Seriously, the only thing that apple has is the Mac Mini which is overpriced. Apple needs a netbook sooner or later. Or Windows 7 will kick their @#%() with its cheap cost.
From a technical standpoint no that Dell is still not exactltly the same as the Mac mini.
The Dell uses an older and far slower graphics chip. Has an 800 front side bus, the mini uses a 1066 front side bus. The Dell uses older 667MHz DDR2 memory while the mini uses newer 1066MHz DDR3 memory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by travisc77
Would a Dell Studio Hybrid be sff? Not exactly the same specs, but at $449 (25% less) it's pretty comparable.
There are three possible definitions of the term "NetBook":
1. A laptop computer reduced in weight and dimensions to be optimally portable while retaining functionality. This is the MacBook Air solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting optical drive, while retaining large screen and large keyboard. It is not low-cost, but is in a similar price range to similar devices from Sony and Dell.
2. A laptop computer reduced in weight, dimensions and specifications to be both portable and low cost. This is the typical "netbook" solution. It reduces weight, dimensions and cost by omitting optical drive, reducing screen and keyboard size and lowering overall quality. It started out as a Linux device as a cost-saving solution, but recently managed to achieve similar results with Windows OS.
3. A portable device optimised for internet connectivity. This is the iPod touch and iPhone solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting all but the most essential hardware, while using a powerful OS and a touch screen to achieve optimal functionality. When mobile network operators costs and subsidies are removed from the equation, an iPod touch at $230 costs less than any of the typical "netbook" solutions. It has better quality and functionality, but a lower screen size.
Sales figures suggest that laptop-style netbooks have slightly less than 20% of the total laptop market by volume. About 10 manufacturers are selling more than 20 netbook models, so each model has about 1% market share at best. Apple's MacBooks have over 30% of this market by sales which are clearly more profitable. Apple's iPhone and iPods sell many times these numbers compared to laptops.
Clearly, there is a huge opportunity for Apple to offer a device similar to the iPod touch but with a bigger screen, provided it can find a way to combine this with offering the greatest value from its combination of iTunes music, videos and apps, especially games. How such a device would work will also depend on whether it comes with a service plan, like the iPhone, or with only WiFi, such as the iPod touch.
Here in Japan, netbooks (plus dongle) are being offered at zero cost by mobile operators in exchange for a two-year sign up, just as the iPhone is. Would people sign on to a reporter's notebook sized Apple iPod touch style device on similar terms? Of course they would. Would it help if they only needed to pay for one contract and could use both devices for not much more than the cost of one? Could Apple deliver this?
There are three possible definitions of the term "NetBook":
1. A laptop computer reduced in weight and dimensions to be optimally portable while retaining functionality. This is the MacBook Air solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting optical drive, while retaining large screen and large keyboard. It is not low-cost, but is in a similar price range to similar devices from Sony and Dell.
2. A laptop computer reduced in weight, dimensions and specifications to be both portable and low cost. This is the typical "netbook" solution. It reduces weight, dimensions and cost by omitting optical drive, reducing screen and keyboard size and lowering overall quality. It started out as a Linux device as a cost-saving solution, but recently managed to achieve similar results with Windows OS.
3. A portable device optimised for internet connectivity. This is the iPod touch and iPhone solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting all but the most essential hardware, while using a powerful OS and a touch screen to achieve optimal functionality. When mobile network operators costs and subsidies are removed from the equation, an iPod touch at $230 costs less than any of the typical "netbook" solutions. It has better quality and functionality, but a lower screen size.
Sales figures suggest that laptop-style netbooks have slightly less than 20% of the total laptop market by volume. About 10 manufacturers are selling more than 20 netbook models, so each model has about 1% market share at best. Apple's MacBooks have over 30% of this market by sales which are clearly more profitable. Apple's iPhone and iPods sell many times these numbers compared to laptops.
Clearly, there is a huge opportunity for Apple to offer a device similar to the iPod touch but with a bigger screen, provided it can find a way to combine this with offering the greatest value from its combination of iTunes music, videos and apps, especially games. How such a device would work will also depend on whether it comes with a service plan, like the iPhone, or with only WiFi, such as the iPod touch.
Here in Japan, netbooks (plus dongle) are being offered at zero cost by mobile operators in exchange for a two-year sign up, just as the iPhone is. Would people sign on to a reporter's notebook sized Apple iPod touch style device on similar terms? Of course they would. Would it help if they only needed to pay for one contract and could use both devices for not much more than the cost of one? Could Apple deliver this?
- Genuine Windows Vista® Home Basic Service Pack 1
- Intel® Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100
Closer, but there are some really aspects to the system. You choose a Pentium with 1MB L2 over a C2D with 3MB L2. I think that Pentium cost about $40. Then you haven't upgraded to the best version of Windows Vista, which is more comparable to Mac OS X, though that would be price prohibitive for that machine and not even run all the PCU intensive bells and whistles offered. The IGP in the new Mac Mini is considerably better than the X3100, though in fairness the X3100 is better than the GM950 that was available in the Mini just a week ago.
- Genuine Windows Vista® Home Basic Service Pack 1
- No Monitor (System includes DVI and HDMI ports. VGA is not supported)
- Slot Load CD / DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive)
- 2GB1 Shared Dual Channel DDR2 at 667MHz (2 DIMM)
- 160GB2 SATA Hard Drive (5400RPM)
- Intel® Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100
- Integrated Stereo Audio with 5.1ch digital output (S/P DIF)
- 1Yr Ltd Hardware Warranty,3 InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis4
Comparable? Hardly. A GMA X3100 vs. an Nvidia 9400, for one thing. Then you are talking about Vista Home Basic, the crummy version. The mini comes with Leopard and iLife '09. The Mini also has much faster RAM (1066MHz DDR3), which is twice as significant when talking about machines with shared video memory.
A lot to lose for 150 bucks. And then your higher electric bill will take the $150 away too, over a couple of years.
IMHO, The mini is an excellent value for the money. Probably the best price/performace ratio of the whole line, except perhaps for the unibody MacBooks.
Maybe. But I have a first generation iPhone. It cost $599. For everybody waiting for a bigger tablet, thinking that it'll cost $600, please keep that in mind. My iPhone cost $600. The new ones reportedly still do, only their price has been buried beneath the AT&T subsidy.
If you're wanting a tablet with a bigger screen at the same price point, it'll have to be at the expense of some other features, and I can't imagine what that would be. If anything, we'll want the bigger screen PLUS a lot of features. How is it gonna come in at $600. (And of course, if it ever did, there would be an outcry because the week before a rumor would spread that it was going to be $400, but that's another issue).
If it is a phone, it will be subsidized. If it's not also a phone, then the proper comparison is to the iPod touch which is $229/299/399. The iPod touch launch was almost two years ago; the CPU got a slight boost last year and a few minor features. Since then, the ARM chips have moved to its next generation (at about the same cost), plus Apple has PA Semi adding its tweaks. Plus, it may have a low-power Nvidia GPU, and Snow Leopard tweaks to use it. Also, flash memory has come down in price (around 50% less).
So compared to iPod touch, this "tablet" has a much larger touch screen display, a GPU, and a larger battery. I could see it at $599.
I understand what you are saying, but I think anything much larger than 9" would be too difficult to hold and use with only two hands. It should be small enough to be able to: A) hold on the sides with both hands and type on the onscreen keyboard with your thumbs, and hold in one hand with enough leverage (hold it steady) to be able to do gestures with the other hand. If you make it so big that I need to set it down to use it, I might as well just use a laptop.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I'll bet that a midget MacBook Air is most definitely NOT coming.
It will be a pad. A bluetooth physical keyboard might be included or be optional. It won't run full-blown OS/X.
It won't be a clamshell, because clamshells are not good for hand-held use. There has to be a way to get the keyboard completely out of the way, or detached, and to use the device in either portrait or landscape mode.
Just a thought, but if you have a rugged shell front cover that slides off, reverse slides in the back you can carry it around and use it without fear of damage. It's not a phone so a slide locking [magnetically locking] case with grooves on the side could be cool.
Oh great. Apple's stock price is going to go up 5% on this news today. Then in a few days when it proves to be false, the stock will drop 10% in disappointment.
The Dow is up 4.5% and the NASDAQ up 6% as of this writing. Apple and Amazon up 6%, MS up 7% and RiM up 9%.
This idea that Apple is going to sell a 7-9-inch netbook for $599 is a joke.
3.5" iPhone = $599 ($199 + $400 from AT&T)
13" MBA = $1799
There is NO WAY that a 7-9-inch Apple branded device will sell for the same amount they sell the iPhone for. Not a chance.
With the MBA, Apple have proven that portability has it's price.
Not to be anal, but IF Apple were to make a 7-9 inch netbook/UMPC the price of their current lineup which would need to be extrapolated from is not the iPhone but the iPod Touch. The iPhone has components in it that this new machine would not need, unless Apple is going to give it 3G access, which I highly doubt.
So, what you would be looking at is
3.5" iPod Touch with 32GB $375
Now consider also that if they make this fabled "netbook" have a 7-9 inch screen then it would likely have more room for components, thus the actual cost could remain close to the same for the "computer" parts while increasing in power simply because of the larger size. As for the screen, it is likely that the 7-9 inch screen may not even cost much more than the 3.5 inch screen.
So, given these things. I could see Apple selling a 7-9 inch netbook/UMPC for around $500-$600.
Of course, I wouldn't put money on this fabled device arriving any time soon, so it all might be moot.
This idea that Apple is going to sell a 7-9-inch netbook for $599 is a joke.
3.5" iPhone = $599 ($199 + $400 from AT&T)
13" MBA = $1799
There is NO WAY that a 7-9-inch Apple branded device will sell for the same amount they sell the iPhone for. Not a chance.
With the MBA, Apple have proven that portability has it's price.
3.5" 8GB iPod touch = $229 (no subsidy)
Alas, there's a difference in price between an Intel Core 2 Duo (including all its supporting chips) and an ARM-based chip (and its support). There's also a lot fewer chips/circuitry/connectors in iPod touch than in MBA.
So compared to iPod touch, this "tablet" has a much larger touch screen display, a GPU, and a larger battery. I could see it at $599.
Your argument is reasonable, but you rarely go wrong with Apple by assuming a price on the high end of whatever range you expect. My guess is at least $699 or higher, for a 7" touch device similar to a large iPod Touch.
I really like that idea, and I think Apple could do a really good job with designing the "dock/keyboard" feature...
(this is my first post, but I've been browsing here for ages)
I cannot believe no one has commented on this…
I watch the video that is linked, I think of the claims of an "application unknown" touchscreen being made for Apple, and I imagine something that blends the video device (but with a cleaner screen to keyboard connection) with this old mockup…
And just maybe a new feature in the 24" LED Cinema Display…?!?
Seriously though, watch the linked video, and think to yourself, "What Would Apple Do?"…
Don't forget that the $600 iPhone, while not traditionally subsidized, had profit sharing backend subsidy.
Apple might sell such a device for $900 and then sell it through AT&T with a $60/month data plan with a 24-month contract. This is how they et al. currently sell their $300 3G cards to consumers.
It will cost more because it will probably need a much stronger battery to drive that screen and CPU. Starting at $1,099- $999 would compete with the white iBook. This will kill the Kindle, netbooks and the MBA- thank god.
Comments
Seriously, the only thing that apple has is the Mac Mini which is overpriced. Apple needs a netbook sooner or later. Or Windows 7 will kick their @#%() with its cheap cost.
SPAM
The Dell uses an older and far slower graphics chip. Has an 800 front side bus, the mini uses a 1066 front side bus. The Dell uses older 667MHz DDR2 memory while the mini uses newer 1066MHz DDR3 memory.
Would a Dell Studio Hybrid be sff? Not exactly the same specs, but at $449 (25% less) it's pretty comparable.
or did someone dig up those eMates?
1. A laptop computer reduced in weight and dimensions to be optimally portable while retaining functionality. This is the MacBook Air solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting optical drive, while retaining large screen and large keyboard. It is not low-cost, but is in a similar price range to similar devices from Sony and Dell.
2. A laptop computer reduced in weight, dimensions and specifications to be both portable and low cost. This is the typical "netbook" solution. It reduces weight, dimensions and cost by omitting optical drive, reducing screen and keyboard size and lowering overall quality. It started out as a Linux device as a cost-saving solution, but recently managed to achieve similar results with Windows OS.
3. A portable device optimised for internet connectivity. This is the iPod touch and iPhone solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting all but the most essential hardware, while using a powerful OS and a touch screen to achieve optimal functionality. When mobile network operators costs and subsidies are removed from the equation, an iPod touch at $230 costs less than any of the typical "netbook" solutions. It has better quality and functionality, but a lower screen size.
Sales figures suggest that laptop-style netbooks have slightly less than 20% of the total laptop market by volume. About 10 manufacturers are selling more than 20 netbook models, so each model has about 1% market share at best. Apple's MacBooks have over 30% of this market by sales which are clearly more profitable. Apple's iPhone and iPods sell many times these numbers compared to laptops.
Clearly, there is a huge opportunity for Apple to offer a device similar to the iPod touch but with a bigger screen, provided it can find a way to combine this with offering the greatest value from its combination of iTunes music, videos and apps, especially games. How such a device would work will also depend on whether it comes with a service plan, like the iPhone, or with only WiFi, such as the iPod touch.
Here in Japan, netbooks (plus dongle) are being offered at zero cost by mobile operators in exchange for a two-year sign up, just as the iPhone is. Would people sign on to a reporter's notebook sized Apple iPod touch style device on similar terms? Of course they would. Would it help if they only needed to pay for one contract and could use both devices for not much more than the cost of one? Could Apple deliver this?
1. A laptop computer reduced in weight and dimensions to be optimally portable while retaining functionality. This is the MacBook Air solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting optical drive, while retaining large screen and large keyboard. It is not low-cost, but is in a similar price range to similar devices from Sony and Dell.
2. A laptop computer reduced in weight, dimensions and specifications to be both portable and low cost. This is the typical "netbook" solution. It reduces weight, dimensions and cost by omitting optical drive, reducing screen and keyboard size and lowering overall quality. It started out as a Linux device as a cost-saving solution, but recently managed to achieve similar results with Windows OS.
3. A portable device optimised for internet connectivity. This is the iPod touch and iPhone solution. It reduces weight and dimensions by omitting all but the most essential hardware, while using a powerful OS and a touch screen to achieve optimal functionality. When mobile network operators costs and subsidies are removed from the equation, an iPod touch at $230 costs less than any of the typical "netbook" solutions. It has better quality and functionality, but a lower screen size.
Sales figures suggest that laptop-style netbooks have slightly less than 20% of the total laptop market by volume. About 10 manufacturers are selling more than 20 netbook models, so each model has about 1% market share at best. Apple's MacBooks have over 30% of this market by sales which are clearly more profitable. Apple's iPhone and iPods sell many times these numbers compared to laptops.
Clearly, there is a huge opportunity for Apple to offer a device similar to the iPod touch but with a bigger screen, provided it can find a way to combine this with offering the greatest value from its combination of iTunes music, videos and apps, especially games. How such a device would work will also depend on whether it comes with a service plan, like the iPhone, or with only WiFi, such as the iPod touch.
Here in Japan, netbooks (plus dongle) are being offered at zero cost by mobile operators in exchange for a two-year sign up, just as the iPhone is. Would people sign on to a reporter's notebook sized Apple iPod touch style device on similar terms? Of course they would. Would it help if they only needed to pay for one contract and could use both devices for not much more than the cost of one? Could Apple deliver this?
Would a Dell Studio Hybrid be sff? Not exactly the same specs, but at $449 (25% less) it's pretty comparable.
- Intel® Pentium? Dual Core T4200 (2.0GHz/800Mhz FSB/1MB cache)
- Genuine Windows Vista® Home Basic Service Pack 1
- Intel® Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100
Closer, but there are some really aspects to the system. You choose a Pentium with 1MB L2 over a C2D with 3MB L2. I think that Pentium cost about $40. Then you haven't upgraded to the best version of Windows Vista, which is more comparable to Mac OS X, though that would be price prohibitive for that machine and not even run all the PCU intensive bells and whistles offered. The IGP in the new Mac Mini is considerably better than the X3100, though in fairness the X3100 is better than the GM950 that was available in the Mini just a week ago.
Plus it will probably be used to justify the higher price point.
Yes I am being anal but what is the difference between 'price' and 'price point'?
"Not an apples to apples comparison.
A tower is not the same as a small form-factor (sff) PC (Mini is sff)
Go price a sff PC and you'll find it is more expensive than the Mini." <--DeanShu
Would a Dell Studio Hybrid be sff? Not exactly the same specs, but at $449 (25% less) it's pretty comparable.
- Intel® Pentium? Dual Core T4200 (2.0GHz/800Mhz FSB/1MB cache)
- Genuine Windows Vista® Home Basic Service Pack 1
- No Monitor (System includes DVI and HDMI ports. VGA is not supported)
- Slot Load CD / DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive)
- 2GB1 Shared Dual Channel DDR2 at 667MHz (2 DIMM)
- 160GB2 SATA Hard Drive (5400RPM)
- Intel® Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100
- Integrated Stereo Audio with 5.1ch digital output (S/P DIF)
- 1Yr Ltd Hardware Warranty,3 InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis4
Comparable? Hardly. A GMA X3100 vs. an Nvidia 9400, for one thing. Then you are talking about Vista Home Basic, the crummy version. The mini comes with Leopard and iLife '09. The Mini also has much faster RAM (1066MHz DDR3), which is twice as significant when talking about machines with shared video memory.
A lot to lose for 150 bucks. And then your higher electric bill will take the $150 away too, over a couple of years.
IMHO, The mini is an excellent value for the money. Probably the best price/performace ratio of the whole line, except perhaps for the unibody MacBooks.
Yes I am being anal but what is the difference between 'price' and 'price point'?
There's just one point of difference.
Maybe. But I have a first generation iPhone. It cost $599. For everybody waiting for a bigger tablet, thinking that it'll cost $600, please keep that in mind. My iPhone cost $600. The new ones reportedly still do, only their price has been buried beneath the AT&T subsidy.
If you're wanting a tablet with a bigger screen at the same price point, it'll have to be at the expense of some other features, and I can't imagine what that would be. If anything, we'll want the bigger screen PLUS a lot of features. How is it gonna come in at $600. (And of course, if it ever did, there would be an outcry because the week before a rumor would spread that it was going to be $400, but that's another issue).
If it is a phone, it will be subsidized. If it's not also a phone, then the proper comparison is to the iPod touch which is $229/299/399. The iPod touch launch was almost two years ago; the CPU got a slight boost last year and a few minor features. Since then, the ARM chips have moved to its next generation (at about the same cost), plus Apple has PA Semi adding its tweaks. Plus, it may have a low-power Nvidia GPU, and Snow Leopard tweaks to use it. Also, flash memory has come down in price (around 50% less).
So compared to iPod touch, this "tablet" has a much larger touch screen display, a GPU, and a larger battery. I could see it at $599.
Yes I am being anal but what is the difference between 'price' and 'price point'?
price point
noun
? a point on a scale of possible prices at which something might be marketed.
price
noun
? the amount of money expected, required, or given in payment for something :
I understand what you are saying, but I think anything much larger than 9" would be too difficult to hold and use with only two hands. It should be small enough to be able to: A) hold on the sides with both hands and type on the onscreen keyboard with your thumbs, and
Did you see Elgan's prediction at Computerworld?
http://blogs.computerworld.com/apple...folding_iphone
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I'll bet that a midget MacBook Air is most definitely NOT coming.
It will be a pad. A bluetooth physical keyboard might be included or be optional. It won't run full-blown OS/X.
It won't be a clamshell, because clamshells are not good for hand-held use. There has to be a way to get the keyboard completely out of the way, or detached, and to use the device in either portrait or landscape mode.
Just a thought, but if you have a rugged shell front cover that slides off, reverse slides in the back you can carry it around and use it without fear of damage. It's not a phone so a slide locking [magnetically locking] case with grooves on the side could be cool.
Oh great. Apple's stock price is going to go up 5% on this news today. Then in a few days when it proves to be false, the stock will drop 10% in disappointment.
The Dow is up 4.5% and the NASDAQ up 6% as of this writing. Apple and Amazon up 6%, MS up 7% and RiM up 9%.
Well Teckstud, I actually agree with you..
This idea that Apple is going to sell a 7-9-inch netbook for $599 is a joke.
3.5" iPhone = $599 ($199 + $400 from AT&T)
13" MBA = $1799
There is NO WAY that a 7-9-inch Apple branded device will sell for the same amount they sell the iPhone for. Not a chance.
With the MBA, Apple have proven that portability has it's price.
Not to be anal, but IF Apple were to make a 7-9 inch netbook/UMPC the price of their current lineup which would need to be extrapolated from is not the iPhone but the iPod Touch. The iPhone has components in it that this new machine would not need, unless Apple is going to give it 3G access, which I highly doubt.
So, what you would be looking at is
3.5" iPod Touch with 32GB $375
Now consider also that if they make this fabled "netbook" have a 7-9 inch screen then it would likely have more room for components, thus the actual cost could remain close to the same for the "computer" parts while increasing in power simply because of the larger size. As for the screen, it is likely that the 7-9 inch screen may not even cost much more than the 3.5 inch screen.
So, given these things. I could see Apple selling a 7-9 inch netbook/UMPC for around $500-$600.
Of course, I wouldn't put money on this fabled device arriving any time soon, so it all might be moot.
Well Teckstud, I actually agree with you..
This idea that Apple is going to sell a 7-9-inch netbook for $599 is a joke.
3.5" iPhone = $599 ($199 + $400 from AT&T)
13" MBA = $1799
There is NO WAY that a 7-9-inch Apple branded device will sell for the same amount they sell the iPhone for. Not a chance.
With the MBA, Apple have proven that portability has it's price.
3.5" 8GB iPod touch = $229 (no subsidy)
Alas, there's a difference in price between an Intel Core 2 Duo (including all its supporting chips) and an ARM-based chip (and its support). There's also a lot fewer chips/circuitry/connectors in iPod touch than in MBA.
So compared to iPod touch, this "tablet" has a much larger touch screen display, a GPU, and a larger battery. I could see it at $599.
Your argument is reasonable, but you rarely go wrong with Apple by assuming a price on the high end of whatever range you expect. My guess is at least $699 or higher, for a 7" touch device similar to a large iPod Touch.
Why not something like this?
http://news.cnet.com/1606-2_3-50005371.html
I really like that idea, and I think Apple could do a really good job with designing the "dock/keyboard" feature...
(this is my first post, but I've been browsing here for ages)
I cannot believe no one has commented on this…
I watch the video that is linked, I think of the claims of an "application unknown" touchscreen being made for Apple, and I imagine something that blends the video device (but with a cleaner screen to keyboard connection) with this old mockup…
And just maybe a new feature in the 24" LED Cinema Display…?!?
Seriously though, watch the linked video, and think to yourself, "What Would Apple Do?"…
Don't forget that the $600 iPhone, while not traditionally subsidized, had profit sharing backend subsidy.
Apple might sell such a device for $900 and then sell it through AT&T with a $60/month data plan with a 24-month contract. This is how they et al. currently sell their $300 3G cards to consumers.
It will cost more because it will probably need a much stronger battery to drive that screen and CPU. Starting at $1,099- $999 would compete with the white iBook. This will kill the Kindle, netbooks and the MBA- thank god.