First I'd like to say I think it's obvious that Apple is playing games here. This is pretty clear. Even though we may not know all the reasons, clearly Apple is toying with the FCC.
Second - the reason Apple is toying with the FCC is because it's not politically correct for Apple to respond to the FCC by saying what really needs to be said, and that is this:
Dear FCC,
in regards to your enquiry about the rejection of the Google voice app. Damn right we rejected it. And to be perfectly honest, we don't need to give you or anyone else any reason for rejecting it. It's our product, and we have 100% authority of what is allowed on the phone and nobody else. This includes Google, and least of all the U.S. Government. It's called a "free market" and this is widely practiced in th U.S.A. to be perfectly honest, as long as we do not have a monopoly position (and last I checked 1% errors on the side of no monopoly) there is not a hell of a lot you can do about it.
To be perfectly honest, we are the ones who have made the smart phone market what it is today. And that is because we know what is right. If Google wants to make all their crappy apps available tooeople, they can submit it to a vendor who has lower standards then we do -there are plenty to choose from - Palm, Windows, and even Android to name just a few.
Again, we would like to emphasize that you - the FCC, has **** all to say about what we allow on our product, we abide by all laws we are required to follow, and FYI - allowing every ***** app that is submitted to the app store is not one of them. You would have better luck getting us to allow sync support for the Pre (which is not going to happen in a million years either btw)
mind you, we have no hard feelings - we realize that we are the hottest company in the history of technology and we are probably the coolest brand in the history of the world, and companies like you and Greenpeace like to latch onto that because it gets you a lot of press. Google also has friends in the Obama administration and probably called in a favour and is probably the only reason you are looking into this. Let's face facts - we both know this issue is none of your ******* business and anything short of an entire overhaul of the communications history and the free market - this letter is where it's going to end. So kindly - please **** off.
Kind Regards,
Steve.
While you might feel, in an emo sort of way, that Apple should respond like this, it would be the worst thing they could do.
The FCC is looking into regulation of this area of the industry, and that would convince them that it should be done.
We've had too many companies drunk with arrogance. That reply would would certainly fit in.
I'm not all the way on one side or the other about this, but I would like to see Apple clear up its position somewhat better than it has. I read the requirements Apple has set up, and while it may read to some as being clear as to what may and may not be done, that would be wrong. There is plenty of wiggle room for Apple.
I think that Apple should interpret their own rules as narrowly as possible. Sometimes they have to understand that they must give up a bit of revenue to make the customer happy.
And after all, if they're making most of their money selling the phones, and not the software, why would they care?
None of this makes any sense. What exactly is Apple's real motivation here?
If they don't want to allow GV on the iPhone, just come out and say so. Apple's just insulting their customers' intelligence, and perhaps worse the FCC, but playing semantics. Not approving the app, rejecting the app, bottom line is that the app is unavailable to customers.
Also, what about the previous third-party GV apps that were approved and then pulled from the app store? Why were they pulled?
Whatever the outcome of all this, I can't help but think that the Google/Apple relationship may take a serious hit. Stay tuned...
You sir are dead on...
I would prefer Apple just come out and say, we didn't like the app because we feel it duplicates the basic functionality of the OS. Then it would be over. Instead, they are looking more and more devious. I really like Apple products, but they are making the same mistakes they made in the 80's, too greedy and controlling. The only difference is this: the threat this go around isn't Microsoft, it's open source
I would prefer Apple just come out and say, we didn't like the app because we feel it duplicates the basic functionality of the OS. Then it would be over. Instead, they are looking more and more devious. I really like Apple products, but they are making the same mistakes they made in the 80's, too greedy and controlling. The only difference is this: the threat this go around isn't Microsoft, it's open source
I don't at all agree that the threat is open source. The threat is Google.
These apps, like OS X, start as open source, but are added to by major companies.
Open source programs aren't for profit. These are.
Google's apps are only there for Google's profit. They serve no other purpose than to up Google's sales and profits.
This locks you into a number of Google's services. Google gets Ad revenue from these services, and some may even be directly paid for.
Don't make the mistake of thinking that something that starts as open source always remains as open source.
I also have an HTC Magic here and I downloaded the GV application from the Android Market and I still can't use Google Voice.
I am in Australia the FCC should make Google release their service to ALL iPhone users before their App is accepted by Apple, the Google Voice service is dicriminatory and should be banned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas
All features available to users of the iPhone, with or without the native App. Apple banning it in no way prevents iPhone users from using the service. The app would have simply made it more convenient to use the service.
I'm just wondering if any of this crap will have any impact in the decisions made in the net neutrality rules that the FCC is set announce on Monday.
Probably not, since something with that much impact must have been in development for quite some time with I'm guessing about a BILLION+ edits before they finally had the okay to announce it to the public.
I think it could be an interesting day on Monday...
GV doesn't take bandwith, it's not a VoIP application, it uses cell minutes as normal calls
BUT - you were able to log-in to GV using your "free" AT&T data path and send GV Text Messages - for Free. Something AT&T does not like. They want you to send Text via the iPhone text app which - if you use it - is not free. That's were the $$$$ comes into this.
Eric has shown his true colors, he's nothing but a whining little child.
Steve was smart to test him by saying no, just to see what he would do.
Eric goes crying to the FCC like a little b*tch when he doesn't get his own way, instead of addressing Apple's concerns and if that didn't work, accepting rejection like a man and hope Apple turns around later in their decision once they got over any fears they had.
Yes folks, this the NEW SOCIALIST AMERICA! I lived in states that were like this, companies crying to the government when they don't get their own way, trying to pull strings. I never thought the whole country would get this way.
Apple has always been it's own ecosystem, it's a vertically integrated company, they make and control the hardware and the software for the best user experience.
Google has become EVIL, in the sense that they track and record as much as possible anything a person does online.
Google Analytics (tracks you), Google Ads (annoys you), Google Search (records you), Google Mail (snoops you?), Google Earth (root kits you), Google Voice (snoops you), Google Apps (watches you work), Google DID I MISS ANYTHING??
All going directly into marketing companies computers and then into Uncle Sam's snoop squad.
Fsck Google, I'm tired of their name, their company and everything about it.
I have to install a hosts file addition to block my computer from their online tracking, a outgoing firewall to block their accessing the internet from programs, and even use Firefox, Ad Block and Ghostery plugin to block their web garbage.
I even have to install the Better Privacy plugin to prevent any Flash cookies they might install. Normal cookie cleaning doesn't catch Flash cookies. 340 Flash cookies removed in the last month since I reinstalled OS X.
How many Flash cookies have you got? Nice hidden record there...
No, no, FCC, it's not fair to formulate this like that. It should be put as "new so-called net neutrality rule Monday that could prevent telecommunications, cable and wireless companies from blocking Google's Internet applications"
Google, you could definitely not to smash everything in your way like a panzer. Just wait a bit for Apple's contract with ATT expires. All that will become so much simpler.
As an Apple shareholder, and as an iPhone developer who has had to modify and re-submit apps to comply with Apple's guidelines and requests I think Google are being pathetic. They clearly don't want to play by the same rules as everyone else, they want to try and bully Apple into letting them do what they want on a platform they are guests on. Well I hope Apple tell them where to go.
As an Apple shareholder, and as an iPhone developer who has had to modify and re-submit apps to comply with Apple's guidelines and requests I think Google are being pathetic. They clearly don't want to play by the same rules as everyone else, they want to try and bully Apple into letting them do what they want on a platform they are guests on. Well I hope Apple tell them where to go.
Please, explains this to the developers which have seen their GV apps pulled from App Store.
They played the rules, their app was approved and months after banned. Ups, it's n
how clever you are, should have known this long time ago. how could anyone accuse apple of anything wrong? damn you google.
btw, did you know that fanboys rarely escape the stockyard?
on a side note, just make the IPA downloadable somewhere, and fu*k apple in the a*s.
It is, well at least GV Mobile is.
Join the world of the jailbreakers and you can get GV Mobile as well quite a few other applications that Apple deems inappropriate for their users... It's this type of crap by Apple that makes jailbreaking a necessity if you're going to own an iPhone and you want to control the equipment YOU own.
I also have an HTC Magic here and I downloaded the GV application from the Android Market and I still can't use Google Voice.
I am in Australia the FCC should make Google release their service to ALL iPhone users before their App is accepted by Apple, the Google Voice service is dicriminatory and should be banned.
Then you really need to get on the horn to the FCC to let them know of all the apps that are US only and that the Aussies feel discriminated against. Somethings are US only.
I am in Canada and can't fully use the GV service yet either. No more relevant than your comments about Aus, but true none the less.
As an Apple shareholder, and as an iPhone developer who has had to modify and re-submit apps to comply with Apple's guidelines and requests I think Google are being pathetic. They clearly don't want to play by the same rules as everyone else, they want to try and bully Apple into letting them do what they want on a platform they are guests on. Well I hope Apple tell them where to go.
Or they want to play by the rules and are puzzled as to why the rules are different for them.
You honestly see yourself as a guest on the iPhone platform? Really.
I didn't realize it was a requirement to hand your nuts over when you downloaded the SDK.
Comments
First I'd like to say I think it's obvious that Apple is playing games here. This is pretty clear. Even though we may not know all the reasons, clearly Apple is toying with the FCC.
Second - the reason Apple is toying with the FCC is because it's not politically correct for Apple to respond to the FCC by saying what really needs to be said, and that is this:
Dear FCC,
in regards to your enquiry about the rejection of the Google voice app. Damn right we rejected it. And to be perfectly honest, we don't need to give you or anyone else any reason for rejecting it. It's our product, and we have 100% authority of what is allowed on the phone and nobody else. This includes Google, and least of all the U.S. Government. It's called a "free market" and this is widely practiced in th U.S.A. to be perfectly honest, as long as we do not have a monopoly position (and last I checked 1% errors on the side of no monopoly) there is not a hell of a lot you can do about it.
To be perfectly honest, we are the ones who have made the smart phone market what it is today. And that is because we know what is right. If Google wants to make all their crappy apps available tooeople, they can submit it to a vendor who has lower standards then we do -there are plenty to choose from - Palm, Windows, and even Android
Again, we would like to emphasize that you - the FCC, has **** all to say about what we allow on our product, we abide by all laws we are required to follow, and FYI - allowing every ***** app that is submitted to the app store is not one of them. You would have better luck getting us to allow sync support for the Pre (which is not going to happen in a million years either btw)
mind you, we have no hard feelings - we realize that we are the hottest company in the history of technology and we are probably the coolest brand in the history of the world, and companies like you and Greenpeace like to latch onto that because it gets you a lot of press. Google also has friends in the Obama administration and probably called in a favour and is probably the only reason you are looking into this. Let's face facts - we both know this issue is none of your ******* business and anything short of an entire overhaul of the communications history and the free market - this letter is where it's going to end. So kindly - please **** off.
Kind Regards,
Steve.
While you might feel, in an emo sort of way, that Apple should respond like this, it would be the worst thing they could do.
The FCC is looking into regulation of this area of the industry, and that would convince them that it should be done.
We've had too many companies drunk with arrogance. That reply would would certainly fit in.
I'm not all the way on one side or the other about this, but I would like to see Apple clear up its position somewhat better than it has. I read the requirements Apple has set up, and while it may read to some as being clear as to what may and may not be done, that would be wrong. There is plenty of wiggle room for Apple.
I think that Apple should interpret their own rules as narrowly as possible. Sometimes they have to understand that they must give up a bit of revenue to make the customer happy.
And after all, if they're making most of their money selling the phones, and not the software, why would they care?
None of this makes any sense. What exactly is Apple's real motivation here?
If they don't want to allow GV on the iPhone, just come out and say so. Apple's just insulting their customers' intelligence, and perhaps worse the FCC, but playing semantics. Not approving the app, rejecting the app, bottom line is that the app is unavailable to customers.
Also, what about the previous third-party GV apps that were approved and then pulled from the app store? Why were they pulled?
Whatever the outcome of all this, I can't help but think that the Google/Apple relationship may take a serious hit. Stay tuned...
You sir are dead on...
I would prefer Apple just come out and say, we didn't like the app because we feel it duplicates the basic functionality of the OS. Then it would be over. Instead, they are looking more and more devious. I really like Apple products, but they are making the same mistakes they made in the 80's, too greedy and controlling. The only difference is this: the threat this go around isn't Microsoft, it's open source
You sir are dead on...
I would prefer Apple just come out and say, we didn't like the app because we feel it duplicates the basic functionality of the OS. Then it would be over. Instead, they are looking more and more devious. I really like Apple products, but they are making the same mistakes they made in the 80's, too greedy and controlling. The only difference is this: the threat this go around isn't Microsoft, it's open source
I don't at all agree that the threat is open source. The threat is Google.
These apps, like OS X, start as open source, but are added to by major companies.
Open source programs aren't for profit. These are.
Google's apps are only there for Google's profit. They serve no other purpose than to up Google's sales and profits.
This locks you into a number of Google's services. Google gets Ad revenue from these services, and some may even be directly paid for.
Don't make the mistake of thinking that something that starts as open source always remains as open source.
If the app was rejected by Apple then Google could simply produce the rejection notice to prove it.
Why don't they?
Or is the rejection notice next to the birth certificate?
Google said they were informed of the rejection over the phone by vice president Phil Schiller.
WAR- What is it good for? Absolutely nuttin!
Say it again, y'all!
Dave
I also have an HTC Magic here and I downloaded the GV application from the Android Market and I still can't use Google Voice.
I am in Australia the FCC should make Google release their service to ALL iPhone users before their App is accepted by Apple, the Google Voice service is dicriminatory and should be banned.
All features available to users of the iPhone, with or without the native App. Apple banning it in no way prevents iPhone users from using the service. The app would have simply made it more convenient to use the service.
Google said they were informed of the rejection over the phone by vice president Phil Schiller.
Well, there seems to be a difference over that.
Probably not, since something with that much impact must have been in development for quite some time with I'm guessing about a BILLION+ edits before they finally had the okay to announce it to the public.
I think it could be an interesting day on Monday...
Dave
GV doesn't take bandwith, it's not a VoIP application, it uses cell minutes as normal calls
BUT - you were able to log-in to GV using your "free" AT&T data path and send GV Text Messages - for Free. Something AT&T does not like. They want you to send Text via the iPhone text app which - if you use it - is not free. That's were the $$$$ comes into this.
Eric has shown his true colors, he's nothing but a whining little child.
Steve was smart to test him by saying no, just to see what he would do.
Eric goes crying to the FCC like a little b*tch when he doesn't get his own way, instead of addressing Apple's concerns and if that didn't work, accepting rejection like a man and hope Apple turns around later in their decision once they got over any fears they had.
Yes folks, this the NEW SOCIALIST AMERICA! I lived in states that were like this, companies crying to the government when they don't get their own way, trying to pull strings. I never thought the whole country would get this way.
Apple has always been it's own ecosystem, it's a vertically integrated company, they make and control the hardware and the software for the best user experience.
Google has become EVIL, in the sense that they track and record as much as possible anything a person does online.
Google Analytics (tracks you), Google Ads (annoys you), Google Search (records you), Google Mail (snoops you?), Google Earth (root kits you), Google Voice (snoops you), Google Apps (watches you work), Google DID I MISS ANYTHING??
All going directly into marketing companies computers and then into Uncle Sam's snoop squad.
Fsck Google, I'm tired of their name, their company and everything about it.
I have to install a hosts file addition to block my computer from their online tracking, a outgoing firewall to block their accessing the internet from programs, and even use Firefox, Ad Block and Ghostery plugin to block their web garbage.
I even have to install the Better Privacy plugin to prevent any Flash cookies they might install. Normal cookie cleaning doesn't catch Flash cookies. 340 Flash cookies removed in the last month since I reinstalled OS X.
How many Flash cookies have you got? Nice hidden record there...
FSCK GOOGLE!
Eric has shown his true colors, he's nothing but a whining little child.
Steve was smart to test him by saying no, just to see what he would do.
how clever you are, should have known this long time ago. how could anyone accuse apple of anything wrong? damn you google.
btw, did you know that fanboys rarely escape the stockyard?
on a side note, just make the IPA downloadable somewhere, and fu*k apple in the a*s.
This is pretty much perjury, not shades of grey. Sad that Apple has to be the bad guy here.
Would you mind pointing that part out?
Apple seems to be stretching the truth. If it isn't approved and they have no intention of approving, then it was rejected.
This is pretty much perjury, not shades of grey. Sad that Apple has to be the bad guy here.
Julius Genachowski, chairman of the Federal Communications Commission, plans to propose a new so-called net neutrality rule Monday that could prevent telecommunications, cable and wireless companies from blocking Internet applications, according to sources at the agency.
No, no, FCC, it's not fair to formulate this like that. It should be put as "new so-called net neutrality rule Monday that could prevent telecommunications, cable and wireless companies from blocking Google's Internet applications"
Google, you could definitely not to smash everything in your way like a panzer. Just wait a bit for Apple's contract with ATT expires. All that will become so much simpler.
As an Apple shareholder, and as an iPhone developer who has had to modify and re-submit apps to comply with Apple's guidelines and requests I think Google are being pathetic. They clearly don't want to play by the same rules as everyone else, they want to try and bully Apple into letting them do what they want on a platform they are guests on. Well I hope Apple tell them where to go.
Please, explains this to the developers which have seen their GV apps pulled from App Store.
They played the rules, their app was approved and months after banned. Ups, it's n
ot banned, it's under review in Apple's words
...where Apple said they "have no intention of approving" (sic).
Would you mind pointing that part out?
Since the moment that previous third party GV apps were pulled from App Store?
how clever you are, should have known this long time ago. how could anyone accuse apple of anything wrong? damn you google.
btw, did you know that fanboys rarely escape the stockyard?
on a side note, just make the IPA downloadable somewhere, and fu*k apple in the a*s.
It is, well at least GV Mobile is.
Join the world of the jailbreakers and you can get GV Mobile as well quite a few other applications that Apple deems inappropriate for their users... It's this type of crap by Apple that makes jailbreaking a necessity if you're going to own an iPhone and you want to control the equipment YOU own.
I'm an iPhone user and I can't use Google Voice.
I also have an HTC Magic here and I downloaded the GV application from the Android Market and I still can't use Google Voice.
I am in Australia the FCC should make Google release their service to ALL iPhone users before their App is accepted by Apple, the Google Voice service is dicriminatory and should be banned.
Then you really need to get on the horn to the FCC to let them know of all the apps that are US only and that the Aussies feel discriminated against. Somethings are US only.
I am in Canada and can't fully use the GV service yet either. No more relevant than your comments about Aus, but true none the less.
As an Apple shareholder, and as an iPhone developer who has had to modify and re-submit apps to comply with Apple's guidelines and requests I think Google are being pathetic. They clearly don't want to play by the same rules as everyone else, they want to try and bully Apple into letting them do what they want on a platform they are guests on. Well I hope Apple tell them where to go.
Or they want to play by the rules and are puzzled as to why the rules are different for them.
You honestly see yourself as a guest on the iPhone platform? Really.
I didn't realize it was a requirement to hand your nuts over when you downloaded the SDK.