I always find it amusing how people almost always trash the findings made by researchers... funny.
I think what the article was trying to convey is that if the MBA had had a lower price point, a lot more people would be buying it.
Also, just because someone says that the MBA is not selling as much (or as well) as the MB doesn't mean they think it's a bad product or doomed or whatever. OF COURSE the MBA will NOT sell as well as the MB. Most people aren't that bright and fail to see the logic in paying more for less (performance). As such they will not opt for the MBA.
I personally am seriously considering the MBA, but I'll wait to see how the new MB and MBP look like when they hopefully come out soon!
we are not trashing other people's research.. i think its good that they have this kind of research.. but if the conclusion is obvious.. do we (the general public) have to read it?
There is a reason notebooks cost more than desktops, while being slower, having less storage capacity and being less future-proof.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
But just think how many they would sell if they priced then at $49 (and included the ethernet dongle, the external DVD burner and a copy of Windows Vista for free)!
Oh right, they wouldn't sell any more than they are now because they are selling them as fast as they can crank them out (for now at least).
So what was the price of the Macbook when it came out in May 2006 and was it as much a technical breakthrough then as the Air is today
It's more of a design breakthough than a technical breakthrough unless you consider omitting ports as such. The SSD drive though is a technical breakthrough however Apple doesn't manufacture that nor the new Intel chip.
People are interested in Lexus, but can only afford Toyota.
Toyota has more volume sales than Lexus, Lexus is doomed!
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
1. It's not about size, it's about weight. Some, like myself, will pay a premium for the lightest Mac portable they can buy. I've owned all the small PowerBooks and the Air feels like less of a compromise than any of them.
2. Dual core 1.6 GHz is plenty fast enough for the vast majority of users. What are we supposed to be doing with all these gigaflops? Rendering the next Pixar movie? Cracking the human genome? I run office apps, surf the Web, do mail, use the iApps, play a few games. I haven't noticed any performance issues at all, and don't expect to.
3. President Bush and Congress are giving these things away for "free" (with our tax dollars) anyway ($1800 "stimulus" refund expected for a family of 4).
4. Frankly I thought I wanted a micro Mac notebook, but I love the "full size" screen on the Air. Any smaller (even if they increased the pixel density) would be a step backwards.
5. The 80 gig hard drive is a drag, but I'll just keep all my media on my 80 gig iPod until I can upgrade the hard drive in a year or so.
The updated 8 core Mac Pro is proving to be a sales nightmare for Apple. The launch in early January is being considered a significant disappointment by analyst who are comparing the sales numbers to the iPod nano and shuffle releases in the previous year.
"The Nano is outselling the Mac Pro over 10 to 1, which has to be hurting Apple's bottom line" said Robert Dobolina from subgenius analysis.
"Every day I see dozens upon dozens of people carrying their shuffles and nanos around with them, but I've yet to see a single individual on the street with an 8 core mac pro", claims William W. Onka a market trend researcher from allaboutprofit.com.
Even worse, Microsofts much feared Zune appears to be nearly matching mac pro sales. Could the Zune be on the verge of breaking out into a full fledged Mac Pro killer?
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
The article (bad though it is) implies otherwise. People come to the "showroom" to see the cool new Air and some walk out with a more affordable MacBook. I'm sure the same thing happens every day at car dealerships. Go in to to see the new Mustand and drive out in a brand new Pinto (or whatever cheap car Ford sells nowadays). Either way it's a new customer.
That said, however, the general consensus amongst members of the reseller channel was that the MacBook Air is too steeply priced for Apple's mainstream consumer base and instead has a smaller but separate target market. Of the 10 reseller comments Munster published alongside his report Tuesday, more than 50 percent indicated that high pricing of the notebook was a concern.
The MacBook Air is so expensive and devoid of any compelling features, besides a low weight, that it comes as a surprise that it is selling. You have to wonder when Apple will come back to it senses.
In Canada, Staples is selling portables from Toshiba for $799 with a DVD drive and a 160 GB hard drive, while MacBooks sell for $1,249.00 with a 80 GB hard drive and an outdated CD-ROM drive on the Canadian AppleStore.
For a MacBook with a SuperDrive DVD drive, the selling price is either $1,449.00 for a "staining" white MacBook or $1,649.00 for a black MacBook.
Is there anyone who would say that Apple doesn't cater to a niche market?
Now, if only Steve Jobs would stop defrauding shareholders for billions of dollars in illegal stock options, maybe the prices could come down to meet the prices of Apple's competitors.
All things considered, you have to wonder how much better Apple would do with another CEO and lower prices. After 10 and 1/2 years, it's time for a change of CEO, this time with enough brains to get a university degree...
I would never buy a Macbook Air for the price they have them selling for now. The only thing it has going is its the thinness, which is way over priced.[/QUOTE]
Well duh !!! Well then its not for you. MacBook Air is light and thin and for the frequent traveller. And BTW going small costs a lot more. Simply compare the cost of the 80 GB 1.8" drive to the 80 GB 2.5 " drive.The larger HD doesn't fit in that's why only 80GB at this time. The memory is hard wired for space. It is all about size and nothing else really. So yes it does have limited appeal. It is for frequent travellers where every ounce may matter. I would imagine that apple will try to make it smaller faster and even lighter in the future when the larger parts also get smaller. Who knows Apple may find out that there isn't a large enough market to continue producing MacBook Airs.
However a couple of my business associates who are always on the move love it because of the weight and the screen size. Those are the only really important issues with them. They can't wait until theirs come in. For me there is no need I can pick up the MacBook or the Pro. Although my wish is a 15" MacBook.
I always find it amusing how people almost always trash the findings made by researchers... funny.
In this case it's not so much trashing as pointing out that the "research" is just stating the obvious and confirming what everyone expected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iextreme
I think what the article was trying to convey is that if the MBA had had a lower price point, a lot more people would be buying it.
Well, duh. That's true of the air, but it's true of EVERY product. What wouldn't sell better at a lower price? But that doesn't mean the product is too expensive, it's comparable to what similar models cost, and in the case of products with miniaturization, cost of manufacture dictates product price (which is higher than bigger, clunkier products - you pay more for small).
I'm sure the MB outsells the MB pro...and the iPod nano outsells the classic and touch...and the iMac outsells the mac pro. But that doesn't mean that the higher end models are overpriced, does it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by emoney35
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
You think it's crazy because you're not the target customer and you haven't compared to similar ultralight notebooks. There are people who want the smallest/lightest possible machine, and they're willing to pay more for it and make sacrifices on speed and features. You may find it hard to believe but there are plenty of PC subnotebooks that cost even more or are even slower (or both).
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
I don't agree that the MBA won't increase the mac user base - there are business users who wouldn't consider a mac until they offered a subnotebook. Now they have an option. And while the MBA is intended as a second computer, I don't think everyone necessarily needs or wants both machines on the same platform. Mac laptop and PC desktop or vice versa is better than two PC's. And two macs is better than one of each.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
We know that the 1.6GHz trounces any PPC Mac notebook ever released and I assume that it would also beat any of new $500 lossleader notebooks that HP and Dell sell.
As for other notebooks in the 3lb weightlcass the MBA is hella fast. I think Sony just upped it's Vaio TZ series to a 1.33GHz LV option, which would make it the 2nd fastest in this class, I think.
But you are right, there are trade offs. I love the MBA except for the battery usage time. If they added a pound of battery for a solid 8-12 hours under normal usage I'd be typing on one right now. Cost means nothing to me if it suits my needs. I remember computers cost a lot more and did a lot less and I have disposable income now so the price means nothing if it suits my needs.
Now, if only Steve Jobs would stop defrauding shareholders for billions of dollars in illegal stock options, maybe the prices could come down to meet the prices of Apple's competitors.
When are you going to stop repeating this same old shit?
The stock options were not, are not, and never will be, illegal.
The updated 8 core Mac Pro is proving to be a sales nightmare for Apple. The launch in early January is being considered a significant disappointment by analyst who are comparing the sales numbers to the iPod nano and shuffle releases in the previous year.
"The Nano is outselling the Mac Pro over 10 to 1, which has to be hurting Apple's bottom line" said Robert Dobolina from subgenius analysis.
"Every day I see dozens upon dozens of people carrying their shuffles and nanos around with them, but I've yet to see a single individual on the street with an 8 core mac pro", claims William W. Onka a market trend researcher from allaboutprofit.com.
Even worse, Microsofts much feared Zune appears to be nearly matching mac pro sales. Could the Zune be on the verge of breaking out into a full fledged Mac Pro killer?
QFT.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan
The MacBook Air is so expensive and devoid of any compelling features, besides a low weight, that it comes as a surprise that it is selling. You have to wonder when Apple will come back to it senses.
So you're saying if you ignore the compelling feature, it has no compelling features. Bravo on the logic, Einstein.
Water is devoid of any compelling features, besides being hydrating, refreshing, and useful for washing things. I'm sure it will never catch on.
I don't agree that the MBA won't increase the mac user base - there are business users who wouldn't consider a mac until they offered a subnotebook. Now they have an option. And while the MBA is intended as a second computer, I don't think everyone necessarily needs or wants both machines on the same platform. Mac laptop and PC desktop or vice versa is better than two PC's. And two macs is better than one of each.
The key for me was this part of the article: "[For these] reason[s] resellers indicate that sales of the MacBook Air have been additive to their overall Mac sales in the quarter," Munster advised clients. "The MacBook Air addresses the need for mobility unlike any other Mac, and as such we believe it is not cannibalizing sales of other Mac laptops."
Comments
second, those sacrifices that the macbook air made... some users are not going to be interested in mba..
cmon man, you guys are suppose to be the expert...
People are interested in Lexus, but can only afford Toyota.
Toyota has more volume sales than Lexus, Lexus is doomed!
I always find it amusing how people almost always trash the findings made by researchers... funny.
I think what the article was trying to convey is that if the MBA had had a lower price point, a lot more people would be buying it.
Also, just because someone says that the MBA is not selling as much (or as well) as the MB doesn't mean they think it's a bad product or doomed or whatever. OF COURSE the MBA will NOT sell as well as the MB. Most people aren't that bright and fail to see the logic in paying more for less (performance). As such they will not opt for the MBA.
I personally am seriously considering the MBA, but I'll wait to see how the new MB and MBP look like when they hopefully come out soon!
we are not trashing other people's research.. i think its good that they have this kind of research.. but if the conclusion is obvious.. do we (the general public) have to read it?
There is a reason notebooks cost more than desktops, while being slower, having less storage capacity and being less future-proof.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
Oh right, they wouldn't sell any more than they are now because they are selling them as fast as they can crank them out (for now at least).
So what was the price of the Macbook when it came out in May 2006 and was it as much a technical breakthrough then as the Air is today
It's more of a design breakthough than a technical breakthrough unless you consider omitting ports as such. The SSD drive though is a technical breakthrough however Apple doesn't manufacture that nor the new Intel chip.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop.
I'll take that bet, depending on how you define "one of the slower processor speeds".
How about $500?
This just in:
People are interested in Lexus, but can only afford Toyota.
Toyota has more volume sales than Lexus, Lexus is doomed!
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
1. It's not about size, it's about weight. Some, like myself, will pay a premium for the lightest Mac portable they can buy. I've owned all the small PowerBooks and the Air feels like less of a compromise than any of them.
2. Dual core 1.6 GHz is plenty fast enough for the vast majority of users. What are we supposed to be doing with all these gigaflops? Rendering the next Pixar movie? Cracking the human genome? I run office apps, surf the Web, do mail, use the iApps, play a few games. I haven't noticed any performance issues at all, and don't expect to.
3. President Bush and Congress are giving these things away for "free" (with our tax dollars) anyway ($1800 "stimulus" refund expected for a family of 4).
4. Frankly I thought I wanted a micro Mac notebook, but I love the "full size" screen on the Air. Any smaller (even if they increased the pixel density) would be a step backwards.
5. The 80 gig hard drive is a drag, but I'll just keep all my media on my 80 gig iPod until I can upgrade the hard drive in a year or so.
The updated 8 core Mac Pro is proving to be a sales nightmare for Apple. The launch in early January is being considered a significant disappointment by analyst who are comparing the sales numbers to the iPod nano and shuffle releases in the previous year.
"The Nano is outselling the Mac Pro over 10 to 1, which has to be hurting Apple's bottom line" said Robert Dobolina from subgenius analysis.
"Every day I see dozens upon dozens of people carrying their shuffles and nanos around with them, but I've yet to see a single individual on the street with an 8 core mac pro", claims William W. Onka a market trend researcher from allaboutprofit.com.
Even worse, Microsofts much feared Zune appears to be nearly matching mac pro sales. Could the Zune be on the verge of breaking out into a full fledged Mac Pro killer?
Help me here guys.
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
The article (bad though it is) implies otherwise. People come to the "showroom" to see the cool new Air and some walk out with a more affordable MacBook. I'm sure the same thing happens every day at car dealerships. Go in to to see the new Mustand and drive out in a brand new Pinto (or whatever cheap car Ford sells nowadays). Either way it's a new customer.
That said, however, the general consensus amongst members of the reseller channel was that the MacBook Air is too steeply priced for Apple's mainstream consumer base and instead has a smaller but separate target market. Of the 10 reseller comments Munster published alongside his report Tuesday, more than 50 percent indicated that high pricing of the notebook was a concern.
The MacBook Air is so expensive and devoid of any compelling features, besides a low weight, that it comes as a surprise that it is selling. You have to wonder when Apple will come back to it senses.
In Canada, Staples is selling portables from Toshiba for $799 with a DVD drive and a 160 GB hard drive, while MacBooks sell for $1,249.00 with a 80 GB hard drive and an outdated CD-ROM drive on the Canadian AppleStore.
For a MacBook with a SuperDrive DVD drive, the selling price is either $1,449.00 for a "staining" white MacBook or $1,649.00 for a black MacBook.
Is there anyone who would say that Apple doesn't cater to a niche market?
Now, if only Steve Jobs would stop defrauding shareholders for billions of dollars in illegal stock options, maybe the prices could come down to meet the prices of Apple's competitors.
All things considered, you have to wonder how much better Apple would do with another CEO and lower prices. After 10 and 1/2 years, it's time for a change of CEO, this time with enough brains to get a university degree...
Well duh !!! Well then its not for you. MacBook Air is light and thin and for the frequent traveller. And BTW going small costs a lot more. Simply compare the cost of the 80 GB 1.8" drive to the 80 GB 2.5 " drive.The larger HD doesn't fit in that's why only 80GB at this time. The memory is hard wired for space. It is all about size and nothing else really. So yes it does have limited appeal. It is for frequent travellers where every ounce may matter. I would imagine that apple will try to make it smaller faster and even lighter in the future when the larger parts also get smaller. Who knows Apple may find out that there isn't a large enough market to continue producing MacBook Airs.
However a couple of my business associates who are always on the move love it because of the weight and the screen size. Those are the only really important issues with them. They can't wait until theirs come in. For me there is no need I can pick up the MacBook or the Pro. Although my wish is a 15" MacBook.
I always find it amusing how people almost always trash the findings made by researchers... funny.
In this case it's not so much trashing as pointing out that the "research" is just stating the obvious and confirming what everyone expected.
I think what the article was trying to convey is that if the MBA had had a lower price point, a lot more people would be buying it.
Well, duh. That's true of the air, but it's true of EVERY product. What wouldn't sell better at a lower price? But that doesn't mean the product is too expensive, it's comparable to what similar models cost, and in the case of products with miniaturization, cost of manufacture dictates product price (which is higher than bigger, clunkier products - you pay more for small).
I'm sure the MB outsells the MB pro...and the iPod nano outsells the classic and touch...and the iMac outsells the mac pro. But that doesn't mean that the higher end models are overpriced, does it?
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
You think it's crazy because you're not the target customer and you haven't compared to similar ultralight notebooks. There are people who want the smallest/lightest possible machine, and they're willing to pay more for it and make sacrifices on speed and features. You may find it hard to believe but there are plenty of PC subnotebooks that cost even more or are even slower (or both).
If computers were these cars, as stated, wouldn't you want the one with more sales volume to increase your OS numbers as well? I think that is the real point here. The MBA is not going to increase the Leopard numbers. First of all, most people who will buy this are not PC people but people with other Macs so there will be very few switchers to come aboard with this product.
I don't agree that the MBA won't increase the mac user base - there are business users who wouldn't consider a mac until they offered a subnotebook. Now they have an option. And while the MBA is intended as a second computer, I don't think everyone necessarily needs or wants both machines on the same platform. Mac laptop and PC desktop or vice versa is better than two PC's. And two macs is better than one of each.
Exactly. All I'm saying is that I feel the MBA is out of proportion when it comes to its price. Obviously there is going to be a premium for the thinness, but to pay $1799 for essentially an internet surfing device is crazy, IMO.
I don't know for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that 1.6 GHz is one of the slower processor speeds out there for a new computer/laptop. As I mentioned above, you can pay less money for a faster Macbook with a minimal increase in actual physical size.
We know that the 1.6GHz trounces any PPC Mac notebook ever released and I assume that it would also beat any of new $500 lossleader notebooks that HP and Dell sell.
As for other notebooks in the 3lb weightlcass the MBA is hella fast. I think Sony just upped it's Vaio TZ series to a 1.33GHz LV option, which would make it the 2nd fastest in this class, I think.
But you are right, there are trade offs. I love the MBA except for the battery usage time. If they added a pound of battery for a solid 8-12 hours under normal usage I'd be typing on one right now. Cost means nothing to me if it suits my needs. I remember computers cost a lot more and did a lot less and I have disposable income now so the price means nothing if it suits my needs.
Now, if only Steve Jobs would stop defrauding shareholders for billions of dollars in illegal stock options, maybe the prices could come down to meet the prices of Apple's competitors.
When are you going to stop repeating this same old shit?
The stock options were not, are not, and never will be, illegal.
This just in...
The updated 8 core Mac Pro is proving to be a sales nightmare for Apple. The launch in early January is being considered a significant disappointment by analyst who are comparing the sales numbers to the iPod nano and shuffle releases in the previous year.
"The Nano is outselling the Mac Pro over 10 to 1, which has to be hurting Apple's bottom line" said Robert Dobolina from subgenius analysis.
"Every day I see dozens upon dozens of people carrying their shuffles and nanos around with them, but I've yet to see a single individual on the street with an 8 core mac pro", claims William W. Onka a market trend researcher from allaboutprofit.com.
Even worse, Microsofts much feared Zune appears to be nearly matching mac pro sales. Could the Zune be on the verge of breaking out into a full fledged Mac Pro killer?
QFT.
The MacBook Air is so expensive and devoid of any compelling features, besides a low weight, that it comes as a surprise that it is selling. You have to wonder when Apple will come back to it senses.
So you're saying if you ignore the compelling feature, it has no compelling features. Bravo on the logic, Einstein.
Water is devoid of any compelling features, besides being hydrating, refreshing, and useful for washing things. I'm sure it will never catch on.
I don't agree that the MBA won't increase the mac user base - there are business users who wouldn't consider a mac until they offered a subnotebook. Now they have an option. And while the MBA is intended as a second computer, I don't think everyone necessarily needs or wants both machines on the same platform. Mac laptop and PC desktop or vice versa is better than two PC's. And two macs is better than one of each.
The key for me was this part of the article: "[For these] reason[s] resellers indicate that sales of the MacBook Air have been additive to their overall Mac sales in the quarter," Munster advised clients. "The MacBook Air addresses the need for mobility unlike any other Mac, and as such we believe it is not cannibalizing sales of other Mac laptops."
That, to me, shows the MBA is doing its job.