Interestingly enough, none of them have a 27" screen with 2560x1440 resolution or a multi-touch mouse. Many of them have touch displays. If the trend catches on, companies that sell display cleaning kits and chiropractors who treat neck and shoulder problems will see their business grow...
...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
I think Apple knows exactly what it is doing. The growth trends are currently fine, thank you.
If and when Apple needs to up that, it can lower prices. Pricing in this space is unidirectional -- once lower, you really can't go back up. So it makes sense for Apple to milk the higher prices for as long as it can.
I totally agree with Walt on this one. Apple needs to reduce the prices. I've owned over a dozen Macs (and a few Apple IIs) and never bought a PC in my life, I'm about to buy a new Mac, but Apple needs to get some more offerings in the sub-$1000 range. The new MacBook should start at $899, and the new iMac $999. And at the very least, Apple needs to upgrade the base MBP config to 250GB HD immediately (with no increase of price), otherwise it's a ridiculous comparison.
I wasn't expecting anything revolutionary design & feature-wise (and we definitely didn't get it), but I was at least hoping for a revolutionary announcement price-wise this month, but no go there either! The Magic mouse is the only really innovative news here. I don't even want to count how many Mighty Mouses I've worn out (that darn track ball just won't stay clean no matter what you do or how many times you try to clean it). So while I can't wait to get my hands on one, they're too expensive also considering how many wireless mice are available for so much less.
Too bad that Apple isn't following the pricing "Trend", because consumers are. Loyal Apple customers who know the value still cringe when they see capable PCs for half the price. No, they're not a Mac, but in today's economy, price matters! ...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
Apple can command a premium price because it is a cut above Windows PCs. As long as this remains the perception of the buying public, Apple will never have to compete on price alone. This is an enviable position to be in, and as the company's record earnings indicate it is a tactic that is working.
What, exactly, is revolutionary about them? They are simply refinements of existing designs.
The iPhone was revolutionary. The current crop of Macs are not.
I have to agreed with Dlux on this one, only magic mouse is really revolutionary and others especially iMac upgrades, are just that.
As for g3pro calling someone who is respected a moron because you do not like his opinion, his little weak minded.
Overall it was a good assessment of the new releases, maybe not what you want to hear, but he was been honest from his point of view. In the past he has given great reviews to Apple products, so I will always read his reviews with open mind.
Interestingly enough, none of them have a 27" screen with 2560x1440 resolution or a multi-touch mouse. Many of them have touch displays. If the trend catches on, companies that sell display cleaning kits and chiropractors who treat neck and shoulder problems will see their business grow...
Nice list of new Win7 machines. There is an HP AIO for $599. Not fast, poor resolution, but I know of people that simply don?t need or want a faster machine that can do more. I think that may fit there occasional needs swimmingly.
Talk about stating the obvious, I recall the Bondi iMac was not revolutionary either, there were all-in-one machines out for years at that time. Apple has to it's credit keeps giving consumers reasons to come back. They constantly refine their hardware (software too) and occasionally take a good idea too far (Cube) (Puck mouse). Speaking of mice, the new Magic Mouse is not available at the Soho - New York as of today however there are several attached to the new iMacs. Not sure Apple has a hit on it's hand with the new mouse. Scrolling was nice but does ask you to keep you hand semi hovering over the device. The side scrolling not so good though, you may find yourself pushing the mouse away from you until you perfect the gesture.
I have to agreed with Dlux on this one, only magic mouse is really revolutionary and others especially iMac upgrades, are just that.
Even that is arguable. The technology in Magic Mouse has been in Apple?s trackpads for years and the trackpad can even do more. It also looks the Magic Mouse has removed some buttons that some people may want.
I think the move to desktop-class CPUs is revolutionary for the iMac line itself. I also wonder if the move to the wider ratio display will catch on with other AIO vendors. If it does, could that be considered revolutionary if competitors are reacting to it directly?
Is Walt writing this on a NETtop? Of course you can buy a PC for $300 nowadays, but why not go further. You can go to craigslist and buy a used laptop that will do email and web for $150. Why doesn't the PC industry just stop making new PCs, and just resell the ones already made for cheaper and cheaper.
Mac is innovating btw, did you see those heat sinks, good luck finding those in your EEEbox.
Not to be facetious, by why exactly should they do this other than to make it easier on your wallet? Jobs formula is clearly working, as the profits are rolling in. You don't see BMW or Lexus racing to cut their prices on their cars. Premium products will always demand premium prices. Apple isn't a charity. Sucks for us as consumers, but good for investors.
Macs are not Lexus or BMWs, and Apple has never (and would be stupid to) use that as an analogy in any marketing campaign. One of their prior CEOs (Gil Amelio) compared Macs to Mag-lites, and he didn't last long after that.
Macs are general consumer electronics devices. Their not hand crafted and don't offer porter service. I happen to think their technology is (and has been) generally superior to PCs, but I know that's not the case in all situations. But I'm in a graphic arts profession and Macs are the clear superior product. But they are by no means luxury items. And I don't expect to pay a premium for their name either. They use many of the exact same componants as PCs and still charge a premium for them (check their custom config pricing, their RAM & HD prices are above competition and offer no advantages whatsoever).
So yes, while I'm glad my Apple stock is going up, I want it to CONTINUE to go up through more wide stream adoption and an increase in market share, and lower prices will help play a role in that continued success.
Mac is innovating btw, did you see those heat sinks, good luck finding those in your EEEbox.
They are massive. The CPU and GPU are now pretty far from each other. I have to wonder if part of the reasoning for going with a wider ratio is to get the benefit of being able to space out the components horizontally for more efficient cooling. A lot of people are surprised Apple was able to go with desktop CPUs when the last machines got so hot.
These latest two products are perhaps two of the most revolutionary products ever released onto the public. He needs to go back to journalism school.
Hardly - incremental cannot be revolutionary. I think to call any personal computer revolutionary these days is stretching the term. The closes would be the iPhone but even that is just a miniaturization. It may be revolutionizing personal computing however. For a personal computer to be revolutionary it needs to do something like operate by thought.
I doubt the lighting in your home is the same as in the store.
i'm back.
Doesn't matter- and then why are they still teaching a class using the 30" MATTE Cinemadisplay. matte is so obviously better- everybody can view it from all angles.
I asked a salesperson if they sold it and she said they have a newer version. I then asked it it was matte like the one used for the class and she had to check with the manager- who I saw shake his head then glared at me. Too funny. They must get asked that all the time.
No, but what a high bar Apple has set for itself with the tech writers. Can you imagine anyone actually mentioning whether a new Dell was revolutionary or not?
Revolutionary - please. And why hasn't Jony Ive understood yet that a desktop screen needs a vertical adjustment - not just an angle swing. For god's sake - GET IT RIGHT!
Loyal Apple customers who know the value still cringe when they see capable PCs for half the price. No, they're not a Mac, but in today's economy, price matters! ...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
Not me. I would cringe, no check that, I would convulse uncontrollably, spasm into shock, and probably die if I ever had to buy a cheap PC running Windows.
Example: November 2008, I checked out a Best Buy and finally saw a netbook. They looked fairly interesting. Later, this past March, I finally considered buying a netbook since I frequently travel. I checked several stores and was disappointed I couldn't find any with Linux. So I didn't buy one. Instead I bought an iPod touch. I can do just about everything I wanted to do with that that I could've with a netbook. It also syncs with my Mac, it is smaller, and it was cheaper than a netbook.
One more tidbit. So I was recently at an airport going through security. One of the ladies says to me, after seeing my 12-inch PowerBook, "you must travel a lot. You're computer is smaller than everybody else's." I guess she hadn't seen a netbook.
Mossberg is careful to structure his reviews to be more positive than not. He doesn't blatantly go off the deep end like any of us die-hard AI guys would (on any OS including SL). I am not saying he can't be trusted but I am saying you have to take it for what it is worth. I question someone's review who says W7 has now made the difference between OS X and W7 close but then goes on to state differences in the versions of the OS and addresses 32 bit and 64 bit.
"involving or causing a complete or dramatic change?
A display ratio change from 16:10 to 16:9, and desktop-class CPUs over notebook-class CPUs for the first time. I?d define those two things as revolutionary for the iMac line.
The screen aspect ratio change is not going to be noticeable to the average consumer, and as for desktop class processors, they've just gone back to the days of the iMac G5. These are solid refinements to the design that was first introduced way back with the iMac G5 nearly five years ago.
To my mind, revolutionary means massive, noticeable changes that cause changes all throught the industry. The original iMac did this. The iMac G4 with it's moveable display and swing arm did this. I'd argue that the current iMac design (going back to the G5) was nowhere near the game changer that the other two designs were.
"Though both new Macs sport important improvements, they are evolutionary, not revolutionary, and neither follows the industry trend toward bargain-basement prices," Mossberg said. "The MacBook is still $999 and the iMac starts at $1,199, though the company is giving users more features at those same price points. You can pay much less for laptops and desktops from competitors like Dell and Hewlett-Packard."
I like Mossberg, but I take exception of his contention that the new iMacs are evolutionary and not revolutionary.
If, as many of the early reviews bear out, i.e., the new iMacs could well cause a resurgence of desktop sales and displace the current trend to the mobile platform, that in itself could be considered 'revolutionary'.
In addition, the suggestion of using them as an external display for DisplayPort devices and the new iMac display's IPS screen technology for HDTV-style viewing via a wall mount, could, in fact, help endorse Mossberg's declaration to the contrary.
But, perhaps Mossberg is more of a god than I believe him to be. Only time will tell.
As for following the industry trend toward bargain-basement prices, thank goodness. Obviously, he has missed the same competitors' trend towards bargain basement offerings and services.
I should also like to add, that Mossberg should perhaps follow his own edict and begin to provide more value for his services. Otherwise, his appearance here could be more revolutionary than evolutionary.
Not me. I would cringe, no check that, I would convulse uncontrollably, spasm into shock, and probably die if I ever had to buy a cheap PC running Windows.
Example: November 2008, I checked out a Best Buy and finally saw a netbook. They looked fairly interesting. Later, this past March, I finally considered buying a netbook since I frequently travel. I checked several stores and was disappointed I couldn't find any with Linux. So I didn't buy one. Instead I bought an iPod touch. I can do just about everything I wanted to do with that that I could've with a netbook. It also syncs with my Mac, it is smaller, and it was cheaper than a netbook.
One more tidbit. So I was recently at an airport going through security. One of the ladies says to me, after seeing my 12-inch PowerBook, "you must travel a lot. You're computer is smaller than everybody else's." I guess she hadn't seen a netbook.
That's a straw man argument. I'm glad you purchased something that met your needs, but it does not address the premise that Apple & investors would benefit from lowering their product prices to make them more appealing in the current economic environment.
Comments
iMac G4 was revolutionary and these iMac are evolutionary. There is nothing wrong about it.
Interestingly enough, none of them have a 27" screen with 2560x1440 resolution or a multi-touch mouse. Many of them have touch displays. If the trend catches on, companies that sell display cleaning kits and chiropractors who treat neck and shoulder problems will see their business grow...
...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
I think Apple knows exactly what it is doing. The growth trends are currently fine, thank you.
If and when Apple needs to up that, it can lower prices. Pricing in this space is unidirectional -- once lower, you really can't go back up. So it makes sense for Apple to milk the higher prices for as long as it can.
Someone employed at the WSJ would be familiar with the phrase "you get what you pay for."
I totally agree with Walt on this one. Apple needs to reduce the prices. I've owned over a dozen Macs (and a few Apple IIs) and never bought a PC in my life, I'm about to buy a new Mac, but Apple needs to get some more offerings in the sub-$1000 range. The new MacBook should start at $899, and the new iMac $999. And at the very least, Apple needs to upgrade the base MBP config to 250GB HD immediately (with no increase of price), otherwise it's a ridiculous comparison.
I wasn't expecting anything revolutionary design & feature-wise (and we definitely didn't get it), but I was at least hoping for a revolutionary announcement price-wise this month, but no go there either! The Magic mouse is the only really innovative news here. I don't even want to count how many Mighty Mouses I've worn out (that darn track ball just won't stay clean no matter what you do or how many times you try to clean it). So while I can't wait to get my hands on one, they're too expensive also considering how many wireless mice are available for so much less.
Too bad that Apple isn't following the pricing "Trend", because consumers are. Loyal Apple customers who know the value still cringe when they see capable PCs for half the price. No, they're not a Mac, but in today's economy, price matters! ...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
Apple can command a premium price because it is a cut above Windows PCs. As long as this remains the perception of the buying public, Apple will never have to compete on price alone. This is an enviable position to be in, and as the company's record earnings indicate it is a tactic that is working.
What, exactly, is revolutionary about them? They are simply refinements of existing designs.
The iPhone was revolutionary. The current crop of Macs are not.
I have to agreed with Dlux on this one, only magic mouse is really revolutionary and others especially iMac upgrades, are just that.
As for g3pro calling someone who is respected a moron because you do not like his opinion, his little weak minded.
Overall it was a good assessment of the new releases, maybe not what you want to hear, but he was been honest from his point of view. In the past he has given great reviews to Apple products, so I will always read his reviews with open mind.
It is kind of funny to see all these iMac wannabes introduced today.
Interestingly enough, none of them have a 27" screen with 2560x1440 resolution or a multi-touch mouse. Many of them have touch displays. If the trend catches on, companies that sell display cleaning kits and chiropractors who treat neck and shoulder problems will see their business grow...
Nice list of new Win7 machines. There is an HP AIO for $599. Not fast, poor resolution, but I know of people that simply don?t need or want a faster machine that can do more. I think that may fit there occasional needs swimmingly.
"You can pay much less for laptops and desktops from competitors like Dell and Hewlett-Packard."
Someone employed at the WSJ would be familiar with the phrase "you get what you pay for."
I have to agreed with Dlux on this one, only magic mouse is really revolutionary and others especially iMac upgrades, are just that.
Even that is arguable. The technology in Magic Mouse has been in Apple?s trackpads for years and the trackpad can even do more. It also looks the Magic Mouse has removed some buttons that some people may want.
I think the move to desktop-class CPUs is revolutionary for the iMac line itself. I also wonder if the move to the wider ratio display will catch on with other AIO vendors. If it does, could that be considered revolutionary if competitors are reacting to it directly?
Mac is innovating btw, did you see those heat sinks, good luck finding those in your EEEbox.
Not to be facetious, by why exactly should they do this other than to make it easier on your wallet? Jobs formula is clearly working, as the profits are rolling in. You don't see BMW or Lexus racing to cut their prices on their cars. Premium products will always demand premium prices. Apple isn't a charity. Sucks for us as consumers, but good for investors.
Macs are not Lexus or BMWs, and Apple has never (and would be stupid to) use that as an analogy in any marketing campaign. One of their prior CEOs (Gil Amelio) compared Macs to Mag-lites, and he didn't last long after that.
Macs are general consumer electronics devices. Their not hand crafted and don't offer porter service. I happen to think their technology is (and has been) generally superior to PCs, but I know that's not the case in all situations. But I'm in a graphic arts profession and Macs are the clear superior product. But they are by no means luxury items. And I don't expect to pay a premium for their name either. They use many of the exact same componants as PCs and still charge a premium for them (check their custom config pricing, their RAM & HD prices are above competition and offer no advantages whatsoever).
So yes, while I'm glad my Apple stock is going up, I want it to CONTINUE to go up through more wide stream adoption and an increase in market share, and lower prices will help play a role in that continued success.
Mac is innovating btw, did you see those heat sinks, good luck finding those in your EEEbox.
They are massive. The CPU and GPU are now pretty far from each other. I have to wonder if part of the reasoning for going with a wider ratio is to get the benefit of being able to space out the components horizontally for more efficient cooling. A lot of people are surprised Apple was able to go with desktop CPUs when the last machines got so hot.
Mossberg the Moron.
These latest two products are perhaps two of the most revolutionary products ever released onto the public. He needs to go back to journalism school.
Hardly - incremental cannot be revolutionary. I think to call any personal computer revolutionary these days is stretching the term. The closes would be the iPhone but even that is just a miniaturization. It may be revolutionizing personal computing however. For a personal computer to be revolutionary it needs to do something like operate by thought.
I doubt the lighting in your home is the same as in the store.
i'm back.
Doesn't matter- and then why are they still teaching a class using the 30" MATTE Cinemadisplay. matte is so obviously better- everybody can view it from all angles.
I asked a salesperson if they sold it and she said they have a newer version. I then asked it it was matte like the one used for the class and she had to check with the manager- who I saw shake his head then glared at me. Too funny. They must get asked that all the time.
No, but what a high bar Apple has set for itself with the tech writers. Can you imagine anyone actually mentioning whether a new Dell was revolutionary or not?
Revolutionary - please. And why hasn't Jony Ive understood yet that a desktop screen needs a vertical adjustment - not just an angle swing. For god's sake - GET IT RIGHT!
Loyal Apple customers who know the value still cringe when they see capable PCs for half the price. No, they're not a Mac, but in today's economy, price matters! ...especially if Apple wants their growth trend to continue to accelerate.
Not me. I would cringe, no check that, I would convulse uncontrollably, spasm into shock, and probably die if I ever had to buy a cheap PC running Windows.
Example: November 2008, I checked out a Best Buy and finally saw a netbook. They looked fairly interesting. Later, this past March, I finally considered buying a netbook since I frequently travel. I checked several stores and was disappointed I couldn't find any with Linux. So I didn't buy one. Instead I bought an iPod touch. I can do just about everything I wanted to do with that that I could've with a netbook. It also syncs with my Mac, it is smaller, and it was cheaper than a netbook.
One more tidbit. So I was recently at an airport going through security. One of the ladies says to me, after seeing my 12-inch PowerBook, "you must travel a lot. You're computer is smaller than everybody else's." I guess she hadn't seen a netbook.
Mossberg said this about OS X from Tiger to Leopard right? Link
Says it about Vista to Windows 7. Link
I think he needs to update his phrase dictionary.
Mossberg is careful to structure his reviews to be more positive than not. He doesn't blatantly go off the deep end like any of us die-hard AI guys would (on any OS including SL). I am not saying he can't be trusted but I am saying you have to take it for what it is worth. I question someone's review who says W7 has now made the difference between OS X and W7 close but then goes on to state differences in the versions of the OS and addresses 32 bit and 64 bit.
"involving or causing a complete or dramatic change?
A display ratio change from 16:10 to 16:9, and desktop-class CPUs over notebook-class CPUs for the first time. I?d define those two things as revolutionary for the iMac line.
The screen aspect ratio change is not going to be noticeable to the average consumer, and as for desktop class processors, they've just gone back to the days of the iMac G5. These are solid refinements to the design that was first introduced way back with the iMac G5 nearly five years ago.
To my mind, revolutionary means massive, noticeable changes that cause changes all throught the industry. The original iMac did this. The iMac G4 with it's moveable display and swing arm did this. I'd argue that the current iMac design (going back to the G5) was nowhere near the game changer that the other two designs were.
"Though both new Macs sport important improvements, they are evolutionary, not revolutionary, and neither follows the industry trend toward bargain-basement prices," Mossberg said. "The MacBook is still $999 and the iMac starts at $1,199, though the company is giving users more features at those same price points. You can pay much less for laptops and desktops from competitors like Dell and Hewlett-Packard."
I like Mossberg, but I take exception of his contention that the new iMacs are evolutionary and not revolutionary.
If, as many of the early reviews bear out, i.e., the new iMacs could well cause a resurgence of desktop sales and displace the current trend to the mobile platform, that in itself could be considered 'revolutionary'.
In addition, the suggestion of using them as an external display for DisplayPort devices and the new iMac display's IPS screen technology for HDTV-style viewing via a wall mount, could, in fact, help endorse Mossberg's declaration to the contrary.
But, perhaps Mossberg is more of a god than I believe him to be. Only time will tell.
As for following the industry trend toward bargain-basement prices, thank goodness. Obviously, he has missed the same competitors' trend towards bargain basement offerings and services.
I should also like to add, that Mossberg should perhaps follow his own edict and begin to provide more value for his services. Otherwise, his appearance here could be more revolutionary than evolutionary.
Not me. I would cringe, no check that, I would convulse uncontrollably, spasm into shock, and probably die if I ever had to buy a cheap PC running Windows.
Example: November 2008, I checked out a Best Buy and finally saw a netbook. They looked fairly interesting. Later, this past March, I finally considered buying a netbook since I frequently travel. I checked several stores and was disappointed I couldn't find any with Linux. So I didn't buy one. Instead I bought an iPod touch. I can do just about everything I wanted to do with that that I could've with a netbook. It also syncs with my Mac, it is smaller, and it was cheaper than a netbook.
One more tidbit. So I was recently at an airport going through security. One of the ladies says to me, after seeing my 12-inch PowerBook, "you must travel a lot. You're computer is smaller than everybody else's." I guess she hadn't seen a netbook.
That's a straw man argument. I'm glad you purchased something that met your needs, but it does not address the premise that Apple & investors would benefit from lowering their product prices to make them more appealing in the current economic environment.