Just tell me you don't truly believe that "match attendance", or what I would call "ticket sales", are an insignificant portion of revenue and I'll drop it.
I'm not quite sure how I'm refuting and agreeing with your case study. I was just commenting on the fact I doubt you've ever been to a ballgame there with #25 in the lineup.
Although this year, I do understand I'll probably end up taking that comment back.
It'll never die. Baseball has a long history of scandal and drama, but most of all forgiveness. Eventually, the public forgives and/or forgets, time goes on, Baseball, like our livelihood at times, takes a hit but moves on and still impresses.
Tell that to Pete Rose.
Anyway...here's what you do. Let the Athletes take all the drugs they want. They'll freak out and kill their trophy wives, dogs and children or keel over from heart attacks. Then start over...works in wrestling.
Or make the games more challenging. Have lions come out on the football fields, 20 foot high baskets with trampolines, flaming hockey goals, bike races with broken glass on the roads, or baseballs with carpenter nails protruding from them.
I'm not quite sure how I'm refuting and agreeing with your case study. I was just commenting on the fact I doubt you've ever been to a ballgame there with #25 in the lineup.
Well, you said this: "I'm not going to get on you for your Giants fans comment. All I can say is that I guarantee you've never been to a game since AT&T was built. And if you did, it was on a Sunday afternoon game or it was after August 7th, 2007."
I went to a Saturday afternoon (maybe it was sunday...) game in the spring, but I can't for the life of me remember who was the opponent. Either way, fans of either football manage to bring it regardless of the time slot. I suggest that you do one of the following:
- Attend any sporting event in Boston
- Attend a Yankees game in NY
- Attend a Redskins game in DC
- Attend or merely watch on TV a soccer game between any two rivals in a major European league (England, Spain, Italy). There is fan energy like nothing you can experience in the states.
Having done all four, perhaps my expectations are just too high. SF is a nice city and I might move there in a few months: interesting people, good brew-pubs, great scenery, great weather, etc. But they make shitty sports fans. There are too many things better to do in SF than watch mediocre sports teams in mediocre/sleepy divisons. I'm told that Raiders and A's fans are much better. I was an an A's game, too, and it was still shit. In fact, I think they played the Giants that day, so I got to see both fans. The atmosphere was typically contrived and way too polite.
Or make the games more challenging. Have lions come out on the football fields, 20 foot high baskets with trampolines, flaming hockey goals, bike races with broken glass on the roads, or baseballs with carpenter nails protruding from them.
Heh, well said. The only thing I can see that would make baseball more interesting, without going to such unlikely extremes, is to implement a free-running timer that cannot be stopped for any reason. After 90 or 120 mins, GAME OVER. Come to think of it, this could possibly make baseball INCREDIBLE.
You were in Florida at the time Bonds was crushing homeruns at Pac Bell/SBC/AT&T during the good 'ol juicing days.
I've been to a Red Sox game, and I can easily attest the electricity was greater at AT&T when Bonds was at the plate back in those days than the fan reaction to Big Papi or Manny in Boston. Back when they were competitive, Pac Bell was as electric as any park in the league. I guarantee you that if you would have gone to any of the World Series games in 2002, you wouldn't be knocking San Francisco fans as much as you are.
The fact is, since 2003, the Giants have been pretty horrible. There has been nothing to be excited about since they made the playoffs, other than seeing the career homerun record get broken.
I mean, you can look at it with the Warriors. Two years ago, that place was a mortuary. Less than 10,000 consistently, and when they played the Kings, there would be more Kings fans than Warrior fans. We'd take buses up there and make it a home game. But now, or last year in the second half of the season, that place was amazing. Yellow shirts everywhere, people chanting out, "Let's go Oakland." It was nuts.
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
Baseball is an awesome game. As I grow older I enjoy its pace and story lines more and more.
Football (American style) is an awesome game. It is fun to watch, easy to bet on and every game is important.
To say baseball is on the decline when attendance has been breaking all time records is sorta asinine, though. TV ratings for EVERYTHING are going down due to the growing choices and options. Superbowls? Viewership down. Nascar? Viewership down the last two years.
I will admit that they are different, though. I take my kid to baseball games (Phillies and Yankees), I go with friends to football games(Eagles). Football I want to be loud and standing up the entire time. I want the stadium to shake. Baseball is a different animal. It can get crazy--it can build tension like no other game I know (limited to traditional North American games, I admit)--but much of the time is calmer and more pleasant.
Just because they are different does not mean that one is good and one is bad.
To the Mitchel Report. I think that any attempt to expose the problems are good. But they only got information from two sources--anybody who thinks that the whole story is out now is not thinking...
I agree with proposals #1 and #2 above. I would also like to see blood banking so they can test blood for banned substances with better tests as they come available...
That or they have to give up and let these guys alter themselves into supermen... That doesn't seem right for baseball, but it might work for football...
Baseball is an awesome game. As I grow older I enjoy its pace and story lines more and more.
Polls seem to indicate that baseball is supported mostly by an older crowd. I don't know if it's part of growing old or simply a generation gap. Either way, there's enough choice in the market that I'm not really bothered what happens to it. That was the original post. Then people got way too sentimental for me not to take jabs: I despise the fact that MLB is a government-sponsored monopoly.
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guybrush Threepwood
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
History makes sports interesting even when the matches aren't great. Good fans are a product of local franchise stability: the idea that a given team is a fixture of the region, just as the people are. Honestly, I couldn't care less about the NFL (or pro-football in general), but I love the Redskins. The Redskins are more a part of DC culture than the federal government is. Perhaps there's too much flux on the west coast, in population or teams, for the same to be said.
On another note, I still am convinced that by the end of the century soccer will have taken over this country completely. It simply cannot be stopped.
I don't know how anyone watches sports or sports channels anymore. As one current game goes on, they roll thousands of other scores below, break into other games across the country, break into sports news, break into former game plays from the past, instant replays from the current game/other game/former games and then there are the commercials. The noise of the crowd, the announcers, the music, the graphics and depending if you are with other sports fanatics at home or in a bar (where they have more than a dozen other screens showing a dozen other games going on) the din is deafening.
You need steroids just to watch these crappy presentations.
Comments
I'm not quite sure how I'm refuting and agreeing with your case study. I was just commenting on the fact I doubt you've ever been to a ballgame there with #25 in the lineup.
Although this year, I do understand I'll probably end up taking that comment back.
http://channels.isp.netscape.com/new...53&floc=NI-ne1
It'll never die.
Tell that to Pete Rose.
Anyway...here's what you do. Let the Athletes take all the drugs they want. They'll freak out and kill their trophy wives, dogs and children or keel over from heart attacks. Then start over...works in wrestling.
Or make the games more challenging. Have lions come out on the football fields, 20 foot high baskets with trampolines, flaming hockey goals, bike races with broken glass on the roads, or baseballs with carpenter nails protruding from them.
This isn't baseball...THIS IS SPARTA!
all I got...
I'm not quite sure how I'm refuting and agreeing with your case study. I was just commenting on the fact I doubt you've ever been to a ballgame there with #25 in the lineup.
Well, you said this: "I'm not going to get on you for your Giants fans comment. All I can say is that I guarantee you've never been to a game since AT&T was built. And if you did, it was on a Sunday afternoon game or it was after August 7th, 2007."
I went to a Saturday afternoon (maybe it was sunday...) game in the spring, but I can't for the life of me remember who was the opponent. Either way, fans of either football manage to bring it regardless of the time slot. I suggest that you do one of the following:
- Attend any sporting event in Boston
- Attend a Yankees game in NY
- Attend a Redskins game in DC
- Attend or merely watch on TV a soccer game between any two rivals in a major European league (England, Spain, Italy). There is fan energy like nothing you can experience in the states.
Having done all four, perhaps my expectations are just too high. SF is a nice city and I might move there in a few months: interesting people, good brew-pubs, great scenery, great weather, etc. But they make shitty sports fans. There are too many things better to do in SF than watch mediocre sports teams in mediocre/sleepy divisons. I'm told that Raiders and A's fans are much better. I was an an A's game, too, and it was still shit. In fact, I think they played the Giants that day, so I got to see both fans. The atmosphere was typically contrived and way too polite.
Or make the games more challenging. Have lions come out on the football fields, 20 foot high baskets with trampolines, flaming hockey goals, bike races with broken glass on the roads, or baseballs with carpenter nails protruding from them.
Heh, well said. The only thing I can see that would make baseball more interesting, without going to such unlikely extremes, is to implement a free-running timer that cannot be stopped for any reason. After 90 or 120 mins, GAME OVER. Come to think of it, this could possibly make baseball INCREDIBLE.
You were in Florida at the time Bonds was crushing homeruns at Pac Bell/SBC/AT&T during the good 'ol juicing days.
I've been to a Red Sox game, and I can easily attest the electricity was greater at AT&T when Bonds was at the plate back in those days than the fan reaction to Big Papi or Manny in Boston. Back when they were competitive, Pac Bell was as electric as any park in the league. I guarantee you that if you would have gone to any of the World Series games in 2002, you wouldn't be knocking San Francisco fans as much as you are.
The fact is, since 2003, the Giants have been pretty horrible. There has been nothing to be excited about since they made the playoffs, other than seeing the career homerun record get broken.
I mean, you can look at it with the Warriors. Two years ago, that place was a mortuary. Less than 10,000 consistently, and when they played the Kings, there would be more Kings fans than Warrior fans. We'd take buses up there and make it a home game. But now, or last year in the second half of the season, that place was amazing. Yellow shirts everywhere, people chanting out, "Let's go Oakland." It was nuts.
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
Baseball is an awesome game. As I grow older I enjoy its pace and story lines more and more.
Football (American style) is an awesome game. It is fun to watch, easy to bet on and every game is important.
To say baseball is on the decline when attendance has been breaking all time records is sorta asinine, though. TV ratings for EVERYTHING are going down due to the growing choices and options. Superbowls? Viewership down. Nascar? Viewership down the last two years.
I will admit that they are different, though. I take my kid to baseball games (Phillies and Yankees), I go with friends to football games(Eagles). Football I want to be loud and standing up the entire time. I want the stadium to shake. Baseball is a different animal. It can get crazy--it can build tension like no other game I know (limited to traditional North American games, I admit)--but much of the time is calmer and more pleasant.
Just because they are different does not mean that one is good and one is bad.
To the Mitchel Report. I think that any attempt to expose the problems are good. But they only got information from two sources--anybody who thinks that the whole story is out now is not thinking...
I agree with proposals #1 and #2 above. I would also like to see blood banking so they can test blood for banned substances with better tests as they come available...
That or they have to give up and let these guys alter themselves into supermen... That doesn't seem right for baseball, but it might work for football...
Baseball is an awesome game. As I grow older I enjoy its pace and story lines more and more.
Polls seem to indicate that baseball is supported mostly by an older crowd. I don't know if it's part of growing old or simply a generation gap. Either way, there's enough choice in the market that I'm not really bothered what happens to it. That was the original post. Then people got way too sentimental for me not to take jabs: I despise the fact that MLB is a government-sponsored monopoly.
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
I understand where you're coming from. Basically, on the West Coast, the fans are different. The teams here have to be great, not just good, in order for fans to get crazy about them. But if the teams are good, they're just as good as any East Coast fan out there.
History makes sports interesting even when the matches aren't great. Good fans are a product of local franchise stability: the idea that a given team is a fixture of the region, just as the people are. Honestly, I couldn't care less about the NFL (or pro-football in general), but I love the Redskins. The Redskins are more a part of DC culture than the federal government is. Perhaps there's too much flux on the west coast, in population or teams, for the same to be said.
On another note, I still am convinced that by the end of the century soccer will have taken over this country completely. It simply cannot be stopped.
You need steroids just to watch these crappy presentations.