Apple: iPhone 2.0.2 update targets 3G issues

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  • Reply 61 of 102
    tiffytiffy Posts: 8member
    Here in Europe we have very few problems with Iphone 3G. More exactly, no more problems with the Iphone than with other mobiles. 3G quality is very sensitive to various environment conditions. For example, I had 2 bars on my Iphone yesterday, and today at exactly the same place, 5 bars. It is the same for my colleagues who have a Samsung or Nokia.



    When I read your forum, I have the feeling that in the USA :

    1. Many Iphone users did not have 3G before and imagined that it would be something perfect (5 bars everywhere in the world). Of course, that's far from being true. Even in a town like Paris, where 3G installations are everywhere, you can not have a constant 3G connection and in some buildings or some streets it is simply impossible.

    2. There is a problem specific to the IPhone/ATT network duo. I couldn't say if it is the fault of ATT, Apple or Infineon but obviously there is problem somewhere. Probably a problem during the 3G to Edge and/or Edge to 3G transition.
  • Reply 62 of 102
    sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by penchanted View Post


    Do you have an authoritative source documenting this as a chip issue and, if so, which chip?



    I've seen some speculation by a financial analyst, Richard Windsor of Nomura, who said "The dropped calls, service interruptions, and abrupt network switches experienced by iPhone 3G users reminded Windsor of similar complaints five years ago, when 3G phones were first launched in Europe" and suggested the faulty component was an "immature" infineon chipset. This is certainly not technical analysis. He was the same analyst who last year misreported that the original iPhone "uses a chemical deposition to provide touch sensitivity based on heat" which is completely false (the iPhone uses capacitance).



    The Swedish engineering weekly, Ny Teknik, cited a report by unnamed experts who concluded that "the most likely cause of the 3G problems is defective adjustments between the antenna and an amplifier that captures very weak signals from the antenna. This could lead to poor 3G connectivity and slower data speeds." Reasonable but it would be more credible if the sources were named and, at any rate, seems to counter the claim that the problem is with an Infineon component.



    BusinessWeek cited "two well-placed sources" who said that the problem relates to the Infineon chip but would be addressed with a firmware upgrade.



    The only source "on the record" is Infineon who points out that the same chip is used in other phones without problems.



    In other words, we really know nothing other than some people are having problems and we don't know how prevalent those problems are.





    About the same proof as you but the fact still remains and continues to be over looked. These are basic 3G 101 problems that Apple could have prevented. It is not just about selling and iPhone. It is also about perception and the Apple brand, shareholder, etc.... By putting others at a financal risk by not doing proper testing Apple was negligent. Someone said that Nokia has an advantage with phones and this is correct. Nokia sends their latest and greatest models globally so that they are tested in real world conditions and fixed before launched on such a grand scale. I am actually embarrassed for Apple. This is something that did not have to be.
  • Reply 63 of 102
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,390member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jmadlena View Post


    You seem to be lost in your own world... Prince made a statement that seems correct.



    Apple has had <3 year experience with cell technology; other phone and OS developers have had many years experience at crafting user interfaces.



    But Apple brought in people that have had a number of years in the mobile industry, technically they should have experience exceeding three years.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jmadlena View Post


    The other companies don't seem to be improving, while Apple's ability to improve their telecomm product remains unseen. Point is, stop claiming everyone is 'cheerleading.' Sure, many people on these forums are (what do you expect, anyway) but that doesn't mean everyone is.



    What do you mean by "other companies don't seem to be improving", there is a lot of improvement going on, or did you mean in your country?



    People seem to forget they have failed in markets before, gaming for example (and before you go on about how powerful the iPhone/iPod Touch is for gaming, they are more expensive than a DS/PSP, and don't have the abilities of these consoles)





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jmadlena View Post


    Really, what is more annoying than any type of fanboy-ism is the anti-fanboy/troll-like propaganda spouted off to rile up the cheerleaders. You know what? Let them cheerlead! Technology enthusiasts don't have much to cheer over since Microsoft began dominating everything and the kitchen sink.



    Everyone has a bias when it comes to everything. You're no different, so give us all a break.



    Why did you bring up Microsoft? What have they got to do with this conversation?



    I am not anti Apple, I have several iPods and three Macs (and about to purchase another), but I am willing to say they are not as perfect as people make them out to be, they have a number of issues with the OS X interface (there are a number of inconsistencies in it), and a number of bugs they refuse to resolve, not forgetting the features they dropped from leopard that they will try and charge us for in 10.6
  • Reply 64 of 102
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    Read the friggin manual (p28-9). Amazing what you may find,



    "iPhone has dictionaries for all supported languages. The appropriate dictionary is

    activated automatically when you select a keyboard on iPhone. iPhone uses the active

    dictionary to suggest corrections or complete the word you?re typing."



    And it works as directed!



    Obviously it doesn't according to those who tried it on the iPhone, including myself, you abusive overbearing fool.



    Doesn't apple pride themselves on the user NOT needing to read the manual? so shouldn't the phone or indeed an internet connected Mac be intelligent enough to work out its location and adjust its language settings to suit on start up ?(likely a pop up dialogue to confirm, or similar)



    I normally read manuals, even for the iPods I've had, but didn't for the iPhone, so I learnt something from this discussion, that YOU WERE WRONG.



    Organise is still being "corrected" to its WRONG spelling of Organize, when one's country originates the language, one is entitled to say when it is bastardised.



    your self important fury over an enquiry is uncalled for unhelpful and in the case of the iPhone WRONG.
  • Reply 65 of 102
    penchantedpenchanted Posts: 1,070member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post


    About the same proof as you but the fact still remains and continues to be over looked.



    At this point, we all have the same proof - NONE. Each of us could write a book about what we don't know about the technical issues involved with the iPhone's problems. What we do have is a whole lot of conjecture.



    Quote:

    These are basic 3G 101 problems that Apple could have prevented. It is not just about selling and iPhone. It is also about perception and the Apple brand, shareholder, etc.... By putting others at a financal risk by not doing proper testing Apple was negligent. Someone said that Nokia has an advantage with phones and this is correct. Nokia sends their latest and greatest models globally so that they are tested in real world conditions and fixed before launched on such a grand scale. I am actually embarrassed for Apple. This is something that did not have to be.



    Are you sure extended testing would have identified the problem" It's only speculation but the Ny Teknik report also suggested that the problem was introduced in mass production which could mean that it was not a design flaw as inferred by your "3G 101 problems" remark. It also means that the problem could be limited to a certain production run (or component production run) which might explain the differing experiences being reported here. Whether or nor a recall will be required to address the issues is unclear.
  • Reply 66 of 102
    sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by penchanted View Post


    At this point, we all have the same proof - NONE. Each of us could write a book about what we don't know about the technical issues involved with the iPhone's problems. What we do have is a whole lot of conjecture.





    Are you sure extended testing would have identified the problem" It's only speculation but the Ny Teknik report also suggested that the problem was introduced in mass production which could mean that it was not a design flaw as inferred by your "3G 101 problems" remark. It also means that the problem could be limited to a certain production run (or component production run) which might explain the differing experiences being reported here.





    Could be, should be, would be. Your first sentence was about the most correct you have made. Basic radio design is all about testing, testing, testing, especially when Apple was going to a new design. What you see now is a lack of testing.
  • Reply 67 of 102
    penchantedpenchanted Posts: 1,070member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post


    Could be, should be, would be. Your first sentence was about the most correct you have made.



    "Could be, should be, would be" also summarizes your many attacks on most anything iPhone. If you have an authoritative source regarding iPhone 3G problems, please share it with us.



    Quote:

    Basic radio design is all about testing, testing, testing, especially when Apple was going to a new design. What you see now is a lack of testing.



    As stated above, Ny Teknik thinks the problem relates to a manufacturing issue which negates your "basic radio design is all about testing, testing, testing." This points to a QA problem in one of the iPhone supplier plants. Has Nokia had no QA missteps thoughout its history?



    You continually berate people who offer any defense of the iPhone as Apple fanbois, but few here miss that you are clearly a Nokia fanboi who acts as if Nokia is incapable of producing anything but stellar products. Rather than arguing on the facts, you betray your disdain for Apple with the "He whose name must not be mentioned" and other such silliness.



    You have made many good points and provided valuable information about cellular technology and deployment worldwide, but you have also acted like a bully when people challenge your view of the mobile phone world. Perhaps yours is the name who must not be mentioned as we all bow to your superior "knowledge".
  • Reply 68 of 102
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    The software patches aren't working so far. Perhaps they could add a telescopic antenna which is hidden normally but can be used by people who need it.
  • Reply 69 of 102
    tiffytiffy Posts: 8member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ascii View Post


    The software patches aren't working so far. Perhaps they could add a telescopic antenna which is hidden normally but can be used by people who need it.



    And a 10 watts 3G amplifier so that we could connect to any 3G antenna in the country...
  • Reply 70 of 102
    sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by penchanted View Post


    "Could be, should be, would be" also summarizes your many attacks on most anything iPhone. If you have an authoritative source regarding iPhone 3G problems, please share it with us.



    As an owner of an iPhone I have the right to express my displeasure especially when Apple can do better. If this had been M$, all hell would have broken loose, with no benefit of the doubt given. In my opinion this is not fair. If Apple offers up something for sale, they are open for critique. It just that way. I defend my iPhone daily in an environment of Apple haters (I work for the US govt), and this new issue is a re-enforcement of old stereotypes. So, in short, you are wrong.



    Quote:

    s stated above, Ny Teknik thinks the problem relates to a manufacturing issue which negates your "basic radio design is all about testing, testing, testing." This points to a QA problem in one of the iPhone supplier plants. Has Nokia had no QA missteps thoughout its history?



    Did you miss the: "opppsss. Nokia put the wrong battery in the N95" crisis? They screwed up colossal and paid the price for it. They took all kinds of financial and reputation hits. If it is good enough for them, it is good enough for Apple. Nokia learned and did not do it again. Hopefully Apple will as well.



    Quote:

    You continually berate people who offer any defense of the iPhone as Apple fanbois, but few here miss that you are clearly a Nokia fanboi who acts as if Nokia is incapable of producing anything but stellar products. Rather than arguing on the facts, you betray your disdain for Apple with the "He whose name must not be mentioned" and other such silliness.



    I poke fun at Jobs because he pokes fun at himself. You will never see me wishing ill of him as others have here. If I didn't like Apple, you could rest assured I would not bitch about them making obvious mistakes that they know better about. By the way, I have been berated here as well. It is part of the forum mileu on occasion.



    Quote:

    superior "knowledge".



    Are you insane. I have Google. All joking aside, my info comes from my sources within the GSM community. Namely network planners from Nokia, and SE. The same with cell phone designers. When I said that this is G3 basics, I was quoting those that make the darn things. They feel that this is something that Apple should have learned from the F-up's from Nokia, Se and the rest. You test, test, test, test. Apple probably just tested.
  • Reply 71 of 102
    willrobwillrob Posts: 203member
    When I dial the Field Test number, I get the little gray number in the upper left area (-99), but none of the fields are filled in as in the example image in the story. I've tried hitting refresh, but still no data. Is there something else I need to do? [not that I'd know what the numbers all mean]
  • Reply 72 of 102
    Ok I tested my phone.. Know I only see a number where the blue bars used to be.. I can tap it and they comeback but they will not stay....
  • Reply 73 of 102
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sigs21 View Post


    Ok I tested my phone.. Know I only see a number where the blue bars used to be.. I can tap it and they comeback but they will not stay....



    It can only be toggled while in the Field Test app.
  • Reply 74 of 102
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by willrob View Post


    When I dial the Field Test number, I get the little gray number in the upper left area (-99), but none of the fields are filled in as in the example image in the story. I've tried hitting refresh, but still no data. Is there something else I need to do? [not that I'd know what the numbers all mean]



    That depends on what you are accessing with what radio. If you have 3G enables then the GSM data will not be avtive as you're using the UMTS radios.
  • Reply 75 of 102
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It can only be toggled while in the Field Test app.



    I am out of field test mode... and it still toggles...



    help.. drives me up the wall
  • Reply 76 of 102
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sigs21 View Post


    I am out of field test mode... and it still toggles...



    help.. drives me up the wall



    1) go back into it and then out again.



    2) If that doesn't work, restart.
  • Reply 77 of 102
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Obviously it doesn't according to those who tried it on the iPhone, including myself, you abusive overbearing fool.



    Doesn't apple pride themselves on the user NOT needing to read the manual? so shouldn't the phone or indeed an internet connected Mac be intelligent enough to work out its location and adjust its language settings to suit on start up ?(likely a pop up dialogue to confirm, or similar)



    I normally read manuals, even for the iPods I've had, but didn't for the iPhone, so I learnt something from this discussion, that YOU WERE WRONG.



    Organise is still being "corrected" to its WRONG spelling of Organize, when one's country originates the language, one is entitled to say when it is bastardised.



    your self important fury over an enquiry is uncalled for unhelpful and in the case of the iPhone WRONG.



    We tested it here in the lab and it does work! Even on the iTouch.



    But you must keep in mind that the iPhone and iTouch include auto-correction. If you have previsously corrected a word, e.g., organize to organise, or vice versa, the spell checker will attempt to auto-correct to your preferred spelling. As such, even if you have changed languages, your preferred will take precedent until you reset the dictionary or remove auto-correction.
  • Reply 78 of 102
    It just so happens I was in Cupertino on non-Apple related business last week. (So anyone from Apple reading along please don't start abducting vendor's children yet.) If you want to see the reported 3g behavior first hand. Simply head on S. De Anza and make a right on Stevens Creek Blvd and you will see the networks attempt to switch and then have the call fail. Or you will get the notification stating that a data connection is not availible. This is less than a mile from the main campus at 1 Infinite Loop. I tried it 6 times and each time received the same failure.(For those of you who know Cupertino there are a lot of U-turns due to all the medians) It just struck me as kind of funny that it happened so close to the HQ.
  • Reply 79 of 102
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    But you must keep in mind that the iPhone and iTouch include auto-correction. If you have previsously corrected a word, e.g., organize to organise, or vice versa, the spell checker will attempt to auto-correct to your preferred spelling.



    This is not the case with the word organise or the other -ise words that aren't considered acceptable spellings. It has auto-correction but I have not seen any evidence of it learning oft used words.
  • Reply 80 of 102
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Obviously it doesn't according to those who tried it on the iPhone, including myself, you abusive overbearing fool.



    Youch! Is it really that serious? If the iPhone manual says the dictionary is supposed to be tied to the selected keyboard language, but it isn't functioning properly, perhaps it's a bug that should be reported by those for whom it's an issue. I know it's a pain, but try resetting the settings on the phone to see if that clears it up.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Doesn't apple pride themselves on the user NOT needing to read the manual?



    I don't think that's Apple's position exactly. Apple's products are certainly designed to be very intuitive and user friendly (and the user guides are often not needed for many or most), but the Help system throughout Apple's product line tends to be thorough and easily accessible because not everything is clear to everyone.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    so shouldn't the phone or indeed an internet connected Mac be intelligent enough to work out its location and adjust its language settings to suit on start up ?(likely a pop up dialogue to confirm, or similar)



    I think Mac OS X (and perhaps to a lesser degree iPhone OS X) attunes a lot throughout the system based on the user-specified location, but you're right in that it could certainly be improved upon and streamlined further (e.g., base on language setting, ZIP or Postal Code, etc.).



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    Organise is still being "corrected" to its WRONG spelling of Organize, when one's country originates the language, one is entitled to say when it is bastardised.



    The very origins of the English language peg it as a bastard tongue derived from multiple sources across Europe. Its strength, and difficulty for non-native English speakers, is its almost limitless versatility and flexibility by way of spelling, grammar, varied use of prepositions, and, most confusingly, regional/cultural idioms. British English is no better or worse than American English, or Australian or Canadian English for that matter. The notion of any one dialect of English as more "proper" or "correct" than another is simply ridiculous.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post


    your self important fury over an enquiry is uncalled for unhelpful and in the case of the iPhone WRONG.



    You had good points to make about the problematic language/dictionary feature of the iPhone, Walter. But the tone of your response hardly seemed called for or helpful.
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