I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone), I will NEVER buy another Apple product. And I am a user who loves the advancement of technology.
I would suggest for the future. If a product does not perform some crucial function that you require. The company has not promised that the product will ever perform the function you require. The wisest choice would be not to buy that product.
Quote:
Otherwise, you will go back to the Apple of yesteryear - OVERPRICED and UNDERPROMISED! This type of attitude will ruin you in the long run if other companies meet the needs of such users! Apple should take advantage of this rocky market to take control of the smartphone business. Yet, it still decides to continue with its stubborn ways and avoid the demads of its audience. It sounds to me like the U.S auto industry, but the next 12 months will reveal the future of Apple. It will either come out ahead, or it will fail, along with Motorola and other companies who decided what was best for the economy based upon the ideas of its executive office, as opposed to the ideas of its consumers. That's Marketing 101!!!
It can be argued that Apple is listening to the needs of consumers. In studies of mobile phones the top three uses of smart phones are email, voice calling, SMS. Everything else is icing on the cake. Most of those extra features go unused by many people.
Its not simply incumbent on a company to provide a product that checks off a feature list. A company should provide a product that does what it does very well. The fact that the iPhone is the best selling phone in the US and the second best selling smartphone in the world, is indication that it does meet the needs of the market.
I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone), I will NEVER buy another Apple product. And I am a user who loves the advancement of technology. I have a doctorate degree in law, and I'm pretty well educated. Apple's stubborn stance will not get it to the next level! You have to satisfy the ENTERPRISE AND the call of the common folk. Otherwise, you will go back to the Apple of yesteryear - OVERPRICED and UNDERPROMISED! I am a J.D. AND an M.B.A.! That may not mean much, but I am speaking for many of those who are well educated but who see Apple as being in an Ivory Tower and not listening to its users. This type of attitude will ruin you in the long run if other companies meet the needs of such users! Apple should take advantage of this rocky market to take control of the smartphone business. Yet, it still decides to continue with its stubborn ways and avoid the demads of its audience. It sounds to me like the U.S auto industry, but the next 12 months will reveal the future of Apple. It will either come out ahead, or it will fail, along with Motorola and other companies who decided what was best for the economy based upon the ideas of its executive office, as opposed to the ideas of its consumers. That's Marketing 101!!!
Well, as a lawyer, I'm sure you have the cash to get the Blackberry storm and dump the iPhone if it doesn't have the "enterprise" support you need. Although, the Army seemed happy enough with Apple's enterprise support and it won the JD Powers customer satisfaction for business users...
Cut and paste is an odd lack. I wonder how much is a security/stability issue because from a technical standpoint it's easy to do.
Video recording may or may not be beyond the ability of the iPhone hardware. Frankly the camera sucks enough that I dunno the real utility of having it. Sure, I've used it but I've wondered if the disposable digital cameras are better.
MMS might be an AT&T thing...Telia is adding MMS. There's no reason for Apple not to want to support MMS. This is also not a big technical thing. Still, it's another odd lack in the iPhone but certainly a software solvable issue.
Cut and paste is an odd lack. I wonder how much is a security/stability issue because from a technical standpoint it's easy to do.
The Black Berry Storm has touch screen copy and paste. From the reviews I've read it doesn't work very well.
Quote:
Video recording may or may not be beyond the ability of the iPhone hardware. Frankly the camera sucks enough that I dunno the real utility of having it. Sure, I've used it but I've wondered if the disposable digital cameras are better.
So few people use a phone to record video that this is more of a "me too" feature than anything actually required.
Quote:
MMS might be an AT&T thing...Telia is adding MMS. There's no reason for Apple not to want to support MMS. This is also not a big technical thing. Still, it's another odd lack in the iPhone but certainly a software solvable issue.
I can see Steve Jobs having a philosophical difference with MMS, preferring email over it.
I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone)...
Hey, can't say you're wrong. Many feel the same way, and find the whole thing more than a little absurd:
Are they buying these phones specifically for these features? Or simply buying a phone that already comes with these features?
I dunno... when you buy a car, do you expect it to have things like airbags, a CD player, air conditioning, antilock brakes? A few don't, but most ppl do.
Some of these items you list are required to gain a good safety rating. But no such a car would not become the best selling car in the US nor one of the best selling cars in the world the way the iPhone has.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins
I dunno... when you buy a car, do you expect it to have things like airbags, a CD player, air conditioning, antilock brakes? A few don't, but most ppl do.
Some of these items you list are required to gain a good safety rating. But no such a car would not become the best selling car in the US nor one of the best selling cars in the world the way the iPhone has.
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
I'm asking that question rhetorically, since, as an Apple fanboi, your knee-jerk response will be to say, "Oh, I don't need any of those basic, expected features, I'm happy with whatever Apple decides to give me."
You make some assumptions. Such as the assumption that all of these features are implemented well and are usable on most phones, and they are not. You assume that Apple could implement all of these features and have them working well and usable, I doubt they can or want to.
I feel that its pretty objective: not pro or con Apple to look at the basic evidence. If these features were so desired and required the iPhone would not sell as well as it has. Its only on these internet lists do people expect Apple to later include features that they have not advertised nor promised for the iPhone. For the most part the larger market doesn't have any further expectation outside of what they purchased.
Their have been several surveys of what most people do with their smartphones. The three features that top the list of every survey I've seen are: email, SMS/MMS, and voice. An iPhone specific survey included the internet as one of the top uses. Everything else: camera, video, music playback. All had lesser and inconsistent use by most people.
To attempt to inflate these features as though they are primary uses simply because other phones have these features ignores the truth. Apple (as every other mobile phone manufacturer) has limitation in what it can design its phone to do best. Most people don't even commonly use most of those features in the first place.
To point this out gets you labeled an Apple fanboy, Hmmmm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
I'm asking that question rhetorically, since, as an Apple fanboi, your knee-jerk response will be to say, "Oh, I don't need any of those basic, expected features, I'm happy with whatever Apple decides to give me."
Yes, correct ones, as per usual. They're based on this thing called 'reality'.
Everything you mention is either a matter of opinion, Apple 'Homerism' (i.e."Apple doesn't offer it, therefore, we do not need it, Master Steve knows all"), cherry-picked surveys (which even agree that pic-messaging is a major feature that Apple left out) or old ground we've tread many, many times before. Suffice it to say, you were wrong then, and nothing's really changed since then, so...
One thing that's particularly silly is your continued inability to understand that while the iPhone is selling well now (in part due to a major feature you thought it didn't really need- 3G), it could well be selling EVEN BETTER if Apple addressed the feature-deficit. 3G was a partial proof of that, particularly in Europe (though your Apple Homer nature will chalk it up entirely to price).
But as you didn't get that then, I don't expect you to get it now.
Quote:
To point this out gets you labeled an Apple fanboy, Hmmmm.
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
One could argue that the software can't really be leading edge if it doesn't offer the software that most people want, even if the OS and apps it does offer are top notch. But while not perfect (Apple has never perfect), I view many of these as: One man's feature is another man's clutter.
For me, the 'basic features' that Apple omitted mean nothing to me, and while I don't necessarily represent their average customer it seems that I probably am. I've had a few issues with the way AT&T sends an SMS to my iPhone for MMS pics being sent as the link isn't hyperlinked and they don't use a hash so you have to put in their cryptic username and password that isn't easy to remember. They couldn't have made it any more complicated! I don't even check them when I get one sent every couple months because it's such a PITA.
As for Copy/Paste, I've only really needed it once in the 17 months I've owned an iPhone, though I'm sure I will use it once Apple finally graces us with that functionality. But that isn't a basic function and their are challenges to adding it to a touchscreen that uses fat fingers for navigation. I do think that Apple has probably completed C/P by now, but will not release it until the sales fall and they need to create new buzz. That is just good business.
Now my experience with the iPhone hasn't been perfect. The 2.0 version was horrible for me for Safari. This is a major issue for me since it's the browser that I use most, like TenoBell states above.I find it odd that it took 3.5 months to get it working properly considering it is the crux, IMO, of the widespread success of the iPhone and that it worked so well from about 1.1 up to 1.1.4
Yes, correct ones, as per usual. They're based on this thing called 'reality'.
Everything you mention is either a matter of opinion, Apple 'Homerism' (i.e."Apple doesn't offer it, therefore, we do not need it, Master Steve knows all"), cherry-picked surveys (which even agree that pic-messaging is a major feature that Apple left out) or old ground we've tread many, many times before. Suffice it to say, you were wrong then, and nothing's really changed since then, so...
The fact that the iPhone has sold well or the surveys of most used features are not my opinion. Essentially I'm saying the iPhone has sold well, most people don't use those features, how useful are they in the first place.
Quote:
One thing that's particularly silly is your continued inability to understand that while the iPhone is selling well now (in part due to a major feature you thought it didn't really need- 3G), it could well be selling EVEN BETTER if Apple addressed the feature-deficit. 3G was a partial proof of that, particularly in Europe (though your Apple Homer nature will chalk it up entirely to price).
Other than a lower price, no I don't see how the iPhone could have sold much better. I've used evidence outside of my opinion to support my point. If you have any evidence outside of your opinion please share it.
Yeah I've been traumatized by the poor performance of Safari in 2.0. I'd come to expect it to crash unexpectedly at any moment. The fact that it doesn't crash now just shows how bad it was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
Now my experience with the iPhone has been perfect. The 2.0 version was horrible for me for Safari. This is a major issue for me since it's the browser that I use most, like TenoBell states above.I find it odd that it took 3.5 months to get it working properly considering it is the crux, IMO, of the widespread success of the iPhone and that it worked so well from about 1.1 up to 1.1.4
The fact that the iPhone has sold well or the surveys of most used features are not my opinion. Essentially I'm saying the iPhone has sold well, most people don't use those features, how useful are they in the first place.
Other than a lower price, no I don't see how the iPhone could have sold much better. I've used evidence outside of my opinion to support my point. If you have any evidence outside of your opinion please share it.
Exactly as I already said- you continue to not understand that Apple could be doing even better, and that 3G mattered.
No point in arguing with a rock, because the rock seldom says anything useful, and does not learn from what you tell it. Congrats on being AI's #1 rock, T.
One could argue that the software can't really be leading edge if it doesn't offer the software that most people want, even if the OS and apps it does offer are top notch.
That sort of ignores that software can be great in one area, and poor in another. Obviously not all products are breakthrough-excellent across the board, or terrible across the board either.
Quote:
For me, the 'basic features' that Apple omitted mean nothing to me
Yes, as you say, for you. But you are not the US market, much less the worldwide one.
I, a California boy, do not presume to tell Hiroshi in Japan or Hans in Germany what they should or should not want. Steve probably shouldn't try to either. There are some encouraging things on that front though. The 3G iPhone, of course, and an MMS app being approved in Sweden.
Exactly as I already said- you continue to not understand that Apple could be doing even better, and that 3G mattered.
No point in arguing with a rock, because the rock seldom says anything useful, and does not learn from what you tell it. Congrats on being AI's #1 rock, T.
...
I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
I agree with the issues of 3G over EDGE and AT&T's then and current 3G issues. However, while the App Store and price drop greatly contributed to the increased sales, I do think that the marketing term "3G" being added to the iPhone was a major factor for many buyers, especially in countries where 3G is commonplace and EDGE is not.
I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Verizon's 3G network is definitely better than ATT's, especially in coverage. But if you're in a metro area that ATT's 3G covers, you still want it, 'cuz EDGE is slow.
And it's a worse situation in Europe, where no 3G often means using GPRS, which is even slower than EDGE. Like dialup slow. As in painful.
Quote:
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The 2G iPhone wasn't a bad decision for the US, but it was a bad one for Europe, which as a market has different (and higher) expectations- as lackluster 2G iPhone sales underscored. And it would've been a disaster in places like Japan and Korea. Fortunately, Apple didn't release the 2G iPhone there.
Far as higher power draw goes, well, you acknowledge it and design around it, in part by going with a bigger battery and slightly thicker iPhone. The 3G iPhone is actually a hair thicker than the 2G (by .03"), but the battery doesn't appear to be higher in capacity, or higher enough at any rate. I understand from past experience that you'll argue 'til your blue in the face that somehow putting a higher-cap battery in would be a bad idea or wouldn't make much of a difference, but I'm satisfied from our previous discussion on the matter that you're incorrect there.
Quote:
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
Price drops, in the US and elsewhere, have helped, but are far from the whole ball of wax, especially overseas. Many of us knew ppl who were holding off on buying 'til 3G showed up, and the situation in Europe was that way and even more so. It's hard to argue with the sales figures- the 3G iPhone has indeed sold very well, and it's not like they weren't price-dropping plans and other things in Europe prior to the 3G iPhone's introduction... price drops by themselves didn't do enough. And 3G helps the App Store by speeding up app dload times, though yes, you can go the dload-by-computer route, but the OTA dloading is what's sexy, obviously. I still don't think it was a coincidence that the App Store and 3G iPhone launched at about the same time.
In any case, feel free to disagree, but I think I'm already well aware of the counter-arguments on the matter. This is all pretty much trodding over old ground. Interesting for you perhaps, not so much to me. I'm just happy they finally coughed up a 3G iPhone.
Comments
I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone), I will NEVER buy another Apple product. And I am a user who loves the advancement of technology.
I would suggest for the future. If a product does not perform some crucial function that you require. The company has not promised that the product will ever perform the function you require. The wisest choice would be not to buy that product.
Otherwise, you will go back to the Apple of yesteryear - OVERPRICED and UNDERPROMISED! This type of attitude will ruin you in the long run if other companies meet the needs of such users! Apple should take advantage of this rocky market to take control of the smartphone business. Yet, it still decides to continue with its stubborn ways and avoid the demads of its audience. It sounds to me like the U.S auto industry, but the next 12 months will reveal the future of Apple. It will either come out ahead, or it will fail, along with Motorola and other companies who decided what was best for the economy based upon the ideas of its executive office, as opposed to the ideas of its consumers. That's Marketing 101!!!
It can be argued that Apple is listening to the needs of consumers. In studies of mobile phones the top three uses of smart phones are email, voice calling, SMS. Everything else is icing on the cake. Most of those extra features go unused by many people.
Its not simply incumbent on a company to provide a product that checks off a feature list. A company should provide a product that does what it does very well. The fact that the iPhone is the best selling phone in the US and the second best selling smartphone in the world, is indication that it does meet the needs of the market.
I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone), I will NEVER buy another Apple product. And I am a user who loves the advancement of technology. I have a doctorate degree in law, and I'm pretty well educated. Apple's stubborn stance will not get it to the next level! You have to satisfy the ENTERPRISE AND the call of the common folk. Otherwise, you will go back to the Apple of yesteryear - OVERPRICED and UNDERPROMISED! I am a J.D. AND an M.B.A.! That may not mean much, but I am speaking for many of those who are well educated but who see Apple as being in an Ivory Tower and not listening to its users. This type of attitude will ruin you in the long run if other companies meet the needs of such users! Apple should take advantage of this rocky market to take control of the smartphone business. Yet, it still decides to continue with its stubborn ways and avoid the demads of its audience. It sounds to me like the U.S auto industry, but the next 12 months will reveal the future of Apple. It will either come out ahead, or it will fail, along with Motorola and other companies who decided what was best for the economy based upon the ideas of its executive office, as opposed to the ideas of its consumers. That's Marketing 101!!!
Well, as a lawyer, I'm sure you have the cash to get the Blackberry storm and dump the iPhone if it doesn't have the "enterprise" support you need. Although, the Army seemed happy enough with Apple's enterprise support and it won the JD Powers customer satisfaction for business users...
Cut and paste is an odd lack. I wonder how much is a security/stability issue because from a technical standpoint it's easy to do.
Video recording may or may not be beyond the ability of the iPhone hardware. Frankly the camera sucks enough that I dunno the real utility of having it. Sure, I've used it but I've wondered if the disposable digital cameras are better.
MMS might be an AT&T thing...Telia is adding MMS. There's no reason for Apple not to want to support MMS. This is also not a big technical thing. Still, it's another odd lack in the iPhone but certainly a software solvable issue.
Cut and paste is an odd lack. I wonder how much is a security/stability issue because from a technical standpoint it's easy to do.
The Black Berry Storm has touch screen copy and paste. From the reviews I've read it doesn't work very well.
Video recording may or may not be beyond the ability of the iPhone hardware. Frankly the camera sucks enough that I dunno the real utility of having it. Sure, I've used it but I've wondered if the disposable digital cameras are better.
So few people use a phone to record video that this is more of a "me too" feature than anything actually required.
MMS might be an AT&T thing...Telia is adding MMS. There's no reason for Apple not to want to support MMS. This is also not a big technical thing. Still, it's another odd lack in the iPhone but certainly a software solvable issue.
I can see Steve Jobs having a philosophical difference with MMS, preferring email over it.
I own an iPhone, and I do NOT own any other Apple products. Based upon the fact that Apple does not listen to the demands of its iPhone users (with respect to MMS, copy and paste, video recording, etc. on the iPhone)...
Hey, can't say you're wrong. Many feel the same way, and find the whole thing more than a little absurd:
...
Hey, can't say you're wrong. Many feel the same way, and find the whole thing more than a little absurd:
...
Out of curiosity exactly which other phones are people buying in large number because of MMS, video recording, video calling, and memory cards?
Pretty much all of 'em, since, 'cept for vid calling, those are very basic, standard features.
Have been for some time now too. Welcome to 2006.
...
Pretty much all of 'em, since, 'cept for vid calling, those are very basic, standard features. Have been for some time now too. Welcome to 2006.
...
Are they buying these phones specifically for these features? Or simply buying a phone that already comes with these features?
I dunno... when you buy a car, do you expect it to have things like airbags, a CD player, air conditioning, antilock brakes? A few don't, but most ppl do.
...
I dunno... when you buy a car, do you expect it to have things like airbags, a CD player, air conditioning, antilock brakes? A few don't, but most ppl do.
...
Some of these items you list are required to gain a good safety rating. But no such a car would not become the best selling car in the US nor one of the best selling cars in the world the way the iPhone has.
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
I'm asking that question rhetorically, since, as an Apple fanboi, your knee-jerk response will be to say, "Oh, I don't need any of those basic, expected features, I'm happy with whatever Apple decides to give me."
...
I feel that its pretty objective: not pro or con Apple to look at the basic evidence. If these features were so desired and required the iPhone would not sell as well as it has. Its only on these internet lists do people expect Apple to later include features that they have not advertised nor promised for the iPhone. For the most part the larger market doesn't have any further expectation outside of what they purchased.
Their have been several surveys of what most people do with their smartphones. The three features that top the list of every survey I've seen are: email, SMS/MMS, and voice. An iPhone specific survey included the internet as one of the top uses. Everything else: camera, video, music playback. All had lesser and inconsistent use by most people.
To attempt to inflate these features as though they are primary uses simply because other phones have these features ignores the truth. Apple (as every other mobile phone manufacturer) has limitation in what it can design its phone to do best. Most people don't even commonly use most of those features in the first place.
To point this out gets you labeled an Apple fanboy, Hmmmm.
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
I'm asking that question rhetorically, since, as an Apple fanboi, your knee-jerk response will be to say, "Oh, I don't need any of those basic, expected features, I'm happy with whatever Apple decides to give me."
...
You make some assumptions.
Yes, correct ones, as per usual. They're based on this thing called 'reality'.
Everything you mention is either a matter of opinion, Apple 'Homerism' (i.e."Apple doesn't offer it, therefore, we do not need it, Master Steve knows all"), cherry-picked surveys (which even agree that pic-messaging is a major feature that Apple left out) or old ground we've tread many, many times before. Suffice it to say, you were wrong then, and nothing's really changed since then, so...
One thing that's particularly silly is your continued inability to understand that while the iPhone is selling well now (in part due to a major feature you thought it didn't really need- 3G), it could well be selling EVEN BETTER if Apple addressed the feature-deficit. 3G was a partial proof of that, particularly in Europe (though your Apple Homer nature will chalk it up entirely to price).
But as you didn't get that then, I don't expect you to get it now.
To point this out gets you labeled an Apple fanboy, Hmmmm.
Well, to be fair T, you really worked for it.
...
Exactly! So the iPhone is able to 'get away with' its fundamental deficiencies in basic, expected features (for now) by virtue of its leading-edge software (Multitouch, mobile Safari, etc).
But, WOW... wouldn't it be great to have BOTH the expected features AND the leading-edge software?
One could argue that the software can't really be leading edge if it doesn't offer the software that most people want, even if the OS and apps it does offer are top notch. But while not perfect (Apple has never perfect), I view many of these as: One man's feature is another man's clutter.
For me, the 'basic features' that Apple omitted mean nothing to me, and while I don't necessarily represent their average customer it seems that I probably am. I've had a few issues with the way AT&T sends an SMS to my iPhone for MMS pics being sent as the link isn't hyperlinked and they don't use a hash so you have to put in their cryptic username and password that isn't easy to remember. They couldn't have made it any more complicated! I don't even check them when I get one sent every couple months because it's such a PITA.
As for Copy/Paste, I've only really needed it once in the 17 months I've owned an iPhone, though I'm sure I will use it once Apple finally graces us with that functionality. But that isn't a basic function and their are challenges to adding it to a touchscreen that uses fat fingers for navigation. I do think that Apple has probably completed C/P by now, but will not release it until the sales fall and they need to create new buzz. That is just good business.
Now my experience with the iPhone hasn't been perfect. The 2.0 version was horrible for me for Safari. This is a major issue for me since it's the browser that I use most, like TenoBell states above.I find it odd that it took 3.5 months to get it working properly considering it is the crux, IMO, of the widespread success of the iPhone and that it worked so well from about 1.1 up to 1.1.4
Yes, correct ones, as per usual. They're based on this thing called 'reality'.
Everything you mention is either a matter of opinion, Apple 'Homerism' (i.e."Apple doesn't offer it, therefore, we do not need it, Master Steve knows all"), cherry-picked surveys (which even agree that pic-messaging is a major feature that Apple left out) or old ground we've tread many, many times before. Suffice it to say, you were wrong then, and nothing's really changed since then, so...
The fact that the iPhone has sold well or the surveys of most used features are not my opinion. Essentially I'm saying the iPhone has sold well, most people don't use those features, how useful are they in the first place.
One thing that's particularly silly is your continued inability to understand that while the iPhone is selling well now (in part due to a major feature you thought it didn't really need- 3G), it could well be selling EVEN BETTER if Apple addressed the feature-deficit. 3G was a partial proof of that, particularly in Europe (though your Apple Homer nature will chalk it up entirely to price).
Other than a lower price, no I don't see how the iPhone could have sold much better. I've used evidence outside of my opinion to support my point. If you have any evidence outside of your opinion please share it.
Now my experience with the iPhone has been perfect. The 2.0 version was horrible for me for Safari. This is a major issue for me since it's the browser that I use most, like TenoBell states above.I find it odd that it took 3.5 months to get it working properly considering it is the crux, IMO, of the widespread success of the iPhone and that it worked so well from about 1.1 up to 1.1.4
The fact that the iPhone has sold well or the surveys of most used features are not my opinion. Essentially I'm saying the iPhone has sold well, most people don't use those features, how useful are they in the first place.
Other than a lower price, no I don't see how the iPhone could have sold much better. I've used evidence outside of my opinion to support my point. If you have any evidence outside of your opinion please share it.
Exactly as I already said- you continue to not understand that Apple could be doing even better, and that 3G mattered.
No point in arguing with a rock, because the rock seldom says anything useful, and does not learn from what you tell it. Congrats on being AI's #1 rock, T.
...
One could argue that the software can't really be leading edge if it doesn't offer the software that most people want, even if the OS and apps it does offer are top notch.
That sort of ignores that software can be great in one area, and poor in another. Obviously not all products are breakthrough-excellent across the board, or terrible across the board either.
For me, the 'basic features' that Apple omitted mean nothing to me
Yes, as you say, for you. But you are not the US market, much less the worldwide one.
I, a California boy, do not presume to tell Hiroshi in Japan or Hans in Germany what they should or should not want. Steve probably shouldn't try to either. There are some encouraging things on that front though. The 3G iPhone, of course, and an MMS app being approved in Sweden.
...
Exactly as I already said- you continue to not understand that Apple could be doing even better, and that 3G mattered.
No point in arguing with a rock, because the rock seldom says anything useful, and does not learn from what you tell it. Congrats on being AI's #1 rock, T.
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I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
I agree with the issues of 3G over EDGE and AT&T's then and current 3G issues. However, while the App Store and price drop greatly contributed to the increased sales, I do think that the marketing term "3G" being added to the iPhone was a major factor for many buyers, especially in countries where 3G is commonplace and EDGE is not.
I know that some folks argued against 3g but frankly, AT&T's 3G network sucked ass at the original launch date. Arguably it still sucks ass in comparison to Verizon's network.
Verizon's 3G network is definitely better than ATT's, especially in coverage. But if you're in a metro area that ATT's 3G covers, you still want it, 'cuz EDGE is slow.
And it's a worse situation in Europe, where no 3G often means using GPRS, which is even slower than EDGE. Like dialup slow. As in painful.
Given that 3G essentially cuts the battery life in half, I dunno that the original 2G iPhone was as bad a decision as some folks make it out to be.
The 2G iPhone wasn't a bad decision for the US, but it was a bad one for Europe, which as a market has different (and higher) expectations- as lackluster 2G iPhone sales underscored. And it would've been a disaster in places like Japan and Korea. Fortunately, Apple didn't release the 2G iPhone there.
Far as higher power draw goes, well, you acknowledge it and design around it, in part by going with a bigger battery and slightly thicker iPhone. The 3G iPhone is actually a hair thicker than the 2G (by .03"), but the battery doesn't appear to be higher in capacity, or higher enough at any rate. I understand from past experience that you'll argue 'til your blue in the face that somehow putting a higher-cap battery in would be a bad idea or wouldn't make much of a difference, but I'm satisfied from our previous discussion on the matter that you're incorrect there.
The price drop and App Store probably did as much or more for sales than 3G.
Price drops, in the US and elsewhere, have helped, but are far from the whole ball of wax, especially overseas. Many of us knew ppl who were holding off on buying 'til 3G showed up, and the situation in Europe was that way and even more so. It's hard to argue with the sales figures- the 3G iPhone has indeed sold very well, and it's not like they weren't price-dropping plans and other things in Europe prior to the 3G iPhone's introduction... price drops by themselves didn't do enough. And 3G helps the App Store by speeding up app dload times, though yes, you can go the dload-by-computer route, but the OTA dloading is what's sexy, obviously. I still don't think it was a coincidence that the App Store and 3G iPhone launched at about the same time.
In any case, feel free to disagree, but I think I'm already well aware of the counter-arguments on the matter. This is all pretty much trodding over old ground. Interesting for you perhaps, not so much to me. I'm just happy they finally coughed up a 3G iPhone.
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