The point I was making is that clearly Apple is not going to get the revenue from the Pro market that buys Apple Displays. No 20-inch, no 23-inch. What happens when it drops the 30-inch?
When selecting a Mac Pro, not just in the US, globally, an Apple Display is a simple, convenient and quality display to go with it.
Yes Mac Pros will continue to be sold. But as Apple already admitted Apple's revenue/profit from the Pro market is already starting to be reduced.
Perhaps I shouldn't have been so blunt, but I'm not the biggest complainer on this thread (there was a guy that used CAPITALISED words a lot) about how Apple is pretty much giving the Pro market the finger.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008
Goodbye Pro market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress
Yeah because Apple FORCES you to buy an Apple Display when you buy a Mac....
...I was at a meeting a few days ago where several people were grousing about the lack of Apple monitors to go with their intended purchases (they needed to purchase both items on one invoice for Applecare purposes).
This is one rather glaring example of Apple's unfortunate trend of not keeping the hardware up to date.
What is going on with Apple management? It seems as though they have lost their way.
Yes, I'm not saying Apple's Pro market is totally dead. But something at Apple management, I'm afraid, probably due to Steve's health, is starting to go off on somewhat of a tangent since the great success of the iPhone 3G...
I have to say that I've been pretty happy with Apples pro offerings until recently.
Both revisions of the Mac Pro are fantastic machines. I know that there are some users out there that can never have too much power, but both revisions have been able to handle everything I've thrown at them, and now that the software is stable they have proven themselves to be rock-solid machines.
Likewise, I purchased another 30" Cinema HD Display recently and I'm absolutely delighted with it. All the issues with the earlier examples have been ironed out, and again it's a rock-solid offering for the pro market.
I am however concerned that one of Apples most recent pro offerings, the MacBook Pro, introduces some features that are unquestionably un-pro.
A few of us have been saying for a while now that we expect Apple to discontinue the current family of aluminium Cinema Displays and replace it with two ranges ? one appealing to the consumer market, and one appealing to professionals.
I think when the 24" LED Cinema Display was launched, a lot of people (myself included) assumed that the new 24" panel was a straight replacement for the discontinued 23" panel. Perhaps in hindsight that isn't the case. After all, nowhere on Apples website does it say that the new 24" LED Cinema Display is a professional product? Indeed it is touted as the a must-have MacBook 'accessory'.
Perhaps the 24" LED Cinema Display is simply the first product to be announced in the consumer family? The inclusion of the glossy display, speakers, MagSafe adaptor and iSight camera might suggest this. 'Cinema Display' is also more suited to a consumer product in my opinion.
So do you think Apple is about to launch a second family of 'Studio Displays' aimed at the professional market?
It would be nice to see Apple have 2 different display lineups. One called studio displays (consumer), the other called cinema or pro displays (professional). The studio displays could be like the 24" LED with the iSight cam, speakers, USB 2 Hub on it. Maybe even drop the price down to say $699. Make a 20" Studio for $499. Then have a 24" Pro Display (matte) and a 30" Pro Display (matte). The pro line up could be both Mini-display and DVI (for backwards compatibility to older Macs).
However these days I think Apple is catering more toward consumers. The bulk of its sales are starting to be regular consumers and Apple doesn't have to depend on creative professionals for sales anymore. I think you can see this in Apple's product lines, especially its updated product lines. So while it would be nice for Apple to have 2 display lineups, I don't think it will happen. Apple's lineup has always been simple and small and I think they want to keep it that way, especially in this economy. The more offerings you have, the more expensive your operating costs are. In this economy the expenses may outweigh the potential extra income.
One noted photographer declared the MacBook Pros unacceptable because of the shiny screen.
Is this a new episode of "Steve Knows Best"?
I was at a meeting a few days ago where several people were grousing about the lack of Apple monitors to go with their intended purchases (they needed to purchase both items on one invoice for Applecare purposes).
This is one rather glaring example of Apple's unfortunate trend of not keeping the hardware up to date.
What is going on with Apple management? It seems as though they have lost their way.
I don't think Apple's management has lost its way. I think Apple's strategies have changed from where they were 10yrs ago. Apple is no longer catering to creative professionals because it doesn't need to in order to get sales like it did 10yrs ago. Apple is a different company. It can now focus its efforts on consumers which I think its doing. Like I just said in the previous posts, you can see this in their current product offerings. They're more consumer oriented. They're giving you what the general public needs, not what creative pros need.
Perhaps if enough people buy Apple towers with 3rd party displays (non-Apple branded) Apple will sit up and take notice. Maybe not...maybe it just doesn't give a shit about the professional market anymore. A shift in strategy.
Maybe the have, but decided that they aren't willing to compete with professional 3rd-party displays in the future.
That very well could be. Or like I said, maybe Apple sees it doesn't need the creative market to survive anymore. It's focusing its efforts on other things, consumer Macs, iPhones, iPods, iTunes Store, etc. They simply may not give a shit about creative professionals anymore. Yes, that may piss some people off, but Apple is a different company than it was 10yrs ago. Its moved on to bigger and better things and some people just can't face that. If Apple ran its company like it did 10yrs ago it wouldn't be where it is today.
Maybe the have, but decided that they aren't willing to compete with professional 3rd-party displays in the future.
Is Apple even capable of competing at all?
I have begun to wonder about this as their product development has slipped.
I believe that a lot of people would like the opportunity to use the OS they are used to and buy hardware from someone who actually wants to meet their needs. (Yea, this is "heresy', but Apple needs to wake up and smell the coffee.)
One noted photographer declared the MacBook Pros unacceptable because of the shiny screen.
And I've heard another noted photographer say that the new displays were the best he's used.
I'm not really that happy about the shiny screens, but this isn't getting anywhere. I actually liked the non-glass glossy displays as those had a more prominent anti-glare coating, the glass ones don't seem to have it so much.
Apple should continue to offer a choice between a glossy or matte finish on their notebooks and their desktop displays. The fact that they are trending away from that is scaring me a little.
And I've heard another noted photographer say that the new displays were the best he's used.
I'm not really that happy about the shiny screens, but this isn't getting anywhere. I actually liked the non-glass glossy displays as those had a more prominent anti-glare coating, the glass ones don't seem to have it so much.
Surprisingly, the two opinions are not, necessarily, inconsistent with each other.
The ability to use the MacBook Pro "out in the field" is largely dependent upon the non-glare characteristics. That is where the "unacceptable" rating came from.
Even with various coatings, a screen that does not have a matte finish is at a distinct disadvantage in my view, and apparently that of many others. The dissatisfaction with such screens is not limited to the Apple crowd either. It is just that you have little, if any, choice the way that Apple is headed.
Even with various coatings, a screen that does not have a matte finish is at a distinct disadvantage in my view, and apparently that of many others. The dissatisfaction with such screens is not limited to the Apple crowd either. It is just that you have little, if any, the way that Apple is headed.
It depends on the antiglare coating. Matte coatings diffuses all incoming light, if you have a lot of light, such as out in the sun, it's just going to wash out the entire display. A smooth, strong antiglare coating will not wash out nearly as much. I've not seen a good strong coating used on notebook displays though, but I have on some camcorders and digital cameras.
I have begun to wonder about this as their product development has slipped.
I believe that a lot of people would like the opportunity to use the OS they are used to and buy hardware from someone who actually wants to meet their needs. (Yea, this is "heresy', but Apple needs to wake up and smell the coffee.)
Does Apple even care enough anymore to try and compete? Thats the real question. If Apple wanted to compete they easily could. Its not like Apple forgot how to do things.
I don't think the lack of a good Apple display makes people look elsewhere for a computer. A lot of people just upgrade the tower they have and keep their existing display.
We can all whine and complain until were blue in the face about the matte vs glossy. Apple is going to do what it wants and you'll either have to live with it, or go elsewhere.
...So do you think Apple is about to launch a second family of 'Studio Displays' aimed at the professional market?
That's looking less and less likely. Just like they got out of high-end Pro RAID, they're getting out of high-end Pro displays... by the look of things.
That's looking less and less likely. Just like they got out of high-end Pro RAID, they're getting out of high-end Pro displays... by the look of things.
I guess the business users have always been driven by value for money.
There's probably more money to be made from selling luxury play-things like the MacBook Air to the kind of consumers that have been willing to pay extra for black-coloured MacBooks in the past.
We may not be far away from the day where Apples entire desktop line-up is the iMac family ? no Mac minis or Mac Pros! The thought of that sends a shiver up my spine but lets face it, the majority of Apples recent announcements haven't exactly bode well for pro users.
About the only thing that does bode well for a future full of powerful multi-core towers is Snow Leopard's Grand Central feature.
Possibly, but I think the Mac Pro will be around for another 3 years at least. The Mac Mini will be hidden in a corner and beaten during this time. Kinda like being sent to an Apple Guantanamo for hardware that doesn't step in line.
Possibly, but I think the Mac Pro will be around for another 3 years at least. The Mac Mini will be hidden in a corner and beaten during this time. Kinda like being sent to an Apple Guantanamo for hardware that doesn't step in line.
If that is the way things go, Apple should sell the OS to Intel (which would presumably take most of the OS people with it) and then just play around with "gadgets", which seems to be the current focus.
Comments
When selecting a Mac Pro, not just in the US, globally, an Apple Display is a simple, convenient and quality display to go with it.
Yes Mac Pros will continue to be sold. But as Apple already admitted Apple's revenue/profit from the Pro market is already starting to be reduced.
Perhaps I shouldn't have been so blunt, but I'm not the biggest complainer on this thread (there was a guy that used CAPITALISED words a lot) about how Apple is pretty much giving the Pro market the finger.
Goodbye Pro market.
Yeah because Apple FORCES you to buy an Apple Display when you buy a Mac....
Ignorance is bliss.
...I was at a meeting a few days ago where several people were grousing about the lack of Apple monitors to go with their intended purchases (they needed to purchase both items on one invoice for Applecare purposes).
This is one rather glaring example of Apple's unfortunate trend of not keeping the hardware up to date.
What is going on with Apple management? It seems as though they have lost their way.
Yes, I'm not saying Apple's Pro market is totally dead. But something at Apple management, I'm afraid, probably due to Steve's health, is starting to go off on somewhat of a tangent since the great success of the iPhone 3G...
Both revisions of the Mac Pro are fantastic machines. I know that there are some users out there that can never have too much power, but both revisions have been able to handle everything I've thrown at them, and now that the software is stable they have proven themselves to be rock-solid machines.
Likewise, I purchased another 30" Cinema HD Display recently and I'm absolutely delighted with it. All the issues with the earlier examples have been ironed out, and again it's a rock-solid offering for the pro market.
I am however concerned that one of Apples most recent pro offerings, the MacBook Pro, introduces some features that are unquestionably un-pro.
I think when the 24" LED Cinema Display was launched, a lot of people (myself included) assumed that the new 24" panel was a straight replacement for the discontinued 23" panel. Perhaps in hindsight that isn't the case. After all, nowhere on Apples website does it say that the new 24" LED Cinema Display is a professional product? Indeed it is touted as the a must-have MacBook 'accessory'.
Perhaps the 24" LED Cinema Display is simply the first product to be announced in the consumer family? The inclusion of the glossy display, speakers, MagSafe adaptor and iSight camera might suggest this. 'Cinema Display' is also more suited to a consumer product in my opinion.
So do you think Apple is about to launch a second family of 'Studio Displays' aimed at the professional market?
However these days I think Apple is catering more toward consumers. The bulk of its sales are starting to be regular consumers and Apple doesn't have to depend on creative professionals for sales anymore. I think you can see this in Apple's product lines, especially its updated product lines. So while it would be nice for Apple to have 2 display lineups, I don't think it will happen. Apple's lineup has always been simple and small and I think they want to keep it that way, especially in this economy. The more offerings you have, the more expensive your operating costs are. In this economy the expenses may outweigh the potential extra income.
???
Matte screens are a big deal.
One noted photographer declared the MacBook Pros unacceptable because of the shiny screen.
Is this a new episode of "Steve Knows Best"?
I was at a meeting a few days ago where several people were grousing about the lack of Apple monitors to go with their intended purchases (they needed to purchase both items on one invoice for Applecare purposes).
This is one rather glaring example of Apple's unfortunate trend of not keeping the hardware up to date.
What is going on with Apple management? It seems as though they have lost their way.
I don't think Apple's management has lost its way. I think Apple's strategies have changed from where they were 10yrs ago. Apple is no longer catering to creative professionals because it doesn't need to in order to get sales like it did 10yrs ago. Apple is a different company. It can now focus its efforts on consumers which I think its doing. Like I just said in the previous posts, you can see this in their current product offerings. They're more consumer oriented. They're giving you what the general public needs, not what creative pros need.
Perhaps if enough people buy Apple towers with 3rd party displays (non-Apple branded) Apple will sit up and take notice. Maybe not...maybe it just doesn't give a shit about the professional market anymore. A shift in strategy.
Perhaps if enough people buy Apple towers with 3rd party displays (non-Apple branded) Apple will sit up and take notice.
Maybe the have, but decided that they aren't willing to compete with professional 3rd-party displays in the future.
Maybe the have, but decided that they aren't willing to compete with professional 3rd-party displays in the future.
That very well could be. Or like I said, maybe Apple sees it doesn't need the creative market to survive anymore. It's focusing its efforts on other things, consumer Macs, iPhones, iPods, iTunes Store, etc. They simply may not give a shit about creative professionals anymore. Yes, that may piss some people off, but Apple is a different company than it was 10yrs ago. Its moved on to bigger and better things and some people just can't face that. If Apple ran its company like it did 10yrs ago it wouldn't be where it is today.
Maybe the have, but decided that they aren't willing to compete with professional 3rd-party displays in the future.
Is Apple even capable of competing at all?
I have begun to wonder about this as their product development has slipped.
I believe that a lot of people would like the opportunity to use the OS they are used to and buy hardware from someone who actually wants to meet their needs. (Yea, this is "heresy', but Apple needs to wake up and smell the coffee.)
???
Matte screens are a big deal.
One noted photographer declared the MacBook Pros unacceptable because of the shiny screen.
And I've heard another noted photographer say that the new displays were the best he's used.
I'm not really that happy about the shiny screens, but this isn't getting anywhere. I actually liked the non-glass glossy displays as those had a more prominent anti-glare coating, the glass ones don't seem to have it so much.
And I've heard another noted photographer say that the new displays were the best he's used.
I'm not really that happy about the shiny screens, but this isn't getting anywhere. I actually liked the non-glass glossy displays as those had a more prominent anti-glare coating, the glass ones don't seem to have it so much.
Surprisingly, the two opinions are not, necessarily, inconsistent with each other.
The ability to use the MacBook Pro "out in the field" is largely dependent upon the non-glare characteristics. That is where the "unacceptable" rating came from.
Even with various coatings, a screen that does not have a matte finish is at a distinct disadvantage in my view, and apparently that of many others. The dissatisfaction with such screens is not limited to the Apple crowd either. It is just that you have little, if any, choice the way that Apple is headed.
Cheers
Even with various coatings, a screen that does not have a matte finish is at a distinct disadvantage in my view, and apparently that of many others. The dissatisfaction with such screens is not limited to the Apple crowd either. It is just that you have little, if any, the way that Apple is headed.
It depends on the antiglare coating. Matte coatings diffuses all incoming light, if you have a lot of light, such as out in the sun, it's just going to wash out the entire display. A smooth, strong antiglare coating will not wash out nearly as much. I've not seen a good strong coating used on notebook displays though, but I have on some camcorders and digital cameras.
Is Apple even capable of competing at all?
I have begun to wonder about this as their product development has slipped.
I believe that a lot of people would like the opportunity to use the OS they are used to and buy hardware from someone who actually wants to meet their needs. (Yea, this is "heresy', but Apple needs to wake up and smell the coffee.)
Does Apple even care enough anymore to try and compete? Thats the real question. If Apple wanted to compete they easily could. Its not like Apple forgot how to do things.
I don't think the lack of a good Apple display makes people look elsewhere for a computer. A lot of people just upgrade the tower they have and keep their existing display.
We can all whine and complain until were blue in the face about the matte vs glossy. Apple is going to do what it wants and you'll either have to live with it, or go elsewhere.
...So do you think Apple is about to launch a second family of 'Studio Displays' aimed at the professional market?
That's looking less and less likely. Just like they got out of high-end Pro RAID, they're getting out of high-end Pro displays... by the look of things.
That's looking less and less likely. Just like they got out of high-end Pro RAID, they're getting out of high-end Pro displays... by the look of things.
Which is a worry!
There's probably more money to be made from selling luxury play-things like the MacBook Air to the kind of consumers that have been willing to pay extra for black-coloured MacBooks in the past.
We may not be far away from the day where Apples entire desktop line-up is the iMac family ? no Mac minis or Mac Pros! The thought of that sends a shiver up my spine but lets face it, the majority of Apples recent announcements haven't exactly bode well for pro users.
About the only thing that does bode well for a future full of powerful multi-core towers is Snow Leopard's Grand Central feature.
Could this be the future?
Gulp!
Could this be the future?
Gulp!
Possibly, but I think the Mac Pro will be around for another 3 years at least. The Mac Mini will be hidden in a corner and beaten during this time. Kinda like being sent to an Apple Guantanamo for hardware that doesn't step in line.
If that is the way things go, Apple should sell the OS to Intel (which would presumably take most of the OS people with it) and then just play around with "gadgets", which seems to be the current focus.