Apple yanks wireless backup from Leopard last minute

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  • Reply 21 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by camimac View Post


    Are you kidding? You must be smoking way too much pot, because you seem to forget that 10.5 is NOT on schedule.



    I think you're the one that needs to smoke some pot and relax!



    Yeah, I know about the one announced delay. Again, what's the BIG deal? That's one 3-month delay. But they did deliver on the new date announced.



    Bunch of whiners or what!
  • Reply 22 of 162
    Apparently Apple also yanked iPhone Notes syncing and temporary stacks (grab a bunch of random files and drag them to the dock to create a quick stack).
  • Reply 23 of 162
    Apple had to change HFS+ to support 'multilinks' aka multiple hard links in Leopard, for Time Machine to work. [1]



    My guess is, first time you connect an HFS+ disk to Leopard, it 'enables' it for mutli-linking. Hence why these workarounds work - the Airport Extreme itself cant enable mutli-linking, but after you've hooked the disk into your mac, its enabled, and so is valid when shared over AFP from the Airport Extreme.



    This explains why the official line is that network Time Machine backups require a Leopard host... because the remote host has to have enabled the multi-linking feature on the backup volume's HFS+ filesystem.



    I strongly suspect a forthcoming Airport Extreme firmware update will address this problem, and enable Time Machine backing up to AirDisks.



    [1] http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...ne.html&page=2



    "Time Machine does something new and different that actually required Apple to make changes to the underlying Mac file system, HFS+. The new change is referred to multi-links, which are similar to "hard links" common to Unix users..."



    NB: Click to the next page of that article for a really good technical explanation of how Time Machine works.
  • Reply 24 of 162
    Personal File Sharing works wirelessly, so mount your drive and back up to it and stop complaining.
  • Reply 24 of 162
    Folks,



    Since the feature was pulled at the last minute, it was either deemed to be:



    A) too unstable to use reliably



    B) too slow to be practical



    If it was reliability, they'll fix it. Too slow, well, that sucks but we will live.



    This IS backup software. It has to be rock solid. If it's not, you THINK you are backed up, but you are NOT. I used to be in the storage business, and fielding a call from a customer who did backup wrong, or lost the backup, or it was corrupted and wouldn't restore, is awful.



    I tried doing backup using a different utility across Airport Extreme to a mounted USB drive using a third party product that works great on FW400 or USB2, but took a whole day to do incremental updates. If Apple is having the same experience, it's laws of physics. For this, I'll ding them, because they should have been able to calculate the load and bandwidth better.



    My guess? A.
  • Reply 26 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by camimac View Post


    That's not the point, do you know many people who will bother? Isn't the whole idea of the Mac that "it just works" (even though that's just one of the worst marketing mottos I've ever seen in my life)?



    Get a life! I'll bet that there was more than once that your mom had to do a work-a-round you.
  • Reply 27 of 162
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    Does anybody know if it is just the wireless functionality that is a problem?



    Can you still backup multiple machines to an AirPort Extreme base station that is connected to the Macs via a physical Ethernet cable?



    Is it just me or is Leopard the biggest disappointment?
  • Reply 28 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Messiah View Post


    Does anybody know if it is just the wireless functionality that is a problem?



    Can you still backup multiple machines to an AirPort Extreme base station that is connected to the Macs via a physical Ethernet cable?



    Is it just me or is Leopard the biggest disappointment?



    You, by far!
  • Reply 29 of 162
    crees!crees! Posts: 501member
    So I have a PowerBook and not always have an external drive hooked up. I'm thinking about having TM over the network on a desktop with an external attached. I wonder how performance is in backing up over the network as well as using TM to recover files over the network. One thing I always notice is that if I have a computer hard wired to a wireless router, my laptop never sees it under Network in Finder. I always have to go to the hard-wired machine and write down it's afp address and manually enter it on my laptop. Maybe this is fixed in Leopard.
  • Reply 30 of 162
    crees - Time Machine will do a backup every time you connect an external disk, if its overdue. This, i think, is a good solution for laptop users.
  • Reply 31 of 162
    This just means they didn't work out the bugs in time. I'll bet it shows up again in .1 or .2. Bummer for people who bought an airport just for this, but it wasn't a smart move, you should never buy hardware based on assumptions about potential future software features.



    Overall, Leopard has been working great so far, I've even had some hardware work fine that I expected would need driver updates. It seems like some people have their panties in a bunch over relatively minor issues.
  • Reply 32 of 162
    gqbgqb Posts: 1,934member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kresh View Post


    It wasn't exactly a rumor. Apple had it plastered as a prominant feature on their website a week ago. How's that being an idiot?



    Ok... hyperbole.

    But nevertheless, making a hardware investment based on a proposed feature for an as-yet unreleased product is skating pretty close to the edge. I don't buy 1.0 anything, let alone make committments based on it.



    My rant is more about the knee-jerk 'I'M GONNA SUE!!!!" idiocy.
  • Reply 33 of 162
    I don't really get what Apple achieve by removing features in such an Orwellian style. Why can't they publicise their intent? If a feature disappears, we are left having to guess whether or not it is simply delayed, or they found some fundamental issue that is going to stop it ever being rolled out (aside from through hacks).



    Where something involves an investment that may already have been made by an individual and they are left in limbo unsure whether they should be finding another solution / returning an item or whatever then it's only decent that the company should reveal their intentions.



    I've not been caught out by this feature drop and it doesn't bother me much. Ok I've spent the past week looking at various NAS enclosures for a couple of external drives I have sitting around here simply for use as a Time Machine backup disk but hey ho, that's how it goes.



    It's not a show stopper or deal breaker or other overly dramatic event, but I do understand why this gets some peoples backs up against Apple. After all, it is an officially stated feature that may have swayed me to make a purchase - it was possible to pre-order Leopard while this feature was listed wasn't it? I would question the legality of this move, whereas if a statement was made saying oops we didn't make it in time but the feature will be enabled in the coming months then this would just be a small delay to live with, sure people would moan but at the end of the day it would be supplied.



    Now time for home... hopefully there'll be a nice box sitting waiting for me
  • Reply 34 of 162
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    You, by far!



    I guess I'm just jaded because I've been using it for a while.
  • Reply 35 of 162
    dfilerdfiler Posts: 3,420member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    My rant is more about the knee-jerk 'I'M GONNA SUE!!!!" idiocy.



    No need to go overboard on either side.



    People who bought based upon advertised features have a legitimate gripe. At the same time, I doubt apple would give anyone a moment's trouble in returning either product because of the dropped feature.
  • Reply 36 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    Ok... hyperbole.

    But nevertheless, making a hardware investment based on a proposed feature for an as-yet unreleased product is skating pretty close to the edge. I don't buy 1.0 anything, let alone make committments based on it.



    My rant is more about the knee-jerk 'I'M GONNA SUE!!!!" idiocy.



    The only "knee-jerk idiocy" here is you calling people idiots, when you were the one who was wrong.
  • Reply 37 of 162
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    YOU smell of poo...



    ...no YOU smell of poo







    Grow up. We're trying to have an adult discussion here.
  • Reply 38 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    Ok... hyperbole.

    But nevertheless, making a hardware investment based on a proposed feature for an as-yet unreleased product is skating pretty close to the edge. I don't buy 1.0 anything, let alone make committments based on it.



    My rant is more about the knee-jerk 'I'M GONNA SUE!!!!" idiocy.



    Uh.. if I'm not mistaken, it was on their website AFTER they started selling Leopard on their store. One should be able to assume that the leopard they describe on their website matches the one they sell there too... otherwise it's false advertising.



    ...and I'm not talking about infomercial-I-though-this-product-would-work-magnificently-but-its-actually-a-piece-of-crap-but-I-got-hosed-so-I'm-out-of-luck false adversiting. I'm talking about legal this-is-what-you-get-when-you-buy-this-product-but-oh-wait-its-not-here false advertising.



    Technically, this could become a legal issue.



    Usually I'm one of the ones who chides these lawsuits as well, but this one is legit. Technically.



    -Clive
  • Reply 39 of 162
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Messiah View Post


    YOU smell of poo...



    ...no YOU smell of poo



    YOU smell of poo...



    [...]



    Grow up. We're trying to have an adult discussion here.



    Please delete this crap. Your post is anything but "adult."



    -Clive
  • Reply 40 of 162
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GQB View Post


    My rant is more about the knee-jerk 'I'M GONNA SUE!!!!" idiocy.



    Who mentioned suing anyone? It looks like you're the one that brought it up.
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