This is completely anecdotal, but I feel like I'm seeing more and more Apple notebooks around. I was in my local Starbucks twice this week and only saw 1 non-Apple laptop in use. Each time there were 10-15 people sitting around surfing the web with their $4 lattes and either a MacBook or MBP. I didn't see any older models, only Intel, so make of that what you will. 2 or 3 years ago, I feel like I wasn't seeing nearly those numbers.
Again, totally unscientific, but it did catch my attention.
I notice them being used on TV a lot as well (in commercials, shows etc) ... although the apple in the back is taped over or altered
I got my MBP in December and know of 3-4 people who are planning to get one within the next month. I'm not a leader, but people seeing that Macs are usable in the real world (unlike what many would try to make you believe) and Mac's ease of use definitely changes their outlook.
It's a domino effect - like iPods when they were introduced - and you can already tell that it's becoming the "big thing".
Three high school seniors I know are all asking for MacBooks for graduation. All are from different schools and don't know each other. All have friends who are using Macs. Gotta love that high school peer pressure. This would have never happened a few years ago, no matter how much I pressured the parents. You really need to know the people involved to realize there is a big shift happening. The parents now are asking me for input.
I notice them being used on TV a lot as well (in commercials, shows etc) ... although the apple in the back is taped over or altered
this has always been the case. the people who work in media and advertising use macs, so whenever a computer is needed and it's not important which brand it is, it's a mac. many times it's just the computer of someone who happens to be on set. macs have always been popular in the media and graphic arts.
I'm confused. Why are HP and Compaq listed separately? I didn't know HP made any Compaq branded products any more. And the www.compaq.com redirects to http://h18002.www1.hp.com, which has a grand total of...2 products on it.
I think the iPod share will go back up again after the new one released. I think it's just down now cause most people have the 4th or 5th generation, and most 4th-ers are probably waiting for the next one to come out.
I would agree. After seeing the iPhone and Multi-Touch, I wouldn't even think about getting an iPod until updated versions are released.
I'm confused. Why are HP and Compaq listed separately? I didn't know HP made any Compaq branded products any more. And the www.compaq.com redirects to http://h18002.www1.hp.com, which has a grand total of...2 products on it.
They still do. Compaq does still sell low end retail offerings, but they are more business oriented.
I'm concerned about Apple's desktop share. The fairly high laptop share pushes that desktop share down further.
That's why some of us think that Apple must radically re-think their desktop lines.
There is NO guarantee that laptops sales will continue to grow and desktop sales slow in the industry overall.
This could be a short lived phenomenon. We don't know.
If Apple managed to grow their desktop share as well, they could get to 10% overall in the US by the end of 2008.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
.
D) More in line with what they expect in that market.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
I totally agree with this. There will always be that segment that for whatever reason (be it actual necessity, or just bragging rights) that will want the fastest and most powerful machine they can get regardless of form factor. However, more and more people (and businesses) can get by just fine with what current portables are able to provide. 90% of the people in my office could do their word processing, excel worksheets and e-mail on any number of available portables. And we're not talking the top of the line either - a $1000 MacBook would suit most of these guys just fine.
I think that the desktop segment as a whole is one it's way out. There will always be a niche for it, but as the technology gets better, the list of reasons that necessitated the "desktop" form factor to begin with will just get shorter and shorter.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
Let me add a few things to what you and others have said about the movement to laptops. I have been a long time laptop user, both Mac and XP. I also do a lot of business travel which means lots of time on plains, trains and ferries. Also, lots of time spent in airports, train stations and hotels. When I first started using laptops for business travel, battery life was very important due to the lack of readily available AC plugs. This is no longer true. Because of the ubiquity of AC plugs on many modes of transportation and in airport and train terminals, I no longer have to worry much about a dead battery. Very Nice. Furthermore, another big change is the availability of free or relatively cheap broadband access (BA). Many hotels, trains and ferries now have free BA. Many cities have or are developing free BA wifi networks. These 2 changes have had a dramatic effect on my road travel habits and ease of computing away from home.
I'm concerned about Apple's desktop share. The fairly high laptop share pushes that desktop share down further.
That's why some of us think that Apple must radically re-think their desktop lines.
There is NO guarantee that laptops sales will continue to grow and desktop sales slow in the industry overall.
This could be a short lived phenomenon. We don't know.
If Apple managed to grow their desktop share as well, they could get to 10% overall in the US by the end of 2008.
I can see that (and I agree), but I haven't seen anything but a general trend towards mobile computers that hasn't backed off or slowed down. Notebooks used to be cost prohibitive, too slow or too poor of a screen, now, they are good enough for most people. Now my parents have an old cast-off notebook that's good enough for idle browsing that's not really used much in any mobile sense, but it's small and unobtrusive. I don't see them going back unless it breaks and money is terrifically tight.
I can see that (and I agree), but I haven't seen anything but a general trend towards mobile computers that hasn't backed off or slowed down. Notebooks used to be cost prohibitive, too slow or too poor of a screen, now, they are good enough for most people. Now my parents have an old cast-off notebook that's good enough for idle browsing that's not really used much in any mobile sense, but it's small and unobtrusive. I don't see them going back unless it breaks and money is terrifically tight.
Of course, I see the trend as well, but no trend continues forever.
It's difficult to predict the future for more than a couple of years, and even that gets wishy.
When Apple's numbers kept going down, it was easy to predict that after a certain time, they would be out of business, and many did, but it didn't happen. The trend reversed itself because of unforeseen circumstances.
Even so, there were about 100 million desktops sold last year. There is no reason why Apple shouldn't get a much larger share of that segment.
Of course, I see the trend as well, but no trend continues forever.
Some do. Unless you mean to suggest that something like VHS is going to make a comeback.
Quote:
It's difficult to predict the future for more than a couple of years, and even that gets wishy.
When Apple's numbers kept going down, it was easy to predict that after a certain time, they would be out of business, and many did, but it didn't happen. The trend reversed itself because of unforeseen circumstances.
Even so, there were about 100 million desktops sold last year. There is no reason why Apple shouldn't get a much larger share of that segment.
That's true, but they seem to be very good at creatively "interpreting" what buyers were asking for, it seems like they are trying hard to avoid the idea. Instead of a cheap tower which is probably what most requests for a headless Mac was about, they decide to answer that with the Cube and mini. I think both were interesting products, but not necessarily what was being requested.
Some do. Unless you mean to suggest that something like VHS is going to make a comeback.
That wasn't a trend. That was a total technology shift, going from analog to digital. This is different. No matter how good portables get, desktops will always be much better.
Until both catagories disappear due to a seismic technology change, which I'm sure will happen sometime in the future.
Quote:
That's true, but they seem to be very good at creatively "interpreting" what buyers were asking for, it seems like they are trying hard to avoid the idea. Instead of a cheap tower which is probably what most requests for a headless Mac was about, they decide to answer that with the Cube and mini. I think both were interesting products, but not necessarily what was being requested.
Yes, Apple did respond with the Cube, which, as many said, would have sold if they weren't using the G4, which at the time was a very expensive chip.
But I mean earlier, starting holiday 1995, when Apple's disaster dated from. The next few years were seriously out of whack.
We both have been arguing for the small, cheap(er?) tower for some time now. Apple has to do something.
But, I wonder, since I haven't been keeping track of the posters, if the same people who are buying laptops here, are also generally the ones who rally behind a more open desktop.
If so, that would be interesting. Would they then BUY that open desktop, or would they just continue to buy portables, while at the same time demand an open desktop?
Many people who get angry with companies for dropping Apple support never buy those products when they are out.
Comments
This is completely anecdotal, but I feel like I'm seeing more and more Apple notebooks around. I was in my local Starbucks twice this week and only saw 1 non-Apple laptop in use. Each time there were 10-15 people sitting around surfing the web with their $4 lattes and either a MacBook or MBP. I didn't see any older models, only Intel, so make of that what you will. 2 or 3 years ago, I feel like I wasn't seeing nearly those numbers.
Again, totally unscientific, but it did catch my attention.
I notice them being used on TV a lot as well (in commercials, shows etc) ... although the apple in the back is taped over or altered
I got my MBP in December and know of 3-4 people who are planning to get one within the next month. I'm not a leader, but people seeing that Macs are usable in the real world (unlike what many would try to make you believe) and Mac's ease of use definitely changes their outlook.
It's a domino effect - like iPods when they were introduced - and you can already tell that it's becoming the "big thing".
Awesome.
I though Apple's goal was only 3% of the entire market? Either way, 10% is killer!
Maybe 3% was the worldwide figure. 10% is US retail only, and only notebooks.
I notice them being used on TV a lot as well (in commercials, shows etc) ... although the apple in the back is taped over or altered
They like to use the design but definitely don't want it used as an endorsement for a product that's not being advertised.
Maybe 3% was the worldwide figure. 10% is US retail only, and only notebooks.
They like to use the design but definitely don't want it used as an endorsement for a product that's not being advertised.
Though sometimes we do see them in commercials with the name or logo prominently displayed.
That's because there is product placement in commercials, as well as in tv shows and movies.
That's why some of us think that Apple must radically re-think their desktop lines.
There is NO guarantee that laptops sales will continue to grow and desktop sales slow in the industry overall.
This could be a short lived phenomenon. We don't know.
If Apple managed to grow their desktop share as well, they could get to 10% overall in the US by the end of 2008.
I notice them being used on TV a lot as well (in commercials, shows etc) ... although the apple in the back is taped over or altered
this has always been the case. the people who work in media and advertising use macs, so whenever a computer is needed and it's not important which brand it is, it's a mac. many times it's just the computer of someone who happens to be on set. macs have always been popular in the media and graphic arts.
It's the demographic. I would argue that 1/5 university students would have macs for 2007-2008 and 1/4 the next year.
-=|Mgkwho
Based on what? A dream you had?
I think the iPod share will go back up again after the new one released. I think it's just down now cause most people have the 4th or 5th generation, and most 4th-ers are probably waiting for the next one to come out.
I would agree. After seeing the iPhone and Multi-Touch, I wouldn't even think about getting an iPod until updated versions are released.
I'm confused. Why are HP and Compaq listed separately? I didn't know HP made any Compaq branded products any more. And the www.compaq.com redirects to http://h18002.www1.hp.com, which has a grand total of...2 products on it.
They still do. Compaq does still sell low end retail offerings, but they are more business oriented.
I'm concerned about Apple's desktop share. The fairly high laptop share pushes that desktop share down further.
That's why some of us think that Apple must radically re-think their desktop lines.
There is NO guarantee that laptops sales will continue to grow and desktop sales slow in the industry overall.
This could be a short lived phenomenon. We don't know.
If Apple managed to grow their desktop share as well, they could get to 10% overall in the US by the end of 2008.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
.
D) More in line with what they expect in that market.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
I totally agree with this. There will always be that segment that for whatever reason (be it actual necessity, or just bragging rights) that will want the fastest and most powerful machine they can get regardless of form factor. However, more and more people (and businesses) can get by just fine with what current portables are able to provide. 90% of the people in my office could do their word processing, excel worksheets and e-mail on any number of available portables. And we're not talking the top of the line either - a $1000 MacBook would suit most of these guys just fine.
I think that the desktop segment as a whole is one it's way out. There will always be a niche for it, but as the technology gets better, the list of reasons that necessitated the "desktop" form factor to begin with will just get shorter and shorter.
Awesome.
I though Apple's goal was only 3% of the entire market? Either way, 10% is killer!
It only counts fixed configurations sold at retail stores. internet retailers and machines ordered BTO from the online apple store are not counted.
Well, I can only imagine that notebooks are getting more popular because a) they are portable, and b) they are now powerful enough to most things that most people want to do without penalty, and c) they keep getting cheaper.
So that I can now buy a sub thousand dollar notebook that does everything I want it to do really fast with a nice big bright screen that I can take with me when I go places.
I can't see where any of that stops being true, and I can't see where any of that becomes less desirable. In fact, my guess is that more and more people will think of notebooks as being "computers", portability being part of the definition of "computer", and desktops will start to look like the mainframes of yore, big heavy things that people used because they had to.
Let me add a few things to what you and others have said about the movement to laptops. I have been a long time laptop user, both Mac and XP. I also do a lot of business travel which means lots of time on plains, trains and ferries. Also, lots of time spent in airports, train stations and hotels. When I first started using laptops for business travel, battery life was very important due to the lack of readily available AC plugs. This is no longer true. Because of the ubiquity of AC plugs on many modes of transportation and in airport and train terminals, I no longer have to worry much about a dead battery. Very Nice. Furthermore, another big change is the availability of free or relatively cheap broadband access (BA). Many hotels, trains and ferries now have free BA. Many cities have or are developing free BA wifi networks. These 2 changes have had a dramatic effect on my road travel habits and ease of computing away from home.
I'm concerned about Apple's desktop share. The fairly high laptop share pushes that desktop share down further.
That's why some of us think that Apple must radically re-think their desktop lines.
There is NO guarantee that laptops sales will continue to grow and desktop sales slow in the industry overall.
This could be a short lived phenomenon. We don't know.
If Apple managed to grow their desktop share as well, they could get to 10% overall in the US by the end of 2008.
I can see that (and I agree), but I haven't seen anything but a general trend towards mobile computers that hasn't backed off or slowed down. Notebooks used to be cost prohibitive, too slow or too poor of a screen, now, they are good enough for most people. Now my parents have an old cast-off notebook that's good enough for idle browsing that's not really used much in any mobile sense, but it's small and unobtrusive. I don't see them going back unless it breaks and money is terrifically tight.
I can see that (and I agree), but I haven't seen anything but a general trend towards mobile computers that hasn't backed off or slowed down. Notebooks used to be cost prohibitive, too slow or too poor of a screen, now, they are good enough for most people. Now my parents have an old cast-off notebook that's good enough for idle browsing that's not really used much in any mobile sense, but it's small and unobtrusive. I don't see them going back unless it breaks and money is terrifically tight.
Of course, I see the trend as well, but no trend continues forever.
It's difficult to predict the future for more than a couple of years, and even that gets wishy.
When Apple's numbers kept going down, it was easy to predict that after a certain time, they would be out of business, and many did, but it didn't happen. The trend reversed itself because of unforeseen circumstances.
Even so, there were about 100 million desktops sold last year. There is no reason why Apple shouldn't get a much larger share of that segment.
Of course, I see the trend as well, but no trend continues forever.
Some do. Unless you mean to suggest that something like VHS is going to make a comeback.
It's difficult to predict the future for more than a couple of years, and even that gets wishy.
When Apple's numbers kept going down, it was easy to predict that after a certain time, they would be out of business, and many did, but it didn't happen. The trend reversed itself because of unforeseen circumstances.
Even so, there were about 100 million desktops sold last year. There is no reason why Apple shouldn't get a much larger share of that segment.
That's true, but they seem to be very good at creatively "interpreting" what buyers were asking for, it seems like they are trying hard to avoid the idea. Instead of a cheap tower which is probably what most requests for a headless Mac was about, they decide to answer that with the Cube and mini. I think both were interesting products, but not necessarily what was being requested.
Some do. Unless you mean to suggest that something like VHS is going to make a comeback.
That wasn't a trend. That was a total technology shift, going from analog to digital. This is different. No matter how good portables get, desktops will always be much better.
Until both catagories disappear due to a seismic technology change, which I'm sure will happen sometime in the future.
That's true, but they seem to be very good at creatively "interpreting" what buyers were asking for, it seems like they are trying hard to avoid the idea. Instead of a cheap tower which is probably what most requests for a headless Mac was about, they decide to answer that with the Cube and mini. I think both were interesting products, but not necessarily what was being requested.
Yes, Apple did respond with the Cube, which, as many said, would have sold if they weren't using the G4, which at the time was a very expensive chip.
But I mean earlier, starting holiday 1995, when Apple's disaster dated from. The next few years were seriously out of whack.
We both have been arguing for the small, cheap(er?) tower for some time now. Apple has to do something.
But, I wonder, since I haven't been keeping track of the posters, if the same people who are buying laptops here, are also generally the ones who rally behind a more open desktop.
If so, that would be interesting. Would they then BUY that open desktop, or would they just continue to buy portables, while at the same time demand an open desktop?
Many people who get angry with companies for dropping Apple support never buy those products when they are out.
You know what I'm saying?