"I'd like to see the annoying bug I discovered last night taken care of. Of course it may actually be a feature. I moved photos from my MicroSD to the trash and the memory count on the MicroSD didn't move down one bit. Every time I tried to copy a new file to the MicroSD card it said it was full. I had to empty the trash for the memory on the MicroSD card to free-up. That's just plain retarded for the OS to hold that memory hostage like that. The trash and the flash memory need to part-ways in one of these bug fixes."
This has been the standard feature for a long time, I think it predates OSX, but I could be wrong, seems like it has always been this way. You have to empty the trash before files are totally deleted. This is a safety feature to make sure you don't delete files accidentally. If files were deleted solely by dragged to the trash, users would complain they didn't get a second notification for files being deleted. I still have to ?Empty Recycle Bin? on my windows computer at work before files are totally deleted as well, so it?s not a new or distinctly Apple feature either.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
I don't understand why they don't just hold 10.5.6 until the new hardware ships in January. That way all Macs would be running the same build of the OS instead of the rather idiotic "normal" situation where each new piece of hardware requires its own unique build.
I understand people are waiting for fixes now, but for a lot of people whether they release December 23 or January 6 is irrelevant.
What's the big deal if a new Mac isn't running the same build or version number of your Mac? It is still the same set of features. New hardware doesn't always get its own unique build. Even if it does, it doesn't offer any new features, it only adds support for new hardware. Most likely, the "new" Macs will be running a slightly older version of Mac OS X Leopard, since that is what they have been developed on.
My iMac G5 was released in Oct 2005. It shipped with OS X 10.4.2. The official release of 10.4.2 was three months earlier in July. When I bought the iMac in February 2006, Mac OS X 10.4.5 was already released. So it really didn't matter which version was shipped with my Mac, or which version was readily available at the time. In either case, it was running the current version after a software update.
Drones of others??? What are you talking about? Why don't you give some examples of which Macs may be affected. I don't have any problems with my Macs staying connected to my wireless router. I don't think anyone else experiences your alleged problems with a wireless network.
I am sure you haven't and probably most users haven't. But if a small percentage have that still makes for a LARGE amount of people. LARGE amounts or DRONES are relative terms so I may be exaggerating in your eyes. Lets agree on the term MANY, and move on. Here's an article you may remember as a visitor to AI - http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._wireless.html
I used the search term 'wifi cuts out on macbook' when trying to solve my problem and discovered I was by no means alone. My brother cannot use the wifi on his iMac and my Macbook works but drops the connection after sleep.
We have the same problems with our iPhones. I only have the wireless "N" set up for the iPhones. The rest of the network is GB Ethernet.
The WiFi symbol shows up on the phone, but as soon as you try to use it, it drops to 3G. Can't figure that one out. The phone works on most other networks. I'm assuming it's the router, but, who knows?
The iPhone doesn't support wireless N. That's your problem. The iPhone only supports 802.11b/g.
What would be nice is if OS X would stop putting those Desktop.DS files EVERYWHERE and having a 4k file of ._filenamehere of every file you open on an NTFS/FAT32 partition (or at least a user accessible option to stop it from putting such silly files everywhere that clutter and take up space!)
Are you talking about the invisible DS_Store files? Do you know why they are everywhere? They hold the view settings information for each window. You can use Cocktail to delete them all, if you like, then all your custom window view settings will be gone.
I agree about the ._filename invisible files that appear when you copy files to a FAT32 partition (especially USB flash drives). Not sure what creates those. I used a utility to show all invisible and system files and I deleted a bunch that were invisible on my Desktop.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
It works that way for drives attached over the network. Why it should delete files automatically from external drives beats me, they can often be as permanent as the internal drive, especially when you have an iMac.
I am sure you haven't and probably most users haven't. But if a small percentage have that still makes for a LARGE amount of people. LARGE amounts or DRONES are relative terms so I may be exaggerating in your eyes. Lets agree on the term MANY, and move on. Here's an article you may remember as a visitor to AI - http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._wireless.html
I used the search term 'wifi cuts out on macbook' when trying to solve my problem and discovered I was by no means alone. My brother cannot use the wifi on his iMac and my Macbook works but drops the connection after sleep.
Your earlier comment implied that every Mac user and every Mac has a problem connecting to a wireless network. A small percentage doesn't make for a large amount of people. A large percentage does. Have you thought about taking your Macs in for service to see if the wireless card is defective, or maybe a problem with the antenna? Or maybe your router is bad?
We have the same problems with our iPhones. I only have the wireless "N" set up for the iPhones. The rest of the network is GB Ethernet.
The WiFi symbol shows up on the phone, but as soon as you try to use it, it drops to 3G. Can't figure that one out. The phone works on most other networks. I'm assuming it's the router, but, who knows?
Your earlier comment implied that every Mac user and every Mac has a problem connecting to a wireless network. A small percentage doesn't make for a large amount of people. A large percentage does. Have you thought about taking your Macs in for service to see if the wireless card is defective, or maybe a problem with the antenna? Or maybe your router is bad?
Which part of my earlier mail suggested to you that every Mac and Every user had this problem? A small percentage surely means a low percentage number. A low percentage of millions makes for a pretty high number. Did you follow the link I posted by the way? If you do you will see that this problem is wide spread and very hard to fix. In fact, there is no fix as of yet.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
It's much safer than the way its done in Windows.
Also, often, we need to "park" files in the trash for testing reasons, etc. If the files were removed every time we placed them in the trash, it could cause problems later, when we needed to put them back, esp. if they were system files.
It's the same reasoning Apple has used for decades about you not being able to remove something without first letting the computer know, so that it could first update the database on the removable media.
One reason why PCDOS and early Windows used to crash as much as it did was because it didn't do that. You could just remove a disk at anytime, without updating it.
Also, often, we need to "park" files in the trash for testing reasons, etc. If the files were removed every time we placed them in the trash, it could cause problems later, when we needed to put them back, esp. if they were system files.
It's the same reasoning Apple has used for decades about you not being able to remove something without first letting the computer know, so that it could first update the database on the removable media.
One reason why PCDOS and early Windows used to crash as much as it did was because it didn't do that. You could just remove a disk at anytime, without updating it.
Put it back and : Crash!!!
Safety is better than minor convenience.
Agree, I often park files in the trash to see if the system works without them, it's a useful feature. I guess I'm just used to emptying the trash and don't see it as troublesome.
Agree, I often park files in the trash to see if the system works without them, it's a useful feature. I guess I'm just used to emptying the trash and don't see it as troublesome.
Exactly!
I've even had people complain to me that they thought the trash should be emptied automatically every time they shut their machine off!
So- 64 bit support for macs made in early 2008 only? Why? My MBP has a core duo processor, and i bought it end of last year why the hell would it not use 64-bit stuff?
So- 64 bit support for macs made in early 2008 only? Why? My MBP has a core duo processor, and i bought it end of last year why the hell would it not use 64-bit stuff?
Oh NOs!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
Additionally, the notes show hardware support for Snow Leopard's 64-bit kernel to remain limited to Macs introduced during the first half of the year, namely the early 2008 Mac Pro, early 2008 iMacs, and early 2008 MacBook Pro.
Apple will extend 64-bit kernel support to additional Macs as Snow Leopard development progresses.
Are you talking about the invisible DS_Store files? Do you know why they are everywhere? They hold the view settings information for each window. You can use Cocktail to delete them all, if you like, then all your custom window view settings will be gone.
I agree about the ._filename invisible files that appear when you copy files to a FAT32 partition (especially USB flash drives). Not sure what creates those. I used a utility to show all invisible and system files and I deleted a bunch that were invisible on my Desktop.
Yes, I meant the DS_Store files, and also, I know what they do. Personally, I don't care if my folders look the same next time I open them (I prefer them all to look the same). But, its really annoying when using a central server that Macs and PCs use to see these files in each folder. Yes, there are utilities that do this, but I think Apple should make it an option in their OS under System Prefs: Appearance that way their OS truely does "Play nice with Windows"
Those on my company server keep asking me "What are these files, and do I need to keep them?" It confuses many folk who don't know, and leave the files, only to find a bunch of them everywhere when they do a search with something that has "DS" in the filename, or "Store" (the last one being very frequent)
As for the ._filename, you can thank Spotlight for that as it stores metadata there. Again, an option would be wonderful. But nope... gotta do it the Apple way.
Always the Apple way... even if you don't use it, you'll see it if someone else does. Blah. Annoyances are all they are really... but so is the Blue Screen of Death and Vista!
I moved photos from my MicroSD to the trash and the memory count on the MicroSD didn't move down one bit. Every time I tried to copy a new file to the MicroSD card it said it was full. I had to empty the trash for the memory on the MicroSD card to free-up. That's just plain retarded for the OS to hold that memory hostage like that.
This story reminds me of the very first "family & friends" tech support incident I had to deal with:
It was around the time that Windows 95 first came out, and I had been mostly using DOS up to that point (found it much quicker to use than Windows 3.1, and I couldn't afford a Mac). The father of a friend of mine was having problems with their new computer (running Win 95) and it turned out the problems were due to the fact that the hard drive was full. I tried deleting a bunch of files to clear up some hard drive space, but I found that the hard drive was still full. I was stymied for a while until I decided to investigate this thing called the "Recycle Bin". Sure enough, I could see all of the files I deleted in there, and by playing around enough, eventually figured out how to fully delete those files and recover the hard drive space.
So yes, even though the Trash/Recycle Bin analogy is commonplace to me now, I can relate to not comprehending why, when you delete a file, you don't immediately get the space back. However, it's certainly not a bug in the OS.
It works that way for drives attached over the network. Why it should delete files automatically from external drives beats me, they can often be as permanent as the internal drive, especially when you have an iMac.
I said prompt the user. I'm talking MicroSD memory for a camera. Is that so surprising that someone would want to permanently delete from a MicroSD card?
Networked drives are quite a different story from a USB or Firewire attached unit since they use a network protocol like TCP/IP.
Windows at least has the common sense to ask you if you want to delete a file when it is too large for the trash bin, but not necessarily too large for the volume.
This story reminds me of the very first "family & friends" tech support incident I had to deal with:
It was around the time that Windows 95 first came out, and I had been mostly using DOS up to that point (found it much quicker to use than Windows 3.1, and I couldn't afford a Mac). The father of a friend of mine was having problems with their new computer (running Win 95) and it turned out the problems were due to the fact that the hard drive was full. I tried deleting a bunch of files to clear up some hard drive space, but I found that the hard drive was still full. I was stymied for a while until I decided to investigate this thing called the "Recycle Bin". Sure enough, I could see all of the files I deleted in there, and by playing around enough, eventually figured out how to fully delete those files and recover the hard drive space.
So yes, even though the Trash/Recycle Bin analogy is commonplace to me now, I can relate to not comprehending why, when you delete a file, you don't immediately get the space back. However, it's certainly not a bug in the OS.
I comprehend "moving file to trash" especially when it is spelled out for you. I didn't connect the dots when I moved the image files to trash and the space was still used on the MicroSD drive. This works differently in Windows obviously for which I was used to.
Comments
"I'd like to see the annoying bug I discovered last night taken care of. Of course it may actually be a feature. I moved photos from my MicroSD to the trash and the memory count on the MicroSD didn't move down one bit. Every time I tried to copy a new file to the MicroSD card it said it was full. I had to empty the trash for the memory on the MicroSD card to free-up. That's just plain retarded for the OS to hold that memory hostage like that. The trash and the flash memory need to part-ways in one of these bug fixes."
This has been the standard feature for a long time, I think it predates OSX, but I could be wrong, seems like it has always been this way. You have to empty the trash before files are totally deleted. This is a safety feature to make sure you don't delete files accidentally. If files were deleted solely by dragged to the trash, users would complain they didn't get a second notification for files being deleted. I still have to ?Empty Recycle Bin? on my windows computer at work before files are totally deleted as well, so it?s not a new or distinctly Apple feature either.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
I don't understand why they don't just hold 10.5.6 until the new hardware ships in January. That way all Macs would be running the same build of the OS instead of the rather idiotic "normal" situation where each new piece of hardware requires its own unique build.
I understand people are waiting for fixes now, but for a lot of people whether they release December 23 or January 6 is irrelevant.
What's the big deal if a new Mac isn't running the same build or version number of your Mac? It is still the same set of features. New hardware doesn't always get its own unique build. Even if it does, it doesn't offer any new features, it only adds support for new hardware. Most likely, the "new" Macs will be running a slightly older version of Mac OS X Leopard, since that is what they have been developed on.
My iMac G5 was released in Oct 2005. It shipped with OS X 10.4.2. The official release of 10.4.2 was three months earlier in July. When I bought the iMac in February 2006, Mac OS X 10.4.5 was already released. So it really didn't matter which version was shipped with my Mac, or which version was readily available at the time. In either case, it was running the current version after a software update.
Drones of others??? What are you talking about? Why don't you give some examples of which Macs may be affected. I don't have any problems with my Macs staying connected to my wireless router. I don't think anyone else experiences your alleged problems with a wireless network.
I am sure you haven't and probably most users haven't. But if a small percentage have that still makes for a LARGE amount of people. LARGE amounts or DRONES are relative terms so I may be exaggerating in your eyes. Lets agree on the term MANY, and move on. Here's an article you may remember as a visitor to AI - http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._wireless.html
I used the search term 'wifi cuts out on macbook' when trying to solve my problem and discovered I was by no means alone. My brother cannot use the wifi on his iMac and my Macbook works but drops the connection after sleep.
We have the same problems with our iPhones. I only have the wireless "N" set up for the iPhones. The rest of the network is GB Ethernet.
The WiFi symbol shows up on the phone, but as soon as you try to use it, it drops to 3G. Can't figure that one out. The phone works on most other networks. I'm assuming it's the router, but, who knows?
The iPhone doesn't support wireless N. That's your problem. The iPhone only supports 802.11b/g.
What would be nice is if OS X would stop putting those Desktop.DS files EVERYWHERE and having a 4k file of ._filenamehere of every file you open on an NTFS/FAT32 partition (or at least a user accessible option to stop it from putting such silly files everywhere that clutter and take up space!)
Are you talking about the invisible DS_Store files? Do you know why they are everywhere? They hold the view settings information for each window. You can use Cocktail to delete them all, if you like, then all your custom window view settings will be gone.
I agree about the ._filename invisible files that appear when you copy files to a FAT32 partition (especially USB flash drives). Not sure what creates those. I used a utility to show all invisible and system files and I deleted a bunch that were invisible on my Desktop.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
It works that way for drives attached over the network. Why it should delete files automatically from external drives beats me, they can often be as permanent as the internal drive, especially when you have an iMac.
I am sure you haven't and probably most users haven't. But if a small percentage have that still makes for a LARGE amount of people. LARGE amounts or DRONES are relative terms so I may be exaggerating in your eyes. Lets agree on the term MANY, and move on. Here's an article you may remember as a visitor to AI - http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._wireless.html
I used the search term 'wifi cuts out on macbook' when trying to solve my problem and discovered I was by no means alone. My brother cannot use the wifi on his iMac and my Macbook works but drops the connection after sleep.
Your earlier comment implied that every Mac user and every Mac has a problem connecting to a wireless network. A small percentage doesn't make for a large amount of people. A large percentage does. Have you thought about taking your Macs in for service to see if the wireless card is defective, or maybe a problem with the antenna? Or maybe your router is bad?
We have the same problems with our iPhones. I only have the wireless "N" set up for the iPhones. The rest of the network is GB Ethernet.
The WiFi symbol shows up on the phone, but as soon as you try to use it, it drops to 3G. Can't figure that one out. The phone works on most other networks. I'm assuming it's the router, but, who knows?
iphone only supports b/g wireless.
Your earlier comment implied that every Mac user and every Mac has a problem connecting to a wireless network. A small percentage doesn't make for a large amount of people. A large percentage does. Have you thought about taking your Macs in for service to see if the wireless card is defective, or maybe a problem with the antenna? Or maybe your router is bad?
Which part of my earlier mail suggested to you that every Mac and Every user had this problem? A small percentage surely means a low percentage number. A low percentage of millions makes for a pretty high number. Did you follow the link I posted by the way? If you do you will see that this problem is wide spread and very hard to fix. In fact, there is no fix as of yet.
That makes sense to me now. I can see the benefits of this feature I suppose.
I would just figure for external storage devices the OS would prompt you to permanently delete the files or not. The OS knows it is external when it is connected via USB and it can figure-out the free space on the device too so it could be a little smarter. Obviously I'm tainted by my Windows experience.
It's much safer than the way its done in Windows.
Also, often, we need to "park" files in the trash for testing reasons, etc. If the files were removed every time we placed them in the trash, it could cause problems later, when we needed to put them back, esp. if they were system files.
It's the same reasoning Apple has used for decades about you not being able to remove something without first letting the computer know, so that it could first update the database on the removable media.
One reason why PCDOS and early Windows used to crash as much as it did was because it didn't do that. You could just remove a disk at anytime, without updating it.
Put it back and : Crash!!!
Safety is better than minor convenience.
iphone only supports b/g wireless.
I know, I already explained that.
It's much safer than the way its done in Windows.
Also, often, we need to "park" files in the trash for testing reasons, etc. If the files were removed every time we placed them in the trash, it could cause problems later, when we needed to put them back, esp. if they were system files.
It's the same reasoning Apple has used for decades about you not being able to remove something without first letting the computer know, so that it could first update the database on the removable media.
One reason why PCDOS and early Windows used to crash as much as it did was because it didn't do that. You could just remove a disk at anytime, without updating it.
Put it back and : Crash!!!
Safety is better than minor convenience.
Agree, I often park files in the trash to see if the system works without them, it's a useful feature. I guess I'm just used to emptying the trash and don't see it as troublesome.
Agree, I often park files in the trash to see if the system works without them, it's a useful feature. I guess I'm just used to emptying the trash and don't see it as troublesome.
Exactly!
I've even had people complain to me that they thought the trash should be emptied automatically every time they shut their machine off!
Sheesh!
So- 64 bit support for macs made in early 2008 only? Why? My MBP has a core duo processor, and i bought it end of last year why the hell would it not use 64-bit stuff?
Oh NOs!!
Additionally, the notes show hardware support for Snow Leopard's 64-bit kernel to remain limited to Macs introduced during the first half of the year, namely the early 2008 Mac Pro, early 2008 iMacs, and early 2008 MacBook Pro.
Apple will extend 64-bit kernel support to additional Macs as Snow Leopard development progresses.
Whew...
Are you talking about the invisible DS_Store files? Do you know why they are everywhere? They hold the view settings information for each window. You can use Cocktail to delete them all, if you like, then all your custom window view settings will be gone.
I agree about the ._filename invisible files that appear when you copy files to a FAT32 partition (especially USB flash drives). Not sure what creates those. I used a utility to show all invisible and system files and I deleted a bunch that were invisible on my Desktop.
Yes, I meant the DS_Store files, and also, I know what they do. Personally, I don't care if my folders look the same next time I open them (I prefer them all to look the same). But, its really annoying when using a central server that Macs and PCs use to see these files in each folder. Yes, there are utilities that do this, but I think Apple should make it an option in their OS under System Prefs: Appearance that way their OS truely does "Play nice with Windows"
Those on my company server keep asking me "What are these files, and do I need to keep them?" It confuses many folk who don't know, and leave the files, only to find a bunch of them everywhere when they do a search with something that has "DS" in the filename, or "Store" (the last one being very frequent)
As for the ._filename, you can thank Spotlight for that as it stores metadata there. Again, an option would be wonderful. But nope... gotta do it the Apple way.
Always the Apple way... even if you don't use it, you'll see it if someone else does. Blah. Annoyances are all they are really... but so is the Blue Screen of Death and Vista!
I moved photos from my MicroSD to the trash and the memory count on the MicroSD didn't move down one bit. Every time I tried to copy a new file to the MicroSD card it said it was full. I had to empty the trash for the memory on the MicroSD card to free-up. That's just plain retarded for the OS to hold that memory hostage like that.
This story reminds me of the very first "family & friends" tech support incident I had to deal with:
It was around the time that Windows 95 first came out, and I had been mostly using DOS up to that point (found it much quicker to use than Windows 3.1, and I couldn't afford a Mac). The father of a friend of mine was having problems with their new computer (running Win 95) and it turned out the problems were due to the fact that the hard drive was full. I tried deleting a bunch of files to clear up some hard drive space, but I found that the hard drive was still full. I was stymied for a while until I decided to investigate this thing called the "Recycle Bin". Sure enough, I could see all of the files I deleted in there, and by playing around enough, eventually figured out how to fully delete those files and recover the hard drive space.
So yes, even though the Trash/Recycle Bin analogy is commonplace to me now, I can relate to not comprehending why, when you delete a file, you don't immediately get the space back. However, it's certainly not a bug in the OS.
It works that way for drives attached over the network. Why it should delete files automatically from external drives beats me, they can often be as permanent as the internal drive, especially when you have an iMac.
I said prompt the user. I'm talking MicroSD memory for a camera. Is that so surprising that someone would want to permanently delete from a MicroSD card?
Networked drives are quite a different story from a USB or Firewire attached unit since they use a network protocol like TCP/IP.
Windows at least has the common sense to ask you if you want to delete a file when it is too large for the trash bin, but not necessarily too large for the volume.
This story reminds me of the very first "family & friends" tech support incident I had to deal with:
It was around the time that Windows 95 first came out, and I had been mostly using DOS up to that point (found it much quicker to use than Windows 3.1, and I couldn't afford a Mac). The father of a friend of mine was having problems with their new computer (running Win 95) and it turned out the problems were due to the fact that the hard drive was full. I tried deleting a bunch of files to clear up some hard drive space, but I found that the hard drive was still full. I was stymied for a while until I decided to investigate this thing called the "Recycle Bin". Sure enough, I could see all of the files I deleted in there, and by playing around enough, eventually figured out how to fully delete those files and recover the hard drive space.
So yes, even though the Trash/Recycle Bin analogy is commonplace to me now, I can relate to not comprehending why, when you delete a file, you don't immediately get the space back. However, it's certainly not a bug in the OS.
I comprehend "moving file to trash" especially when it is spelled out for you. I didn't connect the dots when I moved the image files to trash and the space was still used on the MicroSD drive. This works differently in Windows obviously for which I was used to.