This isn't possible on ANY laptop that doesn't cost double what a MacBook Pro costs. High end gaming laptops with specs where you claim them are REALLY expensive. There are lots that claim to be high end, but really aren't. So either you are making things up for or a fool. I vote for fool because you have now transitioned to comparing a hobbyist white-box tower PC built PC to a laptop. Hell the GPU in a high end gaming machine takes enough power to drain a laptop battery in 10 minutes or less so the whole point is foolish to even bring up. It's like DuH! A Porsche 911 cant carry 2500# of bricks like a Dodge Hemi pickup!!! OMG!!!
Nobody is objecting to your definition just this:
just because you can type de facto doesn't make it so. There are 50+ layouts here. Not all Windows US ASCII, but with so many which all need to be supported by software, and are successfully I think your rantings about Linux not being able to handle a Mac US ASCII layout are pretty pathetic.
Your retort is the one that's irrelevant. Again with the impossible comparison. It doesn't work when you complain a two year old laptop can't compete with a current maxed out gaming PC. That's a plain no-shit-Sherlock. Do we need to go back to bricks, pickups and sports cars?
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
I get it. You're so fucking stupid that for some reason you thought you were in the "laptops aren't as good at gaming as custom desktop pc's" thread. Go find that thread, please, and stop making arguments that are both inane and irrelevant to the topic at hand. Kthanks? Bye.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
No. Again, you started out by claiming Apple's proprietary formats lead to lock-in (and you still haven't cited any examples). You claimed that Apple's hardware offerings were substandard, and that Apple keyboard was "proprietary", whatever that means. You made an entirely circular argument about Mac hardware being "non-standard" because the standard is, by definition, the majority platform (I could just as easily complain about Linux on the same grounds, wondering why it doesn't just stop being stupid and non-standard and become Windows). You also claimed that attempting to install Linux killed your motherboard, which seems pretty unlikely. Those aren't opinions, they're falsehoods or misunderstandings being presented as fact.
I can't even parse what "it was suggested that my Macbook Pro could have filled my gaming needs/not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops" means. When the MacBook Pro was suggested why didn't you shout "I have no desire to have that sub standard experience, leave me to my custom PCs, fool!" Do you just not know much about computers? Did you not understand the limitations of laptops at the time, or the "shoddiness" of Apple laptops in particular, or do no research whatsoever into the appropriateness of a MacBook Pro for running Linux as you wished?
Yelling that you were just stating personal opinions, at this point, seems like backtracking after getting called out on some pretty indefensible stuff. No one here thinks you should be forced to use Linux for gaming on a MacBook Pro, but some of us wonder why you thought that was a good idea in the first place ("suggestions" notwithstanding).
FYI, referring to the MacBook pro as "shoddy" and "a waste of space" does suggest that you have issues with the platform beyond what you've described. Whatever other complaints folks might have about Apple or Apple hardware, very few people would describe the MacBook Pro as shoddy or a waste of space.
No. Again, you started out by claiming Apple's proprietary formats lead to lock-in (and you still haven't cited any examples). You claimed that Apple's hardware offerings were substandard, and that Apple keyboard was "proprietary", whatever that means. You made an entirely circular argument about Mac hardware being "non-standard" because the standard is, by definition, the majority platform (I could just as easily complain about Linux on the same grounds, wondering why it doesn't just stop being stupid and non-standard and become Windows). You also claimed that attempting to install Linux killed your motherboard, which seems pretty unlikely. Those aren't opinions, they're falsehoods or misunderstandings being presented as fact.
I can't even parse what "it was suggested that my Macbook Pro could have filled my gaming needs/not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops" means. When the MacBook Pro was suggested why didn't you shout "I have no desire to have that sub standard experience, leave me to my custom PCs, fool!" Do you just not know much about computers? Did you not understand the limitations of laptops at the time, or the "shoddiness" of Apple laptops in particular, or do no research whatsoever into the appropriateness of a MacBook Pro for running Linux as you wished?
Yelling that you were just stating personal opinions, at this point, seems like backtracking after getting called out on some pretty indefensible stuff. No one here thinks you should be forced to use Linux for gaming on a MacBook Pro, but some of us wonder why you thought that was a good idea in the first place ("suggestions" notwithstanding).
FYI, referring to the MacBook pro as "shoddy" and "a waste of space" does suggest that you have issues with the platform beyond what you've described. Whatever other complaints folks might have about Apple or Apple hardware, very few people would describe the MacBook Pro as shoddy or a waste of space.
FYI MY macbook pro is shoddy and a waste of space since it broke trying to use boot camp to install windows 7.
I built a custom PC to get away from the problems of my macbook pro. One of the benefits of this was that I was now able to play games at high spec on my computer, this was not possible on the MBP. This is all I have stated yet some of you insist on trying to suggest I should be running them at lesser settings on a MBP instead so I can cart it to the airport with me.
Having been a mac user for 3 years I am now a convert to Linux and occasionally Windows.
Some propriety lock in standards through apple (just in case you don't read the press):
1) All Itunes store music older than whenever they released DRM free music. I bought a lot of music before this date and yet apple are trying to charge me to upgrade it to DRM free. This is a price I have to pay to take me outside the eco-system.
2) Itunes rentals/movies - I can only easily play these on apple hardware or a PC with Itunes.
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware. With android I can choose between a number of devices and take my apps with me. I understand this is not something that apple should necessarily change or could even change but still it is a limitation to the apple eco system. This is made worse by their locked down dev policy but that is another topic altogether.
4) Streaming video - I can only play my videos on apple devices through a big screen TV if I have an apple TV, which personally offers me nothing I can't get from my TV provider in the UK as part of a package.
Transferring to apple products is easy. Getting out again once you are using their eco system to full capacity is much more difficult.
FYI MY macbook pro is shoddy and a waste of space since it broke trying to use boot camp to install windows 7.
This is gonna be good: What right do you have to use the word 'broke'? What happened?
Quote:
I built a custom PC to get away from the problems of my macbook pro. One of the benefits of this was that I was now able to play games at high spec on my computer, this was not possible on the MBP.
IT'S A LAPTOP, FOR FRICK'S SAKE.
Quote:
2) Itunes rentals/movies - I can only easily play these on apple hardware or a PC with Itunes.
Blame the studios, not Apple.
Quote:
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware.
FRICK DOY. How stupid do you have to be to not understand this? They can't work on any other operating system, anyway. That's how it works. Do you whine about not being able to use Windows apps in Linux or vice versa?
The Galaxy Tab I had a go with at the store was slow and unresponsive. The screen wasn't very precise to the touch and apps took a while to load. It was like using the internet on the old blackberrys when they first came out...not worth it. The user interface is messy and non-intuitive too. After a few mins I was frustrated and bored with it. Its fat too. Its not a great competitor to the ipad. Also, I reckon tjw is badly socialised and for practice I suggests he/she goes to the local bar and finds some strangers to interact with in the same way to see what happens in real life.
This is gonna be good: What right do you have to use the word 'broke'? What happened?
IT'S A LAPTOP, FOR FRICK'S SAKE.
Blame the studios, not Apple.
FRICK DOY. How stupid do you have to be to not understand this? They can't work on any other operating system, anyway. That's how it works. Do you whine about not being able to use Windows apps in Linux or vice versa?
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried. If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge. After this I tried again and got the same blinking cursor with 3 different install disks and an apple 'genius' was not able to understand why it was not working either. Was that good enough for you? I know you don't believe that anything with a pretty little apple on can break so I offer my sincere apologies when breaking this to you.
In the mean time I built a custom PC as I needed to run windows for work, TO GET OVER THE DIFFICULTIES I HAD WITH MY MBP. I did not need the mobility of a laptop so I chose to build a desktop. It also had the added benefit of being able to run games. My argument that you can't on a MBP was in response to another poster suggesting I could.
Blame the studios not apple? Yet I understand Netflix has no problem running on multiple devices. It is not the studios fault that I can't run an itunes movie on anything else other than itunes or mac hardware it is apple's closed eco system.
About the mobile applications, did you read all that I wrote? I compared it to android and said there you have choice in your device without losing your apps. With apple you have the choice of the one phone they make that is all. I also added that this is not something apple should or could change I was stating it is limitation of going with the apple eco system. Frick doy, you are an ass. Read before you insult my intelligence.
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware. With android I can choose between a number of devices and take my apps with me.
Actually, I want to clarify something here. Can you buy a paid app on one Android device, and then transfer it to another Android device when you change devices? How does this work? Is it linked to a user account like it is with Apple devices? If so, then how is Android different in any way than Apple, except that there are a million fragmented products instead of just a few?
All I know is that I think the Apple way of dealing with this is great. Even if you lose an iPhone, you just plug the new one in and all your apps and data are restored automatically. You can use your apps freely on every iOS device linked to your iTunes account. Does Android do this differently?
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried. If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge. After this I tried again and got the same blinking cursor with 3 different install disks and an apple 'genius' was not able to understand why it was not working either. Was that good enough for you? I know you don't believe that anything with a pretty little apple on can break so I offer my sincere apologies when breaking this to you.
First of all, I think your story is made up.
Secondly, even if it's true, a million people have successfully installed Windows 7 on Bootcamp on a MacBook Pro, and one person screws it up repeatedly and it's Apple's fault?
Third, Windows 7 wasn't released until late 2009, so what on earth were you doing with your "early 2008" MacBook Pro before then?
Secondly, even if it's true, a million people have successfully installed Windows 7 on Bootcamp on a MacBook Pro, and one person screws it up repeatedly and it's Apple's fault?
Third, Windows 7 wasn't released until late 2009, so what on earth were you doing with your "early 2008" MacBook Pro before then?
It is not made up. That would be a pretty elaborate thing to make up don't you think? Come off it. If I felt the need to defend myself I could publish the receipts from the computer repair shop I took it to and the following email I received from an apple service centre.
It screwed up repeatedly because of the hardware, I guess you are insulting the intelligence of apple geniuses as well as me then. They could not find the problem and suggested I upgrade to a 2010 model, which is fine if I have another £1200 to spend....
In response to your third comment: Obviously I tried to install windows 7 after it was released. Before then I was using mac osx and after I graduated this year I needed windows 7 for my job.
Actually, I want to clarify something here. Can you buy a paid app on one Android device, and then transfer it to another Android device when you change devices? How does this work? Is it linked to a user account like it is with Apple devices? If so, then how is Android different in any way than Apple, except that there are a million fragmented products instead of just a few?
All I know is that I think the Apple way of dealing with this is great. Even if you lose an iPhone, you just plug the new one in and all your apps and data are restored automatically. You can use your apps freely on every iOS device linked to your iTunes account. Does Android do this differently?
You have just stated how it is different. There is consumer choice. I choose a handset I like that runs android, sign in to my new phone and download my apps. You don't even need to involve a computer to do this. With apple I have to get the latest iphone when I upgrade or lose my apps. The only choice is apple. Again this is fine if you are happy with apple but this is still a limitation when compared with the choice you have with other platforms.
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried.
Software cannot do this.
Quote:
If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge.
I have one. Using it right now. It is not a common problem. Software cannot do this. The GPUs are worthless, but installing Windows won't fry anything.
Tim Cook will go down in history as one of the worst CEOs the world has ever seen. mark it down.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton
I get it. You're so fucking stupid that for some reason you thought you were in the "laptops aren't as good at gaming as custom desktop pc's" thread. Go find that thread, please, and stop making arguments that are both inane and irrelevant to the topic at hand. Kthanks? Bye.
Wow! There is a fine piece of concise advice! Well played sir.
You have just stated how it is different. There is consumer choice. I choose a handset I like that runs android, sign in to my new phone and download my apps. You don't even need to involve a computer to do this. With apple I have to get the latest iphone when I upgrade or lose my apps. The only choice is apple. Again this is fine if you are happy with apple but this is still a limitation when compared with the choice you have with other platforms.
You really want to go there? Are you that much up for showing a complete lack of logic before keystroke? Well I guess you were.
When you buy an Apple iPhone, you bought an Apple iPhone. When you buy a Windows Phone you get a Windows phone. When you buy a WebOS phone you get a WebOS phone. When you buy an Android phone you get an Android phone. When you buy a Mac, you get a Mac. When you buy a Windows OS you get a Windows OS. When you buy a PS3 you get a PS3. When you buy a PS2 you get a PS2. When you get an Xbox, you get an Xbox. When you buy an Xbox360 you get and Xbox360. Do I need to add to the near endless list?
Now a little quiz. Can you identify the single common issue?
How about, buying software for any one of those means you cannot run it on any other one of those. [there was a short time they the PS3 running PS2 games thing was technically possible, but it was so expensive it was discontinued after just about a month of production]. So what part of buying into a platform has your formidable lack of intellect not grokked? Oh that's right, all of it whenever it comes to posting.
This isn't even a standards thing, this is a platform thing. And it will continue to be a platform thing forever, because different designers think they have better solutions than the other guy. Whether they are or not is for the market to decide. The fact that the platform exists as a platform not compatible with any particular other is not for you to pass judgement on.Only the designers and producers get a vote in that. The only vote you get on that paradigm is which platform to spend $$ on. So get over the fake posturing trying to vilify one platform when the issues you are commenting on are the business of business itself, completely outside of any technical solutions.
You really want to go there? Are you that much up for showing a complete lack of logic before keystroke? Well I guess you were.
When you buy an Apple iPhone, you bought an Apple iPhone. When you buy a Windows Phone you get a Windows phone. When you buy a WebOS phone you get a WebOS phone. When you buy an Android phone you get an Android phone. When you buy a Mac, you get a Mac. When you buy a Windows OS you get a Windows OS. When you buy a PS3 you get a PS3. When you buy a PS2 you get a PS2. When you get an Xbox, you get an Xbox. When you buy an Xbox360 you get and Xbox360. Do I need to add to the near endless list?
Now a little quiz. Can you identify the single common issue?
How about, buying software for any one of those means you cannot run it on any other one of those. [there was a short time they the PS3 running PS2 games thing was technically possible, but it was so expensive it was discontinued after just about a month of production]. So what part of buying into a platform has your formidable lack of intellect not grokked? Oh that's right, all of it whenever it comes to posting.
This isn't even a standards thing, this is a platform thing. And it will continue to be a platform thing forever, because different designers think they have better solutions than the other guy. Whether they are or not is for the market to decide. The fact that the platform exists as a platform not compatible with any particular other is not for you to pass judgement on.Only the designers and producers get a vote in that. The only vote you get on that paradigm is which platform to spend $$ on. So get over the fake posturing trying to vilify one platform when the issues you are commenting on are the business of business itself, completely outside of any technical solutions.
Thanks for the quiz, I spot a flaw in your argument. Here is a quiz for you:
Scenario 1:
I buy an iphone, I buy 70 applications from the app store. My iphone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? Suppose I dislike the new iphone for some reason, may be I see other phones which I find more attractive. But oh I have 70 applications on the iphone. Damn but I must get the new iphone if I don't want these apps to go to waste.
Scenario 2:
I buy a Windows phone 7 phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 7 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 3:
I buy an android phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 20 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 4:
I buy a blackberry. I buy 70 applications from the blackberry marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 4 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Can you spot the pattern?
Other eco systems give you choice. I am not saying apple should change and make more phones. I was asked to point out limitations in their ecosystem and this is one.
Thanks for the quiz, I spot a flaw in your argument. Here is a quiz for you:
Scenario 1:
I buy an iphone, I buy 70 applications from the app store. My iphone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? Suppose I dislike the new iphone for some reason, may be I see other phones which I find more attractive. But oh I have 70 applications on the iphone. Damn but I must get the new iphone if I don't want these apps to go to waste.
Scenario 2:
I buy a Windows phone 7 phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 7 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 3:
I buy an android phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 20 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 4:
I buy a blackberry. I buy 70 applications from the blackberry marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 4 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Can you spot the pattern?
Other eco systems give you choice. I am not saying apple should change and make more phones. I was asked to point out limitations in their ecosystem and this is one.
Yes I can spot the pattern. You don't understand what a platform buying decision is. You cannot cross from platform to platform without loss. That's why they are defined as different platforms... Trying to avoid that by saying ecosystem doesn't change anything,the ecosystems are the platforms, pure and simple.
You are so narrow minded in your defense you can't see you aren't ever buying an interchangable device. Every DEVICE purchase you make you are buying into A PLATFORM. Your set of scenarios are contrived and completely avoid the idea of platform in any of the purchase decisions. That's artificial and out of touch with the reality of the situation.
Basic logic. If your assumptions are fallacious, all conclusions based upon them are fallacious. Pretty simple really.
You aren't very neighborly either. You call me an idiot. A direct unvarnished ad hom attack and not the first. I comment on the illogic and flawed nature of your posts, the writing on the page, and thought it represents. Just basic debate. Go ahead with that pattern of yours some more, I think a lot of us here would enjoy seeing you get a vacation for violation of the posting guidelines.
Yes I can spot the pattern. You don't understand what a platform buying decision is. You cannot cross from platform to platform without loss. That's why they are defined as different platforms... Trying to avoid that by saying ecosystem doesn't change anything,the ecosystems are the platforms, pure and simple.
You are so narrow minded in your defense you can't see you aren't ever buying an interchangable device. Every DEVICE purchase you make you are buying into A PLATFORM. Your set of scenarios are contrived and completely avoid the idea of platform in any of the purchase decisions. That's artificial and out of touch with the reality of the situation.
Basic logic. If your assumptions are fallacious, all conclusions based upon them are fallacious. Pretty simple really.
You aren't very neighborly either. You call me an idiot. A direct unvarnished ad hom attack and not the first. I comment on the illogic and flawed nature of your posts, the writing on the page, and thought it represents. Just basic debate. Go ahead with that pattern of yours some more, I think a lot of us here would enjoy seeing you get a vacation for violation of the posting guidelines.
Correction: You insult me with a patronizing 'quiz' to push your own agenda. All I have done is explained a lock in to the apple ecosystem, in mobile apps. When you buy an iphone you are limited to whatever the new iphone is when you come to upgrade. When you buy a phone on another platform that I have mentioned then you have a much wider choice of an upgrade handset in that platform without losing your apps. What is contrived about that example? Correct. Nothing.
The problem is that with Android, what happens when you decide that you don't like the Android OS and want to get an iPhone or a BlackBerry or a WP7 phone?
Android handsets are like fart apps. There sure are a lot of them to choose from, but they all suck. I'd rather stick with my limited choice of three iOS devices, thanks.
Correction: You insult me with a patronizing 'quiz' to push your own agenda. All I have done is explained a lock in to the apple ecosystem, in mobile apps. When you buy an iphone you are limited to whatever the new iphone is when you come to upgrade. When you buy a phone on another platform that I have mentioned then you have a much wider choice of an upgrade handset in that platform without losing your apps. What is contrived about that example? Correct. Nothing.
Parody of your ridiculous position sucks don't it. You try to define a new to the universe version of lock-in. Problem is everyone else knows and accepts what you are trying to play as new and nefarious. At least you used the term platform this time. I think you fell flat on the upgrade within the platform again though, every viable platform provides an upgrade path. whether you like that path or not weighs on whether you buy into the platform in the first place.
Personally I find nothing in the Android world a significant upgrade compared to an iPhone 4. Spec-whoring can come up with little differences on a phone by phone basis, but overall where's the well executed feature that's an upgrade draw worthy of creating a platform to platform shift. It's not there. And if it's not there, there's no real upgrade. In platform or cross platform.
So trying to create a platform shift scenario with a LARGE paid app investment where no platform shifting motivation exists IS contrived. Especially when you ignore the whole set of reasons people buy into platforms in the first place, which is the platform itself. You keep leaving out all the important stuff to try and make your point and that just constitutes a heap of fail. Kinda like this:
Comments
This isn't possible on ANY laptop that doesn't cost double what a MacBook Pro costs. High end gaming laptops with specs where you claim them are REALLY expensive. There are lots that claim to be high end, but really aren't. So either you are making things up for or a fool. I vote for fool because you have now transitioned to comparing a hobbyist white-box tower PC built PC to a laptop. Hell the GPU in a high end gaming machine takes enough power to drain a laptop battery in 10 minutes or less so the whole point is foolish to even bring up. It's like DuH! A Porsche 911 cant carry 2500# of bricks like a Dodge Hemi pickup!!! OMG!!!
Nobody is objecting to your definition just this:
just because you can type de facto doesn't make it so. There are 50+ layouts here. Not all Windows US ASCII, but with so many which all need to be supported by software, and are successfully I think your rantings about Linux not being able to handle a Mac US ASCII layout are pretty pathetic.
Your retort is the one that's irrelevant. Again with the impossible comparison. It doesn't work when you complain a two year old laptop can't compete with a current maxed out gaming PC. That's a plain no-shit-Sherlock. Do we need to go back to bricks, pickups and sports cars?
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
I get it. You're so fucking stupid that for some reason you thought you were in the "laptops aren't as good at gaming as custom desktop pc's" thread. Go find that thread, please, and stop making arguments that are both inane and irrelevant to the topic at hand. Kthanks? Bye.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
No. Again, you started out by claiming Apple's proprietary formats lead to lock-in (and you still haven't cited any examples). You claimed that Apple's hardware offerings were substandard, and that Apple keyboard was "proprietary", whatever that means. You made an entirely circular argument about Mac hardware being "non-standard" because the standard is, by definition, the majority platform (I could just as easily complain about Linux on the same grounds, wondering why it doesn't just stop being stupid and non-standard and become Windows). You also claimed that attempting to install Linux killed your motherboard, which seems pretty unlikely. Those aren't opinions, they're falsehoods or misunderstandings being presented as fact.
I can't even parse what "it was suggested that my Macbook Pro could have filled my gaming needs/not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops" means. When the MacBook Pro was suggested why didn't you shout "I have no desire to have that sub standard experience, leave me to my custom PCs, fool!" Do you just not know much about computers? Did you not understand the limitations of laptops at the time, or the "shoddiness" of Apple laptops in particular, or do no research whatsoever into the appropriateness of a MacBook Pro for running Linux as you wished?
Yelling that you were just stating personal opinions, at this point, seems like backtracking after getting called out on some pretty indefensible stuff. No one here thinks you should be forced to use Linux for gaming on a MacBook Pro, but some of us wonder why you thought that was a good idea in the first place ("suggestions" notwithstanding).
FYI, referring to the MacBook pro as "shoddy" and "a waste of space" does suggest that you have issues with the platform beyond what you've described. Whatever other complaints folks might have about Apple or Apple hardware, very few people would describe the MacBook Pro as shoddy or a waste of space.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat...
Instead of getting so worked up about it I suggest the following:
No. Again, you started out by claiming Apple's proprietary formats lead to lock-in (and you still haven't cited any examples). You claimed that Apple's hardware offerings were substandard, and that Apple keyboard was "proprietary", whatever that means. You made an entirely circular argument about Mac hardware being "non-standard" because the standard is, by definition, the majority platform (I could just as easily complain about Linux on the same grounds, wondering why it doesn't just stop being stupid and non-standard and become Windows). You also claimed that attempting to install Linux killed your motherboard, which seems pretty unlikely. Those aren't opinions, they're falsehoods or misunderstandings being presented as fact.
I can't even parse what "it was suggested that my Macbook Pro could have filled my gaming needs/not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops" means. When the MacBook Pro was suggested why didn't you shout "I have no desire to have that sub standard experience, leave me to my custom PCs, fool!" Do you just not know much about computers? Did you not understand the limitations of laptops at the time, or the "shoddiness" of Apple laptops in particular, or do no research whatsoever into the appropriateness of a MacBook Pro for running Linux as you wished?
Yelling that you were just stating personal opinions, at this point, seems like backtracking after getting called out on some pretty indefensible stuff. No one here thinks you should be forced to use Linux for gaming on a MacBook Pro, but some of us wonder why you thought that was a good idea in the first place ("suggestions" notwithstanding).
FYI, referring to the MacBook pro as "shoddy" and "a waste of space" does suggest that you have issues with the platform beyond what you've described. Whatever other complaints folks might have about Apple or Apple hardware, very few people would describe the MacBook Pro as shoddy or a waste of space.
FYI MY macbook pro is shoddy and a waste of space since it broke trying to use boot camp to install windows 7.
I built a custom PC to get away from the problems of my macbook pro. One of the benefits of this was that I was now able to play games at high spec on my computer, this was not possible on the MBP. This is all I have stated yet some of you insist on trying to suggest I should be running them at lesser settings on a MBP instead so I can cart it to the airport with me.
Having been a mac user for 3 years I am now a convert to Linux and occasionally Windows.
Some propriety lock in standards through apple (just in case you don't read the press):
1) All Itunes store music older than whenever they released DRM free music. I bought a lot of music before this date and yet apple are trying to charge me to upgrade it to DRM free. This is a price I have to pay to take me outside the eco-system.
2) Itunes rentals/movies - I can only easily play these on apple hardware or a PC with Itunes.
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware. With android I can choose between a number of devices and take my apps with me. I understand this is not something that apple should necessarily change or could even change but still it is a limitation to the apple eco system. This is made worse by their locked down dev policy but that is another topic altogether.
4) Streaming video - I can only play my videos on apple devices through a big screen TV if I have an apple TV, which personally offers me nothing I can't get from my TV provider in the UK as part of a package.
Transferring to apple products is easy. Getting out again once you are using their eco system to full capacity is much more difficult.
Apples keyboard is not standard layout in the UK.
FYI MY macbook pro is shoddy and a waste of space since it broke trying to use boot camp to install windows 7.
This is gonna be good: What right do you have to use the word 'broke'? What happened?
I built a custom PC to get away from the problems of my macbook pro. One of the benefits of this was that I was now able to play games at high spec on my computer, this was not possible on the MBP.
IT'S A LAPTOP, FOR FRICK'S SAKE.
2) Itunes rentals/movies - I can only easily play these on apple hardware or a PC with Itunes.
Blame the studios, not Apple.
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware.
FRICK DOY. How stupid do you have to be to not understand this? They can't work on any other operating system, anyway. That's how it works. Do you whine about not being able to use Windows apps in Linux or vice versa?
This is gonna be good: What right do you have to use the word 'broke'? What happened?
IT'S A LAPTOP, FOR FRICK'S SAKE.
Blame the studios, not Apple.
FRICK DOY. How stupid do you have to be to not understand this? They can't work on any other operating system, anyway. That's how it works. Do you whine about not being able to use Windows apps in Linux or vice versa?
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried. If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge. After this I tried again and got the same blinking cursor with 3 different install disks and an apple 'genius' was not able to understand why it was not working either. Was that good enough for you? I know you don't believe that anything with a pretty little apple on can break so I offer my sincere apologies when breaking this to you.
In the mean time I built a custom PC as I needed to run windows for work, TO GET OVER THE DIFFICULTIES I HAD WITH MY MBP. I did not need the mobility of a laptop so I chose to build a desktop. It also had the added benefit of being able to run games. My argument that you can't on a MBP was in response to another poster suggesting I could.
Blame the studios not apple? Yet I understand Netflix has no problem running on multiple devices. It is not the studios fault that I can't run an itunes movie on anything else other than itunes or mac hardware it is apple's closed eco system.
About the mobile applications, did you read all that I wrote? I compared it to android and said there you have choice in your device without losing your apps. With apple you have the choice of the one phone they make that is all. I also added that this is not something apple should or could change I was stating it is limitation of going with the apple eco system. Frick doy, you are an ass. Read before you insult my intelligence.
3) Mobile applications - I can only ever use these on mac hardware. With android I can choose between a number of devices and take my apps with me.
Actually, I want to clarify something here. Can you buy a paid app on one Android device, and then transfer it to another Android device when you change devices? How does this work? Is it linked to a user account like it is with Apple devices? If so, then how is Android different in any way than Apple, except that there are a million fragmented products instead of just a few?
All I know is that I think the Apple way of dealing with this is great. Even if you lose an iPhone, you just plug the new one in and all your apps and data are restored automatically. You can use your apps freely on every iOS device linked to your iTunes account. Does Android do this differently?
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried. If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge. After this I tried again and got the same blinking cursor with 3 different install disks and an apple 'genius' was not able to understand why it was not working either. Was that good enough for you? I know you don't believe that anything with a pretty little apple on can break so I offer my sincere apologies when breaking this to you.
First of all, I think your story is made up.
Secondly, even if it's true, a million people have successfully installed Windows 7 on Bootcamp on a MacBook Pro, and one person screws it up repeatedly and it's Apple's fault?
Third, Windows 7 wasn't released until late 2009, so what on earth were you doing with your "early 2008" MacBook Pro before then?
First of all, I think your story is made up.
Secondly, even if it's true, a million people have successfully installed Windows 7 on Bootcamp on a MacBook Pro, and one person screws it up repeatedly and it's Apple's fault?
Third, Windows 7 wasn't released until late 2009, so what on earth were you doing with your "early 2008" MacBook Pro before then?
It is not made up. That would be a pretty elaborate thing to make up don't you think? Come off it. If I felt the need to defend myself I could publish the receipts from the computer repair shop I took it to and the following email I received from an apple service centre.
It screwed up repeatedly because of the hardware, I guess you are insulting the intelligence of apple geniuses as well as me then. They could not find the problem and suggested I upgrade to a 2010 model, which is fine if I have another £1200 to spend....
In response to your third comment: Obviously I tried to install windows 7 after it was released. Before then I was using mac osx and after I graduated this year I needed windows 7 for my job.
Actually, I want to clarify something here. Can you buy a paid app on one Android device, and then transfer it to another Android device when you change devices? How does this work? Is it linked to a user account like it is with Apple devices? If so, then how is Android different in any way than Apple, except that there are a million fragmented products instead of just a few?
All I know is that I think the Apple way of dealing with this is great. Even if you lose an iPhone, you just plug the new one in and all your apps and data are restored automatically. You can use your apps freely on every iOS device linked to your iTunes account. Does Android do this differently?
You have just stated how it is different. There is consumer choice. I choose a handset I like that runs android, sign in to my new phone and download my apps. You don't even need to involve a computer to do this. With apple I have to get the latest iphone when I upgrade or lose my apps. The only choice is apple. Again this is fine if you are happy with apple but this is still a limitation when compared with the choice you have with other platforms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjw
It broke: My MBP would not load the bootcamp installer for installing windows 7. Instead I got a black screen with a blinking cursor. I tried numerous times and after about 4 attempts the laptop would not load the EFI. The logic board was fried.
Software cannot do this.
Quote:
If you are familiar with early 2008 MBP you will know this is a common problem, hence I was able to get it fixed free of charge.
I have one. Using it right now. It is not a common problem. Software cannot do this. The GPUs are worthless, but installing Windows won't fry anything.
You're a complete idiot.
For fuck sake! When are you going to get it? Are you really that stupid? Again I will repeat. This debate started because I stated my PERSONAL PREFERENCE of building a custom PC after my shoddy 2008 macbook pro died trying to install windows 7 and linux in boot camp. It was suggested that my macbook pro could have filled my gaming needs and the desire to run linux. It could not. End of. Not once have I mentioned any laptop being able to run games, not once have I expressed the desire to have the sub standard experience of running games on laptops myself. Stop using irrelevant arguments.
I get it. You're so fucking stupid that for some reason you thought you were in the "laptops aren't as good at gaming as custom desktop pc's" thread. Go find that thread, please, and stop making arguments that are both inane and irrelevant to the topic at hand. Kthanks? Bye.
Wow! There is a fine piece of concise advice! Well played sir.
You have just stated how it is different. There is consumer choice. I choose a handset I like that runs android, sign in to my new phone and download my apps. You don't even need to involve a computer to do this. With apple I have to get the latest iphone when I upgrade or lose my apps. The only choice is apple. Again this is fine if you are happy with apple but this is still a limitation when compared with the choice you have with other platforms.
You really want to go there? Are you that much up for showing a complete lack of logic before keystroke? Well I guess you were.
When you buy an Apple iPhone, you bought an Apple iPhone. When you buy a Windows Phone you get a Windows phone. When you buy a WebOS phone you get a WebOS phone. When you buy an Android phone you get an Android phone. When you buy a Mac, you get a Mac. When you buy a Windows OS you get a Windows OS. When you buy a PS3 you get a PS3. When you buy a PS2 you get a PS2. When you get an Xbox, you get an Xbox. When you buy an Xbox360 you get and Xbox360. Do I need to add to the near endless list?
Now a little quiz. Can you identify the single common issue?
How about, buying software for any one of those means you cannot run it on any other one of those. [there was a short time they the PS3 running PS2 games thing was technically possible, but it was so expensive it was discontinued after just about a month of production]. So what part of buying into a platform has your formidable lack of intellect not grokked? Oh that's right, all of it whenever it comes to posting.
This isn't even a standards thing, this is a platform thing. And it will continue to be a platform thing forever, because different designers think they have better solutions than the other guy. Whether they are or not is for the market to decide. The fact that the platform exists as a platform not compatible with any particular other is not for you to pass judgement on.Only the designers and producers get a vote in that. The only vote you get on that paradigm is which platform to spend $$ on. So get over the fake posturing trying to vilify one platform when the issues you are commenting on are the business of business itself, completely outside of any technical solutions.
You really want to go there? Are you that much up for showing a complete lack of logic before keystroke? Well I guess you were.
When you buy an Apple iPhone, you bought an Apple iPhone. When you buy a Windows Phone you get a Windows phone. When you buy a WebOS phone you get a WebOS phone. When you buy an Android phone you get an Android phone. When you buy a Mac, you get a Mac. When you buy a Windows OS you get a Windows OS. When you buy a PS3 you get a PS3. When you buy a PS2 you get a PS2. When you get an Xbox, you get an Xbox. When you buy an Xbox360 you get and Xbox360. Do I need to add to the near endless list?
Now a little quiz. Can you identify the single common issue?
How about, buying software for any one of those means you cannot run it on any other one of those. [there was a short time they the PS3 running PS2 games thing was technically possible, but it was so expensive it was discontinued after just about a month of production]. So what part of buying into a platform has your formidable lack of intellect not grokked? Oh that's right, all of it whenever it comes to posting.
This isn't even a standards thing, this is a platform thing. And it will continue to be a platform thing forever, because different designers think they have better solutions than the other guy. Whether they are or not is for the market to decide. The fact that the platform exists as a platform not compatible with any particular other is not for you to pass judgement on.Only the designers and producers get a vote in that. The only vote you get on that paradigm is which platform to spend $$ on. So get over the fake posturing trying to vilify one platform when the issues you are commenting on are the business of business itself, completely outside of any technical solutions.
Thanks for the quiz, I spot a flaw in your argument. Here is a quiz for you:
Scenario 1:
I buy an iphone, I buy 70 applications from the app store. My iphone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? Suppose I dislike the new iphone for some reason, may be I see other phones which I find more attractive. But oh I have 70 applications on the iphone. Damn but I must get the new iphone if I don't want these apps to go to waste.
Scenario 2:
I buy a Windows phone 7 phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 7 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 3:
I buy an android phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 20 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 4:
I buy a blackberry. I buy 70 applications from the blackberry marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 4 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Can you spot the pattern?
Other eco systems give you choice. I am not saying apple should change and make more phones. I was asked to point out limitations in their ecosystem and this is one.
Thanks for the quiz, I spot a flaw in your argument. Here is a quiz for you:
Scenario 1:
I buy an iphone, I buy 70 applications from the app store. My iphone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? Suppose I dislike the new iphone for some reason, may be I see other phones which I find more attractive. But oh I have 70 applications on the iphone. Damn but I must get the new iphone if I don't want these apps to go to waste.
Scenario 2:
I buy a Windows phone 7 phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 7 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 3:
I buy an android phone. I buy 70 applications from the marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 20 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Scenario 4:
I buy a blackberry. I buy 70 applications from the blackberry marketplace. My phone becomes out of date. Which phone should I buy? I don't like the new version of my particular model but hey there are at least 4 other phones that I can choose from, all slightly different, all running my previously purchased applications. Hoooray choice and no need to lose my apps.
Can you spot the pattern?
Other eco systems give you choice. I am not saying apple should change and make more phones. I was asked to point out limitations in their ecosystem and this is one.
Yes I can spot the pattern. You don't understand what a platform buying decision is. You cannot cross from platform to platform without loss. That's why they are defined as different platforms... Trying to avoid that by saying ecosystem doesn't change anything,the ecosystems are the platforms, pure and simple.
You are so narrow minded in your defense you can't see you aren't ever buying an interchangable device. Every DEVICE purchase you make you are buying into A PLATFORM. Your set of scenarios are contrived and completely avoid the idea of platform in any of the purchase decisions. That's artificial and out of touch with the reality of the situation.
Basic logic. If your assumptions are fallacious, all conclusions based upon them are fallacious. Pretty simple really.
You aren't very neighborly either. You call me an idiot. A direct unvarnished ad hom attack and not the first. I comment on the illogic and flawed nature of your posts, the writing on the page, and thought it represents. Just basic debate. Go ahead with that pattern of yours some more, I think a lot of us here would enjoy seeing you get a vacation for violation of the posting guidelines.
Yes I can spot the pattern. You don't understand what a platform buying decision is. You cannot cross from platform to platform without loss. That's why they are defined as different platforms... Trying to avoid that by saying ecosystem doesn't change anything,the ecosystems are the platforms, pure and simple.
You are so narrow minded in your defense you can't see you aren't ever buying an interchangable device. Every DEVICE purchase you make you are buying into A PLATFORM. Your set of scenarios are contrived and completely avoid the idea of platform in any of the purchase decisions. That's artificial and out of touch with the reality of the situation.
Basic logic. If your assumptions are fallacious, all conclusions based upon them are fallacious. Pretty simple really.
You aren't very neighborly either. You call me an idiot. A direct unvarnished ad hom attack and not the first. I comment on the illogic and flawed nature of your posts, the writing on the page, and thought it represents. Just basic debate. Go ahead with that pattern of yours some more, I think a lot of us here would enjoy seeing you get a vacation for violation of the posting guidelines.
Correction: You insult me with a patronizing 'quiz' to push your own agenda. All I have done is explained a lock in to the apple ecosystem, in mobile apps. When you buy an iphone you are limited to whatever the new iphone is when you come to upgrade. When you buy a phone on another platform that I have mentioned then you have a much wider choice of an upgrade handset in that platform without losing your apps. What is contrived about that example? Correct. Nothing.
Android handsets are like fart apps. There sure are a lot of them to choose from, but they all suck. I'd rather stick with my limited choice of three iOS devices, thanks.
Correction: You insult me with a patronizing 'quiz' to push your own agenda. All I have done is explained a lock in to the apple ecosystem, in mobile apps. When you buy an iphone you are limited to whatever the new iphone is when you come to upgrade. When you buy a phone on another platform that I have mentioned then you have a much wider choice of an upgrade handset in that platform without losing your apps. What is contrived about that example? Correct. Nothing.
Parody of your ridiculous position sucks don't it. You try to define a new to the universe version of lock-in. Problem is everyone else knows and accepts what you are trying to play as new and nefarious. At least you used the term platform this time. I think you fell flat on the upgrade within the platform again though, every viable platform provides an upgrade path. whether you like that path or not weighs on whether you buy into the platform in the first place.
Personally I find nothing in the Android world a significant upgrade compared to an iPhone 4. Spec-whoring can come up with little differences on a phone by phone basis, but overall where's the well executed feature that's an upgrade draw worthy of creating a platform to platform shift. It's not there. And if it's not there, there's no real upgrade. In platform or cross platform.
So trying to create a platform shift scenario with a LARGE paid app investment where no platform shifting motivation exists IS contrived. Especially when you ignore the whole set of reasons people buy into platforms in the first place, which is the platform itself. You keep leaving out all the important stuff to try and make your point and that just constitutes a heap of fail. Kinda like this: