[QUOTE=aplnub;1287995]The core network is infrastructure as well. If you are busy putting up thousands upon thousands of towers, do you think there is money left over to increase the bandwidth to support unlimited data transfers? You rob Peter to pay Paul, at least in AT&T's case. They have a budget and have to fit within it just like every business should. AT&T has to pick what matters are more important to them. More bars in more places, or to allow more faster data usage. One takes money from the other. So they are linked together forever until Federation Credits replace the US Dollar.
Your bosses reference was not lost on anyone. I think everyone is trying to figure out how Condoleezza Rice helped you form an opinion about cellular data download restrictions/limitations within AT&T's network.****
In post #23 you state: "I know what you were talking about and infrastructure is related to geography. However, if your life depends on cell phone data plans, then by all means, don't come back because it would not suit you."
My response was along the lines that I do not make this decision. It is handled via OPM via the Sec State. Pure and simple. I thought that I had made this as easy to understand as possible. I was wrong. It was a nuanced response to a very obtuse statement. I would even go so far as to say it was sarcastic a bit on both sides. Regardless I did not think I would have to go over it again and again. Being as you think that all are trying to figure out how my boss is involved in this, you now have the answer to let them all know.
As for the network issue, they are built from the inside out for several reason, costs being one, gaining customers, providing services, etc..... My only point of contention with your statement about AT&T is that their network should be able to handle unlimited data accesses from x amount of customers if the core network elements are stable, and well planned. If not, you can have towers until the cows come home but the network will still be crappy. You are right that money is a factor in a network build out, this is however budgeted in the rollout plan. So my point still being that a crappy network core will still be terrible no matter how many towers (BTS/BSC) are built.
I think we are approaching the tunnel from two different directions, so I think we can either agree to disagree or you can continue on without me.
Either its been pulled everywhere or just in the UK but I have held off from getting an Iphone just because of the lack of tethering.. if anyone knows how I can get hold of it in the UK then I am very interested... thanks in advance...
In post #23 you state: "I know what you were talking about and infrastructure is related to geography. However, if your life depends on cell phone data plans, then by all means, don't come back because it would not suit you."
My response was along the lines that I do not make this decision. It is handled via OPM via the Sec State. Pure and simple.
No one cares.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
I thought that I had made this as easy to understand as possible. I was wrong.
I caught on just fine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
It was a nuanced response to a very obtuse statement. I would even go so far as to say it was sarcastic a bit on both sides.
I was being sarcastic and serious. If the US's cellular network data plans are such a hamper to your life, then...
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
Regardless I did not think I would have to go over it again and again. Being as you think that all are trying to figure out how my boss is involved in this, you now have the answer to let them all know.
I believe everyone reading this thread understands how your boss got involved in this thread. I am sure she is on pins and needles regarding the State of AT&T Network Data Service Plans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
As for the network issue, they are built from the inside out for several reason, costs being one, gaining customers, providing services, etc..... My only point of contention with your statement about AT&T is that their network should be able to handle unlimited data accesses from x amount of customers if the core network elements are stable, and well planned.
Back on topic, finally.
Sure, but once X number of customers have been exceeded, the problems start. You have to do towers to handle the customers and then you have to wait some time to spend money regarding data bandwidth and support. Or do both but at the cost of doing a little bit for both towers, bandwidth, and 3g/4g/5g upgrades. If money was not a factor, we would have 100% coverage with true unlimited data, and 3G speeds for every phone. So my original point is infrastructure is connected directly to geographical areas because you must have more equipment to support locations in nowheresville and New York City. When offering national calling plans with the iPhone to 50 states, you can't just regionalize customer agreements. Hence, geography plays a big role in a country this size.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
If not, you can have towers until the cows come home but the network will still be crappy. You are right that money is a factor in a network build out, this is however budgeted in the rollout plan. So my point still being that a crappy network core will still be terrible no matter how many towers (BTS/BSC) are built.
Finally, you agree money is a factor. Have you thought that AT&T are picking up more customers (especially those using data phones) than money allocated for future roll outs planned 3 - 4 years ago? It would seem that way at this time. Probably due to the fact they were not expecting to carry the iPhone or underestimated its effect.[/quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby
I think we are approaching the tunnel from two different directions, so I think we can either agree to disagree or you can continue on without me.
Infrastructure is tied to geography. Not debatable.
I was being sarcastic and serious. If the US's cellular network data plans are such a hamper to your life, then...
Ah the obtuse type of statement that started it all. Anyway, you have been educated about the process.
Quote:
Back on topic, finally.
Agreed. I really got tired explaining the obvious.
Quote:
Sure, but once X number of customers have been exceeded, the problems start. You have to do towers to handle the customers and then you have to wait some time to spend money regarding data bandwidth and support. Or do both but at the cost of doing a little bit for both towers, bandwidth, and 3g/4g/5g upgrades.
Wrong. There is a thing called NMS that handles these very situations, and it has jack to do with your magical towers. Towers or BTS/BSC provide the air interface to the phone, and a way to manage the connectivity back to the MSC with QoS thrown in. Here is a very, very, very simple scenario for you. Vodafone rolled out their 3G network in Munich. They had 100% coverage in Munich and the surrounding area, but oh no, at the airport they had a spike in data traffic. What happens now? Does the network simply stop working? Should Vodafone suddenly contact those customers with unlimited data plans and change them until they have more money (being very sarcastic now)? No, how about letting the NMS tell the magic towers to start making disconnects on data connections until the surge drops, and the network can self heal. This is called an IN network. If AT&T does not have something like this, then as I said in my very first post regarding this issue, their network is crap. By the way, not one voice call was dropped.
Quote:
If money was not a factor, we would have 100% coverage with true unlimited data, and 3G speeds for every phone. So my original point is infrastructure is connected directly to geographical areas because you must have more equipment to support locations in nowheresville and New York City. When offering national calling plans with the iPhone to 50 states, you can't just regionalize customer agreements. Hence, geography plays a big role in a country this size.
So your original point about money being a factor is correct to the point that money is always a factor in anything. AT&T shoves a crappy plan down your throat and you swallow it. So be it. I guess this is a win for you. Right now, I have unlimited data with no caps, running on a network designed to provide the service I am paying for. This is a win for me.
Quote:
Finally, you agree money is a factor. Have you thought that AT&T are picking up more customers (especially those using data phones) than money allocated for future roll outs planned 3 - 4 years ago? It would seem that way at this time. Probably due to the fact they were not expecting to carry the iPhone or underestimated its effect.
I think AT&T knew exactly what they are doing. They are charging for a service provide by many to most operators and making look like a "service feature" and people are going for it. Good for AT&T. Hell, I don't care if they drop the connection speeds and raise the rates even higher.
Quote:
Infrastructure is tied to geography. Not debatable.
Hmmmm....... We finally agree. There is no debate on this. As it stand, you have your opinion and I have mine. Nothing wrong with that at all.
By the way my boss, Condi Rice via the OPM, makes the assignment determinations.
When I talk to her tonight I'll mention you don't want to come back to the U.S. because our cell phone plans are terrible. Would you also like me to ask her to give you a raise?
When I talk to her tonight I'll mention you don't want to come back to the U.S. because our cell phone plans are terrible. Would you also like me to ask her to give you a raise?
Do you think she would waster her time talking down to you? Her time would be better spent and more profitable talking to an ashtray but do your best.
I just did a search on this program from my iPhone. You are correct, it is gone again. I am glad I purchased the program when I did. I have yet to try it but I knew the second I read the article I had to download the program before it got whacked. I have been needing a teather, wireless is an extra, for those times when I need to send a file from my MacBook. At least since I can't login to MM from a phone to access my iDisk to email files (unless I am missing something).
So I don't suppose it's ever coming back right? If not is there any way to get it from someone or the company directly into my iPhone 3G?
So I don't suppose it's ever coming back right? If not is there any way to get it from someone or the company directly into my iPhone 3G?
I have to say that the lack of tethering is among a very few things that annoy me greatly about the iPhone (the lack of copy/paste, the inability to forward sms, and the idiocy of the iPhone organising/appointment apps being the only remaining flaws).
I think torrent sites are the only ways to get hold of it now. However, they all say that your iPhone needs to be jailbroken for a torrent Netshare app to work. I don't know why, frankly.
Would hesitate to jailbreak the phone (and consequently lose the warranty) just because of the need to install the Netshare app.
Comments
Your bosses reference was not lost on anyone. I think everyone is trying to figure out how Condoleezza Rice helped you form an opinion about cellular data download restrictions/limitations within AT&T's network.****
In post #23 you state: "I know what you were talking about and infrastructure is related to geography. However, if your life depends on cell phone data plans, then by all means, don't come back because it would not suit you."
My response was along the lines that I do not make this decision. It is handled via OPM via the Sec State. Pure and simple. I thought that I had made this as easy to understand as possible. I was wrong. It was a nuanced response to a very obtuse statement. I would even go so far as to say it was sarcastic a bit on both sides. Regardless I did not think I would have to go over it again and again. Being as you think that all are trying to figure out how my boss is involved in this, you now have the answer to let them all know.
As for the network issue, they are built from the inside out for several reason, costs being one, gaining customers, providing services, etc..... My only point of contention with your statement about AT&T is that their network should be able to handle unlimited data accesses from x amount of customers if the core network elements are stable, and well planned. If not, you can have towers until the cows come home but the network will still be crappy. You are right that money is a factor in a network build out, this is however budgeted in the rollout plan. So my point still being that a crappy network core will still be terrible no matter how many towers (BTS/BSC) are built.
I think we are approaching the tunnel from two different directions, so I think we can either agree to disagree or you can continue on without me.
It's available in the UK.
Either its been pulled everywhere or just in the UK but I have held off from getting an Iphone just because of the lack of tethering.. if anyone knows how I can get hold of it in the UK then I am very interested... thanks in advance...
In post #23 you state: "I know what you were talking about and infrastructure is related to geography. However, if your life depends on cell phone data plans, then by all means, don't come back because it would not suit you."
My response was along the lines that I do not make this decision. It is handled via OPM via the Sec State. Pure and simple.
No one cares.
I thought that I had made this as easy to understand as possible. I was wrong.
I caught on just fine.
It was a nuanced response to a very obtuse statement. I would even go so far as to say it was sarcastic a bit on both sides.
I was being sarcastic and serious. If the US's cellular network data plans are such a hamper to your life, then...
Regardless I did not think I would have to go over it again and again. Being as you think that all are trying to figure out how my boss is involved in this, you now have the answer to let them all know.
I believe everyone reading this thread understands how your boss got involved in this thread.
As for the network issue, they are built from the inside out for several reason, costs being one, gaining customers, providing services, etc..... My only point of contention with your statement about AT&T is that their network should be able to handle unlimited data accesses from x amount of customers if the core network elements are stable, and well planned.
Back on topic, finally.
Sure, but once X number of customers have been exceeded, the problems start. You have to do towers to handle the customers and then you have to wait some time to spend money regarding data bandwidth and support. Or do both but at the cost of doing a little bit for both towers, bandwidth, and 3g/4g/5g upgrades. If money was not a factor, we would have 100% coverage with true unlimited data, and 3G speeds for every phone. So my original point is infrastructure is connected directly to geographical areas because you must have more equipment to support locations in nowheresville and New York City. When offering national calling plans with the iPhone to 50 states, you can't just regionalize customer agreements. Hence, geography plays a big role in a country this size.
If not, you can have towers until the cows come home but the network will still be crappy. You are right that money is a factor in a network build out, this is however budgeted in the rollout plan. So my point still being that a crappy network core will still be terrible no matter how many towers (BTS/BSC) are built.
Finally, you agree money is a factor.
I think we are approaching the tunnel from two different directions, so I think we can either agree to disagree or you can continue on without me.
Infrastructure is tied to geography. Not debatable.
I was being sarcastic and serious. If the US's cellular network data plans are such a hamper to your life, then...
Ah the obtuse type of statement that started it all. Anyway, you have been educated about the process.
Back on topic, finally.
Agreed. I really got tired explaining the obvious.
Sure, but once X number of customers have been exceeded, the problems start. You have to do towers to handle the customers and then you have to wait some time to spend money regarding data bandwidth and support. Or do both but at the cost of doing a little bit for both towers, bandwidth, and 3g/4g/5g upgrades.
Wrong. There is a thing called NMS that handles these very situations, and it has jack to do with your magical towers. Towers or BTS/BSC provide the air interface to the phone, and a way to manage the connectivity back to the MSC with QoS thrown in. Here is a very, very, very simple scenario for you. Vodafone rolled out their 3G network in Munich. They had 100% coverage in Munich and the surrounding area, but oh no, at the airport they had a spike in data traffic. What happens now? Does the network simply stop working? Should Vodafone suddenly contact those customers with unlimited data plans and change them until they have more money (being very sarcastic now)? No, how about letting the NMS tell the magic towers to start making disconnects on data connections until the surge drops, and the network can self heal. This is called an IN network. If AT&T does not have something like this, then as I said in my very first post regarding this issue, their network is crap. By the way, not one voice call was dropped.
If money was not a factor, we would have 100% coverage with true unlimited data, and 3G speeds for every phone. So my original point is infrastructure is connected directly to geographical areas because you must have more equipment to support locations in nowheresville and New York City. When offering national calling plans with the iPhone to 50 states, you can't just regionalize customer agreements. Hence, geography plays a big role in a country this size.
So your original point about money being a factor is correct to the point that money is always a factor in anything. AT&T shoves a crappy plan down your throat and you swallow it. So be it. I guess this is a win for you. Right now, I have unlimited data with no caps, running on a network designed to provide the service I am paying for. This is a win for me.
Finally, you agree money is a factor.
I think AT&T knew exactly what they are doing. They are charging for a service provide by many to most operators and making look like a "service feature" and people are going for it. Good for AT&T. Hell, I don't care if they drop the connection speeds and raise the rates even higher.
Infrastructure is tied to geography. Not debatable.
Hmmmm....... We finally agree. There is no debate on this. As it stand, you have your opinion and I have mine. Nothing wrong with that at all.
By the way my boss, Condi Rice via the OPM, makes the assignment determinations.
When I talk to her tonight I'll mention you don't want to come back to the U.S. because our cell phone plans are terrible. Would you also like me to ask her to give you a raise?
When I talk to her tonight I'll mention you don't want to come back to the U.S. because our cell phone plans are terrible. Would you also like me to ask her to give you a raise?
Do you think she would waster her time talking down to you? Her time would be better spent and more profitable talking to an ashtray but do your best.
I just did a search on this program from my iPhone. You are correct, it is gone again. I am glad I purchased the program when I did. I have yet to try it but I knew the second I read the article I had to download the program before it got whacked. I have been needing a teather, wireless is an extra, for those times when I need to send a file from my MacBook. At least since I can't login to MM from a phone to access my iDisk to email files (unless I am missing something).
So I don't suppose it's ever coming back right? If not is there any way to get it from someone or the company directly into my iPhone 3G?
So I don't suppose it's ever coming back right? If not is there any way to get it from someone or the company directly into my iPhone 3G?
I have to say that the lack of tethering is among a very few things that annoy me greatly about the iPhone (the lack of copy/paste, the inability to forward sms, and the idiocy of the iPhone organising/appointment apps being the only remaining flaws).
I think torrent sites are the only ways to get hold of it now. However, they all say that your iPhone needs to be jailbroken for a torrent Netshare app to work. I don't know why, frankly.
Would hesitate to jailbreak the phone (and consequently lose the warranty) just because of the need to install the Netshare app.