What about the Mac Mini?

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 94
    mjteixmjteix Posts: 563member
    While I was not planning on buying a notebook this year, the announcements scared me a little: however you try to look at these, it's an increase in price and a decrease in processing power, mainly because of the LED LCD display (and the manufacturing process, maybe).



    So what's in store for the desktops?



    A $699 Mac mini with a 1.60GHz cpu, nvidia graphics, Superdrive and Wireless-N?

    A $1399 LED LCD 20" iMac with a 2.26GHz cpu and nivida graphics?

    A $2999 Mac Pro with a single quad 2.66Ghz cpu, because of a "new" glass/alu enclosure?



    Not at all happy with the current direction!

  • Reply 22 of 94
    I was hoping that the rumored $800 macbook would come true. Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. And since the new macbook is way over my budget, I'm now hoping an upgrade to the Mac Mini would come.
  • Reply 23 of 94
    dhagan4755dhagan4755 Posts: 2,152member
    It's evident now that the mini is getting the same NVIDIA graphics chipset, display port, and unibody construction that the MacBook and MacBook Pro received today.



    Next Tuesday for an update?!
  • Reply 24 of 94
    phongphong Posts: 219member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DHagan4755 View Post


    It's evident now that the mini is getting the same NVIDIA graphics chipset, display port, and unibody construction that the MacBook and MacBook Pro received today.



    Next Tuesday for an update?!



    Nope. Not ever... !



    That comic's pretty funny, though, Marvin... If only, lol.
  • Reply 25 of 94
    Right now, the $599 mini is the last computer Apple sells with a combo drive.
  • Reply 26 of 94
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjteix View Post


    While I was not planning on buying a notebook this year, the announcements scared me a little: however you try to look at these, it's an increase in price and a decrease in processing power, mainly because of the LED LCD display (and the manufacturing process, maybe).



    So what's in store for the desktops?



    A $699 Mac mini with a 1.60GHz cpu, nvidia graphics, Superdrive and Wireless-N?

    A $1399 LED LCD 20" iMac with a 2.26GHz cpu and nivida graphics?

    A $2999 Mac Pro with a single quad 2.66Ghz cpu, because of a "new" glass/alu enclosure?



    Not at all happy with the current direction!





    they can't push the cost of the pro to high as they bill it as a better deal then dell, hp at the same price in workstation hardware.



    It will get workstation / sever ver of the core 7i
  • Reply 27 of 94
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjteix View Post


    While I was not planning on buying a notebook this year, the announcements scared me a little: however you try to look at these, it's an increase in price and a decrease in processing power, mainly because of the LED LCD display (and the manufacturing process, maybe).



    So what's in store for the desktops?



    A $699 Mac mini with a 1.60GHz cpu, nvidia graphics, Superdrive and Wireless-N?



    Not at all happy with the current direction!





    and make psystar look like a even better deal?



    When Intel p45 boards / and nvidia boards cost $100 or less



    and desktop ram costs much less then laptop ram.



    when good low end ati and nvidia cards are $50



    and when the e8400 is about $150.
  • Reply 28 of 94
    Too bad there was no silent update today. I hope they at least use the 9400M in the refresh...



    Funny thing, this is still the lowest cost FW400 Mac now...Ibet once they change out the $999 Macbook with an ALu one, the Mac Mini will be updated.





    -written on a 1.83GHz Mini
  • Reply 29 of 94
    Assuming they do update the Mac Mini here's what I hope they'll do:



    1. Like the Macbook, no more firewire.

    2. No more combo drives. All drives will be Superdrive.

    3. A higher capacity hard drive.

    4. A few more added USB ports.

    5. Faster Core 2 Duo processor.

    6. Built-in nVidia graphics.

    7. Mini-DVI port

    8. More built-in RAM
  • Reply 30 of 94
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrnnn View Post


    Assuming they do update the Mac Mini here's what I hope they'll do:



    1. Like the Macbook, no more firewire.

    2. No more combo drives. All drives will be Superdrive.

    3. A higher capacity hard drive.

    4. A few more added USB ports.

    5. Faster Core 2 Duo processor.

    6. Built-in nVidia graphics.

    7. Mini-DVI port

    8. More built-in RAM



    The mini has the room for firewire.



    And at $800 it will need 128-256 meg of it's own vram.



    Or the $800 and up system may be that lower margin desktop system that apple was talking about.
  • Reply 31 of 94
    phongphong Posts: 219member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrnnn View Post


    Assuming they do update the Mac Mini here's what I hope they'll do:



    1. Like the Macbook, no more firewire.

    2. No more combo drives. All drives will be Superdrive.

    3. A higher capacity hard drive.

    4. A few more added USB ports.

    5. Faster Core 2 Duo processor.

    6. Built-in nVidia graphics.

    7. Mini-DVI port

    8. More built-in RAM



    They can't get that for under 800. The 2.4 Ghz MB is double that and the screen can't cost that much.



    Apple's low margin product is very likely the new Cinema Display. Speaking of which, shouldn't the new Mini's have DisplayPort? Maybe coming with a DP-to-HDMI adapter.



    But I'm dreaming. They're never going to update it.
  • Reply 32 of 94
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrnnn View Post


    Assuming they do update the Mac Mini here's what I hope they'll do:



    1. Like the Macbook, no more firewire.

    2. No more combo drives. All drives will be Superdrive.

    3. A higher capacity hard drive.

    4. A few more added USB ports.

    5. Faster Core 2 Duo processor.

    6. Built-in nVidia graphics.

    7. Mini-DVI port

    8. More built-in RAM



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong View Post


    They can't get that for under 800. The 2.4 Ghz MB is double that and the screen can't cost that much.



    Apple's low margin product is very likely the new Cinema Display. Speaking of which, shouldn't the new Mini's have DisplayPort? Maybe coming with a DP-to-HDMI adapter.



    But I'm dreaming. They're never going to update it.



    Display port does not have sound so it will need to be Display port to DVI and mini Display port to Display port for free.
  • Reply 33 of 94
    ssassa Posts: 47member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong View Post


    They can't get that for under 800. The 2.4 Ghz MB is double that and the screen can't cost that much.



    The proposed changes aren't necessarily as hard as one might think. Apple AFAIK wasn't losing money on the Mac Mini a year ago and the costs of many of the components has fallen dramatically. DDR2 prices are more than half what they were a year ago and the processor on the Mac Mini has been discontinued by Intel therefore unless Apple bought a huge number of these discontinued processors then Apple hasn't been paying much for the CPUs. Furthermore, even before those processors were discontinued they weren't terribly high end.



    At this point going to a SuperDrive on the base model of the Mac Mini wouldn't cost much considering that the price differential between a combo drive and a superdrive is virtually nothing. There are laptops hundreds of dollars less that have DVD burners and a screen and the vendor still manages a razor thin margin. The Mac Mini is essentially a laptop without a screen therefore, Apple should at least be able to have a machine that is on par with a $600 laptop spec wise if not slightly better.



    A slight bump in HDD wouldn't cost more than $20. There are ~$600 laptops on the market with HDDs with twice the capacity of the Mac Mini and they are throwing in a small display with the deal. HDD prices have fallen considerable in the last 14 months. Apple should be able to make a bump in HDD size without bumping up the price.



    The only suggestion made that might be problematic is moving towards a much more powerful graphics chipset. Upgrading the Mac Mini chipset to the same chipset as the new Macbooks may be asking a bit much insofar as the chipset not only includes the Geforce 9400, but it also includes support for DDR3. If you moved the Mac Mini to that new chipset you not only have the costs of the chipset itself, but also the cost of DDR3 memory, which at this point is considerably more expensive than DDR2. Nevertheless, below the $800 price point Apple should be able to at least put a lower end Nvidia integrated chipset like either the older Geforce 8400 or the the newer 9300. Either would be a huge improvement in graphical performance over the current Intel graphics, but I know that there are chipsets that use these GPUs that are still using DDR2.



    Even a modest improvement in the base $599 model would revive sales. Apple could make slight bumps in CPU, RAM, HDD and not add a huge amount in costs, but bring life back to the sales of the Mac Mini. One thing that people forget is that there are a lot of Apple switchers that use the Mac Mini as a way to kick the tires on Mac OS without investing a lot of money into trying it out. Ultimately a certain percentage of those that remain happy with the unit may go on to buy one of the Macbooks or perhaps one of their more expensive desktop units.
  • Reply 34 of 94
    seek3rseek3r Posts: 179member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrnnn View Post


    Assuming they do update the Mac Mini here's what I hope they'll do:



    1. Like the Macbook, no more firewire.

    2. No more combo drives. All drives will be Superdrive.

    3. A higher capacity hard drive.

    4. A few more added USB ports.

    5. Faster Core 2 Duo processor.

    6. Built-in nVidia graphics.

    7. Mini-DVI port

    8. More built-in RAM



    My bet is mini-displayport (though that may be what you meant by dvi) and a magsafe power connector as the big port upgrades.
  • Reply 35 of 94
    mjteixmjteix Posts: 563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SSA View Post


    The only suggestion made that might be problematic is moving towards a much more powerful graphics chipset. Upgrading the Mac Mini chipset to the same chipset as the new Macbooks may be asking a bit much insofar as the chipset not only includes the Geforce 9400, but it also includes support for DDR3. If you moved the Mac Mini to that new chipset you not only have the costs of the chipset itself, but also the cost of DDR3 memory, which at this point is considerably more expensive than DDR2. Nevertheless, below the $800 price point Apple should be able to at least put a lower end Nvidia integrated chipset like either the older Geforce 8400 or the the newer 9300. Either would be a huge improvement in graphical performance over the current Intel graphics, but I know that there are chipsets that use these GPUs that are still using DDR2.



    AFAIK, the new nvidia chipset is very expensive about twice as much as a regular Intel chipset. And that maybe one of the reasons why we didn't see a speedbump on the new MBs (actually a speed decrease for the new entry level aluminium MB, that and the LED-BL display of course).



    The new nvidia chipset supports DDR2-800 RAM too (the one in the current iMac). But as far as RAM is concerned, Apple currently prices all the notebook/iMac RAM the same: $75 per GB for DDR2-667/DDR2-800/DRR3-1066. Just look at the BTO options on the Apple Store: $75 to go from 1GB to 2GB and $150 to go from 2GB to 4GB. On any Mac except the MacPro/Xserve.



    If you apply the same ratio between the MacBook and the Mac mini ( previous generation: $1099 to $599 is a 500 price cut), Apple should be able to make a 2.00GHz new Mac mini for $799 ($1299-500), about the same as today but with better graphics, less ports, hopefully 2GB of RAM, 160GB HDD and a Superdrive.



    to seek3r: I don't think a Magsafe power connector is a good idea for a desktop computer with no battery.



    The problem with the new 24" ACD is that it is made for notebooks, not as a general usage monitor. With a desktop computer, people won't know what to do with the MagSafe connector and most will miss the FW hub of the previous models. Also most of the DP video cards have a full DP connector, adding another adaptor to the mix (along with the FW800/400 adaptor...). But maybe Apple will release a "desktop" version of the 24" ADC (full size DP connector) with no MagSafe but a FW800/400 hub (FW800 on the cable and FW800 & FW400 on the back of the display), along with the current 1-to-3 USB hub.
  • Reply 36 of 94
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by seek3r View Post


    My bet is mini-displayport (though that may be what you meant by dvi) and a magsafe power connector as the big port upgrades.



    Thanks for the catch. I meant mini-displayport and wrote mini-dvi instead.
  • Reply 37 of 94
    mjtelx



    Excellent idea on getting the ratio between the previous macmini vs previous macbook with hypothetical macmini vs new macbook.



    However, I do think $500 difference is a bit low. Remember that the new macbooks are built with standard glossy screens (the previous macbooks didn't have glossy screens) and that means an extra amount in favor of the new macbooks vs a hypothetical macmini.



    So instead of a $799 macmini, we could be looking at a macmini between $699 to $749.
  • Reply 38 of 94
    phongphong Posts: 219member
    If you're predicting the price of a future Mac, better to err on the higher side!
  • Reply 39 of 94
    mjteixmjteix Posts: 563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrnnn View Post


    mjtelx



    Excellent idea on getting the ratio between the previous macmini vs previous macbook with hypothetical macmini vs new macbook.



    However, I do think $500 difference is a bit low. Remember that the new macbooks are built with standard glossy screens (the previous macbooks didn't have glossy screens) and that means an extra amount in favor of the new macbooks vs a hypothetical macmini.



    So instead of a $799 macmini, we could be looking at a macmini between $699 to $749.



    That's right, I do believe that the increase in price of the new MB is due to the LED-BL display, but remember that the previous MB had a GM965 chipset and a 2.1GHz cpu while the base Mac mini has an older chipset (GMA950) and an older 1.83GHz cpu. Those differences have to cost something. Compared to the current $700 Mac mini, the proposed nvidia one has: better graphics, possibly a better 2.00GHz cpu (?), more RAM and a bigger HDD, will lack FW, though.



    Anyway, $699/799 for a better Mac mini is better than keeping with the current model as is.
  • Reply 40 of 94
    irelandireland Posts: 17,798member
    The Mac mini is dead. Deal with it.
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