?Why is everyone missing the fact that this phone/device will seamlessly switch between Edge and Wi-Fi saving big $$$ on data rates?? ?Because nobody bothers to post about what they LIKE. If Internetters can?t say something disparaging, they say nothing at all.
All phones with wifi in that I've used do this already be it HTC, Nokia or SE.
Jobs also said it won't do VoIP. So it would seem it'll switch to wifi for net use, email etc but won't for voice, which is crap, but understandable if they don't support UMA and haven't got Skype, Gizmo or whatever on there already. We're already seeing combined UMA phones and services in Europe yet Apple won't even allow a VoIP client on their phone. So much for reinventing the telephone.
Oh, calm down! Several times, both at the Keynote and in subsequent interviews, Jobs noted that there are more devices coming, and intimated more than once that a cell phone- less device is coming that will include much of this technology.
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
All phones with wifi in that I've used do this already be it HTC, Nokia or SE.
Jobs also said it won't do VoIP. So it would seem it'll switch to wifi for net use, email etc but won't for voice, which is crap, but understandable if they don't support UMA and haven't got Skype, Gizmo or whatever on there already. We're already seeing combined UMA phones and services in Europe yet Apple won't even allow a VoIP client on their phone. So much for reinventing the telephone.
As had been said many other places, the anology to the iPod introduction should be informing these discussions, and it isn't. Apple has almost never tried to compete on spec lists and features, but user experience, integration and ease of use. "iPod will fail at that price point", "iPod must have an FM radio or its nothing", "Voice recording on the iPod is absolutely necessary", etc. The same is/will be true for the iPhone. We won't know if it will succeed or not until its in the wild and real people can use the interface but its the interface, not the features, that will make this phone fly and will (if successful) reinvent the mobile phone/device. I would feel safe saying that anyone who says that current mobile phone software/interfaces are mature and usable is very much on the geek end of the tech scale (and that's not a bad thing ) This phone is NOT aimed at them.
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
If you had paid any attention at all in the last week after the keynote, Jobs or other senior execs have given several interviews to various journalists where they have said exactly that. CNBC had just such an interview later last Tuesday. In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
And of course, he didn't say so specifically during the keynote - he WAS talking about the iPhone then huh? But he did mention "other devices". In so many words.
It's been all over, maybe you should, like, actually READ stuff before spouting off.
In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
Maybe you ought to provide some links to back up what you say then.
The company has not decided on whether or not a user's existing music library can be used for ringtones.
This is the dealbreaker for me. If I can only get ringtones from rogers(I imagine will be the canadian provider) I'm completely uninterested.
There is no reason why on a music playing phone to have to buy ringtones from the cell provider.
I made my own ringtones for my pos Moto L2(don't laugh it was free and my ericson died on me) and transferred them by bluetooth and you're telling me I can't do that on apple's legendary iPhone.
As had been said many other places, the anology to the iPod introduction should be informing these discussions, and it isn't. Apple has almost never tried to compete on spec lists and features, but user experience, integration and ease of use. "iPod will fail at that price point", "iPod must have an FM radio or its nothing", "Voice recording on the iPod is absolutely necessary", etc. The same is/will be true for the iPhone. We won't know if it will succeed or not until its in the wild and real people can use the interface but its the interface, not the features, that will make this phone fly and will (if successful) reinvent the mobile phone/device. I would feel safe saying that anyone who says that current mobile phone software/interfaces are mature and usable is very much on the geek end of the tech scale (and that's not a bad thing ) This phone is NOT aimed at them.
QFT.
It's the interface, it's the interface, it's the interface.
I made the rounds over the weekend to phone stores and checked out the latest and greatest smart phones, PDA phones, internet tablets, etc.
Horrifying. I can hardly believe that people are arguing that whatever Palm/Windows Mobile/Symbian thing they're carrying around makes the iPhone irrelevant. Yes, I know you have mastered the interface on your Blackberry and can type 110 words a minute on the thumb board.
Got news for you: the interfaces on these things are horrible. Even the Nokia 770, which has all kinds of room, has a cheap and crummy feeling interface. Not only that, but most of the devices themselves feel cheap and plasticy and crummy.
iPhone overpriced? We know for sure that it will look and feel top notch. We can see that the interface is a whole different order of usability compared to what's out there.
I think the big mistake is assuming at the price point the only market for the iPhone is people who already buy smart phones, i.e. business users, geeks and techophiles.
Looking at the offerings already out there, it's pretty clear why these things are limited to a particular demographic, and I don't think it's entirely about price.
What I think is going to happen is that people are going to walk into the Cingular or Apple store pretty sure that they would never in this world spend $500 on a phone, play with one, and suddenly realize that they will pay $500 for a phone-- the iPhone is going to radically expand the potential market for mobile communication devices.
What I think is going to happen is that people are going to walk into the Cingular or Apple store pretty sure that they would never in this world spend $500 on a phone, play with one, and suddenly realize that they will pay $500 for a phone-- the iPhone is going to radically expand the potential market for mobile communication devices.
The original iPod sold quite well for $400 with only 5GB HDD and a monochrome display, and the original iPod Photo (only two years ago) sold quite well at $500.
A higher price will surely drive away some people looking for a "killer deal", but will bring in many more looking for a "killer solution". Boom!
The original iPod sold quite well for $400 with only 5GB HDD and a monochrome display, and the original iPod Photo (only two years ago) sold quite well at $500. Boom!
Sigh.......\
Both are (sadly, but proudly) displayed on my bookshelf.
Did you have to remind me -- just when I am beginning to come to terms with the fact that another $500 will fly out of my wallet soon.........
Maybe you ought to provide some links to back up what you say then.
I've been to dozens of websites in the last week, these interviews (or accounts of them) are not hard to find. Like I said, CNBC did a widely distributed interview with Jobs last Tuesday.
If you can't be bothered to look for yourself, then I won't do it for you. If you choose not to believe me, then, c'est la vie it's your loss for not knowing. Information is easy to find, and these interviews are not hidden or hard to find out about.
Besides, this issue if easy. Look at Apple's past history. They historically put out a new device; kind of "run it up the flagpole" and see what happens. It is rare for them to put out a new device with full functionality. They've got to leave some features for future releases, that is practically an industry standard in consumer electronics. You know, milk the customers for all they'll give?
I'm sorry, anybody that complains about one of Apple's first generation devices being feature scarce hasn't really looked at history, and doesn't understand marketing. The signs are there to see if only you're willing to look.
Apple lack of awareness regarding 3G and how Europeans, I mean it's only the biggest market economy after all and you can use 3G almost everywhere including in ex-communist states, using high-end pricey phones with 3G is pretty staggering.
And why would I want to be forced to buy rigtones and applications only from Apple or Cingular when my Nokia can use any regular MP3 and Symbian S60-based application just fine - WTF?
Apple lack of awareness regarding 3G and how Europeans, I mean it's only the biggest market economy after all and you can use 3G almost everywhere including in ex-communist states, using high-end pricey phones with 3G is pretty staggering.
Do you know that the phone won't be rolling out to Europe until next year? 3G has been confirmed, all we know is that it probably won't be in the first model that will only be sold in the US. I would not be surprised if the model being sold in the EU will get 3G.
Apple lack of awareness regarding 3G and how Europeans, I mean it's only the biggest market economy after all and you can use 3G almost everywhere including in ex-communist states, using high-end pricey phones with 3G is pretty staggering.
You making some very odd conclusions here. As JeffDM pointed out, the phone will have 3G tech by the time it his Europe. Jobs said this feature is coming during the keynote. Since Europe has wide coverage of HSDPA it makes since that it would be included in the non-US phones. However, there are some valid reason as to why this isn't being rolled out in the US right away.
Cingular doesn't have significant HSDPA coverage. When they do, then Apple will release a new phone and get even more money from the early adopters.
HSDPA comes at a cost. It uses significantly more battery life and processing resources than EDGE.
Cingular's media network is already being jeopardized by the iPhone. They may have a contingency in their contract for Apple that prevent HSDPA from being added in the US for the first year (scenario).
Quote:
Originally Posted by ioport
And why would I want to be forced to buy rigtones and applications only from Apple or Cingular when my Nokia can use any regular MP3 and Symbian S60-based application just fine - WTF?
There are many reasons why the iPhone is closed. The iPod is closed and that seems to do well. Since it does run a version of OS X, you may see there are many hacks for the it coming along.
As for ringtones, this isn't Apple's doing. Apple would rather you buy a song for song on the iTS for $.99 instead of paying $1.99 - $2.49 for a ringtone at Cingular. This is clearly Cingular trying to maintain one of its overly inflated services.
Come June, you may fine Cingular has special plans (especially data rates) for iPhone customers. Unless their contract with Apple specifically states otherwise, they will probably try to charge more to make up for there other loses of supplemental income and the revamping of their network that was required to get the iPhone contract in the first place (i:e: Visual Voicemail).
If you had paid any attention at all in the last week after the keynote, Jobs or other senior execs have given several interviews to various journalists where they have said exactly that.
Please cite, otherwise I'll just assume you're being shitty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahrens
CNBC had just such an interview later last Tuesday. In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
I'm in the UK so I'm not likely to have seen CNBC. I generally read Macworld, the various rumour sites, Daring Fireball (and the links from that to the NYTimes, WSJ and Time amongst others), Ars Technica, TUAW, Engadget and BBC News. None of which have mentioned any other devices. So, it's strange that the tech sites have all missed these mentions of other devices you say Apple have made. The BBC Click program I've just watched even went as far as pointing out that Apple had made NO mention of a widescreen iPod and interviewed Phil Schiller and people annoyed that Apple hadn't mentioned a new device - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programme...ne/default.stm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahrens
And of course, he didn't say so specifically during the keynote - he WAS talking about the iPhone then huh? But he did mention "other devices". In so many words.
'In so many words?' - ie. he didn't make any specific claims at all. He sure did mention 'other devices' but those were competitors other devices like a Treo or Blackberry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahrens
It's been all over, maybe you should, like, actually READ stuff before spouting off.
I have, I've read way too much this past week, and I've quite possibly not read everything still. It's been a media deluge but maybe I've been looking in the wrong places and so have all the journos that write the tech sites. If you can point me out to where Jobs, Schiller, Joswiak or whoever at Apple in any of the interviews they've given have mentioned other devices then please do. That's all I was asking.
As JeffDM pointed out, the phone will have 3G tech by the time it his Europe.
Until it ships in Europe, nobody can actually be sure of that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
HSDPA comes at a cost. It uses significantly more battery life and processing resources than EDGE.
I think this is overstated. 3G/HSDPA only consumes more power when you're actually using it. For the most part, 3G phones drop back into non-3G GSM mode when they aren't doing data. Where I live, I've marginal 3G coverage sometimes and my phone is always dropping in and out of 3G. I've even a hack to permanently set it to the slower non UMTS 3G speeds since it's actually quite annoying waiting for it to switch.
Even still, I didn't notice that much difference in power consumption between my 2.5G p910i and 3G p990 - both similar phones and simlarly specced to the iPhone. The p990 being better specced comms wise at least. Its possible the battery is bigger in the p990 of course to cope but I've not checked. Apple's obsession with making things uber-thin sometimes stops them from offering useful features - like 3G and a long replaceable battery life.
Aside from that, it's got WiFi built in. My p990 drained much quicker with WiFi enabled than running 3G. I think the power argument is a red herring thrown into the mix by Apple to compensate for the cock up of the missing 3G features. Designing things in California is maybe too insular.
I once had a chat with a product designer for bike shoes based in California who'd gone through 3 generations of 'Winter Boot' that had a terrible low-tread sole and no studs in it. His excuse was 'It's never muddy here'. I was tempted to send him a box of UK mud via FedEx and explain it's like that 9 months of the year in the UK and we wear winter boots in Spring and Autumn (sorry 'Fall') too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
There are many reasons why the iPhone is closed. The iPod is closed and that seems to do well. Since it does run a version of OS X, you may see there are many hacks for the it coming along.
I'm sure there will be but if Apple has 'fixed' it so that only signed apps work on the iPhone like Symbian have done in SymbianOS9 then the propensity for 3rd parties to write software is much lessened even with a hack to get them on there. The iPod isn't a Smart Phone so isn't expected to have applications installed on it. Most people expect smart phones to have installable apps and geeks expect to be able to write software for them.
When Jobs mentioned Widgets, my first thought was 'Cool! I can port the Nabaztag widget over and send it messages from my phone'. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if I can't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
As for ringtones, this isn't Apple's doing. Apple would rather you buy a song for song on the iTS for $.99 instead of paying $1.99 - $2.49 for a ringtone at Cingular. This is clearly Cingular trying to maintain one of its overly inflated services.
Come June, you may fine Cingular has special plans (especially data rates) for iPhone customers. Unless their contract with Apple specifically states otherwise, they will probably try to charge more to make up for there other loses of supplemental income and the revamping of their network that was required to get the iPhone contract in the first place (i:e: Visual Voicemail).
So much for "Apple being Apple and Cingular being Cingular". It would seem they're already tripping over each other. Of course, this is complete nonsense here in Europe and I hope Apple have more room to be Apple when they aren't tied to typical US carrier behaviour.
Please cite, otherwise I'll just assume you're being shitty.
Sorry, assume what you wish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aegisdesign
I'm in the UK so I'm not likely to have seen CNBC. I generally read Macworld, the various rumour sites, Daring Fireball (and the links from that to the NYTimes, WSJ and Time amongst others), Ars Technica, TUAW, Engadget and BBC News. None of which have mentioned any other devices. So, it's strange that the tech sites have all missed these mentions of other devices you say Apple have made. The BBC Click program I've just watched even went as far as pointing out that Apple had made NO mention of a widescreen iPod and interviewed Phil Schiller and people annoyed that Apple hadn't mentioned a new device - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programme...ne/default.stm
You don't have to see it on TV. The interview was streamed from several sites, including YouTube.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aegisdesign
'In so many words?' - ie. he didn't make any specific claims at all. He sure did mention 'other devices' but those were competitors other devices like a Treo or Blackberry.
Sure he did, you just didn't listen. He didn't mention specific devices. since when has Apple done that, anyway? I said "in so many words", and I mean just that he said they would be releasing other devices just as cool as iPhone - extrapolate from that what you will.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aegisdesign
I have, I've read way too much this past week, and I've quite possibly not read everything still. It's been a media deluge but maybe I've been looking in the wrong places and so have all the journos that write the tech sites. If you can point me out to where Jobs, Schiller, Joswiak or whoever at Apple in any of the interviews they've given have mentioned other devices then please do. That's all I was asking.
Sorry, you should go to such places as MacWorld, or World of Apple, or MacObserver, or MacDailyNews, or MacRumors, The Apple Blog, Looprumors, or any of a dozen other Mac centric sites. Look back in their entries from last week, and you'll see mention of those interviews. Job's comments have been talked about, picked apart and analyzed in hundreds of thousands of words.
Like I said, I don't care if you don't believe me or not. It's not my problem, and you can call me shitty, stinky, or any other crappy name you wish. I've read it, and I've given good reasons why it makes sense anyway, so go look for it if you are really curious. If you don't, you aren't really interested in learning anything, you're just blowing smoke.
You make claims that no on else has heard and then call people names for not locating these "easily" found news articles themselves. You don't sound credible if you can't back these claims up. Luckily, you have an entire database of databases ready to help you search for whatever you want.
It's logical to assume that this touchscreen technology will be introduced to the next iPod Video. After all, we've all seen the fake iPod Video pics long before the fake iPhone pics came around.
If you can't be bothered to look for yourself, then I won't do it for you. If you choose not to believe me, then, c'est la vie it's your loss for not knowing. Information is easy to find, and these interviews are not hidden or hard to find out about.
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
Agreed. And I read many rumours websites too. At the beginning he said he said something along the lines of having more announcements in the next few months, but that was when he was talking about Macs (felt like a whole minute ) . Apart from that it's often repeated that he said 3G was coming, but wifi-less iPods? Nope
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
I know it's not assured but I don't think it's too far off the mark to assume that some of those features will show up in other parts of the iPod line. A lot of times, design cues in a new Apple product eventually show up in other models, even in unrelated product lines.
Comments
I think the best quote from the Pogue article is
Quote:
?Why is everyone missing the fact that this phone/device will seamlessly switch between Edge and Wi-Fi saving big $$$ on data rates?? ?Because nobody bothers to post about what they LIKE. If Internetters can?t say something disparaging, they say nothing at all.
All phones with wifi in that I've used do this already be it HTC, Nokia or SE.
Jobs also said it won't do VoIP. So it would seem it'll switch to wifi for net use, email etc but won't for voice, which is crap, but understandable if they don't support UMA and haven't got Skype, Gizmo or whatever on there already. We're already seeing combined UMA phones and services in Europe yet Apple won't even allow a VoIP client on their phone. So much for reinventing the telephone.
Oh, calm down! Several times, both at the Keynote and in subsequent interviews, Jobs noted that there are more devices coming, and intimated more than once that a cell phone- less device is coming that will include much of this technology.
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
All phones with wifi in that I've used do this already be it HTC, Nokia or SE.
Jobs also said it won't do VoIP. So it would seem it'll switch to wifi for net use, email etc but won't for voice, which is crap, but understandable if they don't support UMA and haven't got Skype, Gizmo or whatever on there already. We're already seeing combined UMA phones and services in Europe yet Apple won't even allow a VoIP client on their phone. So much for reinventing the telephone.
As had been said many other places, the anology to the iPod introduction should be informing these discussions, and it isn't. Apple has almost never tried to compete on spec lists and features, but user experience, integration and ease of use. "iPod will fail at that price point", "iPod must have an FM radio or its nothing", "Voice recording on the iPod is absolutely necessary", etc. The same is/will be true for the iPhone. We won't know if it will succeed or not until its in the wild and real people can use the interface but its the interface, not the features, that will make this phone fly and will (if successful) reinvent the mobile phone/device. I would feel safe saying that anyone who says that current mobile phone software/interfaces are mature and usable is very much on the geek end of the tech scale
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
If you had paid any attention at all in the last week after the keynote, Jobs or other senior execs have given several interviews to various journalists where they have said exactly that. CNBC had just such an interview later last Tuesday. In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
And of course, he didn't say so specifically during the keynote - he WAS talking about the iPhone then huh? But he did mention "other devices". In so many words.
It's been all over, maybe you should, like, actually READ stuff before spouting off.
In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
Maybe you ought to provide some links to back up what you say then.
The company has not decided on whether or not a user's existing music library can be used for ringtones.
This is the dealbreaker for me. If I can only get ringtones from rogers(I imagine will be the canadian provider) I'm completely uninterested.
There is no reason why on a music playing phone to have to buy ringtones from the cell provider.
I made my own ringtones for my pos Moto L2(don't laugh it was free and my ericson died on me) and transferred them by bluetooth and you're telling me I can't do that on apple's legendary iPhone.
f**k iPhone then.
As had been said many other places, the anology to the iPod introduction should be informing these discussions, and it isn't. Apple has almost never tried to compete on spec lists and features, but user experience, integration and ease of use. "iPod will fail at that price point", "iPod must have an FM radio or its nothing", "Voice recording on the iPod is absolutely necessary", etc. The same is/will be true for the iPhone. We won't know if it will succeed or not until its in the wild and real people can use the interface but its the interface, not the features, that will make this phone fly and will (if successful) reinvent the mobile phone/device. I would feel safe saying that anyone who says that current mobile phone software/interfaces are mature and usable is very much on the geek end of the tech scale
QFT.
It's the interface, it's the interface, it's the interface.
I made the rounds over the weekend to phone stores and checked out the latest and greatest smart phones, PDA phones, internet tablets, etc.
Horrifying. I can hardly believe that people are arguing that whatever Palm/Windows Mobile/Symbian thing they're carrying around makes the iPhone irrelevant. Yes, I know you have mastered the interface on your Blackberry and can type 110 words a minute on the thumb board.
Got news for you: the interfaces on these things are horrible. Even the Nokia 770, which has all kinds of room, has a cheap and crummy feeling interface. Not only that, but most of the devices themselves feel cheap and plasticy and crummy.
iPhone overpriced? We know for sure that it will look and feel top notch. We can see that the interface is a whole different order of usability compared to what's out there.
I think the big mistake is assuming at the price point the only market for the iPhone is people who already buy smart phones, i.e. business users, geeks and techophiles.
Looking at the offerings already out there, it's pretty clear why these things are limited to a particular demographic, and I don't think it's entirely about price.
What I think is going to happen is that people are going to walk into the Cingular or Apple store pretty sure that they would never in this world spend $500 on a phone, play with one, and suddenly realize that they will pay $500 for a phone-- the iPhone is going to radically expand the potential market for mobile communication devices.
What I think is going to happen is that people are going to walk into the Cingular or Apple store pretty sure that they would never in this world spend $500 on a phone, play with one, and suddenly realize that they will pay $500 for a phone-- the iPhone is going to radically expand the potential market for mobile communication devices.
The original iPod sold quite well for $400 with only 5GB HDD and a monochrome display, and the original iPod Photo (only two years ago) sold quite well at $500.
A higher price will surely drive away some people looking for a "killer deal", but will bring in many more looking for a "killer solution". Boom!
The original iPod sold quite well for $400 with only 5GB HDD and a monochrome display, and the original iPod Photo (only two years ago) sold quite well at $500. Boom!
Sigh.......
Both are (sadly, but proudly) displayed on my bookshelf.
Did you have to remind me -- just when I am beginning to come to terms with the fact that another $500 will fly out of my wallet soon.........
Maybe you ought to provide some links to back up what you say then.
I've been to dozens of websites in the last week, these interviews (or accounts of them) are not hard to find. Like I said, CNBC did a widely distributed interview with Jobs last Tuesday.
If you can't be bothered to look for yourself, then I won't do it for you. If you choose not to believe me, then, c'est la vie it's your loss for not knowing. Information is easy to find, and these interviews are not hidden or hard to find out about.
Besides, this issue if easy. Look at Apple's past history. They historically put out a new device; kind of "run it up the flagpole" and see what happens. It is rare for them to put out a new device with full functionality. They've got to leave some features for future releases, that is practically an industry standard in consumer electronics. You know, milk the customers for all they'll give?
I'm sorry, anybody that complains about one of Apple's first generation devices being feature scarce hasn't really looked at history, and doesn't understand marketing. The signs are there to see if only you're willing to look.
And why would I want to be forced to buy rigtones and applications only from Apple or Cingular when my Nokia can use any regular MP3 and Symbian S60-based application just fine - WTF?
Apple lack of awareness regarding 3G and how Europeans, I mean it's only the biggest market economy after all and you can use 3G almost everywhere including in ex-communist states, using high-end pricey phones with 3G is pretty staggering.
Do you know that the phone won't be rolling out to Europe until next year? 3G has been confirmed, all we know is that it probably won't be in the first model that will only be sold in the US. I would not be surprised if the model being sold in the EU will get 3G.
Apple lack of awareness regarding 3G and how Europeans, I mean it's only the biggest market economy after all and you can use 3G almost everywhere including in ex-communist states, using high-end pricey phones with 3G is pretty staggering.
You making some very odd conclusions here. As JeffDM pointed out, the phone will have 3G tech by the time it his Europe. Jobs said this feature is coming during the keynote. Since Europe has wide coverage of HSDPA it makes since that it would be included in the non-US phones. However, there are some valid reason as to why this isn't being rolled out in the US right away.
And why would I want to be forced to buy rigtones and applications only from Apple or Cingular when my Nokia can use any regular MP3 and Symbian S60-based application just fine - WTF?
There are many reasons why the iPhone is closed. The iPod is closed and that seems to do well. Since it does run a version of OS X, you may see there are many hacks for the it coming along.
As for ringtones, this isn't Apple's doing. Apple would rather you buy a song for song on the iTS for $.99 instead of paying $1.99 - $2.49 for a ringtone at Cingular. This is clearly Cingular trying to maintain one of its overly inflated services.
Come June, you may fine Cingular has special plans (especially data rates) for iPhone customers. Unless their contract with Apple specifically states otherwise, they will probably try to charge more to make up for there other loses of supplemental income and the revamping of their network that was required to get the iPhone contract in the first place (i:e: Visual Voicemail).
If you had paid any attention at all in the last week after the keynote, Jobs or other senior execs have given several interviews to various journalists where they have said exactly that.
Please cite, otherwise I'll just assume you're being shitty.
CNBC had just such an interview later last Tuesday. In one, Jobs specifically referred to devices without phone functions, without divulging which devices he was referring to, of course, but noting the use of similar technology.
I'm in the UK so I'm not likely to have seen CNBC. I generally read Macworld, the various rumour sites, Daring Fireball (and the links from that to the NYTimes, WSJ and Time amongst others), Ars Technica, TUAW, Engadget and BBC News. None of which have mentioned any other devices. So, it's strange that the tech sites have all missed these mentions of other devices you say Apple have made. The BBC Click program I've just watched even went as far as pointing out that Apple had made NO mention of a widescreen iPod and interviewed Phil Schiller and people annoyed that Apple hadn't mentioned a new device - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programme...ne/default.stm
And of course, he didn't say so specifically during the keynote - he WAS talking about the iPhone then huh? But he did mention "other devices". In so many words.
'In so many words?' - ie. he didn't make any specific claims at all. He sure did mention 'other devices' but those were competitors other devices like a Treo or Blackberry.
It's been all over, maybe you should, like, actually READ stuff before spouting off.
I have, I've read way too much this past week, and I've quite possibly not read everything still. It's been a media deluge but maybe I've been looking in the wrong places and so have all the journos that write the tech sites. If you can point me out to where Jobs, Schiller, Joswiak or whoever at Apple in any of the interviews they've given have mentioned other devices then please do. That's all I was asking.
As JeffDM pointed out, the phone will have 3G tech by the time it his Europe.
Until it ships in Europe, nobody can actually be sure of that.
HSDPA comes at a cost. It uses significantly more battery life and processing resources than EDGE.
I think this is overstated. 3G/HSDPA only consumes more power when you're actually using it. For the most part, 3G phones drop back into non-3G GSM mode when they aren't doing data. Where I live, I've marginal 3G coverage sometimes and my phone is always dropping in and out of 3G. I've even a hack to permanently set it to the slower non UMTS 3G speeds since it's actually quite annoying waiting for it to switch.
Even still, I didn't notice that much difference in power consumption between my 2.5G p910i and 3G p990 - both similar phones and simlarly specced to the iPhone. The p990 being better specced comms wise at least. Its possible the battery is bigger in the p990 of course to cope but I've not checked. Apple's obsession with making things uber-thin sometimes stops them from offering useful features - like 3G and a long replaceable battery life.
Aside from that, it's got WiFi built in. My p990 drained much quicker with WiFi enabled than running 3G. I think the power argument is a red herring thrown into the mix by Apple to compensate for the cock up of the missing 3G features. Designing things in California is maybe too insular.
I once had a chat with a product designer for bike shoes based in California who'd gone through 3 generations of 'Winter Boot' that had a terrible low-tread sole and no studs in it. His excuse was 'It's never muddy here'. I was tempted to send him a box of UK mud via FedEx and explain it's like that 9 months of the year in the UK and we wear winter boots in Spring and Autumn (sorry 'Fall') too.
There are many reasons why the iPhone is closed. The iPod is closed and that seems to do well. Since it does run a version of OS X, you may see there are many hacks for the it coming along.
I'm sure there will be but if Apple has 'fixed' it so that only signed apps work on the iPhone like Symbian have done in SymbianOS9 then the propensity for 3rd parties to write software is much lessened even with a hack to get them on there. The iPod isn't a Smart Phone so isn't expected to have applications installed on it. Most people expect smart phones to have installable apps and geeks expect to be able to write software for them.
When Jobs mentioned Widgets, my first thought was 'Cool! I can port the Nabaztag widget over and send it messages from my phone'. I'll be thoroughly disappointed if I can't.
As for ringtones, this isn't Apple's doing. Apple would rather you buy a song for song on the iTS for $.99 instead of paying $1.99 - $2.49 for a ringtone at Cingular. This is clearly Cingular trying to maintain one of its overly inflated services.
Come June, you may fine Cingular has special plans (especially data rates) for iPhone customers. Unless their contract with Apple specifically states otherwise, they will probably try to charge more to make up for there other loses of supplemental income and the revamping of their network that was required to get the iPhone contract in the first place (i:e: Visual Voicemail).
So much for "Apple being Apple and Cingular being Cingular". It would seem they're already tripping over each other. Of course, this is complete nonsense here in Europe and I hope Apple have more room to be Apple when they aren't tied to typical US carrier behaviour.
Please cite, otherwise I'll just assume you're being shitty.
Sorry, assume what you wish.
I'm in the UK so I'm not likely to have seen CNBC. I generally read Macworld, the various rumour sites, Daring Fireball (and the links from that to the NYTimes, WSJ and Time amongst others), Ars Technica, TUAW, Engadget and BBC News. None of which have mentioned any other devices. So, it's strange that the tech sites have all missed these mentions of other devices you say Apple have made. The BBC Click program I've just watched even went as far as pointing out that Apple had made NO mention of a widescreen iPod and interviewed Phil Schiller and people annoyed that Apple hadn't mentioned a new device - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programme...ne/default.stm
You don't have to see it on TV. The interview was streamed from several sites, including YouTube.
'In so many words?' - ie. he didn't make any specific claims at all. He sure did mention 'other devices' but those were competitors other devices like a Treo or Blackberry.
Sure he did, you just didn't listen. He didn't mention specific devices. since when has Apple done that, anyway? I said "in so many words", and I mean just that he said they would be releasing other devices just as cool as iPhone - extrapolate from that what you will.
I have, I've read way too much this past week, and I've quite possibly not read everything still. It's been a media deluge but maybe I've been looking in the wrong places and so have all the journos that write the tech sites. If you can point me out to where Jobs, Schiller, Joswiak or whoever at Apple in any of the interviews they've given have mentioned other devices then please do. That's all I was asking.
Sorry, you should go to such places as MacWorld, or World of Apple, or MacObserver, or MacDailyNews, or MacRumors, The Apple Blog, Looprumors, or any of a dozen other Mac centric sites. Look back in their entries from last week, and you'll see mention of those interviews. Job's comments have been talked about, picked apart and analyzed in hundreds of thousands of words.
Like I said, I don't care if you don't believe me or not. It's not my problem, and you can call me shitty, stinky, or any other crappy name you wish. I've read it, and I've given good reasons why it makes sense anyway, so go look for it if you are really curious. If you don't, you aren't really interested in learning anything, you're just blowing smoke.
Sorry, assume what you wish.
You make claims that no on else has heard and then call people names for not locating these "easily" found news articles themselves. You don't sound credible if you can't back these claims up. Luckily, you have an entire database of databases ready to help you search for whatever you want.
It's logical to assume that this touchscreen technology will be introduced to the next iPod Video. After all, we've all seen the fake iPod Video pics long before the fake iPhone pics came around.
If you can't be bothered to look for yourself, then I won't do it for you. If you choose not to believe me, then, c'est la vie it's your loss for not knowing. Information is easy to find, and these interviews are not hidden or hard to find out about.
Haha.
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
Agreed. And I read many rumours websites too. At the beginning he said he said something along the lines of having more announcements in the next few months, but that was when he was talking about Macs (felt like a whole minute
While I'm sure you're right about more devices coming, including the iPhone forming the basis of the next iPod, I don't think I've read anywhere that Jobs has stated that at all and he did not say so during the keynote either.
I know it's not assured but I don't think it's too far off the mark to assume that some of those features will show up in other parts of the iPod line. A lot of times, design cues in a new Apple product eventually show up in other models, even in unrelated product lines.