It is good that they are cracking down. It is not good that they use companies that treat their employees like slave labor.
It would be great if they used American factories. Maybe some of the $40,000,000,000 could be used for bringing more manufacturing in-house? ISTM that there may be additional benefits to doing so beyond being able to avoid using slave labor.
I guess the Western World can't handle knowing where the cheap stuff on their store shelves come from.
Apple is the only company I know of that is VOLUNTARILY doing something about it.
They have absolutely no reason to do so apart from an altruistic motivation to improve conditions for third world workers.
There are plenty of good reasons apart from the good reason you identify. I think that many Apple stockholders, customers and employees would try to avoid exploiting others, for their own sake, and not for the sake of the others.
You do know that Apple does not "employ" all of the 300,000 workers at Foxconn that was mentioned in the report, that other companies are using the services of the same workers in the same factories.
Quote:
Foxconn runs a number of super-factories in the south of China, some of which employ as many as 300,000 workers and form self-contained cities, complete with banks, post offices and basketball courts.
It has been accused, however, of treating its employees extremely harshly. China Labor Watch, a New York-based NGO, accused Foxconn of having an "inhumane and militant" management, which neglects basic human rights. Foxconn's management were not available for comment.
Why would stockholders care about or even want to know about "exploiting others" for that yields the highest returns?
So which other companies are doing the same thing as Apple, Microsoft with X-Boxes and Zunes made by Foxconn, Sony with Playstations made by Foxconn, Nintendo with Wii's made by Foxconn, Nokia with phones made by FoxConn, etc, etc?
Quote:
Foxconn (富士康) is the trade name of the Taiwan based firm Hon Hai Precision Industry Co. (Ltd.) (LSE: HHPD). Foxconn is the largest manufacturer of electronics and computer components worldwide, and mainly manufactures on contract to other companies. Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment...
...Foxconn makes computer cases, heat sinks, and PGA/ZIF sockets, many of which are used by other manufacturers. Foxconn also produces several different motherboards, with many being sold to vendors such as Dell, HP and Sony. Starting in 2003, the company has produced retail boards under its own brand name. In March 2006, Foxconn branched into the manufacture of graphics cards, starting with a GeForce 7900GTX, but with intentions to market both NVIDIA and ATI boards.
Foxconn has worked with Apple since 1986. They produce the Macbook, MacBook Pro and MacBook Air, as well as the iPhone and the iPod. Foxconn also produces devices for Motorola, Nokia, Sony Ericsson, and Palm. Foxconn is also the manufacturer of the Amazon Kindle.
Foxconn also operates under the brand name of Leadtek, which focuses on the hardware-oriented consumer market.
There are plenty of good reasons apart from the good reason you identify. I think that many Apple stockholders, customers and employees would try to avoid exploiting others, for their own sake, and not for the sake of the others.
This is one of the reasons that my wife and I decided to join the ranks of those switching to a Mac. We have been thrilled with our subsequent purchases and pleased with Apple's approach to the environment and conditions in their factories.
So when a senator criticizes Apple (among other companies) for their practice of near-slavery by paying BELOW minimum wage to their workers with atrocious working conditions, Apple fans go "They're bullying Apple because they're jealous..."
Now the reverse happens and Apple fans sing the same tune "They're bullying Apple because they're jealous..."
Looks like everybody is out to get Apple. The slightest bit of criticism is bullying. When it (criticism) happens to Microsoft, Google, Amazon, or any other company, "OMG they're evil! I hope they go bankrupt" and "LOLOLOL Apple #1".
Apple zealots obviously LOVE Apple or they wouldn't be called Apple zealots but the hypocrisy is hilarious.
okay so Apple works with suppliers overseas that pay horrid wages, knowingly hire children, don't pay overtime or give breaks etc and the company is bashed for it.
They audit and do something to stop all this and they are bashed for trying to police their suppliers.
damned if they do, damned if they don't.
I would still rather they bring production home. or at least spread it out so the goods meant for each area are made in that area but I get why they don't so at the least, requiring some level of 'proper' conduct is, in my book, a great thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dickprinter
Oh yeah, in case you guys forgot.....TEKSTUD STILL wants Flash
oh, I thought he said he wanted to be flashed. my bad
"Apple taken to task for reporting partners' child labor violations"
Once again demonstrating that no good deed goes unpunished.
I know it's not a huge deal as eveyone does it and some of the kids really want to work. For example, child actors are watched very closely but they can still, at times, work very hard. For us (music/editing studio), we miss the made in the USA as well as all the atention that used to be given for the pro apps such as Logic, shake, FCP today the whole crowd is different and o remember great FREE CLASSES, TIPS AND TRICKS as one to one was also part of Pro care, all for $99'dollars but it still amazes me how some people still don't get the laptop pricing model which goes something like this, you go in and know you can get a mini or for a litte more an iMac or laptop. Then you decide, laptop but for just a little more you can get the anti glare on the 15", but no express port anymore so for a little more you can get everything you want on the 17" but now your wondering about the bigger iMacs and realize you can get a mac pro for less then of course there is the AppleCare and PronService for justb a little more and suddenly you remember you want the laptop so you went in planning on spending $999 and leave spending almost triple. Its preety amazing that many do this as you hear will this computer do this? No but this one wil, ok we'l what about this, no butthis one will an so on and so on this is why I'm surprised at the low end ipad. But will be excited to see what the osc86 team and other under ground will do with it.
He found a report, was too lazy to do any comparative studies with similar companies or any investigation of his own on child labor practices. He sat at home with a beer and made things easy on himself by banging out a story in short order. He's a lazy sod who should be fired for printing crap... but hey... it's the Telegraph for heaven's sake, it's about par with the News of the World...
They have absolutely no reason to do so apart from an altruistic motivation to improve conditions for third world workers.
not entirely true. there's always the good press.
but hey if they get some good press off of doing something that actually helps people and not just the stock price, what's the harm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avidfcp
remember great FREE CLASSES, TIPS AND TRICKS as one to one was also part of Pro care, all for $99'dollars
they still have the free classes and stuff. I'm about to attend week 4 of a 4 week totally free workshop series on Final Cut
and the whole one to one thing is still around. yes they added the whole only with a computer bought at Apple but at least in my area the demand was insane so I can understand them doing something to limit it. As for ProCare, what was the big deal about that. you get a tuneup on your system once during that year and you could see more than the next 3 days of the appointments. Doesn't seem like much. Especially when they replaced it with a data transfer of your old system to the new computer. I priced a PC to Mac transfer for my brother in law at Best Buy and it was going to be $400 for the amount of stuff he had. The guys at the Apple store didn't care. And had it back to him in 24 hours.
Quote:
but it still amazes me how some people still don't get the laptop pricing model which goes something like this,
and when you go to Best Buy to get that $500 laptop will you really pay just $500. Not if they can help it. You'll buy an optimized system, get the Geek Squad stuff, pay large for a data transfer, and so on.
Quote:
But will be excited to see what the osc86 team and other under ground will do with it.
probably not that much. or at least that much new and exciting. the sim is unlocked so once anyone else (ie T-Mobile) picks up the micro you can switch. so no need for unlocking. they might jailbreak it for some of those porn apps and such but that's really nothing new since the same programs they use on the iphone could work on the ipad. and as for anything else, why bother, it's not a computer after all. it's a 'toy'.
C'mon. That is totally off-base and uncalled-for. You should withdraw the comment, and apologize to the forum.
even if he did, something like 5 folks have quoted it and those copies are still visible.
which is why when someone acts in such a nasty way, you ignore them. either for the moment by not replying (especially with a quote) or literally ignore list them. either way, the troll was not fed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA
Whenever anyone uses Flash, an underage worker overseas has to work an extra hour with no pay.
you forgot that also an angel loses his wings and a fairy falls down dead
So when a senator criticizes Apple (among other companies) for their practice of near-slavery by paying BELOW minimum wage to their workers with atrocious working conditions, Apple fans go "They're bullying Apple because they're jealous..."
What is the minimum wage in China? To assume the blame is on Apple you must be assuming that Apple is forcing the factories not to pay their employees minimum wage. How are they doing that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
I would still rather they bring production home. or at least spread it out so the goods meant for each area are made in that area but I get why they don't so at the least, requiring some level of 'proper' conduct is, in my book, a great thing.
From a personal standpoint I agree as I wouldn't car if I paid 4x as much for the same product, but if I was running Apple there is no way I could see doing it from a business perspective.
The Telegraph's online website is widely known for writing 'link-bait' articles, to get their online readership up. "Apple" in a headline draws lots of readers.
if they could get Apple, Brangelina and Robsten in the same headline the hit counts would crash their servers.
how about "Brangelina and Robsten confess they love Apple, iPad".
...and when you go to Best Buy to get that $500 laptop will you really pay just $500. Not if they can help it. You'll buy an optimized system, get the Geek Squad stuff, pay large for a data transfer, and so on...
you've got me laughing at myself. I went to best buy earlier this month, bought a $449 PC for my sister who's sick, and whose work required it or i'd have gotten her a mac. I knew better than to buy a more costly unit to get RAM or CPU speed i knew her tasks wouldn't require. Still, by the time i bought virus protection software plus a 3 yr virus-ridding contract, plus whatever they call their three year hardware protection plan, they were into me for more than $500 extra. Maybe i shouldn't have bought all that, but i'm trying to assure that when something goes wrong for my sister it's a no-brainer, call the store and it'll be fixed. Just like the what, $249 apple care? so yep, prices add up.
Writing for the Telegraph UK, Malcolm Moore characterized the report's findings to make it sound like Apple had been caught violating the law and had been forced to admit that it was "using child labour in China," when in fact the opposite was actually the case.
After living in the UK for almost 14 years I've learned a few things about newspapers
1. Only a fool man believes what he reads in the newspapers
2. Only an idiot believes british newspapers
3. Only an a**** believes the Telegraph
4. British Journalism is a joke. And it is all English humour.
Comments
If he did, then it's a tabloid.
The Telegraph isn't a tabloid.
It would be great if they used American factories. Maybe some of the $40,000,000,000 could be used for bringing more manufacturing in-house? ISTM that there may be additional benefits to doing so beyond being able to avoid using slave labor.
I guess the Western World can't handle knowing where the cheap stuff on their store shelves come from.
Apple is the only company I know of that is VOLUNTARILY doing something about it.
They have absolutely no reason to do so apart from an altruistic motivation to improve conditions for third world workers.
There are plenty of good reasons apart from the good reason you identify. I think that many Apple stockholders, customers and employees would try to avoid exploiting others, for their own sake, and not for the sake of the others.
He isn't even trying to make a funny, just being inflammatory. I think some moderating of the comment itself is in orderi.
Agreed.
Foxconn runs a number of super-factories in the south of China, some of which employ as many as 300,000 workers and form self-contained cities, complete with banks, post offices and basketball courts.
It has been accused, however, of treating its employees extremely harshly. China Labor Watch, a New York-based NGO, accused Foxconn of having an "inhumane and militant" management, which neglects basic human rights. Foxconn's management were not available for comment.
Source
Why would stockholders care about or even want to know about "exploiting others" for that yields the highest returns?
So which other companies are doing the same thing as Apple, Microsoft with X-Boxes and Zunes made by Foxconn, Sony with Playstations made by Foxconn, Nintendo with Wii's made by Foxconn, Nokia with phones made by FoxConn, etc, etc?
Foxconn (富士康) is the trade name of the Taiwan based firm Hon Hai Precision Industry Co. (Ltd.) (LSE: HHPD). Foxconn is the largest manufacturer of electronics and computer components worldwide, and mainly manufactures on contract to other companies. Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment...
...Foxconn makes computer cases, heat sinks, and PGA/ZIF sockets, many of which are used by other manufacturers. Foxconn also produces several different motherboards, with many being sold to vendors such as Dell, HP and Sony. Starting in 2003, the company has produced retail boards under its own brand name. In March 2006, Foxconn branched into the manufacture of graphics cards, starting with a GeForce 7900GTX, but with intentions to market both NVIDIA and ATI boards.
Foxconn has worked with Apple since 1986. They produce the Macbook, MacBook Pro and MacBook Air, as well as the iPhone and the iPod. Foxconn also produces devices for Motorola, Nokia, Sony Ericsson, and Palm. Foxconn is also the manufacturer of the Amazon Kindle.
Foxconn also operates under the brand name of Leadtek, which focuses on the hardware-oriented consumer market.
Source
There are plenty of good reasons apart from the good reason you identify. I think that many Apple stockholders, customers and employees would try to avoid exploiting others, for their own sake, and not for the sake of the others.
This is one of the reasons that my wife and I decided to join the ranks of those switching to a Mac. We have been thrilled with our subsequent purchases and pleased with Apple's approach to the environment and conditions in their factories.
Now the reverse happens and Apple fans sing the same tune "They're bullying Apple because they're jealous..."
Looks like everybody is out to get Apple. The slightest bit of criticism is bullying. When it (criticism) happens to Microsoft, Google, Amazon, or any other company, "OMG they're evil! I hope they go bankrupt" and "LOLOLOL Apple #1".
Apple zealots obviously LOVE Apple or they wouldn't be called Apple zealots but the hypocrisy is hilarious.
They audit and do something to stop all this and they are bashed for trying to police their suppliers.
damned if they do, damned if they don't.
I would still rather they bring production home. or at least spread it out so the goods meant for each area are made in that area but I get why they don't so at the least, requiring some level of 'proper' conduct is, in my book, a great thing.
Oh yeah, in case you guys forgot.....TEKSTUD STILL wants Flash
oh, I thought he said he wanted to be flashed. my bad
and STILL believes the iPad is a big iPod Touch.
which for many is the appeal
"Apple taken to task for reporting partners' child labor violations"
Once again demonstrating that no good deed goes unpunished.
I know it's not a huge deal as eveyone does it and some of the kids really want to work. For example, child actors are watched very closely but they can still, at times, work very hard. For us (music/editing studio), we miss the made in the USA as well as all the atention that used to be given for the pro apps such as Logic, shake, FCP today the whole crowd is different and o remember great FREE CLASSES, TIPS AND TRICKS as one to one was also part of Pro care, all for $99'dollars but it still amazes me how some people still don't get the laptop pricing model which goes something like this, you go in and know you can get a mini or for a litte more an iMac or laptop. Then you decide, laptop but for just a little more you can get the anti glare on the 15", but no express port anymore so for a little more you can get everything you want on the 17" but now your wondering about the bigger iMacs and realize you can get a mac pro for less then of course there is the AppleCare and PronService for justb a little more and suddenly you remember you want the laptop so you went in planning on spending $999 and leave spending almost triple. Its preety amazing that many do this as you hear will this computer do this? No but this one wil, ok we'l what about this, no butthis one will an so on and so on this is why I'm surprised at the low end ipad. But will be excited to see what the osc86 team and other under ground will do with it.
They have absolutely no reason to do so apart from an altruistic motivation to improve conditions for third world workers.
not entirely true. there's always the good press.
but hey if they get some good press off of doing something that actually helps people and not just the stock price, what's the harm
remember great FREE CLASSES, TIPS AND TRICKS as one to one was also part of Pro care, all for $99'dollars
they still have the free classes and stuff. I'm about to attend week 4 of a 4 week totally free workshop series on Final Cut
and the whole one to one thing is still around. yes they added the whole only with a computer bought at Apple but at least in my area the demand was insane so I can understand them doing something to limit it. As for ProCare, what was the big deal about that. you get a tuneup on your system once during that year and you could see more than the next 3 days of the appointments. Doesn't seem like much. Especially when they replaced it with a data transfer of your old system to the new computer. I priced a PC to Mac transfer for my brother in law at Best Buy and it was going to be $400 for the amount of stuff he had. The guys at the Apple store didn't care. And had it back to him in 24 hours.
but it still amazes me how some people still don't get the laptop pricing model which goes something like this,
and when you go to Best Buy to get that $500 laptop will you really pay just $500. Not if they can help it. You'll buy an optimized system, get the Geek Squad stuff, pay large for a data transfer, and so on.
But will be excited to see what the osc86 team and other under ground will do with it.
probably not that much. or at least that much new and exciting. the sim is unlocked so once anyone else (ie T-Mobile) picks up the micro you can switch. so no need for unlocking. they might jailbreak it for some of those porn apps and such but that's really nothing new since the same programs they use on the iphone could work on the ipad. and as for anything else, why bother, it's not a computer after all. it's a 'toy'.
Oh yeah, in case you guys forgot.....TEKSTUD STILL wants Flash
Whenever anyone uses Flash, an underage worker overseas has to work an extra hour with no pay.
C'mon. That is totally off-base and uncalled-for. You should withdraw the comment, and apologize to the forum.
even if he did, something like 5 folks have quoted it and those copies are still visible.
which is why when someone acts in such a nasty way, you ignore them. either for the moment by not replying (especially with a quote) or literally ignore list them. either way, the troll was not fed.
Whenever anyone uses Flash, an underage worker overseas has to work an extra hour with no pay.
you forgot that also an angel loses his wings and a fairy falls down dead
So when a senator criticizes Apple (among other companies) for their practice of near-slavery by paying BELOW minimum wage to their workers with atrocious working conditions, Apple fans go "They're bullying Apple because they're jealous..."
What is the minimum wage in China? To assume the blame is on Apple you must be assuming that Apple is forcing the factories not to pay their employees minimum wage. How are they doing that?
I would still rather they bring production home. or at least spread it out so the goods meant for each area are made in that area but I get why they don't so at the least, requiring some level of 'proper' conduct is, in my book, a great thing.
From a personal standpoint I agree as I wouldn't car if I paid 4x as much for the same product, but if I was running Apple there is no way I could see doing it from a business perspective.
The Telegraph's online website is widely known for writing 'link-bait' articles, to get their online readership up. "Apple" in a headline draws lots of readers.
if they could get Apple, Brangelina and Robsten in the same headline the hit counts would crash their servers.
how about "Brangelina and Robsten confess they love Apple, iPad".
that hints 4 major link baits in one.
even if he did, something like 5 folks have quoted it and those copies are still visible.
which is why when someone acts in such a nasty way, you ignore them.
I did my bit and the offending portion has been removed now, so good point there (see #17).
I am not sure that ignoring is always the best policy: sometimes, people need to be called out on their nonsense.
...and when you go to Best Buy to get that $500 laptop will you really pay just $500. Not if they can help it. You'll buy an optimized system, get the Geek Squad stuff, pay large for a data transfer, and so on...
you've got me laughing at myself. I went to best buy earlier this month, bought a $449 PC for my sister who's sick, and whose work required it or i'd have gotten her a mac. I knew better than to buy a more costly unit to get RAM or CPU speed i knew her tasks wouldn't require. Still, by the time i bought virus protection software plus a 3 yr virus-ridding contract, plus whatever they call their three year hardware protection plan, they were into me for more than $500 extra. Maybe i shouldn't have bought all that, but i'm trying to assure that when something goes wrong for my sister it's a no-brainer, call the store and it'll be fixed. Just like the what, $249 apple care? so yep, prices add up.
Writing for the Telegraph UK, Malcolm Moore characterized the report's findings to make it sound like Apple had been caught violating the law and had been forced to admit that it was "using child labour in China," when in fact the opposite was actually the case.
After living in the UK for almost 14 years I've learned a few things about newspapers
1. Only a fool man believes what he reads in the newspapers
2. Only an idiot believes british newspapers
3. Only an a**** believes the Telegraph
4. British Journalism is a joke. And it is all English humour.
As components get smaller and smaller I think the need for smaller and smaller employees is a must. Child labour FTW.
Ha ha! Very funny!