Amazon scoops up developer of leading eBook iPhone app

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  • Reply 21 of 41
    virgil-tb2virgil-tb2 Posts: 1,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by subtledoctor View Post


    This is not very mysterious. It actually makes a lot of sense. ...



    Interesting scenario and probably close to what will happen IMO.



    I would hope that Apple might shake things up a bit by making the iBook/iTablet (hopefully not "iPad"), a good document creator as well as reader and putting a mobile version of Preview on it so that we have some options that fall outside of the capitalist cage Amazon and B&N want to keep us in.



    I have an absolutely huge book collection and as soon as there is a good digital alternative I wouldn't shirk at spending my time digitising them all for public consumption before the paper falls apart. Someone has to actually save all the printed stuff that's being lost while Amazon and others fight over who gets paid.
  • Reply 22 of 41
    virgil-tb2virgil-tb2 Posts: 1,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alonso Perez View Post


    ... the Apple tablet will be a general purpose device, with a much larger screen (apparently close to 10") and color. ...This means it will be possible to publish magazines on it. ... a tablet is a good substitute for a physical magazine. You can read a tablet on the couch, at the beauty salon, or on the train or bus. Notebooks are no good in those types of situations. ... Also a large color tablet would be suitable for books that depend on photography or illustrations...



    This highlights something that most people haven't "got" about digital books.



    For the people who really like books and like to read, the layout, the fonts, the pictures and the colours are a major part of the experience. I have thousands of crappy sci-fi paperbacks for instance. I still read them from time to time but the main attraction is the physicality of the book itself. The retro drawings and fonts and especially the cover art are all a big part of the reason those books still exist and entertain.



    Almost all eBook tech to date ignores this fact and re-wraps the book onto whatever screen is available. Further, they either don't have the rights to the artwork and thus leave it out, or they hire some idiot to do a passable version of a new cover for the "digital release." Love of books is about specific books and specific editions of books, as works of art, not just about the ascii characters on the screen.



    If Apple does come out with a tablet, it will be the first eBook reader that you can actually read a book with that has a similar experience to a real book and I'm sure they are aware of that.
  • Reply 23 of 41
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    They're just covering their bets. eBook reading is about to take off on the iPhone platform. They already have their Kindle book app to protect their revenue, but when it takes off with the mainstream there is often a big push-back on the locked in models.



    Especially because it's books, and because most books are in the public domain, readers will be fighting back against Amazon's attempts to monetise the platform and rip you off for even more money. Buying Stanza gives them the leading free-book reader n their back pocket.



    Maybe. But they own mobipocket too and did very little with it. Other than orphaning it from being able to buy and read kindle books.



    You know what would make me get into Kindle? Offering the kindle version with every hardback version Amazon sells. Then after the paperback version hits, sell the kindle version for the same price.



    For the hardback books I buy, I'd purchase from Amazon (which is currently split between impluse buys at Borders and directed purchases from Amazon).



    And I buy the ebook version over paperbacks these days but only when the price drops low enough. Which takes a lot longer than it takes for paperback release.



    Quote:

    The poor developer actually posted something about how this "won't change anything" with Stanza and actually seems to believe it!



    I dunno that he believes it as much as needs to sell it.



    Quote:

    He should know that these guarantees are only good for the short term. Amazon is out to dominate, and is more "Microsofty" than Microsoft in it's own way. They wouldn't have bought the thing if it wasn't part of the "we own all the books in the world" plan Amazon seems to be running with.



    I agree...IMHO they haven't faced stiff competition thus far.
  • Reply 24 of 41
    vinney57vinney57 Posts: 1,162member
    Its a simple covering play surely? Amazon's Kindle is fine as far as it goes but if Apple has a viable alternative coming to market then they know its game over. They need to have a strategy to utilise whatever Apple comes up with. Quite why they couldn't write their own CocoaTouch reader I don't know. Every publisher should be seriously thinking about this right now otherwise they will 'Appled' by Amazon.
  • Reply 25 of 41
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vinea View Post


    Mmmm...mixed feelings. I can't imagine why Amazon would buy Stanza other than to try to lock in more folks into Kindle at the expense of other book stores.



    I buy all my books from webscription and have almost two hundred titles (half free, half purchased). Mostly $6 ones in lieu of paperbacks and I get those in several open formats (HTML, RTF, epub and mobi) just so I know I can read them on any sort of device I might buy in the future.



    I've not gotten any Kindle titles despite their iPhone reader because I don't trust that kindle format won't get "playsforsure'd" again in the future like they did to mobi.



    And there's still no desktop kindle reader...despite owning Mobi and their secure mobi format. So why Stanza? What does that buy them that buying Mobi didn't? Other than an attempt to marginalize epub and ereader even further.



    DRM doesn't bother me that much as long as there's some expectation that it will survive to work on future devices. Secure eReader, Secure Mobipocket, Kindle, secure ePub and MS Reader all have significant risks of becoming content stuck on an obsolete DRM format and unusable in future eBooks.



    Which is why I'm also hesitant to buy from fictionwise.com (Barnes and Noble).



    If the eBook vendors would standardize on one DRM format that would be fine.



    Hmm. Other than duplicate copies in digital I buy all hardbound and a few softbound to have a physical library. I've no need to stare at a screen in digital format all day long. The duplicates in digital are exclusively technical for the use of having ease-of-use while working on the computer.
  • Reply 26 of 41
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    You don't understand Amazon's strategy. They want to be the "Walmart of the Web" by offering whatever people want, wherever and whenever.



    Sure. And locking in content to .azw format that is supported by only one expensive eBook fits this strategy how? Would it not have been better to use the mobipocket secure format (that they already owned) and sold Kindles, Sonys and iLiads?



    On the plus side, the window exists for Apple to get into this business if they desire. We're balkanized into .azw, .mobi/.prc, .pdb, .lit, .epub, .pdf (secure), and a dozen dead or mostly dead formats plus whatever Hearst will do for their ebook.



    Amazon could have taken the lead as opposed to have been another niche ebook hardware competitor. Why? To sell their own hardware? That's not their forte. They sell products and content.
  • Reply 27 of 41
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post


    Hmm. Other than duplicate copies in digital I buy all hardbound and a few softbound to have a physical library. I've no need to stare at a screen in digital format all day long. The duplicates in digital are exclusively technical for the use of having ease-of-use while working on the computer.



    And I buy ebooks so I can read on a plane, in a line, or wherever suits my fancy on whatever hardware I happen to be using. iPhone, netbook, laptop, etc.
  • Reply 28 of 41
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by teckstud View Post


    The device's larger screen size is appealing along with it's thinness. Reading on a 4 inch screen is akin to watching Lawrence of Arabia on a 20 inch screen- it's doable but not fulfilling and not the intent of the content.



    I had a K1 AND I had a K2, and also have Kindle Reader and Stanza on the iPhone. Of the three, I tend to prefer the iPhone.



    I can easily read text on the iPhone at one level below the standard font size, while the low-contrast screen on the K2 required me to INCREASE the size up one level in almost any situation other than sitting outdoors in direct sunlight.



    The result? At those settings one can actually see MORE text per page on the iPhone, even though the Kindle has a much larger screen.



    E-Ink is a temporary technology. Lack of color, lack of backlighting, readability and contrast issues, and extremely poor refresh rates will soon relegate it to the technological scrap heap. Its ONLY saving grace is its extremely low power consumption vs that of current model LCDs, and forthcoming OLED screens will mitigate that advantage severely.



    Who's going to care if an e-ink reader lasts four days when a reader/mdia device with full-color high-resolution high-refresh-rate self-lit OLED screen lasts for two?
  • Reply 29 of 41
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    This highlights something that most people haven't "got" about digital books.



    For the people who really like books and like to read, the layout, the fonts, the pictures and the colours are a major part of the experience. I have thousands of crappy sci-fi paperbacks for instance. I still read them from time to time but the main attraction is the physicality of the book itself. The retro drawings and fonts and especially the cover art are all a big part of the reason those books still exist and entertain.



    Almost all eBook tech to date ignores this fact and re-wraps the book onto whatever screen is available. Further, they either don't have the rights to the artwork and thus leave it out, or they hire some idiot to do a passable version of a new cover for the "digital release." Love of books is about specific books and specific editions of books, as works of art, not just about the ascii characters on the screen.



    If Apple does come out with a tablet, it will be the first eBook reader that you can actually read a book with that has a similar experience to a real book and I'm sure they are aware of that.



    Most of my ebooks have the original cover art and drawings. 90% of my ebook collection are science fiction novels that would have otherwise been purchased as paperbacks or duplicate books I already own.



    For some folks the physicality is important. For others the stories themselves. I reward baen for both having authors I like and having a forward looking business model by buying their books...both ebooks and physical ones. Most of the free Baen books I have a physical copy of anyway.



    Most books sold today are not great works of art, either in terms of authorship or bookmaking. These are great as ebooks since they take no shelf space, gather no dust and you can have with you whenever you want to do some light reading.
  • Reply 30 of 41
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    I have thousands of crappy sci-fi paperbacks for instance. I still read them from time to time but the main attraction is the physicality of the book itself.



    I too have quite a few crappy sci-fi paperbacks purchased over the decades, and unfortunately I CAN'T read most of them. The paper has yellowed and the spines have all cracked and hardened and pretty much the ONLY thing many of them are now good for is sitting on a shelf.



    What good is a book that can't be read?



    On the flip side I also have quite a few ebooks that I've read on a Palm, a HP iPaq, a notebook, and now on my iPhone using Stanza. Between those and the audiobooks I practically have an entire library in my pocket, always available, no matter where I go.



    I suspect that, like music and movies, the future for most books is digital. Other than art books, special editions, and the like, I have no want or need to own (and have to move) a half-ton or so of books, CDs, DVDs, and tapes.
  • Reply 31 of 41
    virgil-tb2virgil-tb2 Posts: 1,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vinea View Post


    Most of my ebooks have the original cover art and drawings. 90% of my ebook collection are science fiction novels that would have otherwise been purchased as paperbacks or duplicate books I already own.



    Didn't know this. Things have changed somewhat since the last time I tried to get into eBooks I guess.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vinea View Post


    ... Most books sold today are not great works of art, either in terms of authorship or bookmaking. These are great as ebooks since they take no shelf space, gather no dust and you can have with you whenever you want to do some light reading.



    Granted, but I take this the opposite way.



    Because most books sold today are indeed "not great works of art" I hardly ever read them. Most of the stuff I would read eBook wise is non-fiction, and most of the fiction I would read would be older titles. That's why from my point of view the ability to buy current books and read them on the reader is almost irrelevant, and what I would really enjoy is the old classics and the books from my youth, but presented in a format that reproduces their original publication.



    I'd like a book reader that you can read comics on. I'd like to be able to re-buy all my old Metal Hurlant mags or even old Playboys, or Life magazine and have it look just like the original magazines. I'd also like these things to cost just a buck or two (as they should), because that's what they cost now in the physical versions in a bargain bin at my local bookstore.



    Needless to say Amazon is not focussing on this market at all, but if the reader (iTablet) exists, at least I could make my own content or convert the physical books and magazines I already have, and so could others. I'm hopeful that the arrival of a decent, ubiquitous, "open" reader will give the impetus needed for some of these older titles and magazines to be saved from certain destruction since there is little monetary reason to save them.



    Another good example is course books for University students. The information provided within never changes significantly, but the publishers have a cosy deal with the professors wherein a new edition is produced every year or every two years. The students are forced to buy these at hundreds of dollars a pop even though the material is public domain. If the reader is ubiquitous and the device itself is "open" enough to allow for anyone to publish to it, these kinds of strangleholds won't last very long.
  • Reply 32 of 41
    I haven't tried the Kindle app because it is not available in my country, Hong Kong.



    I found Stanza last week and love the software, how it functions on my iPhone. I can read all the books I have bought but have stored away since my apartment is small. I downloaded a few of these books to read thinking it won't be anything close to holding a book. But I was wrong. Stanza is superb and convenient since I won't take a larger machine like the Kindle with me everywhere. I only use my iPhone. I also love the quick short cut light adjustment to dim down the screen when reading without the light in a dark room. I take it with me to bed to read, in the toilet (heh), when I eat alone in a restaurant, public transport, and I have read about 40% of a book already which to me is a great achievement for such a small screen. I found that I have better use of my reading time in situations where I could not bring the book with me, and I just have my phone in my pocket.



    I worry with the Amazon changes in future versions will start blocking the PDF or text files I have (I am thinking like the mp3 songs that one purchases with a closed system). I have previously bought books on my Palm many years ago and I converted them to be read in Stanza. I just hope Amazon won't kill a already great software because they want to make us read Amazon ebooks only. That would be lame, and then some other great programmer will come up with a software that will free people of whatever they wish to use and Stanza Amazone version will slowly die out.
  • Reply 33 of 41
    milfordmilford Posts: 26member
    As a long-time user of Stanza, I really can't think of any upsides of this. The app is wonderful, and they have been marvelously responsive to user requests, continually updating the app in significant ways, many I never had imagined before, but which made the app the best e-book reader I've ever encountered. I have no desire to consume DRM in any media, Amazon can only hurt the customer-service appeal of Stanza, and a big company -- even Amazon -- inevitably damages the functioning of a well-working little company that it buys. Plus, it seriously diminished competition and variety in the iPhone market, never a good thing. Boo Amazon.
  • Reply 34 of 41
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vinea View Post


    And I buy ebooks so I can read on a plane, in a line, or wherever suits my fancy on whatever hardware I happen to be using. iPhone, netbook, laptop, etc.



    I carry a book and stick to actually reading it through that fits in my hands, not the palm of my hand or in some hard shell.



    I just like the feel of quality published books.
  • Reply 35 of 41
    Maybe they scooped up this developer before Apple does.



    Maybe Apple will be coming out with its "Category Defining" 99cent bookstore and Amazon already knows something.
  • Reply 36 of 41
    I have downloaded all the dreams I could ever wish to dream. 155 classics. What Stanza opened for me was my own library in my pocket. I have read 20 titles in the past two months. The nearest library (for me) is 20 miles away and I doubt if they even have War and Peace on the shelf. What Stanza does is allows one to have all the reasons to sit quietly and enjoy the story without the hassles of a trip to a public library. Being downsized in my job means I would not be a potential buyer of a Kindle into the distant future. But I found Stanza on my iTouch and I now have a reason to stay up late and enjoy the work of writers I was always to busy to find time for before. The best. And Stanza my hat is off to you. I pray Amazon has enough sense to leave well enough alone... Now back to reading.
  • Reply 37 of 41
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    This highlights something that most people haven't "got" about digital books.



    For the people who really like books and like to read, the layout, the fonts, the pictures and the colours are a major part of the experience. I have thousands of crappy sci-fi paperbacks for instance. I still read them from time to time but the main attraction is the physicality of the book itself. The retro drawings and fonts and especially the cover art are all a big part of the reason those books still exist and entertain.



    Almost all eBook tech to date ignores this fact and re-wraps the book onto whatever screen is available. Further, they either don't have the rights to the artwork and thus leave it out, or they hire some idiot to do a passable version of a new cover for the "digital release." Love of books is about specific books and specific editions of books, as works of art, not just about the ascii characters on the screen.



    If Apple does come out with a tablet, it will be the first eBook reader that you can actually read a book with that has a similar experience to a real book and I'm sure they are aware of that.



    Personally, I don't see why the cover or color would matter for novels. It would for comic books and textbook diagrams. Typefaces can be adjusted, but I think that would affect readability if it strays too far from the norm.



    I think you can divide the book buying market into many different segments. At the moment, I think the epaper books are for people that want the convenience or like gadgets and are willing to pay extra for it and don't mind the other trade-offs. There may be other segments that want ebooks but want certain other issues to be settled out, such as cost of the reader or the cost of the books vs. the value lost because it's not a physical book. Those that want a certain experience for the experience's sake are in their own segment, I imagine that a lot of them will be the last to adopt ebooks.
  • Reply 38 of 41
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    Personally, I don't see why the cover or color would matter for novels. It would for comic books and textbook diagrams. Typefaces can be adjusted, but I think that would affect readability if it strays too far from the norm.



    I think you can divide the book buying market into many different segments. At the moment, I think the epaper books are for people that want the convenience or like gadgets and are willing to pay extra for it and don't mind the other trade-offs. There may be other segments that want ebooks but want certain other issues to be settled out, such as cost of the reader or the cost of the books vs. the value lost because it's not a physical book. Those that want a certain experience for the experience's sake are in their own segment, I imagine that a lot of them will be the last to adopt ebooks.



    When we have hair thin, translucent, flexible sheets that can be added and folded into a book with the contents refreshed with each book loaded then I expect pulp based books to disappear, but only if they are fire proof and waterproof while being insulated from electrical surges of high levels.
  • Reply 39 of 41
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    I too have quite a few crappy sci-fi paperbacks purchased over the decades, and unfortunately I CAN'T read most of them. The paper has yellowed and the spines have all cracked and hardened and pretty much the ONLY thing many of them are now good for is sitting on a shelf



    Exactly how old are they? I have some ~30 year old books, inexpensive paperback and regular hard bound books and they're fine. The one or two books that have fallen apart fell apart early, a symptom of simply bad manufacturing and not old age. If your examples are a much older than that, then I'd say you probably got more life out of those books than you will with digital book files that you might buy.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post


    When we have hair thin, translucent, flexible sheets that can be added and folded into a book with the contents refreshed with each book loaded then I expect pulp based books to disappear, but only if they are fire proof and waterproof while being insulated from electrical surges of high levels.



    I don't expect paper books to disappear, but I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a niche market in a couple decades. For example, vinyl isn't dead, but it's not a mass market item anymore.
  • Reply 40 of 41
    cu10cu10 Posts: 294member
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