That's rather premature. Given the anecdotal evidence is all over the place, it could more likely be either a manufacturing defect or a software issue (software does control hardware, including signal strength and fixing). I find it hard to believe it's a design flaw with so many engineers all over the place working on this thing for at least a year, and all the testing that it's been through. These guys aren't just out of undergrad engineering school. They well know about attenuation.
Really?
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
I know, that was my point, which you did not understand. Non-idiot designers tend to put antennae in locations where they will be touched the least, aka the bottom of the phone (or the top, but the FCC doesn't allow that).
Apple is the only idiotic company that puts the ANTENNAE of a PHONE into the grip.
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
True, but no one knows at this point that anyone knew anything before full scale production was authorized. We're arguing in the dark. Look, if it does turn out to be a design flaw, don't you think Apple is going to do something about it? But it's premature to determine that anything (or at least any ONE thing) is responsible for what some people (others, not) are experiencing. You really stand by your statement that there was a "complete lack of testing"? That's hard to buy.
Ah... well, the actual rational explanation is that you're in an area of poor reception. If you can duplicate this underneath a tower where the reception is known to be 100%, then you may have a point. Otherwise, the evidence, the video, the conclusions... all scientifically meaningless.
You don't understand the scientific method.
The hypothesis was that holding a phone attenuates the signal.
The experiment was done to evaluate this, by finding the exact location when the phone loses signal. That experiment shows definitively that the point is the insulated portion between the two antennae.
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
do you really believe that there was a "complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production", doesn't this sound ridiculous to you too?
I'm pretty sure that once all iPhone users upgrade to the latest version of iOS, which is version 4.0, that they will all have the same features, which includes the gyroscope capability. It would be an example of fragmentation as solipsism would say, but that could never be true in this situation.
Upgrading old phones virtually guarantees seamless feature parity across all iPhone versions.
Unless I am very wrong, the gyroscope is new hardware built into iP 4, ditto the sound canceling microphone. There are certainly iOS 4 software features that work with this hardware, but the iPhone G3 can never have these functions without the hardware.
I know, that was my point, which you did not understand. Non-idiot designers tend to put antennae in locations where they will be touched the least, aka the bottom of the phone (or the top, but the FCC doesn't allow that).
Apple is the only idiotic company that puts the ANTENNAE of a PHONE into the grip.
Actually, if you look at the phone, it's in the same location on the iPhone 4. About a quater of an inch on the bottom is segregated from the rest.
Apple themselves said it was affected by the bottom left corner, just as the HTC manual states. The 3G's and 3GS also experiences the same issue under iOS4. Was it a design flaw that simply wasn't noticed for a few years on those models?
Ah... well, the actual rational explanation is that you're in an area of poor reception. If you can duplicate this underneath a tower where the reception is known to be 100%, then you may have a point. Otherwise, the evidence, the video, the conclusions... all scientifically meaningless.
As an addendum to the original post, you don't need to be under a tower to know you have full strength on the phone. That's what 5 bars means on an iPhone 4, unless you are claiming that Apple falsely represents signal strength in its software.
Unless I am very wrong, the gyroscope is new hardware built into iP 4, ditto the sound canceling microphone. There are certainly iOS 4 software features that work with this hardware, but the iPhone G3 can never have these functions without the hardware.
No, you are very right about that actually. It was more a point to show solipsism that fragmentation is alive and well in the iOS realm because of hardware feature differences and the inability for phones like the iPhone EDGE to upgrade its software features in line with the iPhone 4.
Actually, if you look at the phone, it's in the same location on the iPhone 4. About a quater of an inch on the bottom is segregated from the rest.
Apple themselves said it was affected by the bottom left corner, just as the HTC manual states. The 3G's and 3GS also experiences the same issue under iOS4. Was it a design flaw that simply wasn't noticed for a few years on those models?
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
And? Why do they experience the same issue on 3G and 3GS after upgrading to iOS4 but not before? I should also point out that in the HTC manual, the point they indicate is not at the bottom. It's on the lower left side.
After reading dozens of comments over the past two days I have observed:
1. There are iP4 users with reception problems.
2. Not all iP4 users are experiencing the anomaly.
3. There seem to be as many opinions (guesses) about the cause as there are posters.
My conclusion is that no one knows the cause...i.e. antenna design flaw and/or manufacturing issue.
So hopefully, the technical experts at Apple will find the answer soon so all the Apple and iPhone whiners can get on with their lives. I'm sure Steve Jobs is sorry he even commented on this issue before the Apple technical folks had a more definitive answer.
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
If you were to point this out to one of Apple's engineers, what do you think he or she would say? ..."Oh, I wasn't aware that would be a problem"? If there is indeed a real problem, I think it's going to be a little more involved than a metal band.
And? Why do they experience the same issue on 3G and 3GS after upgrading to iOS4 but not before? I should also point out that in the HTC manual, the point they indicate is not at the bottom. It's on the lower left side.
If Apple changed something in the iOS 4.0 which affected the antenna, it is still a design flaw by definition.
Apple might have to go back to an original, safer antenna software design, but who knows how much of a performance hit the iPhone will take in terms of CPU use, call quality, or battery life.
If Apple changed something in the iOS 4.0 which affected the antenna, it is still a design flaw by definition.
Apple might have to go back to an original, safer antenna software design, but who knows how much of a performance hit the iPhone will take in terms of CPU use, call quality, or battery life.
Now that I agree with. If they find that they cannot resolve the issue via a software update, they will be in a world of hurt.
True, but no one knows at this point that anyone knew anything before full scale production was authorized. We're arguing in the dark. Look, if it does turn out to be a design flaw, don't you think Apple is going to do something about it? But it's premature to determine that anything (or at least any ONE thing) is responsible for what some people (others, not) are experiencing. You really stand by your statement that there was a "complete lack of testing"? That's hard to buy.
No, I don't think Apple is going to do anything about it. They have a long history of not doing anything about defective devices. Than invites class action lawsuits and hard feelings.
Once Apple has your money their interest level is something approaching zero. I do wish I could say otherwise, but history does not support a contrary expectation. It would be refreshing if Apple were to embrace the customers and start earning a reputation of doing right by them, but that would be out of character.
Did you own a Smurf (Blue and White)? It had defective Firewire and ATA controllers among other things that were not correct (they shipped out-of-spec RAM on some, but not all, of them and several batches of CPUs had major problems). Apple's actions? None. They left it up to the owners to identify the problems and figure out solutions. Yea, this is ancient history, but that is the point. Apple has a long history of (mis)behaving this way.
Sorry. If I am proven wrong, please remind me. Nothing would please me more.
If you were to point this out to one of Apple's engineers, what do you think he or she would say? ..."Oh, I wasn't aware that would be a problem"?
I think Steve Jobs' obsession over thinness is the compromising restriction which forced the engineers to make critical design errors.
Every electrical engineer (and now every iPhone user) knows about signal attenuation due to the hand touching the antenna. But it was Apple's ultimate design decision to sacrifice a better antenna placement in favor of a more aesthetically-pretty location.
Comments
Actually, that manual is from the HTC Incredible
http://member.america.htc.com/downlo...d-Warranty.pdf
That's rather premature. Given the anecdotal evidence is all over the place, it could more likely be either a manufacturing defect or a software issue (software does control hardware, including signal strength and fixing). I find it hard to believe it's a design flaw with so many engineers all over the place working on this thing for at least a year, and all the testing that it's been through. These guys aren't just out of undergrad engineering school. They well know about attenuation.
Really?
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
Actually, that manual is from the HTC Incredible
I know, that was my point, which you did not understand. Non-idiot designers tend to put antennae in locations where they will be touched the least, aka the bottom of the phone (or the top, but the FCC doesn't allow that).
Apple is the only idiotic company that puts the ANTENNAE of a PHONE into the grip.
Really?
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
True, but no one knows at this point that anyone knew anything before full scale production was authorized. We're arguing in the dark. Look, if it does turn out to be a design flaw, don't you think Apple is going to do something about it? But it's premature to determine that anything (or at least any ONE thing) is responsible for what some people (others, not) are experiencing. You really stand by your statement that there was a "complete lack of testing"? That's hard to buy.
Ah... well, the actual rational explanation is that you're in an area of poor reception. If you can duplicate this underneath a tower where the reception is known to be 100%, then you may have a point. Otherwise, the evidence, the video, the conclusions... all scientifically meaningless.
You don't understand the scientific method.
The hypothesis was that holding a phone attenuates the signal.
The experiment was done to evaluate this, by finding the exact location when the phone loses signal. That experiment shows definitively that the point is the insulated portion between the two antennae.
It is scientifically established.
Really?
Knowing about something and doing something about it are two entirely different things. This also shows a complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production and a disregard of human factors in the use of the device.
do you really believe that there was a "complete lack of testing of the device before committing to production", doesn't this sound ridiculous to you too?
I'm pretty sure that once all iPhone users upgrade to the latest version of iOS, which is version 4.0, that they will all have the same features, which includes the gyroscope capability. It would be an example of fragmentation as solipsism would say, but that could never be true in this situation.
Upgrading old phones virtually guarantees seamless feature parity across all iPhone versions.
Unless I am very wrong, the gyroscope is new hardware built into iP 4, ditto the sound canceling microphone. There are certainly iOS 4 software features that work with this hardware, but the iPhone G3 can never have these functions without the hardware.
I know, that was my point, which you did not understand. Non-idiot designers tend to put antennae in locations where they will be touched the least, aka the bottom of the phone (or the top, but the FCC doesn't allow that).
Apple is the only idiotic company that puts the ANTENNAE of a PHONE into the grip.
Actually, if you look at the phone, it's in the same location on the iPhone 4. About a quater of an inch on the bottom is segregated from the rest.
Apple themselves said it was affected by the bottom left corner, just as the HTC manual states. The 3G's and 3GS also experiences the same issue under iOS4. Was it a design flaw that simply wasn't noticed for a few years on those models?
Ah... well, the actual rational explanation is that you're in an area of poor reception. If you can duplicate this underneath a tower where the reception is known to be 100%, then you may have a point. Otherwise, the evidence, the video, the conclusions... all scientifically meaningless.
As an addendum to the original post, you don't need to be under a tower to know you have full strength on the phone. That's what 5 bars means on an iPhone 4, unless you are claiming that Apple falsely represents signal strength in its software.
Unless I am very wrong, the gyroscope is new hardware built into iP 4, ditto the sound canceling microphone. There are certainly iOS 4 software features that work with this hardware, but the iPhone G3 can never have these functions without the hardware.
No, you are very right about that actually. It was more a point to show solipsism that fragmentation is alive and well in the iOS realm because of hardware feature differences and the inability for phones like the iPhone EDGE to upgrade its software features in line with the iPhone 4.
Actually, if you look at the phone, it's in the same location on the iPhone 4. About a quater of an inch on the bottom is segregated from the rest.
Apple themselves said it was affected by the bottom left corner, just as the HTC manual states. The 3G's and 3GS also experiences the same issue under iOS4. Was it a design flaw that simply wasn't noticed for a few years on those models?
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
And? Why do they experience the same issue on 3G and 3GS after upgrading to iOS4 but not before? I should also point out that in the HTC manual, the point they indicate is not at the bottom. It's on the lower left side.
Am I the only one who finds this out-of-line for a phone designer?
I think back to the article "The iPhone is the worst phone in the world"
http://is.gd/d5zjn
1. There are iP4 users with reception problems.
2. Not all iP4 users are experiencing the anomaly.
3. There seem to be as many opinions (guesses) about the cause as there are posters.
My conclusion is that no one knows the cause...i.e. antenna design flaw and/or manufacturing issue.
So hopefully, the technical experts at Apple will find the answer soon so all the Apple and iPhone whiners can get on with their lives. I'm sure Steve Jobs is sorry he even commented on this issue before the Apple technical folks had a more definitive answer.
The iPhone 4 antenna is the metal strip around the phone, not at the base of the phone as in other designs.
In other words, the iPhone 4 antenna is completely exposed to the hands where in other phone designs the antenna is located under plastic and is in the interior of the phone away from direct physical contact with the hand.
If you were to point this out to one of Apple's engineers, what do you think he or she would say? ..."Oh, I wasn't aware that would be a problem"? If there is indeed a real problem, I think it's going to be a little more involved than a metal band.
And? Why do they experience the same issue on 3G and 3GS after upgrading to iOS4 but not before? I should also point out that in the HTC manual, the point they indicate is not at the bottom. It's on the lower left side.
If Apple changed something in the iOS 4.0 which affected the antenna, it is still a design flaw by definition.
Apple might have to go back to an original, safer antenna software design, but who knows how much of a performance hit the iPhone will take in terms of CPU use, call quality, or battery life.
If Apple changed something in the iOS 4.0 which affected the antenna, it is still a design flaw by definition.
Apple might have to go back to an original, safer antenna software design, but who knows how much of a performance hit the iPhone will take in terms of CPU use, call quality, or battery life.
Now that I agree with. If they find that they cannot resolve the issue via a software update, they will be in a world of hurt.
True, but no one knows at this point that anyone knew anything before full scale production was authorized. We're arguing in the dark. Look, if it does turn out to be a design flaw, don't you think Apple is going to do something about it? But it's premature to determine that anything (or at least any ONE thing) is responsible for what some people (others, not) are experiencing. You really stand by your statement that there was a "complete lack of testing"? That's hard to buy.
No, I don't think Apple is going to do anything about it. They have a long history of not doing anything about defective devices. Than invites class action lawsuits and hard feelings.
Once Apple has your money their interest level is something approaching zero. I do wish I could say otherwise, but history does not support a contrary expectation. It would be refreshing if Apple were to embrace the customers and start earning a reputation of doing right by them, but that would be out of character.
Did you own a Smurf (Blue and White)? It had defective Firewire and ATA controllers among other things that were not correct (they shipped out-of-spec RAM on some, but not all, of them and several batches of CPUs had major problems). Apple's actions? None. They left it up to the owners to identify the problems and figure out solutions. Yea, this is ancient history, but that is the point. Apple has a long history of (mis)behaving this way.
Sorry. If I am proven wrong, please remind me. Nothing would please me more.
Loss of reception while dialing out?
Avoid using the phone for phone calls.
Dropped calls in San Francisco?
Avoid going to San Francisco.
Playhouse Disney (or other flash site) doesn't work in the browser?
Avoid going to that site.
Screen gets smudged?
Avoid touching the screen.
Hate getting ripped off for expensive junk?
Stop buying Apple products.
Seriously, if the software fix doesn't do it, there will be multitudes of ripped off users who will be pissed off.
Enough is enough dude. Welcome to my ignore list, and good riddance to you.
If you were to point this out to one of Apple's engineers, what do you think he or she would say? ..."Oh, I wasn't aware that would be a problem"?
I think Steve Jobs' obsession over thinness is the compromising restriction which forced the engineers to make critical design errors.
Every electrical engineer (and now every iPhone user) knows about signal attenuation due to the hand touching the antenna. But it was Apple's ultimate design decision to sacrifice a better antenna placement in favor of a more aesthetically-pretty location.
Now Apple is suffering criticism for that.