If it is just a rounding error, why spend real money to advertise against Apple?
They only really spend in the US, where the share gains by Apple are less of a rounding error - they are making gains in the US, so it makes sense that they look to defend.
Ballmer is right globally though, Apple's share gains overall are insignificant. Whether we Apple fans like it or not, Mac sales are tiny when compared with the overall Personal Computer market.
I can't understand why so many people would chose Windows over Mac, but there we go.
Steve Ballmer will end up sucking the life blood out of M$. He is the pinnacle idiot. I know of no other person with such huge blinders on. But, alas, I shouldn't complain to loudly. It is actually fun to watch him show his ass at every turn, the entertainment value is just priceless. Not to mention watching M$ trying to copy everything about Apple time and time again only to, once again, watch the market leader go down in flames.
They advertise against Apple because there is no one else to advertise against. That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago. Apple makes Windows PC more appealing. People like to get a bargin. That is why the sell so many Chevy's.
??
MS didn't bail Apple out. Apple had MS over a legal barrel regarding patent violations - a battle which MS would have lost. Apple at the time, in a roundabout way, blackmailed MS into a deal. And the rest is history. Apple caught MS with its pants down, hunched over the photocopier, and took advantage of the situation.
The rest of your post makes no sense. I'm not sure how "Apple makes Windows PC more appealing." Apparently, it doesn't.
As previously submitted by another poster on MD† re Ballmers statement,
"When you see the hardware, the PC designs that will come out this Christmas with Windows 7, I think that conventional wisdom can begin to really change. There is some really amazing, amazing work. So it is possible to get great hardware innovation, even when hardware and software comes from separate companies."
Quote:
"Yes (Steve,) there is a Santa Claus. HE exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy."*
MS didn't bail Apple out. Apple had MS over a legal barrel regarding patent violations - a battle which MS would have lost. Apple at the time, in a roundabout way, blackmailed MS into a deal. And the rest is history. Apple caught MS with its pants down, hunched over the photocopier, and took advantage of the situation.
[...]
Not disagreeing, but wanted to point out that it has always been in MS's best interest to keep Apple alive when they were faltering ( and lets be honest... Apple in the 90's was barely hanging on at times). Having Apple around bolsters Microsoft's defense that they were not a monopoly. They would ( correctly ) point out that people are free to choose Mac OS as a platform. What do you think the *real* reason is that there is Microsoft Office for Mac?
In truth, Ballmer, though he is an idiot, is right that Microsoft's core business will not be touched by Apple... YET. Apple is handing them their own arses in all other segments of business though. That will hurt MS in the long run. Apple has sweetly positioned itself as the "great enabler". Microsoft once was today's "Apple" when they were fighting against IBM. Microsoft has become "IBM" in public perception. MS continues to talk and talk and talk about innovation and features. None of it ever makes it to market.
What? Not to expensive? WTF Windows is the most expensive OS!
At $299 for a basic retail version and $399 for a premium, thats not expensive?
FYI: Apple has sold 10 million "PC's" and how many did Microsoft sell? Um, 0! All they do is sell software for PC, not hardware!
Microsoft makes its money from volume OEM sales and corporate. They get a fraction of the retail price with the volume discounts.
They only sell a tiny, tiny, tiny amount of Microsoft Windows at retail. That is probably going to change a bit with Windows 7 given how fantastic it runs on older hardware. For the first time in a long time, you can actually improve the performance of your computer by updating to the latest version of Microsoft Windows.
Ballmer laughs everything off and most things come to bite him in the backside. M$ has been a little too smug as of late, its actually pretty annoying considering the company isn't doing too well lately. Ballmers appointment as CEO is almost like giving the village idiot the job as mayor
Not disagreeing, but wanted to point out that it has always been in MS's best interest to keep Apple alive when they were faltering ( and lets be honest... Apple in the 90's was barely hanging on at times). Having Apple around bolsters Microsoft's defense that they were not a monopoly. They would ( correctly ) point out that people are free to choose Mac OS as a platform. What do you think the *real* reason is that there is Microsoft Office for Mac?
In truth, Ballmer, though he is an idiot, is right that Microsoft's core business will not be touched by Apple... YET. Apple is handing them their own arses in all other segments of business though. That will hurt MS in the long run. Apple has sweetly positioned itself as the "great enabler". Microsoft once was today's "Apple" when they were fighting against IBM. Microsoft has become "IBM" in public perception. MS continues to talk and talk and talk about innovation and features. None of it ever makes it to market.
A reasonable view. It certainly is advantageous in certain respects to have MS around. And frankly, Apple seems to look their best in a strong #2 position overall.
"That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago."
Sorry, "phal," but Microsoft did no such thing. When little Billy G's company sent $150 million to Apple "years ago," it was to keep himself and his company out of jail! Microsoft (via one of its supposed "subcontractors) was caught red-handed stealing the code from QuickTime to make its own media support system. Yes, STEALING THE CODE. Gotcha!
The settlement of this matter, accomplished out of court, was the transfer of funds you allude to, above. Believe me, there is no love lost between Microsoft and ANY of its present or former competitors: not Netscape, not Word Perfect, not anybody.
Do NOT delude your self into believing that Microsoft bailed out Apple. Didn't happen. They bailed THEMSELVES out of just one more in a long list of ethical (not to say CRIMINAL) activities here and around the world.
What? Not to expensive? WTF Windows is the most expensive OS!
At $299 for a basic retail version and $399 for a premium, thats not expensive?
FYI: Apple has sold 10 million "PC's" and how many did Microsoft sell? Um, 0! All they do is sell software for PC, not hardware!
I never thought of it that way... it explains why MSFT is focusing on the cost of PCs instead of the cost of the OS in their advertisements. They do not sell PCs. This is a dodge to make you think Mac is more expensive. I wonder how people will feel about MSFT when they try to upgrade their existing system to Windows 7! Apparently the best way to upgrade is to purchase a new PC... (see Walt Mossberg's article on the upgrade).
Ballmer highlights MSFTs weakness by trying to diminish the competition's strength at the same time they attempt to copy it.
Whoa. The reality is that AFTER having spent their advertising dollars, Apple is then costing them nothing. [using your words]
It should not be expected that MS's current position of Apple's being 'insignificant' was accomplished out of thin air. It has been accomplished via Ms's marketing and advertising.
I am not wanting to be sounding like I am on either side but you've got to recognize that the advertising is supposed to have accomplished something.
Ballmer was focusing on the hardware but to be honest my Mac Book Pro and even my iPhone don't stand out on quality. Let's face it iPhone is a thin brick and the MBP a fold open box.
The key to both products is the OS driving each unit. It is brilliant that Apple has taken UNIX so far. In both cases OS and APIs striving for high quality.
In a way though he is focused on an issue the Mac community needs to take a look at. That is the obsession with market share relative to Microsoft. What Apple needs is healthy and controlled growth in shipments that make the company stronger. What is happening anyone quarter against Microsoft isn't relavant. With sustained growth Microsoft will eventually loose but Apple can't loose sight of quality.
In a way Ballmer has a point even though he completely misses on why Microsoft is having so many problems. Let's face it there is hardware out there that equals or exceeeds Apples notebooks in physical quality but nothing comes close with respect to the operating system or customer service.
You guys quit dogging Ballmer. He is eminently qualified to be Microsoft CEO. He was Bill Gates' college buddy.
A "ROUNDING ERROR"
---Well that pretty much describes Ball-mur doesn't it!---
(Ball-mur was a poker and drinking buddy of Gates-someone he could laugh at and who followed him around worshipping his code writing skills. But they both bowed before the 'eminent,' porcelain throne on the weekends!)
Steve Ballmer will end up sucking the life blood out of M$. He is the pinnacle idiot. I know of no other person with such huge blinders on. But, alas, I shouldn't complain to loudly. It is actually fun to watch him show his ass at every turn, the entertainment value is just priceless. Not to mention watching M$ trying to copy everything about Apple time and time again only to, once again, watch the market leader go down in flames.
"That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago."
Sorry, "phal," but Microsoft did no such thing. When little Billy G's company sent $150 million to Apple "years ago," it was to keep himself and his company out of jail! Microsoft (via one of its supposed "subcontractors) was caught red-handed stealing the code from QuickTime to make its own media support system. Yes, STEALING THE CODE. Gotcha!
The settlement of this matter, accomplished out of court, was the transfer of funds you allude to, above. Believe me, there is no love lost between Microsoft and ANY of its present or former competitors: not Netscape, not Word Perfect, not anybody.
Do NOT delude your self into believing that Microsoft bailed out Apple. Didn't happen. They bailed THEMSELVES out of just one more in a long list of ethical (not to say CRIMINAL) activities here and around the world.
Completely forgot it was the Quicktime issue. I knew there was some kind of theft/photocopying involved, however. Good post. Takes me back.
Comments
If it is just a rounding error, why spend real money to advertise against Apple?
They only really spend in the US, where the share gains by Apple are less of a rounding error - they are making gains in the US, so it makes sense that they look to defend.
Ballmer is right globally though, Apple's share gains overall are insignificant. Whether we Apple fans like it or not, Mac sales are tiny when compared with the overall Personal Computer market.
I can't understand why so many people would chose Windows over Mac, but there we go.
They advertise against Apple because there is no one else to advertise against. That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago. Apple makes Windows PC more appealing. People like to get a bargin. That is why the sell so many Chevy's.
??
MS didn't bail Apple out. Apple had MS over a legal barrel regarding patent violations - a battle which MS would have lost. Apple at the time, in a roundabout way, blackmailed MS into a deal. And the rest is history. Apple caught MS with its pants down, hunched over the photocopier, and took advantage of the situation.
The rest of your post makes no sense. I'm not sure how "Apple makes Windows PC more appealing." Apparently, it doesn't.
People like to get a bargin. That is why the sell so many Chevy's.
Is that why GM went bankrupt and needed to be bailed out by the US Gov then?
"When you see the hardware, the PC designs that will come out this Christmas with Windows 7, I think that conventional wisdom can begin to really change. There is some really amazing, amazing work. So it is possible to get great hardware innovation, even when hardware and software comes from separate companies."
"Yes (Steve,) there is a Santa Claus. HE exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy."*
But unfortunately for you, HE works for Apple.
And HE, has been a very good boy.
*http://www.newseum.org/yesvirginia/ (FP Church. Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus. New York Sun Editorial; Sept 21, 1897.)
† http://macdailynews.com/index.php/we...omments/21955/
You guys quit dogging Ballmer. He is eminently qualified to be Microsoft CEO. He was Bill Gates' college buddy.
I was in same cell with Bill Gates in Albuquerque, New Mexico back in 1977. Can I be CEO next?
??
MS didn't bail Apple out. Apple had MS over a legal barrel regarding patent violations - a battle which MS would have lost. Apple at the time, in a roundabout way, blackmailed MS into a deal. And the rest is history. Apple caught MS with its pants down, hunched over the photocopier, and took advantage of the situation.
[...]
Not disagreeing, but wanted to point out that it has always been in MS's best interest to keep Apple alive when they were faltering ( and lets be honest... Apple in the 90's was barely hanging on at times). Having Apple around bolsters Microsoft's defense that they were not a monopoly. They would ( correctly ) point out that people are free to choose Mac OS as a platform. What do you think the *real* reason is that there is Microsoft Office for Mac?
In truth, Ballmer, though he is an idiot, is right that Microsoft's core business will not be touched by Apple... YET. Apple is handing them their own arses in all other segments of business though. That will hurt MS in the long run. Apple has sweetly positioned itself as the "great enabler". Microsoft once was today's "Apple" when they were fighting against IBM. Microsoft has become "IBM" in public perception. MS continues to talk and talk and talk about innovation and features. None of it ever makes it to market.
Lets go back to that line,
What? Not to expensive? WTF Windows is the most expensive OS!
At $299 for a basic retail version and $399 for a premium, thats not expensive?
FYI: Apple has sold 10 million "PC's" and how many did Microsoft sell? Um, 0! All they do is sell software for PC, not hardware!
Microsoft makes its money from volume OEM sales and corporate. They get a fraction of the retail price with the volume discounts.
They only sell a tiny, tiny, tiny amount of Microsoft Windows at retail. That is probably going to change a bit with Windows 7 given how fantastic it runs on older hardware. For the first time in a long time, you can actually improve the performance of your computer by updating to the latest version of Microsoft Windows.
This A Hole is destructive and now that he's at the helm of MS
he think he's GOD and can do whatever the hell he wants.
At least Gates was more elegant and smarter.
oh well....
Not disagreeing, but wanted to point out that it has always been in MS's best interest to keep Apple alive when they were faltering ( and lets be honest... Apple in the 90's was barely hanging on at times). Having Apple around bolsters Microsoft's defense that they were not a monopoly. They would ( correctly ) point out that people are free to choose Mac OS as a platform. What do you think the *real* reason is that there is Microsoft Office for Mac?
In truth, Ballmer, though he is an idiot, is right that Microsoft's core business will not be touched by Apple... YET. Apple is handing them their own arses in all other segments of business though. That will hurt MS in the long run. Apple has sweetly positioned itself as the "great enabler". Microsoft once was today's "Apple" when they were fighting against IBM. Microsoft has become "IBM" in public perception. MS continues to talk and talk and talk about innovation and features. None of it ever makes it to market.
A reasonable view. It certainly is advantageous in certain respects to have MS around. And frankly, Apple seems to look their best in a strong #2 position overall.
"That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago."
Sorry, "phal," but Microsoft did no such thing. When little Billy G's company sent $150 million to Apple "years ago," it was to keep himself and his company out of jail! Microsoft (via one of its supposed "subcontractors) was caught red-handed stealing the code from QuickTime to make its own media support system. Yes, STEALING THE CODE. Gotcha!
The settlement of this matter, accomplished out of court, was the transfer of funds you allude to, above. Believe me, there is no love lost between Microsoft and ANY of its present or former competitors: not Netscape, not Word Perfect, not anybody.
Do NOT delude your self into believing that Microsoft bailed out Apple. Didn't happen. They bailed THEMSELVES out of just one more in a long list of ethical (not to say CRIMINAL) activities here and around the world.
Lets go back to that line,
What? Not to expensive? WTF Windows is the most expensive OS!
At $299 for a basic retail version and $399 for a premium, thats not expensive?
FYI: Apple has sold 10 million "PC's" and how many did Microsoft sell? Um, 0! All they do is sell software for PC, not hardware!
I never thought of it that way... it explains why MSFT is focusing on the cost of PCs instead of the cost of the OS in their advertisements. They do not sell PCs. This is a dodge to make you think Mac is more expensive. I wonder how people will feel about MSFT when they try to upgrade their existing system to Windows 7! Apparently the best way to upgrade is to purchase a new PC... (see Walt Mossberg's article on the upgrade).
Ballmer highlights MSFTs weakness by trying to diminish the competition's strength at the same time they attempt to copy it.
Whoa. The reality is that AFTER having spent their advertising dollars, Apple is then costing them nothing. [using your words]
It should not be expected that MS's current position of Apple's being 'insignificant' was accomplished out of thin air. It has been accomplished via Ms's marketing and advertising.
I am not wanting to be sounding like I am on either side but you've got to recognize that the advertising is supposed to have accomplished something.
You obviously didn't get what I said.....
The key to both products is the OS driving each unit. It is brilliant that Apple has taken UNIX so far. In both cases OS and APIs striving for high quality.
In a way though he is focused on an issue the Mac community needs to take a look at. That is the obsession with market share relative to Microsoft. What Apple needs is healthy and controlled growth in shipments that make the company stronger. What is happening anyone quarter against Microsoft isn't relavant. With sustained growth Microsoft will eventually loose but Apple can't loose sight of quality.
In a way Ballmer has a point even though he completely misses on why Microsoft is having so many problems. Let's face it there is hardware out there that equals or exceeeds Apples notebooks in physical quality but nothing comes close with respect to the operating system or customer service.
Dave
You guys quit dogging Ballmer. He is eminently qualified to be Microsoft CEO. He was Bill Gates' college buddy.
A "ROUNDING ERROR"
---Well that pretty much describes Ball-mur doesn't it!---
(Ball-mur was a poker and drinking buddy of Gates-someone he could laugh at and who followed him around worshipping his code writing skills. But they both bowed before the 'eminent,' porcelain throne on the weekends!)
Steve Ballmer will end up sucking the life blood out of M$. He is the pinnacle idiot. I know of no other person with such huge blinders on. But, alas, I shouldn't complain to loudly. It is actually fun to watch him show his ass at every turn, the entertainment value is just priceless. Not to mention watching M$ trying to copy everything about Apple time and time again only to, once again, watch the market leader go down in flames.
I couldn't agree more,
C
@phalanx,
"That is why the they bailed them out financially years ago."
Sorry, "phal," but Microsoft did no such thing. When little Billy G's company sent $150 million to Apple "years ago," it was to keep himself and his company out of jail! Microsoft (via one of its supposed "subcontractors) was caught red-handed stealing the code from QuickTime to make its own media support system. Yes, STEALING THE CODE. Gotcha!
The settlement of this matter, accomplished out of court, was the transfer of funds you allude to, above. Believe me, there is no love lost between Microsoft and ANY of its present or former competitors: not Netscape, not Word Perfect, not anybody.
Do NOT delude your self into believing that Microsoft bailed out Apple. Didn't happen. They bailed THEMSELVES out of just one more in a long list of ethical (not to say CRIMINAL) activities here and around the world.
Completely forgot it was the Quicktime issue. I knew there was some kind of theft/photocopying involved, however. Good post. Takes me back.