prefer to see HD DVD prevail, as well. I just don't think it will.
Comments
Originally posted by anaknipedro
PS- What Coorporate consumer would want to upgrade to Vista in November when the watered-down home version won't even be ready until January '07? It doesn't make sense to me. Does MSFT have something up their sleeve?
An ounce of crack, maybe.
It seems to me that if the cooporate verson was ready, they would be ready to launch the consumer version too. I don't know, I'm not a developer. Maybe someone could help me out.
They know they can "release" the corporate version because exactly zero large companies will buy it, and they won't have to actually deliver. Or, they can take the order, and ship, in 6-8 weeks (pulling a play from the Apple playbook).
So, if MS does not include an OS update within that time frame, corporations are going to be furious. So, this basically means that Vista will not slip beyond the end of 2006, but the quality is going to massively suffer. Something will be shipping this year, but I sure wouldn't want to touch it.
Apple will never licence OS X (I hope) and the PC market is way too huge to just pack up and leave and convince everyone to buy a Mac. If they did licence OS X, I think they could gain control down the line (years and years from now), but it would be the ruin of everything I love about the Mac. The problem with PCs, other than Windows, is that there are just too many cooks in the kitchen.
This does, however, allow us Mac users to gloat a bit about the superiority of our preferred OS which, although produced by a significantly smaller team than MS has working on their inferior product, has released outstanding upgrades several times (if not too many).
Then again maybe not, since MS has officially renounced 64-bit versions out of the initial Vista mix. Or they could be revamping to follow Apple's OS model. Then we would see Vista 1.0 in 2007, followed by Vista 1.1 in 2008, 1.2 in 2009, etc. just like OS X has gone from 10.0 to 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, 10.4. By the time Microsoft got to Vista 1.12 they'd have all the features they origianlly announced for Longhorn finally in place.
Personally, I expect Apple to introduce a hefty chunk of Merom, Conroe, Woodcrest products @ August 2006 WWDC with a balance of the line transitioning to them in January 2007. By WWDC 2007, hopefully Yonah will be completely phased out of the Apple line-up.
http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/p...a/default.mspx
Every customer with Microsoft Software Assurance receives access to new versions of licensed software released during the term of the agreement. Having new version rights to the latest Microsoft software provides flexibility and simplifies the software procurement process, shortens the business planning cycle, and enables you to deploy solutions at your own pace. With the New Version Rights benefit, you can also lower the costs associated with acquiring new version releases and take immediate advantage of the latest technology.
Originally posted by Quevar
MS if under huge pressure from some major corporations to get Vista out to businesses by Dec. 31, 2006. In 2003, MS announced an contract that corporations could sign up for that would include all updates and upgrades for a set amount of money. It was assumed in that cotract that an OS upgrade would be included. I can't remember the name of the program. If anyone knows what I'm talking about, please let me know.
So, if MS does not include an OS update within that time frame, corporations are going to be furious. So, this basically means that Vista will not slip beyond the end of 2006, but the quality is going to massively suffer. Something will be shipping this year, but I sure wouldn't want to touch it.
Originally posted by ghstmars
will this be the right time to license ( if they ever do ) mac os x? just want to hear your feedback.
They need to do it before OSX for Intel can easily run on a generic PC box via an downloadable hack (and it *will* happen). If they don't license OSX, then perhaps their mindset is to allow for a viral outbreak of OSX on generic PCs - then license it at some point in the future.
Could Apple create a kiosk that it could deploy to most big computer stores that has a Mac Mini, a MacBook Pro and an iPod? Something like the kiosks in every store that have Xboxes and PS2's. Something store managers only need to plug in and perhaps set up to connect to a wifi router and let the products sell themselves!!!!
Put them in as endpieces to the ailes of pc boxes and you could show the "look" of the Mac while people walk by wondering where Vista is... might be an idea.
Originally posted by scavanger
I don't see how this has anything to do with bluray. Bluray is going to be cost prohibitive to most consumers for atleast a year or two. If you want Apple to add a drive that'll up the price of their systems by 200 to 300 dollars go for it. I'll laugh at you when the company is bankrupt.
That's where the PS3 part comes in.
If Sony can actually get the thing out the door, you get an abrupt and wide spread up-take of Blueray players into the living rooms of the world.
Which drives studio Blueray DVD releases and gives you an easy way to play the Blueray DVD burns of your HD home movies (HD consumer camcorders are proliferating and dropping in price as we speak) on your HD set (sales of which are exploding). We're very close to the tipping point where SD starts to feel like "obsolete tech", in the way that black and white television did after the introduction of color.
The big hang-up is the cost of blank media, which is in fact prohibitive at the moment; but the speed at which that drops is contingent on volume sales and the PS3 will really help in that area.
The other suggestions about advertising are far more practical and realistic, you guys need to think these through a bit more before posting them.
Originally posted by scavanger
Did I miss the big sale on HD TVs and all these HD Camcorders?
HD sets to comprise majority of total unit sales in 2006
Sanyo HD1 flash based HD camcorder, $798.
Prices are dropping so fast on HD camcorders it's hard to keep track. Manufacturers are getting out new models as fast as they can.
What was the price of the stand alone Bluray players? 500 dollars and up? I don't know what you expect but in a economy where fuel and energy costs are rising, educations and medical costs are up, you expect mainstream consumers to buy all new media that is expected to cost up to 30 dollars a movie by the end of this year right when the technology comes out? Am I the only one who thinks this is the nonsense or what?
So I guess these hard hit consumers won't be buying MacBook pros, or new Mac towers, or iMacs, the very models most likely to sport an HD media option, since they are luxury items. By that metric it doesn't really matter what Apple does or does not offer, since the rising cost of living rules out most of the consumer electronics on the market. Oh, and purchase cost of a movie does not equal rental cost. Rental dominates the market, so what's your point?
And are you arguing against the adoption of Blueray, specifically, or the viability of the HD market, in general? I can't tell. At any rate, the latter impacts the former, and sales of HD sets belie your dim view of the usefulness or desirability of HD formats.
The intelligent power users (such as the people who spend 10 grand on home theather, and most of the people of webforums like this) will be sitting on the fence until one format wins, I know I will.
Sure. And the PS3 gives a big boost to Blueray "winning". Not sure why "intelligence" is contingent on expensive home theater systems, though. Lots of middle class folks have modest "system in a box" HT set-ups coupled with an HD display.
Not only that you are hoping for a sucessful world wide launch of the PS3 this November, provided that I doubt we'll get close to even 1 million consols for the US market.
I'm not "hoping" for anything. You apparently have me confused with some kind of Blueray enthusiast/partisan. I'm merely making the observation that when a major player like Sony starts putting Blueray in what is likely to be a big selling box, it moves the needle towards Blueray.
At any rate, no serious observer doubts that the PS3 will be "successful", and a few months of supply constraints does not equal the "years out" scenario you're proposing.
You are also hoping that Apple, who has yet to make a media center style PC will sell it at an attractive price point for the mainstream consumer.
What is it with you and my imaginary "hopes"? I think Apple will offer a Blueray option. Maybe for the people that are running iMovie HD and don't currently have anyway of transferring their movies? Nah, that whole iMovie HD thing is just a random glitch.
And since when is Apple about "attractive price points for the main stream consumer"? Last time I checked, I could buy a no-name PC with a printer and a LCD monitor for $300, after rebates, at Walmart. That's one hell of an attractive price point, and it has absolutely nothing to do with how Apple structures their business.
It was only last year that they considered DVD to be common place with most people. Hell I know people that just got their first DVD players last christmas.
OK, now your just making shit up. DVD had the fastest uptake of any consumer electronic device in history, and had become ubiquitous well before "last year". I know people that just got online, I guess this whole internet thing is just starting to show some promise.
See also "HD sets to comprise majority etc" above.
The other suggestions about advertising are far more practical and realistic, you guys need to think these through a bit more before posting them. [/B]
And you might refrain from peddling your vague notions as established fact.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr..._id=1002076585
Goes on about rental prices, $25 is far too much for me to pay for a rental.
I shall respond to the other comments when i have time later
Originally posted by scavanger
I have nothing against either format, I would prefer HD DVD for it's less restrictive rules but thats more of a personal preference.
Agreed.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr..._id=1002076585
Goes on about rental prices, $25 is far too much for me to pay for a rental.
Hadn't seen that. It strikes as the kind of clueless daydreaming that the entertainment industry likes to indulge in.
A 60 day $25 rental is a non-starter. If they're stupid enough to try it they'll find that out quickly enough.
My guess is that rentals will start at under $10 and drop from there. Cheap enough to get the early adopters on board, although still too pricey for really broad, "replaces DVD" action.
Still, my contention is that commercial sales of movie titles doesn't have that much impact on whether or not Apple would choose to add an HD media option to their computers (given the advantages for back-up and getting your home HD stuff on a playable medium), and given the drift of things it looks like Blueray has the upper hand (not just the PS3, but studios signed up, number of player manufacturers committed to the format, etc,)
For what it's worth, I would prefer to see HD DVD prevail, as well. I just don't think it will.
Originally posted by sunilraman
Wow. Never imagined a Microsoft delay would cause such a bloody frenzy like this
It's not every day that the chum of the computer world get to have a feeding frenzy.