The only card I know of that features a hybrid ROM is an ATi one with BIOS and OpenFirmware. I know of no card that supports both BIOS and EFI. I'm sure it's possible; I just don't believe ATi or nVidia have done it at this point.
...I know of no card that supports both BIOS and EFI...
I'm about 99% certain that the Apple 7300 does. I even made that assertion on the Strangedogs forum and none of the Mods has challenged it yet. Of course, they (Strangedogs Mods) haven't had the actual 7300 ROM very long, so they may not have had a chance to study it yet. But it's about the only way to explain the size of the ROM and the fact that it will boot a normal PC and a MacPro. It almost has to have a dual platform ROM.
It would also be safe to assume that a future PC Video card that supports both BIOS and EFI might have a 128kb ROM chip onboard rather than the standard 64kb one. But, the actual 'Meat' of the ROM code is not very large, so it might be possible that the PC Card makers might fit a Dual ROM on a standard 64kb ROM chip. Whereas, we know that the Apple Dual ROM 7300 uses a 128kb ROM chip.
It's still early, I'm interested in what the Strangedogs people have to say about the 7300 ROM
I'm about 99% certain that the Apple 7300 does. I even made that assertion on the Strangedogs forum and none of the Mods has challenged it yet. Of course, they (Strangedogs Mods) haven't had the actual 7300 ROM very long, so they may not have had a chance to study it yet. But it's about the only way to explain the size of the ROM and the fact that it will boot a normal PC and a MacPro. It almost has to have a dual platform ROM.
The 7300 does, my friend popped his (from his mac pro) in his PC and it worked fine.
I think it was macrumors.com someone did a ROM dump and found 2 ROMs on the card.
This is part of the reason that I believe that Apple has no intentions of allowing OSX to work with standard PC ROMs. They put a standard PC ROM on their OEM card and then coded OSX not to use it! They only want OSX to work with the Apple based EFI ROM. And when the PC card makers change to EFI cards, they will have the same basic PC ROM on them. The same basic PC ROM that Apple has coded OSX not to work with!
And then throw in the fact that the Hackintoshers have OSX booting and trying to use the standard PC ROM found on their PC video cards without success. Those people are actually now trying to rewrite the OSX video drivers to work with the standard PC ROM. They've been trying for over a year. And I have a very strong feeling that if Apple even allows the MacPro to boot from an EFI PC ROM video card, we'll find ourselves in the same position as the Hackintoshers. The standard OSX video drivers will not work with the standard PC ROM. And to quote one of the people at InsanelyMac, OSX without video acceleration is basically useless.
And if this is the same Slughead that made the post 'Newbie with a Mac Pro' at Strangedogs, you probably heard that from me. I'm Tbarr at Strangedogs
I always hope Mac users choose that platform because they're willing to break with a few norms and actually move forward one little step at the time, but every single time the graphics card discussion comes up, I'm presented with people who, rather, blindly defend a hacked, broken, non-standard technique from the late 70s / early 80s over two far superior, standardized but not as widely deplyoed, techniques from the early and mid-90s.
This is part of the reason that I believe that Apple has no intentions of allowing OSX to work with standard PC ROMs. They put a standard PC ROM on their OEM card and then coded OSX not to use it! They only want OSX to work with the Apple based EFI ROM. And when the PC card makers change to EFI cards, they will have the same basic PC ROM on them. The same basic PC ROM that Apple has coded OSX not to work with!
And then throw in the fact that the Hackintoshers have OSX booting and trying to use the standard PC ROM found on their PC video cards without success. Those people are actually now trying to rewrite the OSX video drivers to work with the standard PC ROM. They've been trying for over a year. And I have a very strong feeling that if Apple even allows the MacPro to boot from an EFI PC ROM video card, we'll find ourselves in the same position as the Hackintoshers. The standard OSX video drivers will not work with the standard PC ROM. And to quote one of the people at InsanelyMac, OSX without video acceleration is basically useless.
The Macvidia drivers work with 2d, and CoreImage/Quartz Extreme are almost done.
Anyway, does OS X authenticate with the EFI chip? Could one install the hacked 10.4.6 image w/o any cracks, and use a regular card with the Macvidia drivers like the Hackintoshes? It should install perfectly under the BIOS layer. I guess you'd just need the restore discs that came with the Mac Pro.
You'd still risk having updates blow up on you. Your best bet would be to find a way to use TDM, and swap some files with hacked ones, then swap them back when you have to update. That's probably not very easy.
You'd still risk having updates blow up on you. Your best bet would be to find a way to use TDM, and swap some files with hacked ones, then swap them back when you have to update. That's probably not very easy.
But the Mac Pro still has the TPM chip. Anyone with a Mac Pro want to test this hypothesis?
Right after I made that last post my ATI x850 Pro arrived. I've been hip deep ever since. I think I finally got it working, so, I need to go over to Strangedogs and post about it before I forget more than I already have 8)
I really don't know that much about Hackintoshers other than I stopped reading the install instructions after I read something about installing it on a BIOS based PC, on a disc image, or something like that. I just wanted to try and find out how they got OSX past the Black screen firmware (ROM) hangup.
Well now it makes me wonder if you can crossfire a pair of X1900XT's?
Needless to say I think it's obvious Apples MacPro is capable of using both SLI, and Crossfire, and Apple, and ATI should update their drivers for the MacPro. People shouldn't have to go through all this trouble for this.
No, it's the fact that Mac OS X uses EFI and needs an EFI ROM.
I know that. I meant assuming you could get EFI ROM onto an XTX Crossfire card, your XT might work because of the softmodding, and an XT ROM might work on an XTX since they're the same card.
I know that. I meant assuming you could get EFI ROM onto an XTX Crossfire card, your XT might work because of the softmodding, and an XT ROM might work on an XTX since they're the same card.
But the problem there is that the standard ATI ROM chip isn't big enough to fit both the BIOS and EFI ROMs; that's what's so custom about these X1900 XTs, they have extra-large ROM chips.
Comments
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=223663
That alone tells me that EFI has a BIOS compatibility layer as the 7900GTX isn't an EFI card,
Oh, I guess you must have missed the very first part of the first post in there, which said so eloquently:
Although the Mac OS doesn't see this card at all (no video at startup)
oh, and that thing called Boot Camp. That uses the layer too.
Not for video.
Oh, I guess you must have missed the very first part of the first post in there, which said so eloquently:
That's because of the double-roms. Like I said in my earlier post. iirc, the card *does* show up in OS X, but you can't use it in OS X.
Once hacked Mac Pro OS X comes around though, I could see that changing..
That's because of the double-roms.
The only card I know of that features a hybrid ROM is an ATi one with BIOS and OpenFirmware. I know of no card that supports both BIOS and EFI. I'm sure it's possible; I just don't believe ATi or nVidia have done it at this point.
...I know of no card that supports both BIOS and EFI...
I'm about 99% certain that the Apple 7300 does. I even made that assertion on the Strangedogs forum and none of the Mods has challenged it yet. Of course, they (Strangedogs Mods) haven't had the actual 7300 ROM very long, so they may not have had a chance to study it yet. But it's about the only way to explain the size of the ROM and the fact that it will boot a normal PC and a MacPro. It almost has to have a dual platform ROM.
It would also be safe to assume that a future PC Video card that supports both BIOS and EFI might have a 128kb ROM chip onboard rather than the standard 64kb one. But, the actual 'Meat' of the ROM code is not very large, so it might be possible that the PC Card makers might fit a Dual ROM on a standard 64kb ROM chip. Whereas, we know that the Apple Dual ROM 7300 uses a 128kb ROM chip.
It's still early, I'm interested in what the Strangedogs people have to say about the 7300 ROM
I'm about 99% certain that the Apple 7300 does. I even made that assertion on the Strangedogs forum and none of the Mods has challenged it yet. Of course, they (Strangedogs Mods) haven't had the actual 7300 ROM very long, so they may not have had a chance to study it yet. But it's about the only way to explain the size of the ROM and the fact that it will boot a normal PC and a MacPro. It almost has to have a dual platform ROM.
The 7300 does, my friend popped his (from his mac pro) in his PC and it worked fine.
I think it was macrumors.com someone did a ROM dump and found 2 ROMs on the card.
The 7300 does, my friend popped his (from his mac pro) in his PC and it worked fine.
I think it was macrumors.com someone did a ROM dump and found 2 ROMs on the card.
That's a good sign.
That's a good sign.
Good in what way?
This is part of the reason that I believe that Apple has no intentions of allowing OSX to work with standard PC ROMs. They put a standard PC ROM on their OEM card and then coded OSX not to use it! They only want OSX to work with the Apple based EFI ROM. And when the PC card makers change to EFI cards, they will have the same basic PC ROM on them. The same basic PC ROM that Apple has coded OSX not to work with!
And then throw in the fact that the Hackintoshers have OSX booting and trying to use the standard PC ROM found on their PC video cards without success. Those people are actually now trying to rewrite the OSX video drivers to work with the standard PC ROM. They've been trying for over a year. And I have a very strong feeling that if Apple even allows the MacPro to boot from an EFI PC ROM video card, we'll find ourselves in the same position as the Hackintoshers. The standard OSX video drivers will not work with the standard PC ROM. And to quote one of the people at InsanelyMac, OSX without video acceleration is basically useless.
And if this is the same Slughead that made the post 'Newbie with a Mac Pro' at Strangedogs, you probably heard that from me. I'm Tbarr at Strangedogs
Good in what way?
This is part of the reason that I believe that Apple has no intentions of allowing OSX to work with standard PC ROMs. They put a standard PC ROM on their OEM card and then coded OSX not to use it! They only want OSX to work with the Apple based EFI ROM. And when the PC card makers change to EFI cards, they will have the same basic PC ROM on them. The same basic PC ROM that Apple has coded OSX not to work with!
And then throw in the fact that the Hackintoshers have OSX booting and trying to use the standard PC ROM found on their PC video cards without success. Those people are actually now trying to rewrite the OSX video drivers to work with the standard PC ROM. They've been trying for over a year. And I have a very strong feeling that if Apple even allows the MacPro to boot from an EFI PC ROM video card, we'll find ourselves in the same position as the Hackintoshers. The standard OSX video drivers will not work with the standard PC ROM. And to quote one of the people at InsanelyMac, OSX without video acceleration is basically useless.
The Macvidia drivers work with 2d, and CoreImage/Quartz Extreme are almost done.
Anyway, does OS X authenticate with the EFI chip? Could one install the hacked 10.4.6 image w/o any cracks, and use a regular card with the Macvidia drivers like the Hackintoshes? It should install perfectly under the BIOS layer. I guess you'd just need the restore discs that came with the Mac Pro.
You'd still risk having updates blow up on you. Your best bet would be to find a way to use TDM, and swap some files with hacked ones, then swap them back when you have to update. That's probably not very easy.
But the Mac Pro still has the TPM chip. Anyone with a Mac Pro want to test this hypothesis?
And if this is the same Slughead that made the post 'Newbie with a Mac Pro' at Strangedogs, you probably heard that from me. I'm Tbarr at Strangedogs
Yep! Hello again!
Right after I made that last post my ATI x850 Pro arrived. I've been hip deep ever since. I think I finally got it working, so, I need to go over to Strangedogs and post about it before I forget more than I already have 8)
I really don't know that much about Hackintoshers other than I stopped reading the install instructions after I read something about installing it on a BIOS based PC, on a disc image, or something like that. I just wanted to try and find out how they got OSX past the Black screen firmware (ROM) hangup.
Lots more playing to do with my new toy
Needless to say I think it's obvious Apples MacPro is capable of using both SLI, and Crossfire, and Apple, and ATI should update their drivers for the MacPro. People shouldn't have to go through all this trouble for this.
The same basic PC ROM that Apple has coded OSX not to work with!
No, it's the fact that Mac OS X uses EFI and needs an EFI ROM.
No, it's the fact that Mac OS X uses EFI and needs an EFI ROM.
I know that. I meant assuming you could get EFI ROM onto an XTX Crossfire card, your XT might work because of the softmodding, and an XT ROM might work on an XTX since they're the same card.
No, it's the fact that Mac OS X uses EFI and needs an EFI ROM.
Aww come on, he was having so much fun with his ludicrous little conspiracy theory. 8)
I know that. I meant assuming you could get EFI ROM onto an XTX Crossfire card, your XT might work because of the softmodding, and an XT ROM might work on an XTX since they're the same card.
But the problem there is that the standard ATI ROM chip isn't big enough to fit both the BIOS and EFI ROMs; that's what's so custom about these X1900 XTs, they have extra-large ROM chips.