And I don't WANT to own a dedicated DVD player! That's exactly the point. Why would I want Apple TV AND a dedicated DVD player? It's a simple thing for Apple to add a disc drive to the AppleTV. I laugh at my relatives who own a dedicated DVD player, an X-Box or PlayStation with a DVD player, a high-powered computer with (you guessed it) a DVD player. Why do they need so many DVD players?
Yeah, redundant devices in the living room is generally senseless. When I got my xBox 360, which can play DVDs, I boxed up the standalone DVD player for that very reason. But if someone owned a DVD player that was better than the xBox's, say for example one that includes the ability to upscale standard definition DVDs, then again a redundant device rears it's ugly head. However, since 99% of people probably already have the ability to play DVDs in their living room (some of them multiple ways), I think adding a DVD player to the Apple TV would be an unnecessary added expense. Yes, it'd be nice to only use one remote for everything, but since you can't channel surf with the Apple TV ? or even adjust the volume of the tv ? you're still stuck with multiple devices and remotes. One could just as well argue that Tivo or Comcast should add DVD players to their boxes; and likewise, it'd be an unnecessary added expense. The Apple TV's for getting content to your living room that you can't otherwise get; charging an extra $50-$100 to add in a DVD player doesn't solve a problem for 99% of people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranum
My preference (and it is just my preference, although I'm sure there are others like me) is to not try and pack as much consumer electronics into a small space for watching movies. [edit] I'm also not interested in all of the extra cabling that would be required to add a dedicated DVD drive alongside an Apple TV and having to switch back and forth. [/edit] But the real point that is getting lost here is that I would be actually be willing to give Apple more money for downloadable shows if I had an AppleTV. But with no DVD player (so I can take the Mac Mini out of the picture altogether), no AppleTV. And no AppleTV means I'm not likely to buy downloadable TV shows, movies or anything else. If Apple gives me a DVD player in the AppleTV, I'll give Apple my money and more when I download shows and movies.
For people like yourself looking to replace as many devices in your living room as possible, a newer Mac Mini probably makes the most sense. Apple should add purchasing/store browsing capabilities to Front Row, and then they'd have the right device for you.
I can't believe people are advocating taking your disk into the other room, ripping .....
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranum
I guess I could ask the same question back to you: why do you want 1080p and 5.1 audio so bad? .
I am not advocating anything. I am definitely not going to put that effort to watch a standard dvd. I rather simply put the disc on my dvd player and I am done. I just saying that you could if you want.
Regarding the 1080p and 5.1, eventually Apple will offer it as downloads. Not soon. Also I am looking into Apple to add blu-ray support to their Macs and If I decide to rip it than I can watch it or I can buy Elgato and record content in 1080i or soon 1080p or I can create my own 1080p content with my Hi-def camera and watch it. Heck, I have a 1080p HDTV and I want to watch content on full resolution and enjoying my 5.1 audio.
I have no problem in having a device that does it all. I would love to see a DVR option on the AppleTV as well. But, I am only stating that it seems highly unlikely that Apple will pursue it.
Their strategy is to drive people to iTunes store. Also many rumors about movie rentals coming. So clearly they want you to use iTunes rather than make your life easier adding a dvd/blu-ray player and having you buy content at Amazon, Target or renting at Netflix, Blockbuster, etc.
For people like yourself looking to replace as many devices in your living room as possible, a newer Mac Mini probably makes the most sense. Apple should add purchasing/store browsing capabilities to Front Row, and then they'd have the right device for you.
Well, as a point of clarity, I'm currently only looking to replace one device in my living room at the moment - the Mac Mini, not many devices.
While I agree with your observation that a newer Mac Mini makes the most sense at the moment given that AppleTV doesn't include a disc player, there still exist for me two specific problems with the idea of using a new Mac Mini as the solution. Problem #1: While I would have Front Row, I wouldn't have streaming media from my iMac, which will be holding all the media goodies. Problem #2: Price. I've priced older 1.66 Core Duos on eBay and they still sell for more than an AppleTV new. There's no way I would want to pay so much money for a newer Mac Mini, a whole other computer to maintain and update with way more functionality than what I'm requesting in the ability to just to be able to play back DVDs on the AppleTV. As it is, I am wanting to get my current Mac Mini out of the loop. I certainly don't want to add another one back in.
And all that a new Mac Mini would add is the benefit of Front Row to the DVD capabilities my old G4 Mac Mini presently has. Still, no streaming content from the iMac. So while your suggestion may be the best at the moment, it really isn't an adequate solution to the problem.
Really, how hard would it be to raise the case by .5 inch and stick a disc drive inside? Do people really think there would be a huge cost to do this? In fact, I told my friend who works at an Apple Store that, as soon as the AppleTV was introduced, I thought that this was the direction Steve is taking the Mac Mini. The form factor is so similar, I eventually see Steve killing off the Mini, increasing the height of the AppleTV enough to throw in a faster 3.5" hard drive and a (possibly Hi-Def) disc drive. I still think this is the eventual direction of the AppleTV, but I would really like to see an update in the meantime that would give us disc drives so that I would be able to control all my media with the AppleTV and an iMac.
Their strategy is to drive people to iTunes store. Also many rumors about movie rentals coming. So clearly they want you to use iTunes rather than make your life easier adding a dvd/blu-ray player and having you buy content at Amazon, Target or renting at Netflix, Blockbuster, etc.
Yep. I think people are trying to force a square peg in to a round hole here. The Apple TV's purpose in life is to bridge the gap between your Apple-purchased media and your HDTV. It also brings your Digital life assets to the living room, as well as YouTube, Movie Trailers, and presumably future free viewable internet media that has been imprisoned in the computer until this time. These are all things your other living room devices cannot do, hence why Apple TV exists.
So only if AppleTV ever gets a disk drive will I get one. But I'd like one and think it would be a great solution - better than using a dedicated Front Row-incompatible G4 Mac Mini solely as a DVD player - especially when the AppleTV would give me access to ALL of my media, even DVDs.
This is an area that I'm surprised the after-market industry, or even Apple themselves haven't solved for us. A slim add-on with a single, short USB cable could solve all of this, allowing users to purchase the drive type of their choice, or none at all.
While I agree with your observation that a newer Mac Mini makes the most sense at the moment given that AppleTV doesn't include a disc player, there still exist for me two specific problems with the idea of using a new Mac Mini as the solution. Problem #1: While I would have Front Row, I wouldn't have streaming media from my iMac, which will be holding all the media goodies. Problem #2: Price. I've priced older 1.66 Core Duos on eBay and they still sell for more than an AppleTV new. There's no way I would want to pay so much money for a newer Mac Mini, a whole other computer to maintain and update with way more functionality than what I'm requesting in the ability to just to be able to play back DVDs on the AppleTV. As it is, I am wanting to get my current Mac Mini out of the loop. I certainly don't want to add another one back in.
1. You share the iTunes library and don't stream.
2. Well, that isn't likely to be solved anytime soon.
Quote:
Really, how hard would it be to raise the case by .5 inch and stick a disc drive inside? Do people really think there would be a huge cost to do this?
No but they didn't do it. How expensive do you think making the mini .5 inch taller and adding a dedicated GPU would have cost?
The mini and the aTV are similar in construction but different in purpose. One has a GPU and no drive, the other a drive and no GPU. Not that the GeForce Go 7300 is much to write home about but it runs rings around the 950 in the mini and its a $15 part.
That may be, but I'm just speculating along with you. That is, unless you have some special inside knowledge that lets you know for 100% certainty that Apple would never ever ever add a disc drive to the AppleTV.
No thanks. I'm not interested in constantly chasing my tail every time an OS update comes along and having to download an update to be constantly hacking a G4 just to get Front Row to run. Got a lot of better things to do with my time.
All I'm proposing is a simple solution to a simple problem, which I am not the only one to have. It's strange how people here get worked up about that.\
Although it might be useful to some I agree with those that say AppleTV should not and will not get a DVD player. Apple seems to be really jumping on the Internet 2.0 bandwagon i.e. YouTube, .Mac video streaming, rumors of a 700 Mhz auction bid, Wi-Fi music store, the changes in iMovie, and a general disdain for DVDs. I'm not saying Apple is on the right track, or not jumping the gun a bit, but you can clearly see what they want the (their) world to look like. Your whole life, digital or otherwise, based around your Mac, iPhone, Apple TV and linking it all the Internet. The biggest threat to Apple's dream, at least when it comes to entertainment, are the content providers who aren't happy with Apple's pricing and working with them in general.
If AppleTV had a DVD player and you put in a DVD, the machine should check to see if the movie is already in your library, and if not, rip it to the hard drive automatically without forcing the user to go through the pain.
If AppleTV had a DVD player and you put in a DVD, the machine should check to see if the movie is already in your library, and if not, rip it to the hard drive automatically without forcing the user to go through the pain.
That won't happen. It would just piss off the DVD Forum and Apple can't afford that.
Is anybody else getting the feeling that Apple and the DVD rights people are circling around each other waiting for the fight to start? I see Apples' dissing of DVDs to be part of the pre-fight shouting match. Maybe Apple tried to add DVD ripping features and was turned down or they could not reach an agreement on the DRM restrictions.
As far as adding a DVD player to the AppleTV, why not add DVD streaming capabilities from the host computer instead?
No thanks. I'm not interested in constantly chasing my tail every time an OS update comes along and having to download an update to be constantly hacking a G4 just to get Front Row to run. Got a lot of better things to do with my time.
All I'm proposing is a simple solution to a simple problem, which I am not the only one to have. It's strange how people here get worked up about that.\
Well you can reach your objective with a free software patch OR a USB IR receiver, 3rd party software and an Apple remote OR any number of FrontRow replacements to manage your media OR buy a mini you say is too expensive.
Or you can wait, probably forever, until Apple adds a DVD drive to the aTV.
Sounds like you're not interested in any solution but the one single one you want.
As far as adding a DVD player to the AppleTV, why not add DVD streaming capabilities from the host computer instead?
That would indeed be a good solution. But to quote yourself:
"That won't happen. It would just piss off the DVD Forum and Apple can't afford that."
The problem is that the DVD would need to be transmitted to the AppleTV fully encrypted to guarantee that the decoded DVD signal cannot be 'branched off' to some HD for 'later storage'.
I would assume Apple would do a similar setup as for music with the Airport Express. Decrypt the signal in the Mac, and transmit it as Apple Lossless with Fairplay DRM added on the fly.
And I don't think most Macs have enough oompf to encrypt and transmit a DVD to the AppleTV in real time. It would end up buffered with you having to wait a while before being able to watch a DVD - which is boring.
And even if they transmit the original, already encrypted DVD information to the Apple TV, I doubt the wireless speed would be fast enough to transmit full DVD video plus 5.1 audio in real time.
And I don't WANT to own a dedicated DVD player! That's exactly the point. Why would I want Apple TV AND a dedicated DVD player? It's a simple thing for Apple to add a disc drive to the AppleTV. I laugh at my relatives who own a dedicated DVD player, an X-Box or PlayStation with a DVD player, a high-powered computer with (you guessed it) a DVD player. Why do they need so many DVD players?
My preference (and it is just my preference, although I'm sure there are others like me) is to not try and pack as much consumer electronics into a small space for watching movies. [edit] I'm also not interested in all of the extra cabling that would be required to add a dedicated DVD drive alongside an Apple TV and having to switch back and forth. [/edit] But the real point that is getting lost here is that I would be actually be willing to give Apple more money for downloadable shows if I had an AppleTV. But with no DVD player (so I can take the Mac Mini out of the picture altogether), no AppleTV. And no AppleTV means I'm not likely to buy downloadable TV shows, movies or anything else. If Apple gives me a DVD player in the AppleTV, I'll give Apple my money and more when I download shows and movies.
Well if that's your viewpoint. Ditch the 22" 'Home entertainment monitor' altogether. You won't need that with your iMac!
Well if that's your viewpoint. Ditch the 22" 'Home entertainment monitor' altogether. You won't need that with your iMac!
That's not going to happen. The iMac is going to be used as a personal and business computer, handling web design and DAW tasks as well, requiring a few extra hard drives to be plugged in and sitting nearby. And I would be going from a 22" screen to a 20" screen. Not so good for watching films.
As it is now, the Mac Mini is in the living room connected to the 22" screen set inside an armoire. I am sitting in front of it in an office-style black rolling chair with the keyboard and mouse balanced on random stools between me and the armoire. That is what I'm trying to get away from. Doing the same thing with an iMac in place of the Mac Mini just isn't an option in this case.
An additional but random point: We don't have cable or any kind of TV service. Our entertainment needs pretty much are met by renting and watching movies, listening to music, etc. If the AppleTV had a disc dive, then it would suffice for all our needs and our setup would be limited to the AppleTV, monitor and speakers. Simple, clean and elegant.
I agree with forbes. If Apple takes that direction with TV someone else (a disgruntled "I Missed the online Music, and iPod boat" ZUNE Company) will make a simple affordable DVR and add better features, and all the TV will be free. The headline to note isFREE. DVR is Free, can be free, and TV is Apple best selling video medium. It would be better to market an TV killer that worked with your TV, and also automatically encoded a second video that you could plug yor ZUNE into and watch it on there, again for FREE. That ZUNE comnpany could easily kill TV in one fail swoop, and take a major portion of Video iPod users with it. TV took the wrong direction. It's it's own worst enemy. It could help kill the iPod. TV Needs a DVR before it self distructs on itself. Screw DVD.
I certainly agree that DVR capability would be an awesome feature for customers, especially if it was controlled on the iPhone/Touch. But I don't think that Apple or anyone else can expect to offer this feature and still maintain a working relationship with the television studios. DVR offers four main abilities: 1) time shifting, 2) archival for personal use, 3) ability to distribute content via file sharing, and 4) commercial stripping. Time shifting is probably not a problem for the studios; if you watch a program from beginning to end including the commercials, they don't care too much when you do it. Archival for PERSONAL use may not be that big of a deal either. It's file sharing and commercial stripping that are the significant issues. Apple might eliminate most of the file sharing problems by adding Fairplay DRM to all recorded files. This would probably cause a mild uproar from many users, but it might be a workable compromise. Nonetheless, there is virtually nothing Apple can do about commercial stripping. Apple can't keep you from fast-forwarding through the commercials when you watch your recorded programs (well, maybe they could, but the wrath this would inspire is terrible to contemplate). But if viewers don't watch the commercials, then the television studios have no income. Thus the studios will remain mortally opposed to DVR and Apple cannot afford to thwart them.
If you think about it, the studios aren't necessarily being wholly unreasonable. They do need income, and it's not cheap to produce television. Imagine a day when virtually all television programming is available on iTunes for 99¢ rental 24 hours after broadcast. You can either watch a show with commercials in its original time slot, or watch it on your own schedule without commercials for a buck. Isn't that a relatively fair trade-off? If iTunes really had all programming available in a high quality format for immediate viewing, what advantage would you get from the DVR? If the answer is the ability to skip commercials for free, then you have to ask yourself why we deserve such a thing. Sure it's great, but is it justified?
I can imagine many people complaining that 99¢ is still too much to pay per episode. Well maybe there will be deals that let you subscribe to a full 22 show season for $10-15. But even so, it would be nice to have a third option, the ability to watch programs with commercials on your own schedule. The TV studios are beginning to host their own websites that make this possible. I wouldn't be surprised if YouTube eventually adds such programming. But if it shows up on YouTube, then it will also be available on AppleTV. In short, it's not hard to imagine a future in which AppleTV allows multiple avenues to content. But none of those avenues are going to allow you to get content without either payment or advertising, and it's not clear to me that we should ever expect such a thing.
*****
As for a DVD player, I cannot see Apple adding this capability. As hard drives grow and broadband speeds increase there will be less and less need for physical media. For better and worse, Apple sees this future. They get a step ahead of many of us now and then, but the AppleTV is a forward-looking device.
And I would be going from a 22" screen to a 20" screen. Not so good for watching films.
Unless your 22" monitor also has component or HDMI in you'll not likely want an aTV even if it had a DVD player. Yes, you could get a HDMI to DVI cable but depending on what the aTV does without HDCP what it displays may be degraded when aTV goes to 720p and studios get uppity and enable the derez bit.
You're better off with a 2-3m DVI cable for $50 and attaching it directly to your iMac and have a desk next to your armoire.
You know...as much as I like apple stuff, if my entertainment center was a mac I'd take a good look at mediacentral vs frontrow.
Especially given it has a "windowed" mode in case your wife wants to watch something while you work on the iMac. Or you can just use the mini you have.
Yep. I think people are trying to force a square peg in to a round hole here. The Apple TV's purpose in life is to bridge the gap between your Apple-purchased media and your HDTV. It also brings your Digital life assets to the living room, as well as YouTube, Movie Trailers, and presumably future free viewable internet media that has been imprisoned in the computer until this time. These are all things your other living room devices cannot do, hence why Apple TV exists.
Thank you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacJello
As for a DVD player, I cannot see Apple adding this capability. As hard drives grow and broadband speeds increase there will be less and less need for physical media. For better and worse, Apple sees this future. They get a step ahead of many of us now and then, but the AppleTV is a forward-looking device.
Thank You too!
Quote:
Originally Posted by onlooker
TV Needs a DVR before it self distructs on itself. Screw DVD.
I would love to see that, but I have the feeling Apple is offering that trough Elgato. I not sure if Apple will eventually add the DVR option due that fact the TV networks might not like it because the reasons posted by MacJello.
Comments
And I don't WANT to own a dedicated DVD player!
Yeah, redundant devices in the living room is generally senseless. When I got my xBox 360, which can play DVDs, I boxed up the standalone DVD player for that very reason. But if someone owned a DVD player that was better than the xBox's, say for example one that includes the ability to upscale standard definition DVDs, then again a redundant device rears it's ugly head. However, since 99% of people probably already have the ability to play DVDs in their living room (some of them multiple ways), I think adding a DVD player to the Apple TV would be an unnecessary added expense. Yes, it'd be nice to only use one remote for everything, but since you can't channel surf with the Apple TV ? or even adjust the volume of the tv ? you're still stuck with multiple devices and remotes. One could just as well argue that Tivo or Comcast should add DVD players to their boxes; and likewise, it'd be an unnecessary added expense. The Apple TV's for getting content to your living room that you can't otherwise get; charging an extra $50-$100 to add in a DVD player doesn't solve a problem for 99% of people.
My preference (and it is just my preference, although I'm sure there are others like me) is to not try and pack as much consumer electronics into a small space for watching movies. [edit] I'm also not interested in all of the extra cabling that would be required to add a dedicated DVD drive alongside an Apple TV and having to switch back and forth. [/edit] But the real point that is getting lost here is that I would be actually be willing to give Apple more money for downloadable shows if I had an AppleTV. But with no DVD player (so I can take the Mac Mini out of the picture altogether), no AppleTV. And no AppleTV means I'm not likely to buy downloadable TV shows, movies or anything else. If Apple gives me a DVD player in the AppleTV, I'll give Apple my money and more when I download shows and movies.
For people like yourself looking to replace as many devices in your living room as possible, a newer Mac Mini probably makes the most sense. Apple should add purchasing/store browsing capabilities to Front Row, and then they'd have the right device for you.
I can't believe people are advocating taking your disk into the other room, ripping .....
I guess I could ask the same question back to you: why do you want 1080p and 5.1 audio so bad? .
I am not advocating anything. I am definitely not going to put that effort to watch a standard dvd. I rather simply put the disc on my dvd player and I am done. I just saying that you could if you want.
Regarding the 1080p and 5.1, eventually Apple will offer it as downloads. Not soon. Also I am looking into Apple to add blu-ray support to their Macs and If I decide to rip it than I can watch it or I can buy Elgato and record content in 1080i or soon 1080p or I can create my own 1080p content with my Hi-def camera and watch it. Heck, I have a 1080p HDTV and I want to watch content on full resolution and enjoying my 5.1 audio.
I have no problem in having a device that does it all. I would love to see a DVR option on the AppleTV as well. But, I am only stating that it seems highly unlikely that Apple will pursue it.
Their strategy is to drive people to iTunes store. Also many rumors about movie rentals coming. So clearly they want you to use iTunes rather than make your life easier adding a dvd/blu-ray player and having you buy content at Amazon, Target or renting at Netflix, Blockbuster, etc.
For people like yourself looking to replace as many devices in your living room as possible, a newer Mac Mini probably makes the most sense. Apple should add purchasing/store browsing capabilities to Front Row, and then they'd have the right device for you.
Well, as a point of clarity, I'm currently only looking to replace one device in my living room at the moment - the Mac Mini, not many devices.
While I agree with your observation that a newer Mac Mini makes the most sense at the moment given that AppleTV doesn't include a disc player, there still exist for me two specific problems with the idea of using a new Mac Mini as the solution. Problem #1: While I would have Front Row, I wouldn't have streaming media from my iMac, which will be holding all the media goodies. Problem #2: Price. I've priced older 1.66 Core Duos on eBay and they still sell for more than an AppleTV new. There's no way I would want to pay so much money for a newer Mac Mini, a whole other computer to maintain and update with way more functionality than what I'm requesting in the ability to just to be able to play back DVDs on the AppleTV. As it is, I am wanting to get my current Mac Mini out of the loop. I certainly don't want to add another one back in.
And all that a new Mac Mini would add is the benefit of Front Row to the DVD capabilities my old G4 Mac Mini presently has. Still, no streaming content from the iMac. So while your suggestion may be the best at the moment, it really isn't an adequate solution to the problem.
Really, how hard would it be to raise the case by .5 inch and stick a disc drive inside? Do people really think there would be a huge cost to do this? In fact, I told my friend who works at an Apple Store that, as soon as the AppleTV was introduced, I thought that this was the direction Steve is taking the Mac Mini. The form factor is so similar, I eventually see Steve killing off the Mini, increasing the height of the AppleTV enough to throw in a faster 3.5" hard drive and a (possibly Hi-Def) disc drive. I still think this is the eventual direction of the AppleTV, but I would really like to see an update in the meantime that would give us disc drives so that I would be able to control all my media with the AppleTV and an iMac.
Their strategy is to drive people to iTunes store. Also many rumors about movie rentals coming. So clearly they want you to use iTunes rather than make your life easier adding a dvd/blu-ray player and having you buy content at Amazon, Target or renting at Netflix, Blockbuster, etc.
Yep. I think people are trying to force a square peg in to a round hole here. The Apple TV's purpose in life is to bridge the gap between your Apple-purchased media and your HDTV. It also brings your Digital life assets to the living room, as well as YouTube, Movie Trailers, and presumably future free viewable internet media that has been imprisoned in the computer until this time. These are all things your other living room devices cannot do, hence why Apple TV exists.
So only if AppleTV ever gets a disk drive will I get one. But I'd like one and think it would be a great solution - better than using a dedicated Front Row-incompatible G4 Mac Mini solely as a DVD player - especially when the AppleTV would give me access to ALL of my media, even DVDs.
I guess you wont be getting one for a long time.
Here's Front Row for your Mini.
http://andrewescobar.com/frontrow
Have fun.
This is an area that I'm surprised the after-market industry, or even Apple themselves haven't solved for us. A slim add-on with a single, short USB cable could solve all of this, allowing users to purchase the drive type of their choice, or none at all.
http://wiki.awkwardtv.org/wiki/Enable_USB_Storage
Works for USB hard drives. DVD looks untested. Could need another kext. Then you need the DVD player as well.
While I agree with your observation that a newer Mac Mini makes the most sense at the moment given that AppleTV doesn't include a disc player, there still exist for me two specific problems with the idea of using a new Mac Mini as the solution. Problem #1: While I would have Front Row, I wouldn't have streaming media from my iMac, which will be holding all the media goodies. Problem #2: Price. I've priced older 1.66 Core Duos on eBay and they still sell for more than an AppleTV new. There's no way I would want to pay so much money for a newer Mac Mini, a whole other computer to maintain and update with way more functionality than what I'm requesting in the ability to just to be able to play back DVDs on the AppleTV. As it is, I am wanting to get my current Mac Mini out of the loop. I certainly don't want to add another one back in.
1. You share the iTunes library and don't stream.
2. Well, that isn't likely to be solved anytime soon.
Really, how hard would it be to raise the case by .5 inch and stick a disc drive inside? Do people really think there would be a huge cost to do this?
No but they didn't do it. How expensive do you think making the mini .5 inch taller and adding a dedicated GPU would have cost?
The mini and the aTV are similar in construction but different in purpose. One has a GPU and no drive, the other a drive and no GPU. Not that the GeForce Go 7300 is much to write home about but it runs rings around the 950 in the mini and its a $15 part.
I guess you wont be getting one for a long time.
That may be, but I'm just speculating along with you. That is, unless you have some special inside knowledge that lets you know for 100% certainty that Apple would never ever ever add a disc drive to the AppleTV.
Here's Front Row for your Mini.
http://andrewescobar.com/frontrow
Have fun.
No thanks. I'm not interested in constantly chasing my tail every time an OS update comes along and having to download an update to be constantly hacking a G4 just to get Front Row to run. Got a lot of better things to do with my time.
All I'm proposing is a simple solution to a simple problem, which I am not the only one to have. It's strange how people here get worked up about that.
If AppleTV had a DVD player and you put in a DVD, the machine should check to see if the movie is already in your library, and if not, rip it to the hard drive automatically without forcing the user to go through the pain.
That won't happen. It would just piss off the DVD Forum and Apple can't afford that.
Is anybody else getting the feeling that Apple and the DVD rights people are circling around each other waiting for the fight to start? I see Apples' dissing of DVDs to be part of the pre-fight shouting match. Maybe Apple tried to add DVD ripping features and was turned down or they could not reach an agreement on the DRM restrictions.
As far as adding a DVD player to the AppleTV, why not add DVD streaming capabilities from the host computer instead?
No thanks. I'm not interested in constantly chasing my tail every time an OS update comes along and having to download an update to be constantly hacking a G4 just to get Front Row to run. Got a lot of better things to do with my time.
All I'm proposing is a simple solution to a simple problem, which I am not the only one to have. It's strange how people here get worked up about that.
Well you can reach your objective with a free software patch OR a USB IR receiver, 3rd party software and an Apple remote OR any number of FrontRow replacements to manage your media OR buy a mini you say is too expensive.
Or you can wait, probably forever, until Apple adds a DVD drive to the aTV.
Sounds like you're not interested in any solution but the one single one you want.
As far as adding a DVD player to the AppleTV, why not add DVD streaming capabilities from the host computer instead?
That would indeed be a good solution. But to quote yourself:
"That won't happen. It would just piss off the DVD Forum and Apple can't afford that."
The problem is that the DVD would need to be transmitted to the AppleTV fully encrypted to guarantee that the decoded DVD signal cannot be 'branched off' to some HD for 'later storage'.
I would assume Apple would do a similar setup as for music with the Airport Express. Decrypt the signal in the Mac, and transmit it as Apple Lossless with Fairplay DRM added on the fly.
And I don't think most Macs have enough oompf to encrypt and transmit a DVD to the AppleTV in real time. It would end up buffered with you having to wait a while before being able to watch a DVD - which is boring.
And even if they transmit the original, already encrypted DVD information to the Apple TV, I doubt the wireless speed would be fast enough to transmit full DVD video plus 5.1 audio in real time.
And I don't WANT to own a dedicated DVD player!
My preference (and it is just my preference, although I'm sure there are others like me) is to not try and pack as much consumer electronics into a small space for watching movies. [edit] I'm also not interested in all of the extra cabling that would be required to add a dedicated DVD drive alongside an Apple TV and having to switch back and forth. [/edit] But the real point that is getting lost here is that I would be actually be willing to give Apple more money for downloadable shows if I had an AppleTV. But with no DVD player (so I can take the Mac Mini out of the picture altogether), no AppleTV. And no AppleTV means I'm not likely to buy downloadable TV shows, movies or anything else. If Apple gives me a DVD player in the AppleTV, I'll give Apple my money and more when I download shows and movies.
Well if that's your viewpoint. Ditch the 22" 'Home entertainment monitor' altogether. You won't need that with your iMac!
Well if that's your viewpoint. Ditch the 22" 'Home entertainment monitor' altogether. You won't need that with your iMac!
That's not going to happen. The iMac is going to be used as a personal and business computer, handling web design and DAW tasks as well, requiring a few extra hard drives to be plugged in and sitting nearby. And I would be going from a 22" screen to a 20" screen. Not so good for watching films.
As it is now, the Mac Mini is in the living room connected to the 22" screen set inside an armoire. I am sitting in front of it in an office-style black rolling chair with the keyboard and mouse balanced on random stools between me and the armoire.
An additional but random point: We don't have cable or any kind of TV service. Our entertainment needs pretty much are met by renting and watching movies, listening to music, etc. If the AppleTV had a disc dive, then it would suffice for all our needs and our setup would be limited to the AppleTV, monitor and speakers. Simple, clean and elegant.
If you think about it, the studios aren't necessarily being wholly unreasonable. They do need income, and it's not cheap to produce television. Imagine a day when virtually all television programming is available on iTunes for 99¢ rental 24 hours after broadcast. You can either watch a show with commercials in its original time slot, or watch it on your own schedule without commercials for a buck. Isn't that a relatively fair trade-off? If iTunes really had all programming available in a high quality format for immediate viewing, what advantage would you get from the DVR? If the answer is the ability to skip commercials for free, then you have to ask yourself why we deserve such a thing. Sure it's great, but is it justified?
I can imagine many people complaining that 99¢ is still too much to pay per episode. Well maybe there will be deals that let you subscribe to a full 22 show season for $10-15. But even so, it would be nice to have a third option, the ability to watch programs with commercials on your own schedule. The TV studios are beginning to host their own websites that make this possible. I wouldn't be surprised if YouTube eventually adds such programming. But if it shows up on YouTube, then it will also be available on AppleTV. In short, it's not hard to imagine a future in which AppleTV allows multiple avenues to content. But none of those avenues are going to allow you to get content without either payment or advertising, and it's not clear to me that we should ever expect such a thing.
*****
As for a DVD player, I cannot see Apple adding this capability. As hard drives grow and broadband speeds increase there will be less and less need for physical media. For better and worse, Apple sees this future. They get a step ahead of many of us now and then, but the AppleTV is a forward-looking device.
And I would be going from a 22" screen to a 20" screen. Not so good for watching films.
Unless your 22" monitor also has component or HDMI in you'll not likely want an aTV even if it had a DVD player. Yes, you could get a HDMI to DVI cable but depending on what the aTV does without HDCP what it displays may be degraded when aTV goes to 720p and studios get uppity and enable the derez bit.
You're better off with a 2-3m DVI cable for $50 and attaching it directly to your iMac and have a desk next to your armoire.
Then use this script:
http://www.macosxhints.com/article.p...51201230156840
to swap to the 22" when you want to use it as a TV.
Especially given it has a "windowed" mode in case your wife wants to watch something while you work on the iMac. Or you can just use the mini you have.
Yep. I think people are trying to force a square peg in to a round hole here. The Apple TV's purpose in life is to bridge the gap between your Apple-purchased media and your HDTV. It also brings your Digital life assets to the living room, as well as YouTube, Movie Trailers, and presumably future free viewable internet media that has been imprisoned in the computer until this time. These are all things your other living room devices cannot do, hence why Apple TV exists.
Thank you!
As for a DVD player, I cannot see Apple adding this capability. As hard drives grow and broadband speeds increase there will be less and less need for physical media. For better and worse, Apple sees this future. They get a step ahead of many of us now and then, but the AppleTV is a forward-looking device.
Thank You too!
TV Needs a DVR before it self distructs on itself. Screw DVD.
I would love to see that, but I have the feeling Apple is offering that trough Elgato. I not sure if Apple will eventually add the DVR option due that fact the TV networks might not like it because the reasons posted by MacJello.