What are you talking about? On most carriers MMS is included with the data plan. It is only in bizarro AT&T/iPhone world where you end up paying for both as add-ons. I can choose to pay for messaging minus data or data which includes messaging. There is no weird combo you mention where you get data, but no messaging for the rest of us. For us it isn't an "or" choice.
Which Verizon are YOU on?
The only Verizon I can get charges me for MMS separately from the data plan (which went from optional to mandatory with the signing of the contract)
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman
Most regular cell phones and even most features phones do not have browser advanced enough to allow use of these services and even the iPhone cannot use them through a browser without flash. The claim (hung out there as you seem to do) was that Verizon keeps things off their network so they really don't have much data to move.
It's not that they keep things off their network - it's that they keep things off the phones on their network. The simple-to-grasp reason is that way, they can (theoretically) drive sales through their captive-crap network.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman
The point is not only do they not keep it off, they provide a gateway to get the media out there. Smartphones that support flash are in no form or fashion prevented from accessing the services and sites you mentioned. The "apps" or wrappers you talk about Apple "allowing" are nothing more than wrappers to get around the limitations of the iPhone with regard to flash. It is wrong and unless you provide a source to prove it right, do not conflate the two again.
Since you're the arbiter of "wrong" AND a conflation instructor, you can certainly handle the falsification yourself: name the programs I can add to my Centro that will provide me with the same access to free net services that iPhone users have, and It'll be game set & match for you.
However, don't include VCAST, as they are all "premium" services - meaning extra cost for reduced function.
I notice you also fail to mention that Verizon charges MORE per month than ATT for the same (actually slightly-improved) voice/data package; you fail to mention the fact that you can't copy anything to or from your phone without going through a varety of badly-designed & executed "services" intended not to provided customers with options but to trap them within the Verizon 'network'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman
If by efficient you mean the iPhone can handle it then you are right. However this is all VCast and other services are doing for a plethora of other phones. I can go through VCAST and get shows from CBS, NBC, and ABC. They could offer their own third party apps but since Verizon provides the services, they just line up and take advantage of it.
I'm glad you like Verizon. I was sure there must be people who are charmed and excited by their offerings, and though I never expected to encounter one, I'm a bit surprised. Since you & VCAST were made for each other, I find it odd that you're posting about a phone & service that is so completely NOT VERIZON.
In June, I shall buy my way out of my Verizon contract (my daughter is graduating from college & will be taking on her own phone bill) and I shall get a new iPhone. I will do so serene in the knowledge that ATT is not as bad FOR ME as Verizon.
You haven't stated any proven facts there. Only an opinion that is so vague as to be useless.
No,no. My original post did not state accurate facts, it rather showed my emotions. My response to your remark was closer to being accurate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
You can use any smilies you want to here, in an attempt to make yourself think that you've won something, but it doesn't change what you've said.
I'm here not to win something. Please trust, that's quite easy, if you know what I mean. I'm here to type certain quantity of my "posts of the day". Consider them if you find them being of some interest, skip them otherwise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
What you've NOW said, is very different from what you said before, in response to Sol's statement, both of which I'll include here, capitalizing the incorrect statement, which you see to want to forget you made:
... ALL PHONES ARE 3G NOW ...
It's not always too hard to pretend you didn't say something when it's just spoken. But when it's in a public forum, you can't act as though what's in print isn't there.
I quoted that line the first time, and find it hard to understand how you are denying it.
Just say "Oops! I made a mistake.", and go on from there.
Why? I did say what I said.
Firstly, it's not that obvious to me I make a big mistake. Though, I agree, my original post is an exaggeration to some extent.
I have now very accurate and perfectly up-to-date statistics before my eyes. The market shares of all cellphone models. The calculation of exact total percentage of 3G compliant phones is still quite a work, but I can sum all those percents, if you want me to. It will take time, sure. Random digs in that list always reveal 3G-compliant responses. So, I still believe even my first statement was as close to the truth, as its negation.
Secondly, I believe both my statements are very well glued one to another by saying "All major phone makes have now 3G-compliant models, one sees so many 3G-compliant phones around, that one has the impression of very high (quite close to 100%) level of presence of those devices and one can rightfully express the surprise and the clear dislike towards the fact carriers still have issues with 3G and the coverage is far from being perfect".
No,no. My original post did not state accurate facts, it rather showed my emotions. My response to your remark was closer to being accurate.
I'm here not to win something. Please trust, that's quite easy, if you know what I mean. I'm here to type certain quantity of my "posts of the day". Consider them if you find them being of some interest, skip them otherwise.
Why? I did say what I said.
Firstly, it's not that obvious to me I make a big mistake. Though, I agree, my original post is an exaggeration to some extent.
I have now very accurate and perfectly up-to-date statistics before my eyes. The market shares of all cellphone models. The calculation of exact total percentage of 3G compliant phones is still quite a work, but I can sum all those percents, if you want me to. It will take time, sure. Random digs in that list always reveal 3G-compliant responses. So, I still believe even my first statement was as close to the truth, as its negation is.
Secondly, I believe both my statements are very well glued one to another by saying "All major phone makes have now 3G-compliant models, one sees so many 3G-compliant phones around, that one has the impression of very high (quite close to 100%) level of presence of those devices and one can rightfully express the surprise and the clear dislike towards the fact carriers still have issues with 3G and the coverage is far from being perfect".
Ivan, we don't need all the stats from around the world, or even from here in the USA.
I think we can all acknowledge that there are many cells with 3G, and there are many without.
I was just objecting to your contention in that post, that ALL cells had 3G.
You're now saying that you didn't really mean that, and that's fine.
Ivan, we don't need all the stats from around the world, or even from here in the USA.
I think we can all acknowledge that there are many cells with 3G, and there are many without.
Absolutely. Khm... I believe oppositely, the stats, viewed as is, are quite interesting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
I was just objecting to your contention in that post, that ALL cells had 3G.
You're now saying that you didn't really mean that, and that's fine.
So we can consider the issue as closed.
Mea culpa. I knew exactly, what my thoughts were, when I wrote the post, readers did not. "ALL" stood for rather fervent exclamation, having tried to draw the attention to the fact, there are already way too many 3G handsets to be neglected by carriers. "ALL" certainly did not mean "every last phone".
I cannot believe you're using the completely craptastic V-Cast mess as a contradiction of the point; I think you're closer to making his point than supporting your own.
Then you have missed the point completely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt. Obvious
Which Verizon are YOU on?
The only Verizon I can get charges me for MMS separately from the data plan (which went from optional to mandatory with the signing of the contract)
It's not that they keep things off their network - it's that they keep things off the phones on their network. The simple-to-grasp reason is that way, they can (theoretically) drive sales through their captive-crap network.
The plans I see start on tiers with messaging being the lowest and you keep getting enticed to add a few more for another $10 progressively until you are at full data with VCast and VZNavigator. Tell me what plans you are referring to and I'll be happy to discuss them.
Quote:
Since you're the arbiter of "wrong" AND a conflation instructor, you can certainly handle the falsification yourself: name the programs I can add to my Centro that will provide me with the same access to free net services that iPhone users have, and It'll be game set & match for you.
However, don't include VCAST, as they are all "premium" services - meaning extra cost for reduced function.
I'm not completely familiar with every program for every smartphone platform. The point of contention was the claim that Verizon would somehow stop you from adding programs to your Palm and streaming the data from the network to your phone.
Is there a third party app you've tried to load or use on your phone that Verizon locked out or disabled? That is the question to be answered.
Quote:
I notice you also fail to mention that Verizon charges MORE per month than ATT for the same (actually slightly-improved) voice/data package; you fail to mention the fact that you can't copy anything to or from your phone without going through a varety of badly-designed & executed "services" intended not to provided customers with options but to trap them within the Verizon 'network'.
I'm not that concerned with the costs. A cheaper package that doesn't work means nothing to me. I'm a Mac user so I'll pay more for something that works right. If AT&T worked right, I'd own an iPhone. It doesn't so I don't. Additionally if someone is on a network that they consider not reliable and thus have to keep a house line, they spend much more than either of us.
Quote:
I'm glad you like Verizon. I was sure there must be people who are charmed and excited by their offerings, and though I never expected to encounter one, I'm a bit surprised. Since you & VCAST were made for each other, I find it odd that you're posting about a phone & service that is so completely NOT VERIZON.
In June, I shall buy my way out of my Verizon contract (my daughter is graduating from college & will be taking on her own phone bill) and I shall get a new iPhone. I will do so serene in the knowledge that ATT is not as bad FOR ME as Verizon.
Good luck and I wish you well with your choices. My choices are limited, not by Verizon or by Apple but by AT&T and their crap service out where I live. Verizon reminds me very much of Apple in that there is seldom a value sweet spot in their offerings. If you want something you will pay and there are no two ways around that. However they are also like Apple in that for me, they just work and do so very reliably.
Comments
What are you talking about? On most carriers MMS is included with the data plan. It is only in bizarro AT&T/iPhone world where you end up paying for both as add-ons. I can choose to pay for messaging minus data or data which includes messaging. There is no weird combo you mention where you get data, but no messaging for the rest of us. For us it isn't an "or" choice.
Which Verizon are YOU on?
The only Verizon I can get charges me for MMS separately from the data plan (which went from optional to mandatory with the signing of the contract)
Most regular cell phones and even most features phones do not have browser advanced enough to allow use of these services and even the iPhone cannot use them through a browser without flash. The claim (hung out there as you seem to do) was that Verizon keeps things off their network so they really don't have much data to move.
It's not that they keep things off their network - it's that they keep things off the phones on their network. The simple-to-grasp reason is that way, they can (theoretically) drive sales through their captive-crap network.
The point is not only do they not keep it off, they provide a gateway to get the media out there. Smartphones that support flash are in no form or fashion prevented from accessing the services and sites you mentioned. The "apps" or wrappers you talk about Apple "allowing" are nothing more than wrappers to get around the limitations of the iPhone with regard to flash. It is wrong and unless you provide a source to prove it right, do not conflate the two again.
Since you're the arbiter of "wrong" AND a conflation instructor, you can certainly handle the falsification yourself: name the programs I can add to my Centro that will provide me with the same access to free net services that iPhone users have, and It'll be game set & match for you.
However, don't include VCAST, as they are all "premium" services - meaning extra cost for reduced function.
I notice you also fail to mention that Verizon charges MORE per month than ATT for the same (actually slightly-improved) voice/data package; you fail to mention the fact that you can't copy anything to or from your phone without going through a varety of badly-designed & executed "services" intended not to provided customers with options but to trap them within the Verizon 'network'.
If by efficient you mean the iPhone can handle it then you are right. However this is all VCast and other services are doing for a plethora of other phones. I can go through VCAST and get shows from CBS, NBC, and ABC. They could offer their own third party apps but since Verizon provides the services, they just line up and take advantage of it.
I'm glad you like Verizon. I was sure there must be people who are charmed and excited by their offerings, and though I never expected to encounter one, I'm a bit surprised. Since you & VCAST were made for each other, I find it odd that you're posting about a phone & service that is so completely NOT VERIZON.
In June, I shall buy my way out of my Verizon contract (my daughter is graduating from college & will be taking on her own phone bill) and I shall get a new iPhone. I will do so serene in the knowledge that ATT is not as bad FOR ME as Verizon.
You haven't stated any proven facts there. Only an opinion that is so vague as to be useless.
No,no. My original post did not state accurate facts, it rather showed my emotions. My response to your remark was closer to being accurate.
You can use any smilies you want to here, in an attempt to make yourself think that you've won something, but it doesn't change what you've said.
I'm here not to win something. Please trust, that's quite easy, if you know what I mean. I'm here to type certain quantity of my "posts of the day". Consider them if you find them being of some interest, skip them otherwise.
What you've NOW said, is very different from what you said before, in response to Sol's statement, both of which I'll include here, capitalizing the incorrect statement, which you see to want to forget you made:
... ALL PHONES ARE 3G NOW ...
It's not always too hard to pretend you didn't say something when it's just spoken. But when it's in a public forum, you can't act as though what's in print isn't there.
I quoted that line the first time, and find it hard to understand how you are denying it.
Just say "Oops! I made a mistake.", and go on from there.
Why? I did say what I said.
Firstly, it's not that obvious to me I make a big mistake. Though, I agree, my original post is an exaggeration to some extent.
I have now very accurate and perfectly up-to-date statistics before my eyes. The market shares of all cellphone models. The calculation of exact total percentage of 3G compliant phones is still quite a work, but I can sum all those percents, if you want me to. It will take time, sure. Random digs in that list always reveal 3G-compliant responses. So, I still believe even my first statement was as close to the truth, as its negation.
Secondly, I believe both my statements are very well glued one to another by saying "All major phone makes have now 3G-compliant models, one sees so many 3G-compliant phones around, that one has the impression of very high (quite close to 100%) level of presence of those devices and one can rightfully express the surprise and the clear dislike towards the fact carriers still have issues with 3G and the coverage is far from being perfect".
No,no. My original post did not state accurate facts, it rather showed my emotions. My response to your remark was closer to being accurate.
I'm here not to win something. Please trust, that's quite easy, if you know what I mean. I'm here to type certain quantity of my "posts of the day". Consider them if you find them being of some interest, skip them otherwise.
Why? I did say what I said.
Firstly, it's not that obvious to me I make a big mistake. Though, I agree, my original post is an exaggeration to some extent.
I have now very accurate and perfectly up-to-date statistics before my eyes. The market shares of all cellphone models. The calculation of exact total percentage of 3G compliant phones is still quite a work, but I can sum all those percents, if you want me to. It will take time, sure. Random digs in that list always reveal 3G-compliant responses. So, I still believe even my first statement was as close to the truth, as its negation is.
Secondly, I believe both my statements are very well glued one to another by saying "All major phone makes have now 3G-compliant models, one sees so many 3G-compliant phones around, that one has the impression of very high (quite close to 100%) level of presence of those devices and one can rightfully express the surprise and the clear dislike towards the fact carriers still have issues with 3G and the coverage is far from being perfect".
Ivan, we don't need all the stats from around the world, or even from here in the USA.
I think we can all acknowledge that there are many cells with 3G, and there are many without.
I was just objecting to your contention in that post, that ALL cells had 3G.
You're now saying that you didn't really mean that, and that's fine.
So we can consider the issue as closed.
Ivan, we don't need all the stats from around the world, or even from here in the USA.
I think we can all acknowledge that there are many cells with 3G, and there are many without.
Absolutely.
I was just objecting to your contention in that post, that ALL cells had 3G.
You're now saying that you didn't really mean that, and that's fine.
So we can consider the issue as closed.
Mea culpa. I knew exactly, what my thoughts were, when I wrote the post, readers did not. "ALL" stood for rather fervent exclamation, having tried to draw the attention to the fact, there are already way too many 3G handsets to be neglected by carriers. "ALL" certainly did not mean "every last phone".
Have a nice... day, I guess...
I cannot believe you're using the completely craptastic V-Cast mess as a contradiction of the point; I think you're closer to making his point than supporting your own.
Then you have missed the point completely.
Which Verizon are YOU on?
The only Verizon I can get charges me for MMS separately from the data plan (which went from optional to mandatory with the signing of the contract)
It's not that they keep things off their network - it's that they keep things off the phones on their network. The simple-to-grasp reason is that way, they can (theoretically) drive sales through their captive-crap network.
The plans I see start on tiers with messaging being the lowest and you keep getting enticed to add a few more for another $10 progressively until you are at full data with VCast and VZNavigator. Tell me what plans you are referring to and I'll be happy to discuss them.
Since you're the arbiter of "wrong" AND a conflation instructor, you can certainly handle the falsification yourself: name the programs I can add to my Centro that will provide me with the same access to free net services that iPhone users have, and It'll be game set & match for you.
However, don't include VCAST, as they are all "premium" services - meaning extra cost for reduced function.
I'm not completely familiar with every program for every smartphone platform. The point of contention was the claim that Verizon would somehow stop you from adding programs to your Palm and streaming the data from the network to your phone.
Is there a third party app you've tried to load or use on your phone that Verizon locked out or disabled? That is the question to be answered.
I notice you also fail to mention that Verizon charges MORE per month than ATT for the same (actually slightly-improved) voice/data package; you fail to mention the fact that you can't copy anything to or from your phone without going through a varety of badly-designed & executed "services" intended not to provided customers with options but to trap them within the Verizon 'network'.
I'm not that concerned with the costs. A cheaper package that doesn't work means nothing to me. I'm a Mac user so I'll pay more for something that works right. If AT&T worked right, I'd own an iPhone. It doesn't so I don't. Additionally if someone is on a network that they consider not reliable and thus have to keep a house line, they spend much more than either of us.
I'm glad you like Verizon. I was sure there must be people who are charmed and excited by their offerings, and though I never expected to encounter one, I'm a bit surprised. Since you & VCAST were made for each other, I find it odd that you're posting about a phone & service that is so completely NOT VERIZON.
In June, I shall buy my way out of my Verizon contract (my daughter is graduating from college & will be taking on her own phone bill) and I shall get a new iPhone. I will do so serene in the knowledge that ATT is not as bad FOR ME as Verizon.
Good luck and I wish you well with your choices. My choices are limited, not by Verizon or by Apple but by AT&T and their crap service out where I live. Verizon reminds me very much of Apple in that there is seldom a value sweet spot in their offerings. If you want something you will pay and there are no two ways around that. However they are also like Apple in that for me, they just work and do so very reliably.