When the phone switches from 3G to EDGE the radio is not behaving as it should. The radio is supposed to ALWAYS give priority to Voice. By now everyone probably knows EDGE and GSM use the same radio. Only one can be engaged at the same time. This radio is designed (or supposed to be designed) to not drop calls if it looses 3G and falls back to EDGE, it should stay in GSM until the call ends. The iPhone is NOT doing this, instead it turns on EDGE.
I agree that AT&T has network issues that are not helping anything but this issue is far more severe then just a network issue.
While AT&T needs to fix their network for more capacity, the way the green infineon chipset is performing is also a major issue.
Yet again the Apple hating portion of the media put the blame on Apple for the faults of the network provider.
I bet they'll be extremely quiet about the fact that the hardware is perfectly adequate in terms of 3G support.
Anyone written an iPhone app that measures your phone signal and type (3.5G, 3G, EDGE, GPRS, 2G), gets your GPS location, does a speed test, and then sends it to a website to view AT&T signal quality on a far more granular basis?
I'm working on a speed test website which should launch later today which allows the user to select their state / city. So hopefully people use it and I can put together some interesting data. I think it would be cool to have it in an app to automatically get your location, but not sure you can measure signal strength with an app. If I ever get accepted into the app store program I will probably create it in app form if possible.
Well I finally finished the first public version of the speed test. Check it out and let me know what you think. Also, just go into the apple dev program so maybe I can bring this as a true app in the future.
Good point Dave. The antenna could be fine, but a faulty chipset/firmware could still muck up calls and connections. The real question is if AT&T's other 3G devices are experiencing this problem, and if they are, how come we're not hearing about it.
Because those users are not the extremely high expectations or I'll post it on an Apple site types. Really, if your Sony Ericsson or Blackberry or LG conectivity suck, where is the forum that has immediate worldwide visibility? It just doesn't exist in those markets unless something catastrophic happens.
what's amusing it that, according to all the articles, Apple offered this gig to all the companies and only ATT was willing to step up to Apple's conditions.
apparently the gig was that the carrier would chip in a major piece of the devo costs in exchange for the exclusive contract which would allow for payback of the money. akin to the whole 'we'll give you your new phone for free and you will use us for 2 years' gig that subscribers get.
but the other boys balked because Apple wanted total design control. they weren't willing to give the carrier a say in how the phone was designed, what hardware or software etc. which is not the norm with such deals. ATT said okay and got the gig.
and now the others are probably kicking themselves
Ok I've corrected my spelling mistake(s). But you should not get so angry over spelling errors and think before you write especially when you think you cannot edit after hitting submit. Is this a spelling bee forum?
The story here though, is that the percentage has barely changed. It's pretty low, which is what I've been trying to get across for a while now. It's also why I've thought that 3G isn't really all that important in Europe, or most anywhere yet, though some here have insisted that it is.
Just because a service is available doesn't mean that larger percentages of people will get it.
I've figured since day one that although there may indeed be a small amount ( < 0.01%) of customers with truly faulty hardware, most of the reported "Iphone 3G problems" really probably had to do with the crappy 3G coverage provided by AT&T.
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area never objectively compared the iPhone to another 3G device?
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area wrongly compared the iPhone to another phone running on a DIFFERENT NETWORK, instead of an AT&T 3G phone?
They really need to fix this article to make it accurate. The engineers DID NOT say all of the hardware and software worked properly. They only said the ANTENNA worked properly. There is a big difference. The editor is stretching what they said to encompass things they did not say.
I've figured since day one that although there may indeed be a small amount ( < 0.01%) of customers with truly faulty hardware, most of the reported "Iphone 3G problems" really probably had to do with the crappy 3G coverage provided by AT&T.
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area never objectively compared the iPhone to another 3G device?
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area wrongly compared the iPhone to another phone running on a DIFFERENT NETWORK, instead of an AT&T 3G phone?
- etc
I have tested my unit in the AT&T stores against other units and other iPhones. I have tested it all across the USA including, Orlando, FL (Disney World, & Airport), Dallas Airport, TX, Washington, D.C. & Alexandria, VA, Riverside, CA, Norco, CA, Newport Beach, CA, Seattle, WA, Bremerton, WA to name just a few of the places. Everywhere it drops calls, says call didn't go through, can have intermittent data connectivity and performance that varies from 30kbps to 600kbps.
Walk into any AT&T store and compare. Be careful they usually have the iPhone set to EDGE or WiFi to hide the poor signal performance. I have also had the phone replaced with no significant change in performance.
They really need to fix this article to make it accurate. The engineers DID NOT say all of the hardware and software worked properly. They only said the ANTENNA worked properly. There is a big difference. The editor is stretching what they said to encompass things they did not say.
The story here though, is that the percentage has barely changed. It's pretty low, which is what I've been trying to get across for a while now. It's also why I've thought that 3G isn't really all that important in Europe, or most anywhere yet, though some here have insisted that it is.
Just because a service is available doesn't mean that larger percentages of people will get it.
How many of these 3G-capable phones actually pay and use data services on them? Stateside i know several people that don't, but I do know that it is required sales from pretty much avery nation's carrier.
How many of these 3G-capable phones actually pay and use data services on them? Stateside i know several people that don't, but I do know that it is required sales from pretty much avery nation's carrier.
When you look at the fact that only about 100 million of over 900 million are high speed accounts, you realize that it's a small number percentagewise. It's only about 11.14%.
That means that almost 90% of all phone users are on slow services. That's why the old iPhone has proven to be so popular around the world.
I don't know which of all those carriers require hi speed accounts or even data services. It would be interesting, to say the least, to know this. We do hear that many Japanese who have these complicated phones with all these special services never use them. I would suppose the same thing is true elsewhere, even if they pay for the basic ones.
AT&T is in the build stage. Actually one of the reasons why Apple didn't jump into 3G in the first place. (Interesting, but as of Dec 27, there were only 45 million 3G subscribers in Europe.)
I am not sure with what you mean by 3G subscribers. When I get my contract here in Finland, 3G is simply part of it. Do you mean dedicated bandwidth? I can use all the 3G I want but I can also ask for dedicated 1 or 2 meg and pay for this dedicated bandwidth.
Oh, 45 million subscibers is quite a bit in any study.
The tests tell us that under laboratory conditions, the Phone works to spec. It does not tell us whether the iPhone works out in the real world.
The iPhone may very well be working perfectly in the real world. It may very well be a lemon. This test doesn't address the real world situations people are complaining about.
A phone's physical design encourages people to hold it in their hands a certain way, and hold it a certain distance from their head. With a badly designed phone, these simple actions might block the signal. That would be a major problem that would NOT show up under the type of standard testing conditions described.
I'm not saying their is a problem with the iPhone 3G. I'm just saying laboratory tests don't always tell us about real world performance.
When you look at the fact that only about 100 million of over 900 million are high speed accounts, you realize that it's a small number percentagewise. It's only about 11.14%.
That 100 million is in the EU, where did you get that out of 900 million figure from?
I hate these generalized quotes. I have had 6 different phones since I have been with AT&T and the worst was the RAZR I have had 2 LG phones 1 RAZR 1 SLVR and both iPhones. The LG phone I had also used 3G but was pointless because it was just a standard flip phone. The call quality was good though and so is the new iPhone 3g. The call quality is fantastic. The Quality itself is good the problem is there are too few towers. So lets solve this problem. Lets make this phone amazing. I have 2 requests. 1 for apple and 1 for AT&T.
AT&T: Build more god damn towers!!!! Stop wasting time! 3g is where everyone is going not only for the iPhone so lets get those damn towers going please.
Apple: Fix all of the LAG!!!! My old 1st Gen iphone now lags after 2.0 and my iPhone 3g lags. It is frustrating.
More towers do not necessarily equate to better service. The key is more antenna. You can put them on the sides of buildings, on silos, etc... Coupled with this is a state of the art OSS and BSS, not to mention MSC. AT&T can build until the cows come home but if the core network is crap, things will not likely change.
Comments
I wish you would keep your simple agreement statements to yourself.
Who are you- High Priest of the Apple Council?
Yes. (Simple agreement statement).
How did you know? (Follow up).
I agree that AT&T has network issues that are not helping anything but this issue is far more severe then just a network issue.
While AT&T needs to fix their network for more capacity, the way the green infineon chipset is performing is also a major issue.
Yet again the Apple hating portion of the media put the blame on Apple for the faults of the network provider.
I bet they'll be extremely quiet about the fact that the hardware is perfectly adequate in terms of 3G support.
Anyone written an iPhone app that measures your phone signal and type (3.5G, 3G, EDGE, GPRS, 2G), gets your GPS location, does a speed test, and then sends it to a website to view AT&T signal quality on a far more granular basis?
I'm working on a speed test website which should launch later today which allows the user to select their state / city. So hopefully people use it and I can put together some interesting data. I think it would be cool to have it in an app to automatically get your location, but not sure you can measure signal strength with an app. If I ever get accepted into the app store program I will probably create it in app form if possible.
Well I finally finished the first public version of the speed test. Check it out and let me know what you think. Also, just go into the apple dev program so maybe I can bring this as a true app in the future.
http://my3gspeed.com
Good point Dave. The antenna could be fine, but a faulty chipset/firmware could still muck up calls and connections. The real question is if AT&T's other 3G devices are experiencing this problem, and if they are, how come we're not hearing about it.
Because those users are not the extremely high expectations or I'll post it on an Apple site types. Really, if your Sony Ericsson or Blackberry or LG conectivity suck, where is the forum that has immediate worldwide visibility? It just doesn't exist in those markets unless something catastrophic happens.
what's amusing it that, according to all the articles, Apple offered this gig to all the companies and only ATT was willing to step up to Apple's conditions.
apparently the gig was that the carrier would chip in a major piece of the devo costs in exchange for the exclusive contract which would allow for payback of the money. akin to the whole 'we'll give you your new phone for free and you will use us for 2 years' gig that subscribers get.
but the other boys balked because Apple wanted total design control. they weren't willing to give the carrier a say in how the phone was designed, what hardware or software etc. which is not the norm with such deals. ATT said okay and got the gig.
and now the others are probably kicking themselves
Except that we don't know if any of that is true.
Now we can bury the 3G chipset and iPhone suck debate and maybe move on to dealing with application issues...
Like:
1) updates done on my iPhone crashing the phone - till i restore it.
2) apps wiping out their data
3) and proper push.
Don't get me wrong... I love my iPhone - I just want the obvious fixed.
I haven't had the first two problems, and i have a fair number of apps.
The third will be completed later, as Apple has said, supposedly in September.
You can't complain about something that we were all told wouldn't be available for at least a month until AFTER, we're supposed to have it.
Ok I've corrected my spelling mistake(s). But you should not get so angry over spelling errors and think before you write especially when you think you cannot edit after hitting submit. Is this a spelling bee forum?
Officially? Only when Mr. H is around.
Why doesn't Apple just admit they made a mistake going with AT&T and move on? Seriously, could they have picked a worse carrier in the US?
And which other GSM carrier in the US should they have gone with instead?
My error. Old age.
Interesting
Date.......................................... April 2, 2007*
Total Mobile Subscribers................ 478.4 million
Total 3G.......................................... 45 million
Date ...........................................End May, 2008†
Total Mobile Subscribers...............910.8 million
Total 3G......................................101.5 million
* http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/April2007/4516.htm"]http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/April2007/4516.htm
† http://www.unwiredview.com/2008/06/2...s-100-million/
The story here though, is that the percentage has barely changed. It's pretty low, which is what I've been trying to get across for a while now. It's also why I've thought that 3G isn't really all that important in Europe, or most anywhere yet, though some here have insisted that it is.
Just because a service is available doesn't mean that larger percentages of people will get it.
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area never objectively compared the iPhone to another 3G device?
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area wrongly compared the iPhone to another phone running on a DIFFERENT NETWORK, instead of an AT&T 3G phone?
- etc
I've figured since day one that although there may indeed be a small amount ( < 0.01%) of customers with truly faulty hardware, most of the reported "Iphone 3G problems" really probably had to do with the crappy 3G coverage provided by AT&T.
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area never objectively compared the iPhone to another 3G device?
- How many people complaining about a poor 3G signal in a given area wrongly compared the iPhone to another phone running on a DIFFERENT NETWORK, instead of an AT&T 3G phone?
- etc
I have tested my unit in the AT&T stores against other units and other iPhones. I have tested it all across the USA including, Orlando, FL (Disney World, & Airport), Dallas Airport, TX, Washington, D.C. & Alexandria, VA, Riverside, CA, Norco, CA, Newport Beach, CA, Seattle, WA, Bremerton, WA to name just a few of the places. Everywhere it drops calls, says call didn't go through, can have intermittent data connectivity and performance that varies from 30kbps to 600kbps.
Walk into any AT&T store and compare. Be careful they usually have the iPhone set to EDGE or WiFi to hide the poor signal performance. I have also had the phone replaced with no significant change in performance.
They really need to fix this article to make it accurate. The engineers DID NOT say all of the hardware and software worked properly. They only said the ANTENNA worked properly. There is a big difference. The editor is stretching what they said to encompass things they did not say.
You want to calm down a little?
The story here though, is that the percentage has barely changed. It's pretty low, which is what I've been trying to get across for a while now. It's also why I've thought that 3G isn't really all that important in Europe, or most anywhere yet, though some here have insisted that it is.
Just because a service is available doesn't mean that larger percentages of people will get it.
How many of these 3G-capable phones actually pay and use data services on them? Stateside i know several people that don't, but I do know that it is required sales from pretty much avery nation's carrier.
How many of these 3G-capable phones actually pay and use data services on them? Stateside i know several people that don't, but I do know that it is required sales from pretty much avery nation's carrier.
When you look at the fact that only about 100 million of over 900 million are high speed accounts, you realize that it's a small number percentagewise. It's only about 11.14%.
That means that almost 90% of all phone users are on slow services. That's why the old iPhone has proven to be so popular around the world.
I don't know which of all those carriers require hi speed accounts or even data services. It would be interesting, to say the least, to know this. We do hear that many Japanese who have these complicated phones with all these special services never use them. I would suppose the same thing is true elsewhere, even if they pay for the basic ones.
AT&T is in the build stage. Actually one of the reasons why Apple didn't jump into 3G in the first place. (Interesting, but as of Dec 27, there were only 45 million 3G subscribers in Europe.)
I am not sure with what you mean by 3G subscribers. When I get my contract here in Finland, 3G is simply part of it. Do you mean dedicated bandwidth? I can use all the 3G I want but I can also ask for dedicated 1 or 2 meg and pay for this dedicated bandwidth.
Oh, 45 million subscibers is quite a bit in any study.
The tests tell us that under laboratory conditions, the Phone works to spec. It does not tell us whether the iPhone works out in the real world.
The iPhone may very well be working perfectly in the real world. It may very well be a lemon. This test doesn't address the real world situations people are complaining about.
A phone's physical design encourages people to hold it in their hands a certain way, and hold it a certain distance from their head. With a badly designed phone, these simple actions might block the signal. That would be a major problem that would NOT show up under the type of standard testing conditions described.
I'm not saying their is a problem with the iPhone 3G. I'm just saying laboratory tests don't always tell us about real world performance.
One of the few that get it.
When you look at the fact that only about 100 million of over 900 million are high speed accounts, you realize that it's a small number percentagewise. It's only about 11.14%.
That 100 million is in the EU, where did you get that out of 900 million figure from?
I hate these generalized quotes. I have had 6 different phones since I have been with AT&T and the worst was the RAZR I have had 2 LG phones 1 RAZR 1 SLVR and both iPhones. The LG phone I had also used 3G but was pointless because it was just a standard flip phone. The call quality was good though and so is the new iPhone 3g. The call quality is fantastic. The Quality itself is good the problem is there are too few towers. So lets solve this problem. Lets make this phone amazing. I have 2 requests. 1 for apple and 1 for AT&T.
AT&T: Build more god damn towers!!!! Stop wasting time! 3g is where everyone is going not only for the iPhone so lets get those damn towers going please.
Apple: Fix all of the LAG!!!! My old 1st Gen iphone now lags after 2.0 and my iPhone 3g lags. It is frustrating.
More towers do not necessarily equate to better service. The key is more antenna. You can put them on the sides of buildings, on silos, etc... Coupled with this is a state of the art OSS and BSS, not to mention MSC. AT&T can build until the cows come home but if the core network is crap, things will not likely change.