Great phone?... You mean "great" for a phone with Microsoft software on it...
No, I mean a great phone. The hacking community behind windows mobile is especially appealing. You can pretty much get WM to do whatever you need, and people have even ported Android over to the HD2 as well so if you don't like WM, you can load up Android. You can even run ubuntu.
It's a great phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead
Sure there is some new code in there, but the basis for Windows Phone 7 is the primitive Windows CE just like Windows Mobile is. His point is quite valid. Microsoft loves to reskin old crappy OSes and get all the clueless Microsoft drones to pay for it again.
Windows CE has different versions, and they use 6.0 R3 for Windows Phone 7, which has a completely new kernel and uses Windows Embedded Compact 7 features. Basically CE is the backbone, but it's not primitive, and the new kernel and code they use forced MS to build this OS from the ground up.
Apparently things like copy and paste are possibilities for future releases, and even backward compatibility for running previous Windows Mobile apps in a sort of virtual mode is on the table.
Either way, this isn't the same Windows Mobile OS that we have seen with 6.0 - 6.5.5.
Agreed, iOS1 was indeed ground breaking. It was worth the price of admission just for the elegant use of contacts management, Photo management, visual voicemail, texting and emailing. Especially the syncing with the desktop. And, never mind all the apps! How soon we forget!
Sometimes I read an article on this site that is so blatantly and obviously biased that I have a hard time believe that people can get away with it and call themselves journalists. This is one of those times.
Ok I have read almost the entire comment section of this article and am amazed that no one has mentioned the obvious. Who cares if its 1.0 or 100.5 version ... get ready for it ...
Windows Phone 7 looks like a pile of cow dung! Seriously, the interface looks absolutely terrible. Functionality? Seriously? Who would want to use these old ass looking square boxes, like something out of 1988?
I don't care if this phone could make me breakfast, I'm not using something that looks this bad.
Oh and for those who say this 'NEW' OS to not have Copy/Paste is acceptable are smoking something. Did Microsoft even take note of the massive uproar over iOS not having it? To not have it after almost 4 years since the iPhone has come out is really dumb.
LOL, wow this was the most entertain thing to read all week. So many uninformed posters as well as the most utterly biased article written.
First off, WP7 is NOT a successor of 6.5. Don't say "oh they're both based on Windows CE." Please take an Operating Systems class at your local community college before you start spouting non-sense. Oh and FYI, 6.5 had copy/paste.
Second, I really laugh at all the people saying DOA. Really? Are you the same people that said iPhone was DOA? Or are you the ones that were defending Apple? Seems kind of ironic doesn't it?
Microsoft may be slow, but you shouldn't underestimate them. I'm predicting that WP7 will become a strong competitor against both Apple and Google in the future.
P.S. I would like to play around with WP7, but my heart is set on a Verizon iPhone (keeping my HTC TP, waiting til January to upgrade....)
Ok I have read almost the entire comment section of this article and am amazed that no one has mentioned the obvious. Who cares if its 1.0 or 100.5 version ... get ready for it ...
Windows Phone 7 looks like a pile of cow dung! Seriously, the interface looks absolutely terrible. Functionality? Seriously? Who would want to use these old ass looking square boxes, like something out of 1988?
I don't care if this phone could make me breakfast, I'm not using something that looks this bad.
Oh and for those who say this 'NEW' OS to not have Copy/Paste is acceptable are smoking something. Did Microsoft even take note of the massive uproar over iOS not having it? To not have it after almost 4 years since the iPhone has come out is really dumb.
Ok, off high horse ...
I have no inside knowledge, but I would guess that MS had other plans -- plans to enhance their existing mobile OS offerings.
At some point MS realized that it would be better to back up and start over.
I suspect that decision was made about a year ago.
WP7 appears to be not quite done. It does have some good ideas, but the execution is not right... yet.
I think what we see is similar to what we'd see if Apple or Google were to show their year-long development effort, several months before it was finished and ready to be shown.
But what else could MS do? Do nothing? Rather, they chose to show what they had, insinuate what is coming-- and hope people will wait for them to catch up.
Some will!
I suspect more enterprise IT shops than consumers, will wait for a MS phone.
I believe that MS has until July 2011 (a little over 9 months) to get it together!
I see a big problem for MS in the Tablet area -- and a Tablet running Windows 7 isn't the answer.
IT wants tablet solutions, as well as phone, laptop and desktop solutions.
At some point MS realized that it would be better to back up and start over. I suspect that decision was made about a year ago.
I'd say that's just about spot on. It's impressive what Microsoft's developers can accomplish, and how quickly they can accomplish it, when management help instead of hinder them (I would assume by mainly just getting out of the way).
Windows Phone 7 is so bad that reviewers are forced to praise its atrocious interface just for being “different.” How amusing. It’s almost like Microsoft is the underdog now—the massive, bloated, incompetent underdog.
That sums up about exactly what I was planning to reply. I've been following WP7 news closely since the day it was announced, because I think it's interesting, unexpected, and frankly quite ballsy from Microsoft's part to literally throw everything out of the window (pardon the pun), ditch backwards compatibility for all your current installed base, and basically make a 180 degree turn to base their new phone platform off the same concepts as the iPhone. Closed app store, tight hardware control, full finger UI, gone with the fugly widgets and dialogs they ripped out of desktop Windows for WM, main focus on consumers and not businesses, and very limited OEM customizations. I thought they finally got it, and I thought it was a good thing, competition benefits everyone.
That said, as the launch date came closer lots of the initial buzz got muted, many of the trumpeted features appeared to be unfinished initially, watered down or scrapped altogether, and now that the first reviews are coming in it seems they are all trying to sidestep this as if it's only a minor detail. I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar. How's the 3D performance in games? How's the battery life? Is the new UI actually comfortable to use?
The only conclusion every review seems to draw is that the UI is different and snappy. That's not innovation just because it is different. If it drastically improved the way you use a smartphone, it could be innovative, but I get the impression it's not like that, just different. At the end of the day you still see lots of lists to scroll through, except that you now also scroll horizontally sometimes, and that typography is pretty much the only chrome added to the UI. Horizontal scrolling is not new at all, it rears it's head every now and then but it never sticks, probably because it doesn't work so well. Which may have something to do with the fact that text runs left to right in Western languages, which creates all kinds of readability issues if you have lots of it and you can't wrap it vertically like you do with vertical scrolling.
Eventually WP7 will get some marketshare, but I sincerely don't think Apple will suffer much, my prediction is that it will end up primarily as a business phone OS after they realize that all the consumer oriented gizmo's they tried so hard to stuff in there weren't enough to sway users choosing WP7 over Android or iOS.
As usual, the enterprise environment is where WP7 will end up, I mean, it confunds me as to why 99.99% of businesses think its necessary to run windows technology.
There will no doubt be a flood of applications, not that WP7 really needs that many.
...
I'm not saying WP7 doesn't need applications (it does) just that it doesn't need 300,000 to be competitive with iPhone.
It just needs the most popular and high quality applications.
...
It's going to be an interesting few years!
The table have turned in an interesting manner: For decades the MS faithful triumphed Windows over Mac by loudly proclaiming how many programs were available for PCs and how few were available for the Mac. Now look where things stand with the App Store. Not that anyone ever has the time to sift through 300 000 apps!
BREAKING NEWS: A brand new platform is not quite yet as good as the far more matured Android and iOS platforms.
Guess what? iOS 1.x wasn't much to write home about, either. But it got better over time. The same with Android. And the same will be true of Windows Phone 7.
..but that was 3 years ago. That is about 15 dog years, and 50 electronic years.
Yeah, but this isn't 2007 any more. The iPhone and Android have been on the scene for years now.
You can't come out to where your competitors were years ago, you have to come out ahead of them. That MS could release a phone without copy and paste in 2010 (late 2010 at that!) just boggles...
You could say the same about Apple, a lot of the "new" features they introduced with iOS had existed in other mobile platforms for years before they released the feature.
I have had dealings wit Microsoft dating back to 1979.
I have a strong dislike and distrust for the Microsoft company, their style and ethics --based on personal experience as a Microsoft customer and reseller.
And as one of Dick's customers in the days of Compµter Plus, I can vouch for his words above.
Quote:
Yes! There are Innovations in the WP7 UI that are innovative -- as I tried to detail in my post.
There are thoughts in your analysis that are thoughtful. There are expressions in the above that are expressive. You lack of bias is unbiased. [Sorry, Dick, couldn't help observing the "innovative innovations turn of phrase above!]
Actually I felt that your original lengthy comment was one of the best I've seen WRT WP7, and your rebuttal was long on experience and very short on emotion. Thanks for that.
Ex-IBMer Dick has a long and personal view of APPL and the Mac. The reason he's not a tech blogger is that he has integrity!
Not surprisingly, the article puts a slant on the reviews which is not entirely accurate. The reviews have generally been positive, with Mossberg's being the most negative (big surprise there), while noticing the absence of some features in the current release.
For example, the Appleinsider article implies that Engadget did not particularly like WP7, and would not recommend it.
Here is the summary of the Engadget review, which paints a very different picture.
The only site more bias that Walt is AppleInsider. AI is the KING of taking stuff out of context and close to the top of link baiting article titles to drive hits.
"saying the "a pretty face" is the only thing that WP7 offers over its competition" that and Zune Pass. Anything Music trumps both the iPhone and Android.
Copy and Paste.....does anyone know how I can TURN IT OFF on my iPHone as I have NEVER used it and it CONSTANTLY gets in my way when zooming. Microsoft has missed some features, but none of them IMHO are game stoppers and yet their Hub centric GUI and Zune intergration is a game changer IMHO.
That sums up about exactly what I was planning to reply. I've been following WP7 news closely since the day it was announced, because I think it's interesting, unexpected, and frankly quite ballsy from Microsoft's part to literally throw everything out of the window (pardon the pun), ditch backwards compatibility for all your current installed base, and basically make a 180 degree turn to base their new phone platform off the same concepts as the iPhone. Closed app store, tight hardware control, full finger UI, gone with the fugly widgets and dialogs they ripped out of desktop Windows for WM, main focus on consumers and not businesses, and very limited OEM customizations. I thought they finally got it, and I thought it was a good thing, competition benefits everyone.
That said, as the launch date came closer lots of the initial buzz got muted, many of the trumpeted features appeared to be unfinished initially, watered down or scrapped altogether, and now that the first reviews are coming in it seems they are all trying to sidestep this as if it's only a minor detail. I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar. How's the 3D performance in games? How's the battery life? Is the new UI actually comfortable to use?
The only conclusion every review seems to draw is that the UI is different and snappy. That's not innovation just because it is different. If it drastically improved the way you use a smartphone, it could be innovative, but I get the impression it's not like that, just different. At the end of the day you still see lots of lists to scroll through, except that you now also scroll horizontally sometimes, and that typography is pretty much the only chrome added to the UI. Horizontal scrolling is not new at all, it rears it's head every now and then but it never sticks, probably because it doesn't work so well. Which may have something to do with the fact that text runs left to right in Western languages, which creates all kinds of readability issues if you have lots of it and you can't wrap it vertically like you do with vertical scrolling.
Eventually WP7 will get some marketshare, but I sincerely don't think Apple will suffer much, my prediction is that it will end up primarily as a business phone OS after they realize that all the consumer oriented gizmo's they tried so hard to stuff in there weren't enough to sway users choosing WP7 over Android or iOS.
"I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar."
I guess you were really not following the news close enough. It has been explained in many blog aritcles. Play one of the Xbox live games on the phoen and it updates your stats on Live. If the same game is on the 360 your progression/stats are updated there.
I have seen many screen shots of Office for the phone. Add to that Sharepoint sycing has been reviewed. Honestly I have only read a few articles and I picked all of that up.
I had a Dell Axim 7 years ago. I will *never* go back to Windows mobile platforms. I had a gaming rig running XP2, Vista(horrible), 7(good) but I stopped playing a few months ago mainly because so many titles are just console ports, assuming it even makes it to PC. All the good games are on consoles, which frustratingly, have worse graphics than a relatively modest US$800 gaming PC. And console graphics aren't going to improve much!
Happy here in the Walled Garden of Good and Evil. LOL
"7 years ago" yeah what he said because nothing ever changes in 7 years.
And as one of Dick's customers in the days of Compµter Plus, I can vouch for his words above.
There are thoughts in your analysis that are thoughtful. There are expressions in the above that are expressive. You lack of bias is unbiased. [Sorry, Dick, couldn't help observing the "innovative innovations turn of phrase above!]
Actually I felt that your original lengthy comment was one of the best I've seen WRT WP7, and your rebuttal was long on experience and very short on emotion. Thanks for that.
Ex-IBMer Dick has a long and personal view of APPL and the Mac. The reason he's not a tech blogger is that he has integrity!
Thanks Tod -- I think you covered everything I asked you to...
The only site more bias that Walt is AppleInsider. AI is the KING of taking stuff out of context and close to the top of link baiting article titles to drive hits.
"saying the "a pretty face" is the only thing that WP7 offers over its competition" that and Zune Pass. Anything Music trumps both the iPhone and Android.
Copy and Paste.....does anyone know how I can TURN IT OFF on my iPHone as I have NEVER used it and it CONSTANTLY gets in my way when zooming. Microsoft has missed some features, but none of them IMHO are game stoppers and yet their Hub centric GUI and Zune intergration is a game changer IMHO.
I have no particular problem with bias per se, and Walt, while biased, does not make things up.
However, lately, IMO Appleinsider is coming close to yellow journalism, particularly after the Ballmer incident. This article is no different than if someone wrote a summary of the iPhone 4 reviews with the headline, "iPhone 4 suffers from significant hardware problems" and then quoted a bunch of reviewers who had said something about the antenna or proximity sensor.
"I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar."
I guess you were really not following the news close enough. It has been explained in many blog aritcles. Play one of the Xbox live games on the phoen and it updates your stats on Live. If the same game is on the 360 your progression/stats are updated there.
I have seen many screen shots of Office for the phone. Add to that Sharepoint sycing has been reviewed. Honestly I have only read a few articles and I picked all of that up.
To be fair, most posters here are Apple fans/users like myself. I doubt that many follow the blogs for MS or other competitors products -- I know I don't.
What I do is follow rumors leading up to announcements -- to see what to expect! Then I try to watch or listen to the announcement event. I try to watch closely and form my own opinions.
Leading up to the WP7 event there were rumors on what set it apart from other smart phones -- including Office, XBox/Zune, and Marketplace integration.
Unfortunately, none of those were demonstrated -- and I believe they are key features.
So, we cannot evaluate how well or badly these are implemented-- if at all.
One video showed a MS rep demoing a phone. He was asked to show a Zune app (whatever). He said he couldn't because none of the MS reps at the demo had access to a Zune account-- yeah, sure! Did you forget to brush your teeth before coming to the demo?
It would have been acceptable if he had said: "That's not available, yet" or somesuch. Instead, I distrusted everything else he said and showed.
It was good that they showed working devices, working navigation and a few working apps.
Quote:
Aside::
The RIM PlayBook event was orders of magnitude worse than the WP7 event -- they had nothing to show or talk about, except a partial features list.
Most people will give someone the benefit the doubt, unless they feel they are being deliberately mislead -- especially in response to a direct question or request.
I don't think WP7 is complete... yet. I suspect will be sometime next year, and it will have all the things that are now, in various stages of completion.
It is too early to judge WP7 or write them off.
But, you can't expect Apple fans/users to actively search the blogs for positive reactions to, and pictures of, things that MS couldn't/didn't show in their event
Comments
Great phone?... You mean "great" for a phone with Microsoft software on it...
No, I mean a great phone. The hacking community behind windows mobile is especially appealing. You can pretty much get WM to do whatever you need, and people have even ported Android over to the HD2 as well so if you don't like WM, you can load up Android. You can even run ubuntu.
It's a great phone.
Sure there is some new code in there, but the basis for Windows Phone 7 is the primitive Windows CE just like Windows Mobile is. His point is quite valid. Microsoft loves to reskin old crappy OSes and get all the clueless Microsoft drones to pay for it again.
Windows CE has different versions, and they use 6.0 R3 for Windows Phone 7, which has a completely new kernel and uses Windows Embedded Compact 7 features. Basically CE is the backbone, but it's not primitive, and the new kernel and code they use forced MS to build this OS from the ground up.
Apparently things like copy and paste are possibilities for future releases, and even backward compatibility for running previous Windows Mobile apps in a sort of virtual mode is on the table.
Either way, this isn't the same Windows Mobile OS that we have seen with 6.0 - 6.5.5.
BREAKING NEWS: another insipid comment by Quillz.
iOS 1 was ground breaking.
Agreed, iOS1 was indeed ground breaking. It was worth the price of admission just for the elegant use of contacts management, Photo management, visual voicemail, texting and emailing. Especially the syncing with the desktop. And, never mind all the apps! How soon we forget!
Best
Windows Phone 7 looks like a pile of cow dung! Seriously, the interface looks absolutely terrible. Functionality? Seriously? Who would want to use these old ass looking square boxes, like something out of 1988?
I don't care if this phone could make me breakfast, I'm not using something that looks this bad.
Oh and for those who say this 'NEW' OS to not have Copy/Paste is acceptable are smoking something. Did Microsoft even take note of the massive uproar over iOS not having it? To not have it after almost 4 years since the iPhone has come out is really dumb.
Ok, off high horse ...
First off, WP7 is NOT a successor of 6.5. Don't say "oh they're both based on Windows CE." Please take an Operating Systems class at your local community college before you start spouting non-sense. Oh and FYI, 6.5 had copy/paste.
Second, I really laugh at all the people saying DOA. Really? Are you the same people that said iPhone was DOA? Or are you the ones that were defending Apple? Seems kind of ironic doesn't it?
Microsoft may be slow, but you shouldn't underestimate them. I'm predicting that WP7 will become a strong competitor against both Apple and Google in the future.
P.S. I would like to play around with WP7, but my heart is set on a Verizon iPhone (keeping my HTC TP, waiting til January to upgrade....)
Ok I have read almost the entire comment section of this article and am amazed that no one has mentioned the obvious. Who cares if its 1.0 or 100.5 version ... get ready for it ...
Windows Phone 7 looks like a pile of cow dung! Seriously, the interface looks absolutely terrible. Functionality? Seriously? Who would want to use these old ass looking square boxes, like something out of 1988?
I don't care if this phone could make me breakfast, I'm not using something that looks this bad.
Oh and for those who say this 'NEW' OS to not have Copy/Paste is acceptable are smoking something. Did Microsoft even take note of the massive uproar over iOS not having it? To not have it after almost 4 years since the iPhone has come out is really dumb.
Ok, off high horse ...
I have no inside knowledge, but I would guess that MS had other plans -- plans to enhance their existing mobile OS offerings.
At some point MS realized that it would be better to back up and start over.
I suspect that decision was made about a year ago.
WP7 appears to be not quite done. It does have some good ideas, but the execution is not right... yet.
I think what we see is similar to what we'd see if Apple or Google were to show their year-long development effort, several months before it was finished and ready to be shown.
But what else could MS do? Do nothing? Rather, they chose to show what they had, insinuate what is coming-- and hope people will wait for them to catch up.
Some will!
I suspect more enterprise IT shops than consumers, will wait for a MS phone.
I believe that MS has until July 2011 (a little over 9 months) to get it together!
I see a big problem for MS in the Tablet area -- and a Tablet running Windows 7 isn't the answer.
IT wants tablet solutions, as well as phone, laptop and desktop solutions.
Well, the hesitatin' stalker's
got them hesitatin' shoes
Lord, I got them Hesitatin' Blues,.
Tell me how long do I have to wait...
Can I get you now, or, must I hesitate?
Yeah!
Hesitation blues (Clean Version)
.
At some point MS realized that it would be better to back up and start over. I suspect that decision was made about a year ago.
I'd say that's just about spot on. It's impressive what Microsoft's developers can accomplish, and how quickly they can accomplish it, when management help instead of hinder them (I would assume by mainly just getting out of the way).
Windows Phone 7 is so bad that reviewers are forced to praise its atrocious interface just for being “different.” How amusing. It’s almost like Microsoft is the underdog now—the massive, bloated, incompetent underdog.
That sums up about exactly what I was planning to reply. I've been following WP7 news closely since the day it was announced, because I think it's interesting, unexpected, and frankly quite ballsy from Microsoft's part to literally throw everything out of the window (pardon the pun), ditch backwards compatibility for all your current installed base, and basically make a 180 degree turn to base their new phone platform off the same concepts as the iPhone. Closed app store, tight hardware control, full finger UI, gone with the fugly widgets and dialogs they ripped out of desktop Windows for WM, main focus on consumers and not businesses, and very limited OEM customizations. I thought they finally got it, and I thought it was a good thing, competition benefits everyone.
That said, as the launch date came closer lots of the initial buzz got muted, many of the trumpeted features appeared to be unfinished initially, watered down or scrapped altogether, and now that the first reviews are coming in it seems they are all trying to sidestep this as if it's only a minor detail. I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar. How's the 3D performance in games? How's the battery life? Is the new UI actually comfortable to use?
The only conclusion every review seems to draw is that the UI is different and snappy. That's not innovation just because it is different. If it drastically improved the way you use a smartphone, it could be innovative, but I get the impression it's not like that, just different. At the end of the day you still see lots of lists to scroll through, except that you now also scroll horizontally sometimes, and that typography is pretty much the only chrome added to the UI. Horizontal scrolling is not new at all, it rears it's head every now and then but it never sticks, probably because it doesn't work so well. Which may have something to do with the fact that text runs left to right in Western languages, which creates all kinds of readability issues if you have lots of it and you can't wrap it vertically like you do with vertical scrolling.
Eventually WP7 will get some marketshare, but I sincerely don't think Apple will suffer much, my prediction is that it will end up primarily as a business phone OS after they realize that all the consumer oriented gizmo's they tried so hard to stuff in there weren't enough to sway users choosing WP7 over Android or iOS.
There will no doubt be a flood of applications, not that WP7 really needs that many.
...
I'm not saying WP7 doesn't need applications (it does) just that it doesn't need 300,000 to be competitive with iPhone.
It just needs the most popular and high quality applications.
...
It's going to be an interesting few years!
The table have turned in an interesting manner: For decades the MS faithful triumphed Windows over Mac by loudly proclaiming how many programs were available for PCs and how few were available for the Mac. Now look where things stand with the App Store. Not that anyone ever has the time to sift through 300 000 apps!
BREAKING NEWS: A brand new platform is not quite yet as good as the far more matured Android and iOS platforms.
Guess what? iOS 1.x wasn't much to write home about, either. But it got better over time. The same with Android. And the same will be true of Windows Phone 7.
..but that was 3 years ago. That is about 15 dog years, and 50 electronic years.
I just went to buy one and they were sold out, so evidently more than just me.
Aha! Are you sure "they" were sold out and not "it" was sold out?
How long was the line waiting to buy the single phone?
Sorry, couldn't resist.
Yeah, but this isn't 2007 any more. The iPhone and Android have been on the scene for years now.
You can't come out to where your competitors were years ago, you have to come out ahead of them. That MS could release a phone without copy and paste in 2010 (late 2010 at that!) just boggles...
You could say the same about Apple, a lot of the "new" features they introduced with iOS had existed in other mobile platforms for years before they released the feature.
I have had dealings wit Microsoft dating back to 1979.
I have a strong dislike and distrust for the Microsoft company, their style and ethics --based on personal experience as a Microsoft customer and reseller.
And as one of Dick's customers in the days of Compµter Plus, I can vouch for his words above.
Yes! There are Innovations in the WP7 UI that are innovative -- as I tried to detail in my post.
There are thoughts in your analysis that are thoughtful. There are expressions in the above that are expressive. You lack of bias is unbiased. [Sorry, Dick, couldn't help observing the "innovative innovations turn of phrase above!]
Actually I felt that your original lengthy comment was one of the best I've seen WRT WP7, and your rebuttal was long on experience and very short on emotion. Thanks for that.
Ex-IBMer Dick has a long and personal view of APPL and the Mac. The reason he's not a tech blogger is that he has integrity!
Not surprisingly, the article puts a slant on the reviews which is not entirely accurate. The reviews have generally been positive, with Mossberg's being the most negative (big surprise there), while noticing the absence of some features in the current release.
For example, the Appleinsider article implies that Engadget did not particularly like WP7, and would not recommend it.
Here is the summary of the Engadget review, which paints a very different picture.
The only site more bias that Walt is AppleInsider. AI is the KING of taking stuff out of context and close to the top of link baiting article titles to drive hits.
"saying the "a pretty face" is the only thing that WP7 offers over its competition" that and Zune Pass. Anything Music trumps both the iPhone and Android.
Copy and Paste.....does anyone know how I can TURN IT OFF on my iPHone as I have NEVER used it and it CONSTANTLY gets in my way when zooming. Microsoft has missed some features, but none of them IMHO are game stoppers and yet their Hub centric GUI and Zune intergration is a game changer IMHO.
That sums up about exactly what I was planning to reply. I've been following WP7 news closely since the day it was announced, because I think it's interesting, unexpected, and frankly quite ballsy from Microsoft's part to literally throw everything out of the window (pardon the pun), ditch backwards compatibility for all your current installed base, and basically make a 180 degree turn to base their new phone platform off the same concepts as the iPhone. Closed app store, tight hardware control, full finger UI, gone with the fugly widgets and dialogs they ripped out of desktop Windows for WM, main focus on consumers and not businesses, and very limited OEM customizations. I thought they finally got it, and I thought it was a good thing, competition benefits everyone.
That said, as the launch date came closer lots of the initial buzz got muted, many of the trumpeted features appeared to be unfinished initially, watered down or scrapped altogether, and now that the first reviews are coming in it seems they are all trying to sidestep this as if it's only a minor detail. I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar. How's the 3D performance in games? How's the battery life? Is the new UI actually comfortable to use?
The only conclusion every review seems to draw is that the UI is different and snappy. That's not innovation just because it is different. If it drastically improved the way you use a smartphone, it could be innovative, but I get the impression it's not like that, just different. At the end of the day you still see lots of lists to scroll through, except that you now also scroll horizontally sometimes, and that typography is pretty much the only chrome added to the UI. Horizontal scrolling is not new at all, it rears it's head every now and then but it never sticks, probably because it doesn't work so well. Which may have something to do with the fact that text runs left to right in Western languages, which creates all kinds of readability issues if you have lots of it and you can't wrap it vertically like you do with vertical scrolling.
Eventually WP7 will get some marketshare, but I sincerely don't think Apple will suffer much, my prediction is that it will end up primarily as a business phone OS after they realize that all the consumer oriented gizmo's they tried so hard to stuff in there weren't enough to sway users choosing WP7 over Android or iOS.
"I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar."
I guess you were really not following the news close enough. It has been explained in many blog aritcles. Play one of the Xbox live games on the phoen and it updates your stats on Live. If the same game is on the 360 your progression/stats are updated there.
I have seen many screen shots of Office for the phone. Add to that Sharepoint sycing has been reviewed. Honestly I have only read a few articles and I picked all of that up.
I had a Dell Axim 7 years ago. I will *never* go back to Windows mobile platforms. I had a gaming rig running XP2, Vista(horrible), 7(good) but I stopped playing a few months ago mainly because so many titles are just console ports, assuming it even makes it to PC. All the good games are on consoles, which frustratingly, have worse graphics than a relatively modest US$800 gaming PC. And console graphics aren't going to improve much!
Happy here in the Walled Garden of Good and Evil. LOL
"7 years ago" yeah what he said because nothing ever changes in 7 years.
And as one of Dick's customers in the days of Compµter Plus, I can vouch for his words above.
There are thoughts in your analysis that are thoughtful. There are expressions in the above that are expressive. You lack of bias is unbiased. [Sorry, Dick, couldn't help observing the "innovative innovations turn of phrase above!]
Actually I felt that your original lengthy comment was one of the best I've seen WRT WP7, and your rebuttal was long on experience and very short on emotion. Thanks for that.
Ex-IBMer Dick has a long and personal view of APPL and the Mac. The reason he's not a tech blogger is that he has integrity!
Thanks Tod -- I think you covered everything I asked you to...
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The only site more bias that Walt is AppleInsider. AI is the KING of taking stuff out of context and close to the top of link baiting article titles to drive hits.
"saying the "a pretty face" is the only thing that WP7 offers over its competition" that and Zune Pass. Anything Music trumps both the iPhone and Android.
Copy and Paste.....does anyone know how I can TURN IT OFF on my iPHone as I have NEVER used it and it CONSTANTLY gets in my way when zooming. Microsoft has missed some features, but none of them IMHO are game stoppers and yet their Hub centric GUI and Zune intergration is a game changer IMHO.
I have no particular problem with bias per se, and Walt, while biased, does not make things up.
However, lately, IMO Appleinsider is coming close to yellow journalism, particularly after the Ballmer incident. This article is no different than if someone wrote a summary of the iPhone 4 reviews with the headline, "iPhone 4 suffers from significant hardware problems" and then quoted a bunch of reviewers who had said something about the antenna or proximity sensor.
"I want to know how 'office' for WP7 works. What the xbox live integration actually means besides a 3D avatar."
I guess you were really not following the news close enough. It has been explained in many blog aritcles. Play one of the Xbox live games on the phoen and it updates your stats on Live. If the same game is on the 360 your progression/stats are updated there.
I have seen many screen shots of Office for the phone. Add to that Sharepoint sycing has been reviewed. Honestly I have only read a few articles and I picked all of that up.
To be fair, most posters here are Apple fans/users like myself. I doubt that many follow the blogs for MS or other competitors products -- I know I don't.
What I do is follow rumors leading up to announcements -- to see what to expect! Then I try to watch or listen to the announcement event. I try to watch closely and form my own opinions.
Leading up to the WP7 event there were rumors on what set it apart from other smart phones -- including Office, XBox/Zune, and Marketplace integration.
Unfortunately, none of those were demonstrated -- and I believe they are key features.
So, we cannot evaluate how well or badly these are implemented-- if at all.
One video showed a MS rep demoing a phone. He was asked to show a Zune app (whatever). He said he couldn't because none of the MS reps at the demo had access to a Zune account-- yeah, sure! Did you forget to brush your teeth before coming to the demo?
It would have been acceptable if he had said: "That's not available, yet" or somesuch. Instead, I distrusted everything else he said and showed.
It was good that they showed working devices, working navigation and a few working apps.
Aside::
The RIM PlayBook event was orders of magnitude worse than the WP7 event -- they had nothing to show or talk about, except a partial features list.
Most people will give someone the benefit the doubt, unless they feel they are being deliberately mislead -- especially in response to a direct question or request.
I don't think WP7 is complete... yet. I suspect will be sometime next year, and it will have all the things that are now, in various stages of completion.
It is too early to judge WP7 or write them off.
But, you can't expect Apple fans/users to actively search the blogs for positive reactions to, and pictures of, things that MS couldn't/didn't show in their event
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