Prices will come down, innovation will go up, revenue will go up.
Apple's probably roughly somewhere around 5% global and 10% US market share for computers. Windows still has the lead in a huge way here, and not everyone can afford to buy a Mac.
So, apps are going to need to be Windows/Mac, or even Windows/Mac/Linux, and dropping the prices on all platforms probably won't happen.
The iphone has greater market share, and there isn't at present anything like Windows looming over the smartphone environment at those kind of ratios (90/10) + that these app developers have to contend with, nor are smartphones nearly as capable or useful at running complex software, such as one might run on a Windows computer or an Apple computer.
I doubt innovation will go up because of the App Store. Creativity might be necessary, but this will be finding creative ways to deal with the less than optimal environment Apple is creating for its OS. So, innovation may go up, but only in terms of innovative ways to negotiate Apple's new framework, not necessarily innovation in software design.
The app store, for many of the larger, more complex, more heavy-duty apps that are typically used on a PC or workstation, (as opposed to a smartphone), lives in an environment where Windows has 90%+ and Linux is growing slowly in some areas. The app store might be another outlet, it might not. But it won't be the only outlet, and that's why it won't affect innovation in any significant fashion. Software is more or less a "known" thing in the PC world. You know your niche, your industry, and your industry knows the choices. There aren't that many, and they are well known, established brands. Since many of us specialize, it's not that hard to keep up with new developments in the field. It's doubtful the app store would be the first source of information that an individual working in a particular field would glean information from about new software programs specializing in his or her niche.
Something about this isn't right. It's not a huge deal, nor is it a deal-breaker, but once the very extended honeymoon is over, it might turn out to be a less than optimal use of resources. Personally, driving a Porsche while wearing a Porsche watch and sunglasses, with a Porsche pen in my pocket, Porsche luggage in my trunk, not to mention my Porsche shoes and jacket, ad infinitum. It gets old. Not that I have anything against a Porsche, they're great cars. It's just that there comes a point where, well, you know...
Buy a computer. Buy some software. Mix and match as you see fit. It's much less nauseating that way.
If you allow other users on your Mac, I would imagine that they would be able to use the programs as well He didn't say anything about user accounts. He said; "Macs you own".
you can use a single Itunes ID with multiple mac accounts on a single mac... i'm already using in this way for the iphone app store and it still counts as 1 mac account...
In the Romeo & Juliet scene, "wherefore" kind of means "why". As in, why do you have to be Romeo, a Montague, if you were someone else we could be together. In the context it's because the two families are sworn enemies.
So even though I assume your purpose was to ask Strobe "where are you"?, what you have actually done is ask Strobe "why do you have to be Strobe"?... which, oddly enough, even though your question missed its intended purpose, actually ended up being more humorous than what you meant to ask!
In the Romeo & Juliet scene, "wherefore" kind of means "why". As in, why do you have to be Romeo, a Montague, if you were someone else we could be together. In the context it's because the two families are sworn enemies.
So even though I assume your purpose was to ask Strobe "where are you"?, what you have actually done is ask Strobe "why do you have to be Strobe"?... which, oddly enough, even though your question missed its intended purpose, actually ended up being more humorous than what you meant to ask!
Seriously though, I really think that this is a just a step towards hosted apps. Eventually the apps will just run remotely and you will view them via your iWhatever.
Another nice thing that this does is transfer the cost of distribution of free programs for the Macs back onto Apple...
So an OPTIONAL store which gives small scale developers international distribution is a bad thing. Strange logic you have there.
Logic doesn't matter to the haters. By their reasoning, Apple offering MORE ways for developers equals less choice - unbelieveable
Then you have the conspiracy theorists who evidently left their tin foil hats off by the droves (including Leo Laporte - I think Leo has been hanging out with Adam Curry too much) that think this signals some attempt by Apple to lock down Mac OSX. Has to be one of the stupidest assertions I have seen thrown out there in a long time - but it makes great link bait!
Yes, but those aren't multi GB suites with many install options.
Yet...
Wow... that's an interesting aspect of this I hadn't considered. If they integrate it for businesses and let them run their own store on their own Xserve....
Apple's probably roughly somewhere around 5% global and 10% US market share for computers. Windows still has the lead in a huge way here, and not everyone can afford to buy a Mac.
What's better - to be a big fish in a small pond or a small fish in a huge pond?
The app store lets developers (of any size) be a visible fish in a pond stocked with affluent customers with a proven track record of actually buying software instead of pirating it.
Quote:
Something about this isn't right. It's not a huge deal, nor is it a deal-breaker, but once the very extended honeymoon is over, it might turn out to be a less than optimal use of resources
I think you are 180 degrees out of alignment with reality. This is the biggest part of the announcement today - it's simply huge and will be a huge feather in Apple's cap to further woo over switchers.
The software updating and patching aspects of such a store alone are huge. Look at the hodge podge of software update schemes out there today. I always thought both Microsoft and Apple missed a huge boat by not extending the OS software update features to third parties. Well, now Apple has a way to address that.
Wow... that's an interesting aspect of this I hadn't considered. If they integrate it for businesses and let them run their own store on their own Xserve....
Hmm! Time to hunt down my rep...
Not sure if you're laying sarcasm down thick or are serious...
Either way, Software can be very dynamic depending on the end user. Some software needs extra configuration, some software needs heavy background processes, some software needs to be stripped bare. Especially after looking at the App Store guidelines, there is no way they'd be able to accommodate any of this. What are they going to say? Too bad, don't buy a mac? It doesn't work this way, and never will work this way.
Just their guidelines alone would wipe out 70% of the mac software out there (yes made up number, but relative still). Most mac apps run background processes, use something other than Objective-C, run emulators, require command line, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc.
This doom and gloom needs to stop, and stop here. It's unrealistic and isn't going to happen. As Melgross said, once the cat is out of the bag, it isn't going back in.
Open software was here before the app store. On the iphone, the app store was there before software (minus jailbreaking). It's completely different platforms with completely different end tasks.
They might just add more categories to the "Games for Windows" client as it has been doing this stuff for years.
It might make sense to bring it all under the "Zune" banner, but it would probably make more sense to bring "Zune"\\"Games for Windows"\\"Xbox Marketplace" under the one "Windows Marketplace" banner.
The "old" Microsoft didn't have a very good track record in bringing all of its services together. A few years ago I would have said there was no way they would do it. The "new" Microsoft seems interested in integrating though... so you never know!
Apple won't wait for Lion to bring the Mac App Store to the masses, as the software download destination is set to arrive on the current version of Mac OS X, Snow Leopard, in the next three months.
The App Store will allow users to download and install applications with just one click, like on the iPhone, iPod touch and iPad. Developers will also be able to take a 70 percent cut of sales through the digital storefront, while Apple keeps 30 percent. [...]
In both Lion and Snow Leopard, users will not be tied to the App Store for new software. Jobs said that the App Store will simply be an option for both developers and users, suggesting Mac OS X will not become a "walled garden" like iOS.
There are a number of obvious problems with the Mac App Store:
1- The reason why there are so few developers and software titles on the Mac is low market share, 5% world market share caused by higher Mac prices, less choices of options and models as a result of the "one size fits all" approach to reducing Apple manufacturing and inventory costs, and the steadfast refusal to licence Mac OS X (or the iOS) to competing manufacturers (No, Apple was never "a software company" contrary to what Steve Jobs just said);
2- Apple is motivated by greed, the 30% fee it wants to get on every application sold for the Mac, instead of being motivated by the long term expansion of the Mac market share;
3- The danger of trapping the market by encouraging every developer to use and "benefit" from the Mac App Store so that established developers refuse to release their software outside of the Mac App Store;
4- The occasional unpaid use of software at home or in school is part of learning, akin to using shareware. Software used at work, to gain income, must be paid for as developers rely on royalties to gain their own income, but software used at home for personal purposes, in a non-commercial way, should be free or mostly free, just like software used in school. Successful developers (like Microsoft) often donate their software to schools, public libraries and not-for-profit organizations.
Once you pay for internet access and computer use, the use of internet is mostly free. Outside of businesses, software should be either free or mostly free (e.g. shareware which you pay "if it's worth it").
I regret to say that if the trap materializes, if the Mac App Store becomes the only way to get and use software on the Mac, I will advise my friends to stay with Windows PC computers and I will rejoin the Windows crowd as I will always choose freedom over control and entrapment.
Greed will be Apple's demise.
By the way, did Apple ever determine how many potential customers they lose by insisting on the App Store for iOS iPhones and iPads? The inability to choose my own software is definitely a good reason to stay away from the iPhone and, possibly, the iPad.
Negatives add up. All the reasons for not buying a product add up.
90% of computers run on Windows. There are many reasons for that, including the possibility to choose what software to use.
If this thing takes off, and in a year or two the vast majority of Mac Apps are installed via a single central application that handles purchase, install and updates, then Windows is going to look mighty clumsy by comparison. Go the Mac!
If this thing takes off, and in a year or two the vast majority of Mac Apps are installed via a single central application that handles purchase, install and updates, then Windows is going to look mighty clumsy by comparison. Go the Mac!
It'll take off.
50% of new Mac users are switchers from PC. They've heard that Apple's Mac is an easier system and it's less "encumbered" with virus and other malware. When they are told that there's a curated store that they can trust for the Mac that's just like the iPhone App Store it's a no brainer that they'll use it.
The process is simple.
1. Peruse Mac App Store
2. Find interesting app and decide to purchase
3. Click buy button
4. App downloads ..no serial number to input, no restarting no single computer license restriction
50% of new Mac users are switchers from PC. They've heard that Apple's Mac is an easier system and it's less "encumbered" with virus and other malware. When they are told that there's a curated store that they can trust for the Mac that's just like the iPhone App Store it's a no brainer that they'll use it.
Good point, the Mac probably does have a disproportionate % of users who would favor this kind of approach.
The internet is going to be full of this sort of comment, about how we're on a slippery slope etc.
When in fact the Mac App store is an option.
Ubuntu has a package manager that lets you install applications (all free of course) in one click and it works amazingly well. It's only natural for commercial OS's to do the same. As long as they realise that it should not be the ONLY option, which Apple understands and so will Microsoft I'm sure - when they do their equivalent.
Ubuntu's / debian's synaptic is the best tool available for all the free stuff out there and also provides an options to add multiple repos so that you don't have to stick with canonical for each and every thing.
Mac & Linux are moving towards a direction where it might take windows ages to come even close
Not that I expect anyone to know this answer yet...
Apple said I can use an app I purchase on any Mac I own. I actually asume that means any Mac with iTunes authoried to my iTunes account (ie, AppleID). But whatever, 5 Macs is plenty.
My question is about other users on the same Mac? Will they have access to use an app I purchase from the Mac App Store? I hope so or it would be a major drawback of releasing your apps via the Store.
That might be the reason why it outside the itunes. Generally Itunes has this per user thingy as it is tied to one of the itunes sync accounts
Comments
So does this mean apps will be able to play on the mac?
Do you think the app store will be eventually removed from itunes?
you can't run iphone or ipad apps on mac, for mac there will be a separate app store where only mac apps can be run...
Prices will come down, innovation will go up, revenue will go up.
Apple's probably roughly somewhere around 5% global and 10% US market share for computers. Windows still has the lead in a huge way here, and not everyone can afford to buy a Mac.
So, apps are going to need to be Windows/Mac, or even Windows/Mac/Linux, and dropping the prices on all platforms probably won't happen.
The iphone has greater market share, and there isn't at present anything like Windows looming over the smartphone environment at those kind of ratios (90/10) + that these app developers have to contend with, nor are smartphones nearly as capable or useful at running complex software, such as one might run on a Windows computer or an Apple computer.
I doubt innovation will go up because of the App Store. Creativity might be necessary, but this will be finding creative ways to deal with the less than optimal environment Apple is creating for its OS. So, innovation may go up, but only in terms of innovative ways to negotiate Apple's new framework, not necessarily innovation in software design.
The app store, for many of the larger, more complex, more heavy-duty apps that are typically used on a PC or workstation, (as opposed to a smartphone), lives in an environment where Windows has 90%+ and Linux is growing slowly in some areas. The app store might be another outlet, it might not. But it won't be the only outlet, and that's why it won't affect innovation in any significant fashion. Software is more or less a "known" thing in the PC world. You know your niche, your industry, and your industry knows the choices. There aren't that many, and they are well known, established brands. Since many of us specialize, it's not that hard to keep up with new developments in the field. It's doubtful the app store would be the first source of information that an individual working in a particular field would glean information from about new software programs specializing in his or her niche.
Something about this isn't right. It's not a huge deal, nor is it a deal-breaker, but once the very extended honeymoon is over, it might turn out to be a less than optimal use of resources. Personally, driving a Porsche while wearing a Porsche watch and sunglasses, with a Porsche pen in my pocket, Porsche luggage in my trunk, not to mention my Porsche shoes and jacket, ad infinitum. It gets old. Not that I have anything against a Porsche, they're great cars. It's just that there comes a point where, well, you know...
Buy a computer. Buy some software. Mix and match as you see fit. It's much less nauseating that way.
If you allow other users on your Mac, I would imagine that they would be able to use the programs as well He didn't say anything about user accounts. He said; "Macs you own".
you can use a single Itunes ID with multiple mac accounts on a single mac... i'm already using in this way for the iphone app store and it still counts as 1 mac account...
Strobe, oh Strobe, wherefore art thou?
In the Romeo & Juliet scene, "wherefore" kind of means "why". As in, why do you have to be Romeo, a Montague, if you were someone else we could be together. In the context it's because the two families are sworn enemies.
So even though I assume your purpose was to ask Strobe "where are you"?, what you have actually done is ask Strobe "why do you have to be Strobe"?... which, oddly enough, even though your question missed its intended purpose, actually ended up being more humorous than what you meant to ask!
O Romeo, Romeo, wherefore art thou Romeo?
Deny thy father and refuse thy name;
Or if thou wilt not, be but sworn my love
And I'll no longer be a Capulet.
In the Romeo & Juliet scene, "wherefore" kind of means "why". As in, why do you have to be Romeo, a Montague, if you were someone else we could be together. In the context it's because the two families are sworn enemies.
So even though I assume your purpose was to ask Strobe "where are you"?, what you have actually done is ask Strobe "why do you have to be Strobe"?... which, oddly enough, even though your question missed its intended purpose, actually ended up being more humorous than what you meant to ask!
O Romeo, Romeo, wherefore art thou Romeo?
Deny thy father and refuse thy name;
Or if thou wilt not, be but sworn my love
And I'll no longer be a Capulet.
Often, things are not what they appear to be...
Draw the huge bottoms through the furrow'd sea,
Breasting the lofty surge:
.
Seriously though, I really think that this is a just a step towards hosted apps. Eventually the apps will just run remotely and you will view them via your iWhatever.
Another nice thing that this does is transfer the cost of distribution of free programs for the Macs back onto Apple...
So an OPTIONAL store which gives small scale developers international distribution is a bad thing. Strange logic you have there.
Logic doesn't matter to the haters. By their reasoning, Apple offering MORE ways for developers equals less choice - unbelieveable
Then you have the conspiracy theorists who evidently left their tin foil hats off by the droves (including Leo Laporte - I think Leo has been hanging out with Adam Curry too much) that think this signals some attempt by Apple to lock down Mac OSX. Has to be one of the stupidest assertions I have seen thrown out there in a long time - but it makes great link bait!
rust me, "OPTIONAL" will last a year or two.
Trust me - not gonna happen.
Pathetic,.,,,
indeed
Sigh! The usual unobservant and illogical comments from one of our few resident trolls. Nice to see you again.
You may think so but I don't. Was it really necessary to quote his whole "post"?!?
it's an obvious trojan horse deal
The only thing obvious is your username is perfect for your rationalizations - even if it is missing an l
Yes, but those aren't multi GB suites with many install options.
Yet...
Wow... that's an interesting aspect of this I hadn't considered. If they integrate it for businesses and let them run their own store on their own Xserve....
Hmm! Time to hunt down my rep...
Apple's probably roughly somewhere around 5% global and 10% US market share for computers. Windows still has the lead in a huge way here, and not everyone can afford to buy a Mac.
What's better - to be a big fish in a small pond or a small fish in a huge pond?
The app store lets developers (of any size) be a visible fish in a pond stocked with affluent customers with a proven track record of actually buying software instead of pirating it.
Something about this isn't right. It's not a huge deal, nor is it a deal-breaker, but once the very extended honeymoon is over, it might turn out to be a less than optimal use of resources
I think you are 180 degrees out of alignment with reality. This is the biggest part of the announcement today - it's simply huge and will be a huge feather in Apple's cap to further woo over switchers.
The software updating and patching aspects of such a store alone are huge. Look at the hodge podge of software update schemes out there today. I always thought both Microsoft and Apple missed a huge boat by not extending the OS software update features to third parties. Well, now Apple has a way to address that.
I can't wait for the Zune app store on Windows
Yet...
Wow... that's an interesting aspect of this I hadn't considered. If they integrate it for businesses and let them run their own store on their own Xserve....
Hmm! Time to hunt down my rep...
Not sure if you're laying sarcasm down thick or are serious...
Either way, Software can be very dynamic depending on the end user. Some software needs extra configuration, some software needs heavy background processes, some software needs to be stripped bare. Especially after looking at the App Store guidelines, there is no way they'd be able to accommodate any of this. What are they going to say? Too bad, don't buy a mac? It doesn't work this way, and never will work this way.
Just their guidelines alone would wipe out 70% of the mac software out there (yes made up number, but relative still). Most mac apps run background processes, use something other than Objective-C, run emulators, require command line, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc.
This doom and gloom needs to stop, and stop here. It's unrealistic and isn't going to happen. As Melgross said, once the cat is out of the bag, it isn't going back in.
Open software was here before the app store. On the iphone, the app store was there before software (minus jailbreaking). It's completely different platforms with completely different end tasks.
I can't wait for the Zune app store on Windows
They might just add more categories to the "Games for Windows" client as it has been doing this stuff for years.
It might make sense to bring it all under the "Zune" banner, but it would probably make more sense to bring "Zune"\\"Games for Windows"\\"Xbox Marketplace" under the one "Windows Marketplace" banner.
The "old" Microsoft didn't have a very good track record in bringing all of its services together. A few years ago I would have said there was no way they would do it. The "new" Microsoft seems interested in integrating though... so you never know!
Apple won't wait for Lion to bring the Mac App Store to the masses, as the software download destination is set to arrive on the current version of Mac OS X, Snow Leopard, in the next three months.
The App Store will allow users to download and install applications with just one click, like on the iPhone, iPod touch and iPad. Developers will also be able to take a 70 percent cut of sales through the digital storefront, while Apple keeps 30 percent. [...]
In both Lion and Snow Leopard, users will not be tied to the App Store for new software. Jobs said that the App Store will simply be an option for both developers and users, suggesting Mac OS X will not become a "walled garden" like iOS.
There are a number of obvious problems with the Mac App Store:
1- The reason why there are so few developers and software titles on the Mac is low market share, 5% world market share caused by higher Mac prices, less choices of options and models as a result of the "one size fits all" approach to reducing Apple manufacturing and inventory costs, and the steadfast refusal to licence Mac OS X (or the iOS) to competing manufacturers (No, Apple was never "a software company" contrary to what Steve Jobs just said);
2- Apple is motivated by greed, the 30% fee it wants to get on every application sold for the Mac, instead of being motivated by the long term expansion of the Mac market share;
3- The danger of trapping the market by encouraging every developer to use and "benefit" from the Mac App Store so that established developers refuse to release their software outside of the Mac App Store;
4- The occasional unpaid use of software at home or in school is part of learning, akin to using shareware. Software used at work, to gain income, must be paid for as developers rely on royalties to gain their own income, but software used at home for personal purposes, in a non-commercial way, should be free or mostly free, just like software used in school. Successful developers (like Microsoft) often donate their software to schools, public libraries and not-for-profit organizations.
Once you pay for internet access and computer use, the use of internet is mostly free. Outside of businesses, software should be either free or mostly free (e.g. shareware which you pay "if it's worth it").
I regret to say that if the trap materializes, if the Mac App Store becomes the only way to get and use software on the Mac, I will advise my friends to stay with Windows PC computers and I will rejoin the Windows crowd as I will always choose freedom over control and entrapment.
Greed will be Apple's demise.
By the way, did Apple ever determine how many potential customers they lose by insisting on the App Store for iOS iPhones and iPads? The inability to choose my own software is definitely a good reason to stay away from the iPhone and, possibly, the iPad.
Negatives add up. All the reasons for not buying a product add up.
90% of computers run on Windows. There are many reasons for that, including the possibility to choose what software to use.
If this thing takes off, and in a year or two the vast majority of Mac Apps are installed via a single central application that handles purchase, install and updates, then Windows is going to look mighty clumsy by comparison. Go the Mac!
It'll take off.
50% of new Mac users are switchers from PC. They've heard that Apple's Mac is an easier system and it's less "encumbered" with virus and other malware. When they are told that there's a curated store that they can trust for the Mac that's just like the iPhone App Store it's a no brainer that they'll use it.
The process is simple.
1. Peruse Mac App Store
2. Find interesting app and decide to purchase
3. Click buy button
4. App downloads ..no serial number to input, no restarting no single computer license restriction
drop...dead...simple = win
50% of new Mac users are switchers from PC. They've heard that Apple's Mac is an easier system and it's less "encumbered" with virus and other malware. When they are told that there's a curated store that they can trust for the Mac that's just like the iPhone App Store it's a no brainer that they'll use it.
Good point, the Mac probably does have a disproportionate % of users who would favor this kind of approach.
The internet is going to be full of this sort of comment, about how we're on a slippery slope etc.
When in fact the Mac App store is an option.
Ubuntu has a package manager that lets you install applications (all free of course) in one click and it works amazingly well. It's only natural for commercial OS's to do the same. As long as they realise that it should not be the ONLY option, which Apple understands and so will Microsoft I'm sure - when they do their equivalent.
Ubuntu's / debian's synaptic is the best tool available for all the free stuff out there and also provides an options to add multiple repos so that you don't have to stick with canonical for each and every thing.
Mac & Linux are moving towards a direction where it might take windows ages to come even close
Not that I expect anyone to know this answer yet...
Apple said I can use an app I purchase on any Mac I own. I actually asume that means any Mac with iTunes authoried to my iTunes account (ie, AppleID). But whatever, 5 Macs is plenty.
My question is about other users on the same Mac? Will they have access to use an app I purchase from the Mac App Store? I hope so or it would be a major drawback of releasing your apps via the Store.
That might be the reason why it outside the itunes. Generally Itunes has this per user thingy as it is tied to one of the itunes sync accounts