Perhaps it hasn't occurred to you, but perhaps people stay Mac users for life because Apple produces higher end computers. If it were to cut out features, maybe some of the Mac experience that you love so much would be cut out as well. Apple is selling more Macs then it ever has sold. I don't see any reason to sacrifice margins as long as this trend continues to hold. If it were to cut prices, it should be more because the US economy is hurting and it wants to make sure computers sell for the Holiday. I, however, am skeptical Apple is intending to sacrifice margins on it's Macs. I think Oppemheimer was referring to margin cuts in it's iPod lines. As we have seen Apple lowered the prices there, but increased the features. More specifically, I think he was referring to the iPod Touch.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeben
I'm a long-time Apple-loving watcher (and user since 1984) who's never posted. Here is what I want to say: I think Apple, in its desire to produce only awesome products, sometimes misses an important point, and it is this: Virtually anyone who buys a Mac stays a Mac customer forever. That being said, I think this is Apple's time to come out with very aggressive pricing on some sort of entry-level complete Mac, even if that means cutting out some nice-to-have features. They will sell a boatload of those to what I like to call the "uninlightend PC users in the dark" who presently can't see past the sticker price. Once these people live the "Mac experience", they are ours forever (cackle, cackle), because it is as much about the whole OS/user experience as it is the hardware. Like virtually all of us, they will move up the price/performance ladder over time, loving it all the way (I don't know about you, but Santa ain't putting no skimpy Mac Mini under my tree this year). In summary, I feel that 1.the Mac is approaching that magical "tipping point", 2. once you go Mac, you never go back, so, 3. just get them in the bloody door any bloody way you can, even if it hurts margins in the short run. I am hopeful that that is exactly why Oppenheimer spoke about a product re-vamp and lower margins.
I don't believe it for a second that Apple would do what you say. They have a standard, and they keep to it no matter what. I have faith that they are smart enough to know how to find that medium of cutting-edge tech/performance and value without looking like they are making an inferior product or damaging their brand.
You say to look at Dell and Gateway, but I don't think these companies run anything like Apple. No one in their right mind would compare these manufactures, and no one would expect Apple to make any of the mistakes that they have made.
How else can Apple lower the price of their MacBook but 20, 30 or 40% and still maintain the quality that you want and expect? You have put Apple's business model on a pedestal and think they have the name they have today in spite of the using the Pareto principle, not because of.
But ou're absolutely right, Dell and Gateway aren't run anything like because has decided to setup up stores in expensive high-traffic areas and have products you ca take home. They also have to sell high volume for little profit, as opposed to Apple's lower volume at a high profit which creates a brand that is sought after brand.
Apple may very lower the price of their notebooks somewhat. The iBook stated at $1500 and was as low as $999 at times between 2003 and 2006 when it was finally discontinued. The marketing of having a Mac under $1000 does have a psychological basis. But don't expect something so drastic that Apple loses profit just to gain marketshare. They are already the 3rd largest OC vender in the US with their average sale being 2x that of other vendors and they are reported as being the 6th largest in the world. Looking at the OS marketshare is pointless because even if they had HP's worldwide marketshare they would still only have a quarter of the OS marketshare Windows has.
I think Apple is little worried about the drop of US market.
That's why they are pushing all these updates right before holidays. They probably will go with a "Best Holiday Line-Up Ever" or the "Funnest Holiday Line Up" theme this season. Apple needs these aggressive prices for International Distribution. In US Apple is pretty affordable...but still not to anyone. Overseas Apple is like TOP Price, top name.
Macbook was well into $999 with student discount and most students buy macbook, so I wouldn't drop too low here. Maybe $929 for all and $829 for students. This is pretty aggressive already. Now Macbook Pro has to drop few digits. I think with all that re-engineering it might cost little less to make. So into price of $1499 can be very appealing and $1999 for higher end.
Macbook Air...ohh i don't even wanna go there. Apple didn't focus on it at all. Its like in some dark corner.
Sounds promising. If this is all true, they'll sell boat loads of these.
I would expect invites to go out within the next 10 days though if they are starting to ship. This would appear to contradict the previous 14th October rumour.
That's why they are pushing all these updates right before holidays.
Most Mac and iPod models have historically been updated right before or during the holiday season. And then again 6 months later. Some months the updates vary, but MacRumors' Buyer's Guide will give you an nice overview.
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
among other things.
i think a drop of more than 100 dollars is wishful thinking, unless they do offer an "entry level" Mac, but with an aluminum enclosure and LED that may be difficult.
This is exciting however. If they drop the new macbooks 100 dollars, does that mean big cuts to the old macbook (plastic) ?
My girlfriend doesn't want an aluminum one but I've made her wait
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
How much are the macbooks right now? Now think about brand new macbooks with new enclosures, LED backlighting, probably a near doubling of storage capacity, plus who knows what other features....all for $999.99???? You BETCHA thats going to be aggressive!
i think a drop of more than 100 dollars is wishful thinking, unless they do offer an "entry level" Mac, but with an aluminum enclosure and LED that may be difficult.
This is exciting however. If they drop the new macbooks 100 dollars, does that mean big cuts to the old macbook (plastic) ?
My girlfriend doesn't want an aluminum one but I've made her wait
By competitor's standards, the current $1099 MacBook would be fairly-priced at $700, maybe $800 if you want to give Apple an extra benjamin for elegant design and software.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut
How much are the macbooks right now? Now think about brand new macbooks with new enclosures, LED backlighting, probably a near doubling of storage capacity, plus who knows what other features....all for $999.99???? You BETCHA thats going to be aggressive!
Eh, this seems aggressive to me; in many ways, those specs match or outshine Apple's $1999 offerings. A groin-burning aluminum case and LED backlighting isn't really enough to justify $999.
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
agree. i wouldn't expect that the rrp will be lower than $999, but it is a good idea to drop it down to that level. edu price will therefore be lower, of course.
I still think it was so much nicer when we didn't know every single thing about every product being released before it was released.
Ah see dude the thing is we still don't.
Its just that the longer Apple keeps with their tradition of not pre-announcing their product plans the more they train the public on how to research the most probable direction Apple is going.
The analysts do checks on what the manufacturing plants in Asia are doing. No, the plant might not tell anybody specifically what they are assembling but its easy to find out using common sense what they most likely are producing by researching probable components.
Hey, someone explain it better than me please?
After constant analysis though one develops an instinct for whats going to happen. Even so, Steve does still manage to have most of Apple's secrets close to his chest. We all know for instance that PA Semi is now making custom chip designs for Apple and their next iphone model. But what features will it have? We have no clue yet.
By competitor's standards, the current $1099 MacBook would be fairly-priced at $700, maybe $800 if you want to give Apple an extra benjamin for elegant design and software.
Eh, this seems aggressive to me; in many ways, those specs match or outshine Apple's $1999 offerings. A groin-burning aluminum case and LED backlighting isn't really enough to justify $999.
Groin burning? That was fixed in a firmware update if your referring to the macbook air. And it won't be just a case and LED backlighting that is going to justify whatever Apple is going to do.
Lets wait and see what happens.
No, it won't be "OMG OH NO HE DIDN'T" type of excitement. But it will be impressive.
Comments
$999 is not agressive.
No, $999 is certainly not aggressive. I think they had an iBook at $999 at one time.
Apple doesn't need to go as low as the $599 PC laptops currently selling.
But if it wants to own the laptop segment, they could do it with an entry level MB selling for $799.
I doubt it will happen, but I'd love to see a lineup similar to this.
13" MB entry :$799
13" MB mid: $999
13" MB high: $1199
15" MB: $1399
rumor is there can be only one. Pro is dead. just shiny macbooks with extra options.
Riiiighhttt.....Apple would never drop a high end laptop. That's their best interest.
I'm a long-time Apple-loving watcher (and user since 1984) who's never posted. Here is what I want to say: I think Apple, in its desire to produce only awesome products, sometimes misses an important point, and it is this: Virtually anyone who buys a Mac stays a Mac customer forever. That being said, I think this is Apple's time to come out with very aggressive pricing on some sort of entry-level complete Mac, even if that means cutting out some nice-to-have features. They will sell a boatload of those to what I like to call the "uninlightend PC users in the dark" who presently can't see past the sticker price. Once these people live the "Mac experience", they are ours forever (cackle, cackle), because it is as much about the whole OS/user experience as it is the hardware. Like virtually all of us, they will move up the price/performance ladder over time, loving it all the way (I don't know about you, but Santa ain't putting no skimpy Mac Mini under my tree this year). In summary, I feel that 1.the Mac is approaching that magical "tipping point", 2. once you go Mac, you never go back, so, 3. just get them in the bloody door any bloody way you can, even if it hurts margins in the short run. I am hopeful that that is exactly why Oppenheimer spoke about a product re-vamp and lower margins.
I don't believe it for a second that Apple would do what you say. They have a standard, and they keep to it no matter what. I have faith that they are smart enough to know how to find that medium of cutting-edge tech/performance and value without looking like they are making an inferior product or damaging their brand.
You say to look at Dell and Gateway, but I don't think these companies run anything like Apple. No one in their right mind would compare these manufactures, and no one would expect Apple to make any of the mistakes that they have made.
How else can Apple lower the price of their MacBook but 20, 30 or 40% and still maintain the quality that you want and expect? You have put Apple's business model on a pedestal and think they have the name they have today in spite of the using the Pareto principle, not because of.
But ou're absolutely right, Dell and Gateway aren't run anything like because has decided to setup up stores in expensive high-traffic areas and have products you ca take home. They also have to sell high volume for little profit, as opposed to Apple's lower volume at a high profit which creates a brand that is sought after brand.
Apple may very lower the price of their notebooks somewhat. The iBook stated at $1500 and was as low as $999 at times between 2003 and 2006 when it was finally discontinued. The marketing of having a Mac under $1000 does have a psychological basis. But don't expect something so drastic that Apple loses profit just to gain marketshare. They are already the 3rd largest OC vender in the US with their average sale being 2x that of other vendors and they are reported as being the 6th largest in the world. Looking at the OS marketshare is pointless because even if they had HP's worldwide marketshare they would still only have a quarter of the OS marketshare Windows has.
That's why they are pushing all these updates right before holidays. They probably will go with a "Best Holiday Line-Up Ever" or the "Funnest Holiday Line Up" theme this season. Apple needs these aggressive prices for International Distribution. In US Apple is pretty affordable...but still not to anyone. Overseas Apple is like TOP Price, top name.
Macbook was well into $999 with student discount and most students buy macbook, so I wouldn't drop too low here. Maybe $929 for all and $829 for students. This is pretty aggressive already. Now Macbook Pro has to drop few digits. I think with all that re-engineering it might cost little less to make. So into price of $1499 can be very appealing and $1999 for higher end.
Macbook Air...ohh i don't even wanna go there. Apple didn't focus on it at all. Its like in some dark corner.
$999 with solid state drives would be awesome. I just hope they don't skimp on the graphics again.
I'd expect the graphics to be pretty good (or at least better) seeing as the displays are supposed to be LED.
Sounds promising. If this is all true, they'll sell boat loads of these.
I would expect invites to go out within the next 10 days though if they are starting to ship. This would appear to contradict the previous 14th October rumour.
lol I get it...boat load....hahaha...clever.
That's why they are pushing all these updates right before holidays.
Most Mac and iPod models have historically been updated right before or during the holiday season. And then again 6 months later. Some months the updates vary, but MacRumors' Buyer's Guide will give you an nice overview.
$999 is not agressive.
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
I'd expect the graphics to be pretty good (or at least better) seeing as the displays are supposed to be LED.
LCD with LED backlit.
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
among other things.
i think a drop of more than 100 dollars is wishful thinking, unless they do offer an "entry level" Mac, but with an aluminum enclosure and LED that may be difficult.
This is exciting however. If they drop the new macbooks 100 dollars, does that mean big cuts to the old macbook (plastic) ?
My girlfriend doesn't want an aluminum one but I've made her wait
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
How much are the macbooks right now? Now think about brand new macbooks with new enclosures, LED backlighting, probably a near doubling of storage capacity, plus who knows what other features....all for $999.99???? You BETCHA thats going to be aggressive!
I still think it was so much nicer when we didn't know every single thing about every product being released before it was released.
As if we do?
i think a drop of more than 100 dollars is wishful thinking, unless they do offer an "entry level" Mac, but with an aluminum enclosure and LED that may be difficult.
This is exciting however. If they drop the new macbooks 100 dollars, does that mean big cuts to the old macbook (plastic) ?
My girlfriend doesn't want an aluminum one but I've made her wait
By competitor's standards, the current $1099 MacBook would be fairly-priced at $700, maybe $800 if you want to give Apple an extra benjamin for elegant design and software.
How much are the macbooks right now? Now think about brand new macbooks with new enclosures, LED backlighting, probably a near doubling of storage capacity, plus who knows what other features....all for $999.99???? You BETCHA thats going to be aggressive!
Eh, this seems aggressive to me; in many ways, those specs match or outshine Apple's $1999 offerings. A groin-burning aluminum case and LED backlighting isn't really enough to justify $999.
It is when they are switching to aluminum enclosures and LED backlighting at the same time.
agree. i wouldn't expect that the rrp will be lower than $999, but it is a good idea to drop it down to that level. edu price will therefore be lower, of course.
I still think it was so much nicer when we didn't know every single thing about every product being released before it was released.
Ah see dude the thing is we still don't.
Its just that the longer Apple keeps with their tradition of not pre-announcing their product plans the more they train the public on how to research the most probable direction Apple is going.
The analysts do checks on what the manufacturing plants in Asia are doing. No, the plant might not tell anybody specifically what they are assembling but its easy to find out using common sense what they most likely are producing by researching probable components.
Hey, someone explain it better than me please?
After constant analysis though one develops an instinct for whats going to happen. Even so, Steve does still manage to have most of Apple's secrets close to his chest. We all know for instance that PA Semi is now making custom chip designs for Apple and their next iphone model. But what features will it have? We have no clue yet.
I'm tempted, but there may be more troubles ahead with the overall economy.
By competitor's standards, the current $1099 MacBook would be fairly-priced at $700, maybe $800 if you want to give Apple an extra benjamin for elegant design and software.
Eh, this seems aggressive to me; in many ways, those specs match or outshine Apple's $1999 offerings. A groin-burning aluminum case and LED backlighting isn't really enough to justify $999.
Groin burning? That was fixed in a firmware update if your referring to the macbook air. And it won't be just a case and LED backlighting that is going to justify whatever Apple is going to do.
Lets wait and see what happens.
No, it won't be "OMG OH NO HE DIDN'T" type of excitement. But it will be impressive.
Anyone jumpin in on buying some APPL stock?
I'm tempted, but there may be more troubles ahead with the overall economy.
Why not? Your only supposed to use disposable cash anyways when you invest. Just don't throw in the life savings ok?
Not for me though. No disposable cash at the moment.