iLife '09 not fully compatible with PowerPC Macs

Posted:
in Mac Software edited January 2014
Apple is slowly dropping PowerPC compatibility with its latest software releases as evidenced by a major new feature of iLife '09 that will function only on Intel-based Macs.



Ars Technica points out that GarageBand's Learn to Play, a new section within the music-making software that serves as a digital instructor for a user learning a new instrument, is not officially supported for Macs still running on PowerPC processors.



System requirements found on the Apple Store website say, in fine print, "GarageBand Learn to Play requires an Intel-based Mac with a dual-core processor or better."



When iLife '09 was first announced at last month's Macworld, the system requirements included "a Power PC G5 or 867 MHz or faster PowerPC G4" without mentioning any incompatible individual features.



Learn to Play also offers Artist Lessons from a Lesson Store built into GarageBand where artists teach fans how to play their hit songs on certain instruments for $4.99 each lesson.



Chief executive Steve Jobs confirmed the switch from PowerPC to Intel in June 2005, targeting the end of 2007 for the transition to be completed.



Mac OS X Leopard excluded slower PowerPC-based Macs with a cutoff set at 800 MHz G4 or faster.



Official documentation from Apple gives clues that PowerPC Macs very well may be left out completely when Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard is released sometime during the first half of this year. Developer copies distributed at WWDC last year included a requirements PDF that listed "an Intel processor" as the minimum necessary to run the software.



Adding further weight to that possibility, people familiar with the ongoing development of Leopard have previously told AppleInsider that Snow Leopard would in all likelihood exclude support for PowerPC processors.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 48
    iqatedoiqatedo Posts: 1,595member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    Apple is slowly dropping PowerPC compatibility with its latest software releases as evidenced by a major new feature of iLife '09 that will function only on Intel-based Macs.



    Ars Technica points out that GarageBand's Learn to Play, a new section within the music-making software that serves as a digital instructor for a user learning a new instrument... told AppleInsider that Snow Leopard would in all likelihood exclude support for PowerPC processors.



    To me, Learn to Play demonstrates another powerful direction for applications under OS X, graphic instruction in skills that we might otherwise not be confident to pursue but which Garageband (and no doubt, future applications) makes very, very attractive. I guess, in the light of the ever increasing demand on performance that these applications seem to require, support for older systems will decline.



    Still using a dual 1.42 GHz G4, along with my near new MacBook Pro.
  • Reply 2 of 48
    aplnubaplnub Posts: 2,584member
    I wouldn't be shocked for Snow Leopard to take a whiz on all PPC Mac's. If Snow Leopard is available for PPC Macs, I definitely see SL being the last officially supported OS for PPC Mac's.



    The upside should be more sales of computers.
  • Reply 3 of 48
    Snow Leopard will be intel only. I'm surprised that apple hasen't announced that yet. They reduced the size of files as well as the OS. The only way to do that is by removing the PPC code in there.

    There is actually an app you can get that will remove the unecessary PPC code in Leopard on an Intel machine and the final file size for apps is the same size i've been seeing for apps bundled with snow leopard.
  • Reply 4 of 48
    In order to "dip my toe" into OS X, I bought the very first PowerPC MacMini back in 2005. After about a while, I discovered the MacMini was a little underpowered for some things, especially Eclipse and Google Earth. Just as I was about to buy an iMac, Apple announced the Intel transition.



    So I held off for several months waiting for more info on the transition. I was pleasantly surprised when I found out the iMac was the Mac to go Intel. After reading all the reviews and MacIntouch (which indicated very slight issues, but the first Intel iMac was mostly in tip-top shape), the only concern I had was that the Intel chip was 32-bit, and that the Core 2 Duo would only come out later in the year. After asking around, I was told that the only advantage to a 64-bit chip was that it would address more than 4 Gb of RAM.



    Well, I got nailed later when Apple provided Java 6 only for 64-bit Intel chips. That was a real letdown, seeing as I'm a Java developer.



    Anyway, to make a long story short, there's never a right time to buy a new computer, or a new Mac. No matter how well you try to time it, you'll miss out on something.
  • Reply 5 of 48
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,146member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aplnub View Post


    I wouldn't be shocked for Snow Leopard to take a whiz on all PPC Mac's. If Snow Leopard is available for PPC Macs, I definitely see SL being the last officially supported OS for PPC Mac's.



    The upside should be more sales of computers.



    I'd expect SL to be delivered without PPC support. How exactly does Apple optimize and set a roadmap for the future by clinging on to computers that will be nigh 4 years old when SL is purported to ship?



    To date there's been no hint of PPC support so I doubt that we suddenly get a build that inserts PPC.



    Though Leopard is a fine OS for PPC and I frankly do not see much reason for PPC owners to anguish over not being invited to the SL party. The GPU and CPU features are pretty much tailored for Intel and recent AMD/Nvidia product
  • Reply 6 of 48
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    Apple is slowly dropping PowerPC compatibility with its latest software releases as evidenced by a major new feature of iLife '09 that will function only on Intel-based Macs.



    Ars Technica points out that GarageBand's Learn to Play, a new section within the music-making software that serves as a digital instructor for a user learning a new instrument, is not officially supported for Macs still running on PowerPC processors.



    System requirements found on the Apple Store website say, in fine print, "GarageBand Learn to Play requires an Intel-based Mac with a dual-core processor or better."



    When iLife '09 was first announced at last month's Macworld, the system requirements included "a Power PC G5 or 867 MHz or faster PowerPC G4" without mentioning any incompatible individual features.



    Learn to Play also offers Artist Lessons from a Lesson Store built into GarageBand where artists teach fans how to play their hit songs on certain instruments for $4.99 each lesson.



    Chief executive Steve Jobs confirmed the switch from PowerPC to Intel in June 2005, targeting the end of 2007 for the transition to be completed.



    Mac OS X Leopard excluded slower PowerPC-based Macs with a cutoff set at 800 MHz G4 or faster.



    Official documentation from Apple gives clues that PowerPC Macs very well may be left out completely when Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard is released sometime during the first half of this year. Developer copies distributed at WWDC last year included a requirements PDF that listed "an Intel processor" as the minimum necessary to run the software.



    Adding further weight to that possibility, people familiar with the ongoing development of Leopard have previously told AppleInsider that Snow Leopard would in all likelihood exclude support for PowerPC processors.



    Yes it seems that way is inevitable and it brings another question I have about Rosetta. Seems that it will be scrapped in Snow leopard ? can anyone confirm ?

    I am dependant on Appleworks so I may have to buy a macbook now to be sure of having Rosetta at hand.
  • Reply 7 of 48
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we know this at MacWorld? I could have sworn Phil said this during his presentation.
  • Reply 8 of 48
    This should lead to at least 5 more law-suits.
  • Reply 9 of 48
    It looks like AppleInside is creating news today. The Garageband learn to play requirements were up the day of the keynote and did not change. I read that before I pre-ordered the Mac Box set Family Pack.
  • Reply 10 of 48
    If it's not on the box that GarageBand doesn't fully support PPC, then those people should be allowed to get their money back if they want.
  • Reply 11 of 48
    As a last gen G5 owner I do not mind one bit Apple dropping PPC from SL, I will eventually update my PowerMac to an Intel version in a few more years, and will have a spanking new MacPro w/ 8 or more cores to boot! In the meanwhile, Im thinking of getting a MacBook for my traveling/ portable convenience.
  • Reply 12 of 48
    If Apple is dumping PPC support, they need to find the balls to come out and announce it instead of leaving everyone in the dark, both users and developers.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    How exactly does Apple optimize and set a roadmap for the future by clinging on to computers that will be nigh 4 years old when SL is purported to ship?



    Actually, less than 3 years, the tower didn't switch from G5 to intel until august 2006.



    My biggest concern is that there will be apps that won't run on 10.5, say if Logic 8.1 ships this fall.
  • Reply 13 of 48
    No surprises. It's time for Apple to move on from the PowerPC. I would like to see any major security holes plugged in Leopard for some time, which I'm sure Apple will. Beyond that, the only thing I'd ask is for XCode to maintain the ability to compile for PPC and Tiger/Leopard for a couple of more years in order to help transition legacy systems to the new scheme of things.



    Snow Leopard could represent as huge a change for developers as anything we've seen since the move from Classic/Carbon to Cocoa. I've been rather busy so I haven't kept up much with Snow Leopard. I'm curious as to how much of these changes will apply to app developers, as far as taking advantage of Grand Central and/or OpenCL. As in, how much of that will be left to the compiler versus directly tweaking the knobs and levers ourselves. For example, if I already have a Core Animation app, will Core Animation now automatically take advantage of these new capabilities, to where I merely re-compile the binary for Snow Leopard and automagically get these benefits?
  • Reply 14 of 48
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post


    My biggest concern is that there will be apps that won't run on 10.5, say if Logic 8.1 ships this fall.



    I doubt that would be the case: the Pro apps have always supported one generation of OS X backwards. In Leopard's case that would automatically mean that PPC support would have to be in the box.



    The Universal binary tactic actually has quite a few upsides: we could see three binaries for a while -- PPC, Intel, and an Intel-Snow Leopard binary, optimized for multi-core stations with Grand Central and OpenCL. That would be sweet.
  • Reply 15 of 48
    This two year transition from the PowerPC to Intel is the same timeframe as the transition from the 68040 to the PowerPC. Apple supported the 68040 for about two years after the shift to PowerPC. Slowly the software shifted to PowerPC only, and dropped all 680x0 support. The same thing was said about Mac OS 8.5, but there was no reason for it to support 68040 processors anymore.



    Snow Leopard is still Leopard. There is no reason for Apple to continue to support the PowerPC G5 processor when it is already 6 years old. It doesn't bother me. It will save me from spending $129 for another OS release on my iMac G5.



    The GarageBand requirement even shuts out the Mac Mini with the single-core Intel processor. GarageBand was always slow to begin with.
  • Reply 16 of 48
    pbg4 dudepbg4 dude Posts: 1,611member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JavaCowboy View Post


    In order to "dip my toe" into OS X, I bought the very first PowerPC MacMini back in 2005. After about a while, I discovered the MacMini was a little underpowered for some things, especially Eclipse and Google Earth. Just as I was about to buy an iMac, Apple announced the Intel transition.



    So I held off for several months waiting for more info on the transition. I was pleasantly surprised when I found out the iMac was the Mac to go Intel. After reading all the reviews and MacIntouch (which indicated very slight issues, but the first Intel iMac was mostly in tip-top shape), the only concern I had was that the Intel chip was 32-bit, and that the Core 2 Duo would only come out later in the year. After asking around, I was told that the only advantage to a 64-bit chip was that it would address more than 4 Gb of RAM.



    Well, I got nailed later when Apple provided Java 6 only for 64-bit Intel chips. That was a real letdown, seeing as I'm a Java developer.



    Anyway, to make a long story short, there's never a right time to buy a new computer, or a new Mac. No matter how well you try to time it, you'll miss out on something.



    I got nailed by the Java 6 thing too. I have a 32bit Intel MacBook. It isn't a 32 vs. 64 bit thing though, it's Apple only developing Java 6 for 64 bit only for whatever reason (probably cost savings as 32 bit Intel computers were only available for a short time).
  • Reply 17 of 48
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Macintox View Post


    Yes it seems that way is inevitable and it brings another question I have about Rosetta. Seems that it will be scrapped in Snow leopard ? can anyone confirm ?

    I am dependant on Appleworks so I may have to buy a macbook now to be sure of having Rosetta at hand.



    I don't think Apple will drop Rosetta support in any version of Mac OS X. Even though Snow Leopard won't run on PowerPC hardware, it should still support PowerPC emulation for older software programs. A lot of people don't have money to invest in new versions, or may prefer an older version of a program. Even when they transitioned to PowerPC from the 68040, Mac OS 8.5 dropped 68040 Macs and only ran on PowerPC's, but the Mac OS still ran 680x0 software all the way through Mac OS 9.2.2. The Rosetta emulation for PowerPC is completely different than trying to continue support for the Classic Mac OS. They can easily retain Rosetta support.
  • Reply 18 of 48
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post


    If it's not on the box that GarageBand doesn't fully support PPC, then those people should be allowed to get their money back if they want.



    It is on the box and on the website under System Requirements. This is no secret.
  • Reply 19 of 48
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,146member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post


    If Apple is dumping PPC support, they need to find the balls to come out and announce it instead of leaving everyone in the dark, both users and developers.



    Actually, less than 3 years, the tower didn't switch from G5 to intel until august 2006.



    My biggest concern is that there will be apps that won't run on 10.5, say if Logic 8.1 ships this fall.



    Exactly. Apple should have already declared pricing and at least what computers will be included or left out. Frankly I think Snow Leopard is going to be a snoozer and certainly not worth $129 ...hell $59 would be pushing it.



    The day it ships it'll likely have less than 10 apps that take advantage of OpenCL or Grand Central or whatever.



    Apple's major and minor apps won't be SL optimized until next year's refreshes. Look how long it took for iLife to get Core Animation and other Leopard goodies. It took Leopard being out over a year and being on version 10.5.6.



    If you have a PPC rejoice and let Intel users beta test Snow Leopard and shoot for 10.7 or 10.6.6 before you upgrade. By then you'll actually have apps that take advantage of all this new tech.
  • Reply 20 of 48
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post


    If Apple is dumping PPC support, they need to find the balls to come out and announce it instead of leaving everyone in the dark, both users and developers.



    You would have to be pretty stupid not to realize that Snow Leopard only runs on Intel. It is no secret. Ever since it was first announced and developers were testing early versions, it was documented that it only ran on Intel hardware. They are not going to suddenly throw in PowerPC support at the end. The PowerPC is not in Apple's future, and it has already been three years since the first Intel Mac arrived. The Intel optimizations won't benefit a PowerPC Mac, and you are not getting any major features in Snow Leopard.
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