Also, look at what businesses are giving their employees. It's nearly always a diskless system from Lenovo or HP or Dell. The reason is simple. Such computers are not for burning music CDs, and they're not for watching DVDs. The user is also not supposed to install stuff by himself (although nearly everyone has music, movies and non-sanctioned programs).
These computers are supposed to be centrally maintained by the IT department, and they can have a few external drive. no optical means one less thing to break, less weight, less price - a good thing all over.
It's true that Apple has never been good at selling to businesses, so it's possible that they won't make a machine like that, because it's not their target market.
You just answered very nicely why such a notebook is rather a geek dream in forums like the present one than anything else. Well, "geek dream" stretches it a little because there are many users in business enviromnent that would need minimal notebooks. But other than that I don't see many uses for such notebooks, especially when all Apple is about is OS X, iLife and simplicity of use; this means optical disks and complete, compact computers.
Now with Apple everything is possible because there is already a precedent. But if finally Apple releases such a notebook without DVD drive, I am very curious to see what kind of market is hoping to target at.
Well they clearly analyzed the potential market for the device in various configurations. They naturally could be wrong, but they did not use this willy nilly. The 13inch screen offers them a way to get people to move up from the macbook line for someone that doesn't want a 15inch MBP as well as get people that will pay a premium for portability.
Yup. That's what it's for. If it's got the same screen as the MacBook and the same dimensions other than thickness then it's simply a replacement for the old 12.1" PowerBook.
I've a 12.1" iBook still and I've not replaced it with a MacBook as I found the MacBook too big. This MacBook thin model is still too big - bigger than my iBook.
Neither the 12.1" models or the 13.3" models satisfy the 'Ultra-Portable' market. If anything they're worse than the old PPC models.
When Apple gets down to EeePC dimensions, then they've got the Ultra-Portable sorted.
Maybe new Mac portables will replace the optical drive with something we have used for years in other devices, memory card slots. A starter card could come with the machine and contain the OSX system and diagnostic software. With a special keyboard combination the system could boot from that memory card and such a card would be difficult to lose since it could remain installed in its slot.
4GB SDHC cards like those used in new HD video cameras now have a street price of less than $60 so including one of these would be cheaper than a typical OEM optical drive.
As to future system software, it could be downloaded as a dmg file just like we do now with most new software. The download would be large, however, much like the size of iTunes Movie files.
The Leopard DVD was dual-layer and about 7GB IIRC so that'd be one heck of a download to reinstall the OS.
I've got TechTool Pro on my iMac and one of it's features is a safety 'eDrive'. It creates a partition into which you can boot should the main partition not. That's about 1.6GB. I suppose Apple could stick a small partition on the SSD of this diskless computer which got you up and running should you suffer a problem, possibly repairing the install over a network.
MicroMat also do a tool to install an OS onto a USB stick or iPod from which you can boot. Perhaps Apple will do something like that.
If this is truly an ultraportable and therefore a second computer for use just on the road, then a network install or install from USB stick/iPod is quite useful. Beats carrying around DVD drives and DVDs.
Here's a 3D mockup I made that sort of shows what some of the rumors are pointing to:
I imagine a glass multitouch pad in place of a trackpad and no mouse button. Very thin base and bezel, no hard drive, no optical drive, and a 64GB SSD. Shows with 13.3" widescreen display.
Very nice Rolo.
By the way though, I think the rumours are slightly entangled.
1.
There is I predict ultra thin 13" MacBook. Basically the super popular MacBook, but thinner, lighter, sexier. Will have DVD writers standard across the line, INTERNAL.
Not as thin as the mockup, but in the spirit of it.
2.
Then there is the 10" or 11" "tablet". The multi-touch stuff applies here because...
THERE IS NO KEYBOARD. It is just the screen ala ModBook.
Thus when browsing, etc, just hand gestures. Need to type? Qwerty comes up on touch screen ala iPhone. No stylus.
This is the one with no optical drive in it, external optical drive *will* be bundled with the "tablet" etc. This is for ripping music, installations, etc. No official DVD ripping support as such, because of iTunes movie rentals. No 2.5G or 3G support, just 802.11n/g/b. External optical is FW400 port or USB 3.x ??? Not sure.
Hard disk is solid state 32 GB. Upgradeable to 64GB custom order or something.
3.
MacBookPro: Penryn class 45nm stuff. Thinner, lighter, etc. MacBookPro may not be announced at Macworld but a few weeks after to buffer the consumer space. GPU will probably be 8700M GT.
4.
Mac Pro Penryn etc. to be announced at that special Final Cut user group, with nVidia 8600GT standard, or 8500GT standard, option for 8800 GTs?? Not sure.
You just answered very nicely why such a notebook is rather a geek dream in forums like the present one than anything else. Well, "geek dream" stretches it a little because there are many users in business enviromnent that would need minimal notebooks. But other than that I don't see many uses for such notebooks, especially when all Apple is about is OS X, iLife and simplicity of use; this means optical disks and complete, compact computers.
Now with Apple everything is possible because there is already a precedent. But if finally Apple releases such a notebook without DVD drive, I am very curious to see what kind of market is hoping to target at.
Again I firstly apologise for my serial-posting. It's just the way my brain works, okay.... Do bear with me.
As to the quote above, opticaldiskless "thin clients", is around the corner for corporate. Have you tried NetBoot with Leopard OS 10.5 Server? Phenomenal stuff. Highly secure (in a sense) if you take out the hard disk so that it is pure thin client. Speeds are actually quite acceptable on a GigE/ fibre etc. etc. This is because the thin client Mac hitting the "network drive" is actually not that much if you have 1GB around, kernel caching to RAM in Leopard is quite efficient now. If you are talking say 20 MegaBytes per second average for network throughput this is quite acceptable for non-media aspects, just surfing the Internet, iWork08, Office2008, Mail, etc.
As to the quote above, opticaldiskless "thin clients", is around the corner for corporate. Have you tried NetBoot with Leopard OS 10.5 Server? phenomenal stuff. Highly secure (in a sense) if you take out the hard disk so that it is pure thin client. Speeds are actually quite acceptable on a GigE/ fibre etc. etc.
All this is good and nice, but do you imply that Apple is targeting corporate clients? Such a notebook (and every notebook) needs a market and the home/family setting is certainly not well suited. And I cannot imagine Apple, and everyone at that matter, producing a computer without doing first the appropriate market research.
I have to say that I just don't think that Apple would have an external optical drive. I didn't think they would release an MP3 player either so I could easily be wrong on this, but I just can't picture Apple trying to sell this after all their spiel about AIO and what not.
For some time now I've wanted the following: a subnotebook & external screen combo, but with a difference. The external screen has got its own HD, DVD, and videocard. It also allows you to slide in your subnotebook from the side.
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
For some time now I've wanted the following: a subnotebook & external screen combo, but with a difference. The external screen has got its own HD, DVD, and videocard. It also allows you to slide in your subnotebook from the side.
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
Anyone here thinks this is a good idea?
This is a cunning idea indeed, granted a little bit special. I'm wondering
how the slot is probably called: subnotebook-slot?
And how do the ads work out that speciality? Here you go, "First Monitor with
I remember some time ago a discussion about future computers that people would carry around and then plug into monitors at various locations. Sorta sounds like that.
For some time now I've wanted the following: a subnotebook & external screen combo, but with a difference. The external screen has got its own HD, DVD, and videocard. It also allows you to slide in your subnotebook from the side.
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
Anyone here thinks this is a good idea?
I think it is a decent idea when taken from the angle of a tablet with a DVI port and optional bluetooth keyboard and mouse. The tablet could be mounted on a stand and resemble an iMac or use an on-screen multi-touch keyboard and resemble an iPhone. I've mentioned this idea before and there are some similar devices mentioned in previous posts, but basically, the Mac Touch would be the hybrid of a macbook and iphone...
All this is good and nice, but do you imply that Apple is targeting corporate clients? Such a notebook (and every notebook) needs a market and the home/family setting is certainly not well suited. And I cannot imagine Apple, and everyone at that matter, producing a computer without doing first the appropriate market research.
The beauty is that Apple doesn't really target corporate, yet just watch them gobble up the new MacBook 13" UltraThin... And maybe... the MacTabletToGo™ or something like that.
The "target market" is Mobility. Whether it is music, a document, a business presentation, a phone call, some movies, the latest Desperate Housewives, or just a morning read of the news.
By the way though, I think the rumours are slightly entangled.
1.
There is I predict ultra thin 13" MacBook. Basically the super popular MacBook, but thinner, lighter, sexier. Will have DVD writers standard across the line, INTERNAL.
Not as thin as the mockup, but in the spirit of it.
2.
Then there is the 10" or 11" "tablet". The multi-touch stuff applies here because...
THERE IS NO KEYBOARD. It is just the screen ala ModBook.
Thus when browsing, etc, just hand gestures. Need to type? Qwerty comes up on touch screen ala iPhone. No stylus.
This is the one with no optical drive in it, external optical drive *will* be bundled with the "tablet" etc. This is for ripping music, installations, etc. No official DVD ripping support as such, because of iTunes movie rentals. No 2.5G or 3G support, just 802.11n/g/b. External optical is FW400 port or USB 3.x ??? Not sure.
Hard disk is solid state 32 GB. Upgradeable to 64GB custom order or something.
3.
MacBookPro: Penryn class 45nm stuff. Thinner, lighter, etc. MacBookPro may not be announced at Macworld but a few weeks after to buffer the consumer space. GPU will probably be 8700M GT.
4.
Mac Pro Penryn etc. to be announced at that special Final Cut user group, with nVidia 8600GT standard, or 8500GT standard, option for 8800 GTs?? Not sure.
Wow. MacWorld 2008. Whoa
Interestingly, I would like to point out that I posted this before reading the Macrumors "leaked keynote draft".
Comments
Also, look at what businesses are giving their employees. It's nearly always a diskless system from Lenovo or HP or Dell. The reason is simple. Such computers are not for burning music CDs, and they're not for watching DVDs. The user is also not supposed to install stuff by himself (although nearly everyone has music, movies and non-sanctioned programs).
These computers are supposed to be centrally maintained by the IT department, and they can have a few external drive. no optical means one less thing to break, less weight, less price - a good thing all over.
It's true that Apple has never been good at selling to businesses, so it's possible that they won't make a machine like that, because it's not their target market.
You just answered very nicely why such a notebook is rather a geek dream in forums like the present one than anything else. Well, "geek dream" stretches it a little because there are many users in business enviromnent that would need minimal notebooks. But other than that I don't see many uses for such notebooks, especially when all Apple is about is OS X, iLife and simplicity of use; this means optical disks and complete, compact computers.
Now with Apple everything is possible because there is already a precedent. But if finally Apple releases such a notebook without DVD drive, I am very curious to see what kind of market is hoping to target at.
Well they clearly analyzed the potential market for the device in various configurations. They naturally could be wrong, but they did not use this willy nilly. The 13inch screen offers them a way to get people to move up from the macbook line for someone that doesn't want a 15inch MBP as well as get people that will pay a premium for portability.
Yup. That's what it's for. If it's got the same screen as the MacBook and the same dimensions other than thickness then it's simply a replacement for the old 12.1" PowerBook.
I've a 12.1" iBook still and I've not replaced it with a MacBook as I found the MacBook too big. This MacBook thin model is still too big - bigger than my iBook.
Neither the 12.1" models or the 13.3" models satisfy the 'Ultra-Portable' market. If anything they're worse than the old PPC models.
When Apple gets down to EeePC dimensions, then they've got the Ultra-Portable sorted.
Maybe new Mac portables will replace the optical drive with something we have used for years in other devices, memory card slots. A starter card could come with the machine and contain the OSX system and diagnostic software. With a special keyboard combination the system could boot from that memory card and such a card would be difficult to lose since it could remain installed in its slot.
4GB SDHC cards like those used in new HD video cameras now have a street price of less than $60 so including one of these would be cheaper than a typical OEM optical drive.
As to future system software, it could be downloaded as a dmg file just like we do now with most new software. The download would be large, however, much like the size of iTunes Movie files.
The Leopard DVD was dual-layer and about 7GB IIRC so that'd be one heck of a download to reinstall the OS.
I've got TechTool Pro on my iMac and one of it's features is a safety 'eDrive'. It creates a partition into which you can boot should the main partition not. That's about 1.6GB. I suppose Apple could stick a small partition on the SSD of this diskless computer which got you up and running should you suffer a problem, possibly repairing the install over a network.
MicroMat also do a tool to install an OS onto a USB stick or iPod from which you can boot. Perhaps Apple will do something like that.
If this is truly an ultraportable and therefore a second computer for use just on the road, then a network install or install from USB stick/iPod is quite useful. Beats carrying around DVD drives and DVDs.
http://www.crucial.com/promo/index.aspx?prog=ssd
Here's a 3D mockup I made that sort of shows what some of the rumors are pointing to:
I imagine a glass multitouch pad in place of a trackpad and no mouse button. Very thin base and bezel, no hard drive, no optical drive, and a 64GB SSD. Shows with 13.3" widescreen display.
Very nice Rolo.
By the way though, I think the rumours are slightly entangled.
1.
There is I predict ultra thin 13" MacBook. Basically the super popular MacBook, but thinner, lighter, sexier. Will have DVD writers standard across the line, INTERNAL.
Not as thin as the mockup, but in the spirit of it.
2.
Then there is the 10" or 11" "tablet". The multi-touch stuff applies here because...
THERE IS NO KEYBOARD. It is just the screen ala ModBook.
Thus when browsing, etc, just hand gestures. Need to type? Qwerty comes up on touch screen ala iPhone. No stylus.
This is the one with no optical drive in it, external optical drive *will* be bundled with the "tablet" etc. This is for ripping music, installations, etc. No official DVD ripping support as such, because of iTunes movie rentals. No 2.5G or 3G support, just 802.11n/g/b. External optical is FW400 port or USB 3.x ??? Not sure.
Hard disk is solid state 32 GB. Upgradeable to 64GB custom order or something.
3.
MacBookPro: Penryn class 45nm stuff. Thinner, lighter, etc. MacBookPro may not be announced at Macworld but a few weeks after to buffer the consumer space. GPU will probably be 8700M GT.
4.
Mac Pro Penryn etc. to be announced at that special Final Cut user group, with nVidia 8600GT standard, or 8500GT standard, option for 8800 GTs?? Not sure.
Wow. MacWorld 2008. Whoa
You just answered very nicely why such a notebook is rather a geek dream in forums like the present one than anything else. Well, "geek dream" stretches it a little because there are many users in business enviromnent that would need minimal notebooks. But other than that I don't see many uses for such notebooks, especially when all Apple is about is OS X, iLife and simplicity of use; this means optical disks and complete, compact computers.
Now with Apple everything is possible because there is already a precedent. But if finally Apple releases such a notebook without DVD drive, I am very curious to see what kind of market is hoping to target at.
Again I firstly apologise for my serial-posting. It's just the way my brain works, okay.... Do bear with me.
As to the quote above, opticaldiskless "thin clients", is around the corner for corporate. Have you tried NetBoot with Leopard OS 10.5 Server? Phenomenal stuff. Highly secure (in a sense) if you take out the hard disk so that it is pure thin client. Speeds are actually quite acceptable on a GigE/ fibre etc. etc. This is because the thin client Mac hitting the "network drive" is actually not that much if you have 1GB around, kernel caching to RAM in Leopard is quite efficient now. If you are talking say 20 MegaBytes per second average for network throughput this is quite acceptable for non-media aspects, just surfing the Internet, iWork08, Office2008, Mail, etc.
New MBs
New UMB like thingy
New iMac
New Mac Mini
New small tower (I think they are getting hit by the wastefulness of the large PM enclosure)
New PowerMacs at the Final Cut meeting the next day
New MBPs (sans HD, sans OD) the next day
Busted wallets and credit accounts the world over once these things go on sale.
I could be dreaming or temporarily insane or both
As to the quote above, opticaldiskless "thin clients", is around the corner for corporate. Have you tried NetBoot with Leopard OS 10.5 Server? phenomenal stuff. Highly secure (in a sense) if you take out the hard disk so that it is pure thin client. Speeds are actually quite acceptable on a GigE/ fibre etc. etc.
All this is good and nice, but do you imply that Apple is targeting corporate clients? Such a notebook (and every notebook) needs a market and the home/family setting is certainly not well suited. And I cannot imagine Apple, and everyone at that matter, producing a computer without doing first the appropriate market research.
I could be dreaming or temporarily insane or both
Should we to show you the way?
...
I am confident that by now you are convinced that it is not just you.
However, time will tell, if the rumoured subnotebook makes a hit.
best
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
Anyone here thinks this is a good idea?
hrmpf
For some time now I've wanted the following: a subnotebook & external screen combo, but with a difference. The external screen has got its own HD, DVD, and videocard. It also allows you to slide in your subnotebook from the side.
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
Anyone here thinks this is a good idea?
This is a cunning idea indeed, granted a little bit special. I'm wondering
how the slot is probably called: subnotebook-slot?
And how do the ads work out that speciality? Here you go, "First Monitor with
subnotebook-loading capabilities.
For some time now I've wanted the following: a subnotebook & external screen combo, but with a difference. The external screen has got its own HD, DVD, and videocard. It also allows you to slide in your subnotebook from the side.
What I think is ideal about this set up is that due to the videocard in the screen, you can still run graphics extensive applications, and because the screen also has a built-in HD, you get automatic backup, as well as extra disk space the moment the slide in you notebook. The other benefit is that this way they can keep the notebook really slim.
Anyone here thinks this is a good idea?
I think it is a decent idea when taken from the angle of a tablet with a DVI port and optional bluetooth keyboard and mouse. The tablet could be mounted on a stand and resemble an iMac or use an on-screen multi-touch keyboard and resemble an iPhone. I've mentioned this idea before and there are some similar devices mentioned in previous posts, but basically, the Mac Touch would be the hybrid of a macbook and iphone...
This is a cunning idea indeed, granted a little bit special. I'm wondering
how the slot is probably called: subnotebook-slot?
And how do the ads work out that speciality? Here you go, "First Monitor with
subnotebook-loading capabilities.
How about: 'Cinema Display To Go', or, 'The World's First Home-Cinema Notebook'.
All this is good and nice, but do you imply that Apple is targeting corporate clients? Such a notebook (and every notebook) needs a market and the home/family setting is certainly not well suited. And I cannot imagine Apple, and everyone at that matter, producing a computer without doing first the appropriate market research.
The beauty is that Apple doesn't really target corporate, yet just watch them gobble up the new MacBook 13" UltraThin... And maybe... the MacTabletToGo™ or something like that.
The "target market" is Mobility. Whether it is music, a document, a business presentation, a phone call, some movies, the latest Desperate Housewives, or just a morning read of the news.
Mac + Mobility = 2008 And Beyond.
iPod Touch
iPhone
MacBook To Go
MacBook
MacBook Pro
iMac (more anorexic in '08)!
See the pattern?
Very nice Rolo.
By the way though, I think the rumours are slightly entangled.
1.
There is I predict ultra thin 13" MacBook. Basically the super popular MacBook, but thinner, lighter, sexier. Will have DVD writers standard across the line, INTERNAL.
Not as thin as the mockup, but in the spirit of it.
2.
Then there is the 10" or 11" "tablet". The multi-touch stuff applies here because...
THERE IS NO KEYBOARD. It is just the screen ala ModBook.
Thus when browsing, etc, just hand gestures. Need to type? Qwerty comes up on touch screen ala iPhone. No stylus.
This is the one with no optical drive in it, external optical drive *will* be bundled with the "tablet" etc. This is for ripping music, installations, etc. No official DVD ripping support as such, because of iTunes movie rentals. No 2.5G or 3G support, just 802.11n/g/b. External optical is FW400 port or USB 3.x ??? Not sure.
Hard disk is solid state 32 GB. Upgradeable to 64GB custom order or something.
3.
MacBookPro: Penryn class 45nm stuff. Thinner, lighter, etc. MacBookPro may not be announced at Macworld but a few weeks after to buffer the consumer space. GPU will probably be 8700M GT.
4.
Mac Pro Penryn etc. to be announced at that special Final Cut user group, with nVidia 8600GT standard, or 8500GT standard, option for 8800 GTs?? Not sure.
Wow. MacWorld 2008. Whoa
Interestingly, I would like to point out that I posted this before reading the Macrumors "leaked keynote draft".