"What? An adding machine that'll fit in your pocket? Yeah, right."
"What? A telephone that doesn't have to sit on the end table and will fit it my pocket? Yeah, right."
I think you've confused a multi-decade technology shift for one that happens in a single year. There's a lot of new features rumored, many of them more power consuming in general, and supposedly it's all going to get into a tinier package than the previous year's model.
It's possible, but I too am holding out the idea that it may also be an attempt at stock manipulation. Even if it's illegal, prosecution is pretty rare.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
I'm only expecting iPhone2 (maybe not even that) and iPod Touch demo with some cool apps. If they hand out stickers, so much the better.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
THANK YOU!!! Apple prolly hates all these rumors! But they love us talking about this and getting excited.
I think you've got the right idea, but your price points are off. My guess:
First: $549/16GB, $699/32GB
Second: $299
Apple's history is to offer more functionality at the same price point in subsequent models -- see especially the history of iPod price to functionality and specs ratio over the years. So maybe $399 with a $499 BTO 32GB. I can't see $549 for the base main model.
The $299 sounds about right though -- for a "little iDevice for all of us" -- and it might be allowed to be subsidized to $200 as reports have suggested -- which would bring several rumors together.
Apple's admitted that their not married to any business model. The exclusive contract probably refers to revenue sharing. I'm sure Apple could (and might) decide to break the exclusive contract in exchange for loss of profit sharing of data plans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Kubrick
One more thing. The iphone is now on Verizion too!
Working with Verizon would mean a separate CDMA version. I don't foresee that happening. Eventually GSM phones will work on Verizon as Verizon has said they will open up their network.
Something that is being overlooked is that when thne 1 was in R&D, very few within Apple knew that it was in development. You had the phone people and the multitouch iTablet people working on the same device. So, I'm pretty sure that the iPhone 2 will be the ideal iPhone that Jobs wanted to deliver. I'm sure Apple will once again blow us away when he shows us the new and improved iPhone. So yes, I believe that the new iPhone will deliver longer battery life, being from better battery or from power management within the OS. And I do believe that we will see a thinner, 3G, GPS, revamped iPhone come monday.
Also, a little off topic,but with two icon app slots available on the iPhone. What kindof fun apps do you guys think Santa Steve will give us?
Also, a little off topic,but with two icon app slots available on the iPhone. What kindof fun apps do you guys think Santa Steve will give us?
Are you referring to the Home Screen? I believe you can currently have up to 8 home screens. SInce you can put bookmarks on the Home Screens and the App Store will allow you to install many apps I don't expect anythign but he App Store icon to be on there.
First of all, If the claims of better battery life is true, Then I'd surely bet that there will be an asterisk next to the claim that points out that the stated battery life is measured with WIFI, GPS, Forward-facing cam, and potentially even UMTS/3G disabled.
But at the same time, a lighter/thinner 3G iPhone with better battery life is not necessarily wishful thinking. With regards to hardware improvements, people need to remember how fast integrated-circuit technology moves, particularly in microprocessors, embedded systems, telecommunications, etc. Since the first iPhone's parts were sourced, embedded chip manufacturers have moved to smaller processing nodes, with many chips going from 110/90nm down to 55nm/65nm. This leads to smaller die sizes and better power efficiency.
There are also always continuing advancements in chip integration and optimization. For communications, Maybe iPhone 3G has a special SoC ARM processor that not only is more power efficient from a die-shrink, but has improved architecture and algorithms. Maybe the iPhone 3G uses an advanced baseband chip that is smaller, yet includes UMTS, WiFi, and GPS all on one chip and thereby saves significant physical space which and allows the iPhone to be thinner, but have a larger battery at the same time. All I'm saying is that most of us don't know enough to be able to accurately predict whether they can pull this off the type of improvements in the rumor or not. We need an experienced mobile phone/embedded systems engineer to comment on recent developments in this technology area.
One final thing to think about is that Apple probably didn't use the smallest/most power efficient/most modern components available, so as to save some headroom for iPhone v2 improvements (and reduce costs).
This fits with the recent downgrading of Apple stock by an analyst who says there will be short supply of the chips Apple uses in the iPhone. Apple *wants* to release the iPhone worldwide next week and is sure going to try, but there may be supply constraints that will keep it from filling the retail channels until later this year. \
Is that a joke? Why would Apple risk doing that. You cant even buy iphone in the UK any more. Absolute rubbish.
Something that is being overlooked is that when thne 1 was in R&D, very few within Apple knew that it was in development. You had the phone people and the multitouch iTablet people working on the same device. So, I'm pretty sure that the iPhone 2 will be the ideal iPhone that Jobs wanted to deliver. I'm sure Apple will once again blow us away when he shows us the new and improved iPhone. So yes, I believe that the new iPhone will deliver longer battery life, being from better battery or from power management within the OS. And I do believe that we will see a thinner, 3G, GPS, revamped iPhone come monday.
But do you have an opinion of your own on the matter?
One of the ways to tell if a rumor is true or not is to ask, Does this use technology that exists today? People frequently forget this when it comes to Apple products. Back when the MacBook Air was still a rumor people were speculating that it would contain an SSD drive at a capacity that was unavailable and a price that was impossibly low. Afterwards they all expressed disappointment that Apple hadn't set up its own factory for creating magical non-existent 256gb SSD drives at prices 10 times below their competitors 64gb drives. With this in mind I find it highly unlikely that Apple has a 3G phone that gets better battery life than its current phone. 3G phones have notoriously bad battery life. Apple doesn't do research on batteries and doesn't make batteries and better power management is never going to give you that kind of battery life.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
This fits with the recent downgrading of Apple stock by an analyst who says there will be short supply of the chips Apple uses in the iPhone. Apple *wants* to release the iPhone worldwide next week and is sure going to try, but there may be supply constraints that will keep it from filling the retail channels until later this year. \
That's funny - just a week or so ago, there was a rumor of OVERSUPPLY of these chips - and the analyst blamed reduced Apple usage. Hint: Don't believe rumors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Performa6200forLIFE
You've missed the point. As an established journalist on Apple, Leander depends on the integrity of facts, not rumors. His product is credibility and insight--why would he risk this in an arena that is saturated enough with rumors? As for analysts, they will profit no matter what they spew.
Since when has factual integrity been the hallmark of journalism? OK, maybe back in the 60's, but for the last 20 years, 'journalism' has been all about hype, FUD, and building mountains out of molehills.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8CoreWhore
Why would a programmer know about the form factor? Even the Apple iPhone programmers didn't know what the 1G would look like. Silly.
Apple often distributes beta units for programmers. They didn't do it with iPhone 1.0 because there were no authorized outside programmers. Since one of the features of iPhone 2.0 is the ability to have third party programs, it wouldn't surprise me to have some in the hands of programmers.
It's possible I'd guess. Likely, no. Leander has been known to be a bit away with the fairies at times quoting unqualified rumours.
Here's why I think it's possible and purely my take on what I've read over the last year...
iPhone v1 was more a stick in the sand design. All the parts were pretty much off the shelf and v1 was split between two boards - one 'logic', one comms. I'd guess that they could just switch out the comms board for a 3G comms board and be done with v2 but that wouldn't give them thinner and better battery, and Steve likes thinner.
If they've been doing their work in the last two to three years since the v1 design was probably finished, v2 will use more highly integrated chips, reducing the chip count and using better processes. The ARM SOC manufacturers are using 45nm now. Some of iPhone v1's ARM chips are on .13 microns! They've also got multiple CPUs in there that seem to be underused to me. The SGOLD3 chip on the comms board is pretty much a phone in itself with it's own ARM926 core and second ARM7 core but they've also got the main ARM CPU on the logic board. To me, the iPhone design still looks like an iPod Touch with a cheap EDGE phone board slapped on. It's surely inefficient in both space and power.
So, it's highly possible the board and chip design has got smaller/simpler yet adding features and requiring less power. That might give them room for a smaller battery and so thinner.
Out of left field, there's also that patent for solar charging a few weeks back with solar cells under the LCD display. Maybe they've added that, reduced the battery size and added a big asterisk that says 'when tested in sunny California' to the specs. I hope they don't as I'm in rainy Manchester.
It's clear that Apple will try to make a better iPhone, by improving on iPhone 1.0
They need to
1) Improve reception - by adopting a more radio-transparent case
2) Add 3G - which comes at the price of increased power consumption
3) Beef up the battery - which means making the phone fatter
4) Offset the fatness - by having thin tapered edges.
This is exactly what we are seeing in the leaked images.
We have seen 5 or 6 images from different sources showing exactly the same design. Some in Pearl some in Jet.
Folks, we are going to get a slightly fatter phone, with a non-metal back.
The fatness is not going to be a problem because the edges will be thinner, mirroring the MacBook Air. It will slide into your pocket and *feel* thinner.
Comments
"What? An adding machine that'll fit in your pocket? Yeah, right."
"What? A telephone that doesn't have to sit on the end table and will fit it my pocket? Yeah, right."
I think you've confused a multi-decade technology shift for one that happens in a single year. There's a lot of new features rumored, many of them more power consuming in general, and supposedly it's all going to get into a tinier package than the previous year's model.
It's possible, but I too am holding out the idea that it may also be an attempt at stock manipulation. Even if it's illegal, prosecution is pretty rare.
BUY A COMPUTER!!!!
Not a whole lot of computers support all day internet use on a battery.
I very strongly doubt the veracity of the claims on several grounds.
1. Steve was very worried about 3G's power draining, a problem that would result in A) more battery being placed in or
Keep in mind that Steve saying something doesn't mean it's the concern that truly caused the feature to be dropped.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
I'm only expecting iPhone2 (maybe not even that) and iPod Touch demo with some cool apps. If they hand out stickers, so much the better.
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
THANK YOU!!! Apple prolly hates all these rumors! But they love us talking about this and getting excited.
I think you've got the right idea, but your price points are off. My guess:
First: $549/16GB, $699/32GB
Second: $299
Apple's history is to offer more functionality at the same price point in subsequent models -- see especially the history of iPod price to functionality and specs ratio over the years. So maybe $399 with a $499 BTO 32GB. I can't see $549 for the base main model.
The $299 sounds about right though -- for a "little iDevice for all of us" -- and it might be allowed to be subsidized to $200 as reports have suggested -- which would bring several rumors together.
http://www.fiercecio.com/techwatch/s...dma/2007-05-23
Apple's admitted that their not married to any business model. The exclusive contract probably refers to revenue sharing. I'm sure Apple could (and might) decide to break the exclusive contract in exchange for loss of profit sharing of data plans.
One more thing. The iphone is now on Verizion too!
Working with Verizon would mean a separate CDMA version. I don't foresee that happening. Eventually GSM phones will work on Verizon as Verizon has said they will open up their network.
Also, a little off topic,but with two icon app slots available on the iPhone. What kindof fun apps do you guys think Santa Steve will give us?
Also, a little off topic,but with two icon app slots available on the iPhone. What kindof fun apps do you guys think Santa Steve will give us?
Are you referring to the Home Screen? I believe you can currently have up to 8 home screens. SInce you can put bookmarks on the Home Screens and the App Store will allow you to install many apps I don't expect anythign but he App Store icon to be on there.
But at the same time, a lighter/thinner 3G iPhone with better battery life is not necessarily wishful thinking. With regards to hardware improvements, people need to remember how fast integrated-circuit technology moves, particularly in microprocessors, embedded systems, telecommunications, etc. Since the first iPhone's parts were sourced, embedded chip manufacturers have moved to smaller processing nodes, with many chips going from 110/90nm down to 55nm/65nm. This leads to smaller die sizes and better power efficiency.
There are also always continuing advancements in chip integration and optimization. For communications, Maybe iPhone 3G has a special SoC ARM processor that not only is more power efficient from a die-shrink, but has improved architecture and algorithms. Maybe the iPhone 3G uses an advanced baseband chip that is smaller, yet includes UMTS, WiFi, and GPS all on one chip and thereby saves significant physical space which and allows the iPhone to be thinner, but have a larger battery at the same time. All I'm saying is that most of us don't know enough to be able to accurately predict whether they can pull this off the type of improvements in the rumor or not. We need an experienced mobile phone/embedded systems engineer to comment on recent developments in this technology area.
One final thing to think about is that Apple probably didn't use the smallest/most power efficient/most modern components available, so as to save some headroom for iPhone v2 improvements (and reduce costs).
This fits with the recent downgrading of Apple stock by an analyst who says there will be short supply of the chips Apple uses in the iPhone. Apple *wants* to release the iPhone worldwide next week and is sure going to try, but there may be supply constraints that will keep it from filling the retail channels until later this year.
Is that a joke? Why would Apple risk doing that. You cant even buy iphone in the UK any more. Absolute rubbish.
Something that is being overlooked is that when thne 1 was in R&D, very few within Apple knew that it was in development. You had the phone people and the multitouch iTablet people working on the same device. So, I'm pretty sure that the iPhone 2 will be the ideal iPhone that Jobs wanted to deliver. I'm sure Apple will once again blow us away when he shows us the new and improved iPhone. So yes, I believe that the new iPhone will deliver longer battery life, being from better battery or from power management within the OS. And I do believe that we will see a thinner, 3G, GPS, revamped iPhone come monday.
But do you have an opinion of your own on the matter?
...Unless Apple have found a wonderful new power source, I don't see the 22% happening.
why can't the 3G automatically turn on when you open safari and turn off when you go back to the home screen?
why can't das 3g automatically turn on when it checks email and turn back off when it's finished checking/downloading?
why can't les 3g automatically turn on and off when it's needed?
[i'm not so technically inclinced, but if you can turn it off manually, as suggested in software update photos, why not do it on the auto matic?]
Because that would make too much sense like copy and paste and a flash on the rear camera. Apple doesn't like making sense.
Dunno, you'd have to ask him why he's doing it... but doing it he is. He is publishing speculation and rumor, and nothing more.
I kind of have to ask why you care so much to start a new account on his behalf.
Ouch! Take a chill pill.
One of the ways to tell if a rumor is true or not is to ask, Does this use technology that exists today? People frequently forget this when it comes to Apple products. Back when the MacBook Air was still a rumor people were speculating that it would contain an SSD drive at a capacity that was unavailable and a price that was impossibly low. Afterwards they all expressed disappointment that Apple hadn't set up its own factory for creating magical non-existent 256gb SSD drives at prices 10 times below their competitors 64gb drives. With this in mind I find it highly unlikely that Apple has a 3G phone that gets better battery life than its current phone. 3G phones have notoriously bad battery life. Apple doesn't do research on batteries and doesn't make batteries and better power management is never going to give you that kind of battery life.
You win the thread!
We always do this to ourselves...build things up to a frenzy only to be disappointed when nothing like this ever pans out. I can't recall any upgrade that has met or surpassed expectations.
My guess is 3G and a tapered form factor. I'll go as far as saying there won't even be GPS included.
Aim low so you'll be pleasantly surprised.
I agree with your prediction.
This fits with the recent downgrading of Apple stock by an analyst who says there will be short supply of the chips Apple uses in the iPhone. Apple *wants* to release the iPhone worldwide next week and is sure going to try, but there may be supply constraints that will keep it from filling the retail channels until later this year.
That's funny - just a week or so ago, there was a rumor of OVERSUPPLY of these chips - and the analyst blamed reduced Apple usage. Hint: Don't believe rumors.
You've missed the point. As an established journalist on Apple, Leander depends on the integrity of facts, not rumors. His product is credibility and insight--why would he risk this in an arena that is saturated enough with rumors? As for analysts, they will profit no matter what they spew.
Since when has factual integrity been the hallmark of journalism? OK, maybe back in the 60's, but for the last 20 years, 'journalism' has been all about hype, FUD, and building mountains out of molehills.
Why would a programmer know about the form factor? Even the Apple iPhone programmers didn't know what the 1G would look like. Silly.
Apple often distributes beta units for programmers. They didn't do it with iPhone 1.0 because there were no authorized outside programmers. Since one of the features of iPhone 2.0 is the ability to have third party programs, it wouldn't surprise me to have some in the hands of programmers.
Here's why I think it's possible and purely my take on what I've read over the last year...
iPhone v1 was more a stick in the sand design. All the parts were pretty much off the shelf and v1 was split between two boards - one 'logic', one comms. I'd guess that they could just switch out the comms board for a 3G comms board and be done with v2 but that wouldn't give them thinner and better battery, and Steve likes thinner.
If they've been doing their work in the last two to three years since the v1 design was probably finished, v2 will use more highly integrated chips, reducing the chip count and using better processes. The ARM SOC manufacturers are using 45nm now. Some of iPhone v1's ARM chips are on .13 microns! They've also got multiple CPUs in there that seem to be underused to me. The SGOLD3 chip on the comms board is pretty much a phone in itself with it's own ARM926 core and second ARM7 core but they've also got the main ARM CPU on the logic board. To me, the iPhone design still looks like an iPod Touch with a cheap EDGE phone board slapped on. It's surely inefficient in both space and power.
So, it's highly possible the board and chip design has got smaller/simpler yet adding features and requiring less power. That might give them room for a smaller battery and so thinner.
Out of left field, there's also that patent for solar charging a few weeks back with solar cells under the LCD display. Maybe they've added that, reduced the battery size and added a big asterisk that says 'when tested in sunny California' to the specs. I hope they don't as I'm in rainy Manchester.
They need to
1) Improve reception - by adopting a more radio-transparent case
2) Add 3G - which comes at the price of increased power consumption
3) Beef up the battery - which means making the phone fatter
4) Offset the fatness - by having thin tapered edges.
This is exactly what we are seeing in the leaked images.
We have seen 5 or 6 images from different sources showing exactly the same design. Some in Pearl some in Jet.
Folks, we are going to get a slightly fatter phone, with a non-metal back.
The fatness is not going to be a problem because the edges will be thinner, mirroring the MacBook Air. It will slide into your pocket and *feel* thinner.
C.