Okay, I know the mods didn't want politics in future hardware, but what about comedy?
[quote]
The only network that I have seen that usually dos not have a liberal bias is Fox News Channel. They even lean towards conservative at times.
<hr></blockquote>
That (bold) has to be one of the funniest things I've read in awhile. Faux News Network, home of the Chandra Levy 24 hour special report, LEANING to the right. That is absolutely priceless.
Let's take a look at their hosts shall we,
"Your World with Neil Cavuto" - Conservative Financial Pundit
"The Big Story with John Gibson" - Very Conservative
"Special Report with Brit Hume" - Super Conservative
"Fox Report with Shepard Smith" - Conservative, but closer to moderate than the others
"The O'Reilly Factor" - This dolt is so conservative it's not even funny. The big "spin" is that he claims he's not.
"Hannity & Colmes" - Hannity, Very Conservative. Colmes - Very Liberal, but an idiot.
"War on Terror: The Hunt for the Killers" - I think this is the show with a bunch of women with so much makeup on it looks like they apply it with a trowel. Not even close to moderate.
Has any one found out if the MPC8540 is available or not?
It appears that MOSR, The Register, Archintosh, etc. really blew it. At one point or another, I believe each were saying that the G5 was in or close to production, if not available for MWSF the Apollo G4 would be used in the towers.
<strong>Has any one found out if the MPC8540 is available or not?
It appears that MOSR, The Register, Archintosh, etc. really blew it. At one point or another, I believe each were saying that the G5 was in or close to production, if not available....</strong><hr></blockquote>
Captain Obvious here: just wanted to point out that there are no indications whatever that the 8540 is slated for the PowerMac.
OK, now that we know you hate conservatives can we get back to discussing the G5?
Embrace the future people. Embrace the G5.
<hr></blockquote>
Oh, oh the G5, sorry.
Hmmm.
Hmmm.
Oh yeah, the G5 doesn't exist.
Shall we discuss politics, or create another "My friend's Mom is a macrobiotic vegan hooker and she was servicing some guy in Palo Alto that wouldn't take off his blue jeans or his black turtle neck (she thought that was weird btw) and she swears this guy was murmuring "the G5 is coming at the WWDC, the G5 is coming at the WWDC." She asked the guy what they hell he was talking about and he showed her what he claimed was a quad 2Ghz G5 with a 400Mhz bus and QDR ram in a titanium case (anodized black, no doubt) and it would sell for $1299.00. She had no idea what the hell this guy was ranting about, but she did notice an Apple logo on the machine and since she knows her son is a mac-head, she told him and I'm telling you. Take it for what it's worth.
Just checking, people here and over at Arstechnica have said the MPC8540 is available and I have yet to see a Motorola document stating that the MPC8540 is in fact a shipping product.
Most of this speculation is based on the MPC8540 Fact Sheet which has links to a "where to buy section"
I checked all the where to buy links and found absolutely no reference to the MPC8540 at any of the sites. Also, Motorola's own pdf cross reference list for 1st half of 2002 doesn't list the MPC8540.
But people continue to post as if the MPC8540 is a shipping product. Maybe I'm wrong and it is shipping, but I would really like to see a link verifying this contention.
I kinda doubt that the 8540 is any indication of when the G5 for Apple's PowerMacs will ship. I think Apple has been playing a much bigger role here than we think. Just because Motorola has or hasn't put out some embedded chip that is based on some of the technology Moto and Apple are using for the G5 desktop chip doesn't really matter if Apple has been a big player in the desktop G5 development. This would also explain why there have not been any public announcements of the G5 from Motorola, kinda like the G4, when they talked a little about it at some Microprocessor Forum (I forgot which one it was.), since any word about it is a breach of NDA.
"Captain Obvious here: just wanted to point out that there are no indications whatever that the 8540 is slated for the PowerMac."
If you had taken the time to read any of my previous posts regarding this subject, any at all, you would know I have never said the MPC8540 would be used in a desktop computer.
The importance of the MPC8540 lays in the fact that in Motorola's press release on 10/17/02, they REPEATEDLY referered to the MPC8540 as the first G5 processor, the foundation for future G5 development.
Their own press release stated that the MPC8540 would be sampling in the 2nd half of 2002. That would mean the G5 from Motorola for any PowerMac would come late in the year or early 2003.
YET STILL, people post that either the MPC8540 is shipping and the G5 for Apple will appear soon. I want proof and no one has posted a single link verifying the availability of the MPC8540.
Let me see if I get this right. Motorola sold, what, 66 million processors total in the fiscal year 2000? Motorola was a $37 billion company that year?
Of that, they sold about what, a million? to Apple. I guess that puts Apple at the top of Mototola's priority list
Also, people keep bringing up the fact that Apple is playing a large role in designing the G5. Yes, they are a part of AIM, but how many engineers does Apple have involved in the actual design of the processors. I truely haven't got the foggiest, but I'd venture that is less than Motorola and Motorola has the largest say in the actual design of processors. Not just the Book E specifications. Prove me wrong, show me the data.
Apple is truely between a rock and a hard place. Motorola makes the vast bulk of their processors for embedded applications, let's see 1÷66X100= 1.51% of Motorola's processors are sold to Apple. That represents about $400 - 500 million maybe out of 37 billion in sales.
My numbers are from memory and are probably off but even an error of a factor of 2X wouldn't make a difference. Get over it, Motorola has repeatedly proved they do not want to design and manufacture a desktop cpu. Deal with it.
<strong>Let me see if I get this right. Motorola sold, what, 66 million processors total in the fiscal year 2000? Motorola was a $37 billion company that year?
Of that, they sold about what, a million? to Apple. I guess that puts Apple at the top of Mototola's priority list </strong><hr></blockquote>
Doesn't apple also fund some of the PPC development costs.
Keep in mind that Apple also buys their most expensive processors.
and Motorola has shown that they will design a processor special for apple. the 7450 is a perfect example. they just got lucky that Cisco decided to use it too
Doesn't apple also fund some of the PPC development costs.
Keep in mind that Apple also buys their most expensive processors.
and Motorola has shown that they will design a processor special for apple. the 7450 is a perfect example. they just got lucky that Cisco decided to use it too</strong><hr></blockquote>
They they got lucky that cisco decided to use it also. DECIDED? LOL!
I would assume that Apple is actively involved in the development of the Book E spec's. As far as designing the cpu's, I don't know.
Note: In Motorola's press release describing the MPC7455, that now uses SOI, Motorola mentioned Ericsson(sp?) specifically with no mention of Apple at all.
I may be way off base, but all evidence in Motorola's documentation, press releases, etc. indicates that their main focus, by a long shot, is embedded processors.
The war between Intel and AMD spurred extremely large jumps in cpu design for desktops and Motorola has not kept pace. They don't have to. They don't what to, desktop cpu's from Intel and AMD generate too much heat and use too much power.
The answer to my percieved dilema that Apple faces eludes me and it appears it eludes Apple also. If any one has an answer, please send Apple an email, I'm sure they'd be interested.
[quote]Corportate Media? Yes, but they sure as hell are NOT conservatives! The liberal bias in the media is well documented and proven. It has been proven that interviews with conservatives are, on average, edited THREE times more than their liberal counterparts. Dan Rather and Peter Jennings, as well as Tom Brokaw are all outspoken liberals. There are VERY few balanced networks.<hr></blockquote>
Ok, a few broadcasters are democrats, but you do realize that they are not the ones who decide what to report, right? The corporate media is owned and operated by ultra-rich, ultra-right wingers. That's a fact. And the news stories reflect that bias. If the media is so left wing, then why were they focusing on Clinton's sex life, when there were real, imposing issues to report on? The media could have focused on problems that affect our lives, like global warming, habitat destruciton and loss of biodiversity, or global disease prevention and poverty. They could have reported on the corporate contributions and influence in Washington (both parties). Instead they distracted attention from these issues with stories that don't impact our lives. That's why the media is right wing, because they empower those who are currently in power, the corporatinos, the millitary-industrial complex.
[quote]---Seriously now. That is VERY harsh. And the fact that you believe that right wing/conservative people/politicians are like this is proof of the criminal liberal media's influence on the population of this nation.<hr></blockquote>
Yeah, right, the media reports on this. If right wingers cared then they would do something about it. They choose to ignore the problem at the very least, or at worst, they make matters worse through their budget allocations.
[quote]Our Government is a bloated, corrupt institution. As I have said before, if you add up the taxes that are paid in this nation by the working class and even "lower upper class" (say those that earn up to 200,000 year), it comes to 50-60% of your income. What??? You say that sounds absurdly high? Well:
40% goes to Federal Income and SS tax.
In PA, where I live, the state tax is 2.5%
Local Tax: 1% of my income for me.
Gas Tax=50% of total purchase price. Assuming a two car family spends 1200/year on gas, that means about 1-2% of income goes to this tax. ($30-60,000 per year income assumed)
This brings us to 44.5% without considering: Luxury Tax, Ciggarette Tax, Licensing Fees (drivers license, fishing hunting, boating.....they are all really just another way of taxing).
Don't forget about property taxes, assuming my income (between 30-60,000 let's just say), the property taxes on my house I'm buying will be over 5% of my INCOME!!!!
That brings us to 49.5%. Oh, and don't forget your phone, cable and internet bills. They not only get taxed, they included things like "federal access fees" and the like, which are taxes intended to pay for things like innner city internet connections and the like. Oh, and did I mention SALES TAX? That, in my state, is 6% of almost everything you spend! Assuming most Americans spend more than 80% of their incomes (and that is probably a LOW figure), we can tack on another 4% or so.<hr></blockquote>
Look at yourself, your selfish and arrogant, whining about having to pay taxes. Nobody forces you to pay taxes, you are welcome to go somewhere else. Oh, what's that, you want to live in the USA? Well the privilidge of living here costs, buddy.
You want the best public health measures in the world? The greatest military? A population that is served by their government? That costs money.
BTW, the US has the lowest tax rate of any industrialized nation. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. Part of the reason is that the US doesn't provide health care to it's citizens, instead we saddle corporations with that bill.
And yes, obviously our government is corrupt, but ALL governments are. The US government is less corrupt than most, at least, but the job of keeping the government honest falls on the media. And the media hasn't been doing a good job of this lately. Yeah, we nailed Clinton for shagging in the Oval Office, but what about real corruption, of the sort where the will of the people, the constitution, is violated? Like in the Iran/Contra affair, where the adminstrative branch broke the constitution by violating congressional law, effectively negating the balance of power between government branches? That is the important corruption that the media should report on, and it could happen in ANY administration, but rather than watch Clinton on that front, they worried about his personal business. Lame.
So you're going to respond with talk about how you DESERVE lower taxes, just because, and blah blah blah. I'd personally rather pay taxes and have the services and benefits our government provides to us, but it's fine we disagree on this one. We probably both vote so our opinions are heard, right? Elections DO matter in the US...right? I think so?
The importance of the MPC8540 lays in the fact that in Motorola's press release on 10/17/02, they REPEATEDLY referered to the MPC8540 as the first G5 processor, the foundation for future G5 development.
I hear a lot of "MPC8540" here and people stating that it's ready and others that it's not.
have you ever though about the fact, that the 8540 may well NOT be the chip Apple is going to use as the "G5" chip in the end?
Aparently the 8540 is aimed at the embedded market anyway, so it's likely that Apple would use a modified version without all the ethernet stuff etc to use as their host processor. And exactly WHO said that "our" G5 is "their" 8540?
Maybe "our" G5 is the yet unannounced and secretly developped 8550 or even different, and maybe it's ready for MWNY (FORGET about MWTY, that's powerbook time there), maybe it's not.
You're emphasizing far too much on totally unconfirmed stuff to build up your "Confirmed: blabla" statements.
We know nothing. And I know that I know nothing. And that is already a lot.
Frankly, I don't think the e500 core will be the basis of the G5 that Apple will eventually put in their machines. It only has a 7 stage pipeline. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I think that Apple is actively involved in the design of a Book-E core that Motorola will incorporate in their modular chip design for Apple's desktop business. Think about it. The MPC8540 is just a modular chip design of a processor core, memory controller, PCI-X controller, some Ethernet, serial controllers, etc. Apple might 'BTO' their own design from Motorola. Sort of like a chinese buffet. A little kung-pow chicken, a little crab rangoon, some shrimp fried rice... a 14 stage Processor core with Altivec, a DDR memory controller, an ethernet and firewire controller, PCI-X controller. The purpose of Book-E is for a flexable chip design to bring SOC and and other chip solutions to market quicker.
Take a look at the bottom of Motorola's current roadmap. it says:
6xx, 7xx, 7xxx - high performance microprocessor targeting computing and high end embedded.
8xx, 8xxx - integrated processor targeting the communications and consumer markets.
5xx, 5xxx - integrated processor targeting the transportation market.
The G5, otherwise known as 85xx, is targeted towards the communications market, NOT the desktop computing one. Instead expect Apple to use faster and upgraded 74xx chips well into next year.
Comments
[quote]
The only network that I have seen that usually dos not have a liberal bias is Fox News Channel. They even lean towards conservative at times.
<hr></blockquote>
That (bold) has to be one of the funniest things I've read in awhile. Faux News Network, home of the Chandra Levy 24 hour special report, LEANING to the right. That is absolutely priceless.
Let's take a look at their hosts shall we,
"Your World with Neil Cavuto" - Conservative Financial Pundit
"The Big Story with John Gibson" - Very Conservative
"Special Report with Brit Hume" - Super Conservative
"Fox Report with Shepard Smith" - Conservative, but closer to moderate than the others
"The O'Reilly Factor" - This dolt is so conservative it's not even funny. The big "spin" is that he claims he's not.
"Hannity & Colmes" - Hannity, Very Conservative. Colmes - Very Liberal, but an idiot.
"War on Terror: The Hunt for the Killers" - I think this is the show with a bunch of women with so much makeup on it looks like they apply it with a trowel. Not even close to moderate.
Embrace the future people. Embrace the G5.
It appears that MOSR, The Register, Archintosh, etc. really blew it. At one point or another, I believe each were saying that the G5 was in or close to production, if not available for MWSF the Apollo G4 would be used in the towers.
Bah, I refuse to believe these rumor sites.
<strong>Has any one found out if the MPC8540 is available or not?
It appears that MOSR, The Register, Archintosh, etc. really blew it. At one point or another, I believe each were saying that the G5 was in or close to production, if not available....</strong><hr></blockquote>
Captain Obvious here: just wanted to point out that there are no indications whatever that the 8540 is slated for the PowerMac.
Have a nice day, and don't forget to think!
OK, now that we know you hate conservatives can we get back to discussing the G5?
Embrace the future people. Embrace the G5.
<hr></blockquote>
Oh, oh the G5, sorry.
Hmmm.
Hmmm.
Oh yeah, the G5 doesn't exist.
Shall we discuss politics, or create another "My friend's Mom is a macrobiotic vegan hooker and she was servicing some guy in Palo Alto that wouldn't take off his blue jeans or his black turtle neck (she thought that was weird btw) and she swears this guy was murmuring "the G5 is coming at the WWDC, the G5 is coming at the WWDC." She asked the guy what they hell he was talking about and he showed her what he claimed was a quad 2Ghz G5 with a 400Mhz bus and QDR ram in a titanium case (anodized black, no doubt) and it would sell for $1299.00. She had no idea what the hell this guy was ranting about, but she did notice an Apple logo on the machine and since she knows her son is a mac-head, she told him and I'm telling you. Take it for what it's worth.
Just checking, people here and over at Arstechnica have said the MPC8540 is available and I have yet to see a Motorola document stating that the MPC8540 is in fact a shipping product.
Most of this speculation is based on the MPC8540 Fact Sheet which has links to a "where to buy section"
I checked all the where to buy links and found absolutely no reference to the MPC8540 at any of the sites. Also, Motorola's own pdf cross reference list for 1st half of 2002 doesn't list the MPC8540.
But people continue to post as if the MPC8540 is a shipping product. Maybe I'm wrong and it is shipping, but I would really like to see a link verifying this contention.
[ 01-22-2002: Message edited by: Tarbash ]</p>
"Captain Obvious here: just wanted to point out that there are no indications whatever that the 8540 is slated for the PowerMac."
If you had taken the time to read any of my previous posts regarding this subject, any at all, you would know I have never said the MPC8540 would be used in a desktop computer.
The importance of the MPC8540 lays in the fact that in Motorola's press release on 10/17/02, they REPEATEDLY referered to the MPC8540 as the first G5 processor, the foundation for future G5 development.
Their own press release stated that the MPC8540 would be sampling in the 2nd half of 2002. That would mean the G5 from Motorola for any PowerMac would come late in the year or early 2003.
YET STILL, people post that either the MPC8540 is shipping and the G5 for Apple will appear soon. I want proof and no one has posted a single link verifying the availability of the MPC8540.
Of that, they sold about what, a million? to Apple. I guess that puts Apple at the top of Mototola's priority list
Also, people keep bringing up the fact that Apple is playing a large role in designing the G5. Yes, they are a part of AIM, but how many engineers does Apple have involved in the actual design of the processors. I truely haven't got the foggiest, but I'd venture that is less than Motorola and Motorola has the largest say in the actual design of processors. Not just the Book E specifications. Prove me wrong, show me the data.
Apple is truely between a rock and a hard place. Motorola makes the vast bulk of their processors for embedded applications, let's see 1÷66X100= 1.51% of Motorola's processors are sold to Apple. That represents about $400 - 500 million maybe out of 37 billion in sales.
My numbers are from memory and are probably off but even an error of a factor of 2X wouldn't make a difference. Get over it, Motorola has repeatedly proved they do not want to design and manufacture a desktop cpu. Deal with it.
It looks like you avoided the bullet on the first PowerMac update of the year. Looks like the waiting game continues.
<strong>Let me see if I get this right. Motorola sold, what, 66 million processors total in the fiscal year 2000? Motorola was a $37 billion company that year?
Of that, they sold about what, a million? to Apple. I guess that puts Apple at the top of Mototola's priority list
Doesn't apple also fund some of the PPC development costs.
Keep in mind that Apple also buys their most expensive processors.
and Motorola has shown that they will design a processor special for apple. the 7450 is a perfect example. they just got lucky that Cisco decided to use it too
<strong>
Doesn't apple also fund some of the PPC development costs.
Keep in mind that Apple also buys their most expensive processors.
and Motorola has shown that they will design a processor special for apple. the 7450 is a perfect example. they just got lucky that Cisco decided to use it too</strong><hr></blockquote>
They they got lucky that cisco decided to use it also. DECIDED? LOL!
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
I would assume that Apple is actively involved in the development of the Book E spec's. As far as designing the cpu's, I don't know.
Note: In Motorola's press release describing the MPC7455, that now uses SOI, Motorola mentioned Ericsson(sp?) specifically with no mention of Apple at all.
I may be way off base, but all evidence in Motorola's documentation, press releases, etc. indicates that their main focus, by a long shot, is embedded processors.
The war between Intel and AMD spurred extremely large jumps in cpu design for desktops and Motorola has not kept pace. They don't have to. They don't what to, desktop cpu's from Intel and AMD generate too much heat and use too much power.
The answer to my percieved dilema that Apple faces eludes me and it appears it eludes Apple also. If any one has an answer, please send Apple an email, I'm sure they'd be interested.
[ 01-28-2002: Message edited by: rickag ]</p>
Ok, a few broadcasters are democrats, but you do realize that they are not the ones who decide what to report, right? The corporate media is owned and operated by ultra-rich, ultra-right wingers. That's a fact. And the news stories reflect that bias. If the media is so left wing, then why were they focusing on Clinton's sex life, when there were real, imposing issues to report on? The media could have focused on problems that affect our lives, like global warming, habitat destruciton and loss of biodiversity, or global disease prevention and poverty. They could have reported on the corporate contributions and influence in Washington (both parties). Instead they distracted attention from these issues with stories that don't impact our lives. That's why the media is right wing, because they empower those who are currently in power, the corporatinos, the millitary-industrial complex.
[quote]---Seriously now. That is VERY harsh. And the fact that you believe that right wing/conservative people/politicians are like this is proof of the criminal liberal media's influence on the population of this nation.<hr></blockquote>
Yeah, right, the media reports on this. If right wingers cared then they would do something about it. They choose to ignore the problem at the very least, or at worst, they make matters worse through their budget allocations.
[quote]Our Government is a bloated, corrupt institution. As I have said before, if you add up the taxes that are paid in this nation by the working class and even "lower upper class" (say those that earn up to 200,000 year), it comes to 50-60% of your income. What??? You say that sounds absurdly high? Well:
40% goes to Federal Income and SS tax.
In PA, where I live, the state tax is 2.5%
Local Tax: 1% of my income for me.
Gas Tax=50% of total purchase price. Assuming a two car family spends 1200/year on gas, that means about 1-2% of income goes to this tax. ($30-60,000 per year income assumed)
This brings us to 44.5% without considering: Luxury Tax, Ciggarette Tax, Licensing Fees (drivers license, fishing hunting, boating.....they are all really just another way of taxing).
Don't forget about property taxes, assuming my income (between 30-60,000 let's just say), the property taxes on my house I'm buying will be over 5% of my INCOME!!!!
That brings us to 49.5%. Oh, and don't forget your phone, cable and internet bills. They not only get taxed, they included things like "federal access fees" and the like, which are taxes intended to pay for things like innner city internet connections and the like. Oh, and did I mention SALES TAX? That, in my state, is 6% of almost everything you spend! Assuming most Americans spend more than 80% of their incomes (and that is probably a LOW figure), we can tack on another 4% or so.<hr></blockquote>
Look at yourself, your selfish and arrogant, whining about having to pay taxes. Nobody forces you to pay taxes, you are welcome to go somewhere else. Oh, what's that, you want to live in the USA? Well the privilidge of living here costs, buddy.
You want the best public health measures in the world? The greatest military? A population that is served by their government? That costs money.
BTW, the US has the lowest tax rate of any industrialized nation. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. Part of the reason is that the US doesn't provide health care to it's citizens, instead we saddle corporations with that bill.
And yes, obviously our government is corrupt, but ALL governments are. The US government is less corrupt than most, at least, but the job of keeping the government honest falls on the media. And the media hasn't been doing a good job of this lately. Yeah, we nailed Clinton for shagging in the Oval Office, but what about real corruption, of the sort where the will of the people, the constitution, is violated? Like in the Iran/Contra affair, where the adminstrative branch broke the constitution by violating congressional law, effectively negating the balance of power between government branches? That is the important corruption that the media should report on, and it could happen in ANY administration, but rather than watch Clinton on that front, they worried about his personal business. Lame.
So you're going to respond with talk about how you DESERVE lower taxes, just because, and blah blah blah. I'd personally rather pay taxes and have the services and benefits our government provides to us, but it's fine we disagree on this one. We probably both vote so our opinions are heard, right? Elections DO matter in the US...right? I think so?
<strong>
The importance of the MPC8540 lays in the fact that in Motorola's press release on 10/17/02, they REPEATEDLY referered to the MPC8540 as the first G5 processor, the foundation for future G5 development.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Except that Motorola's own press release (at <a href="http://www.motorola.com/mediacenter/news/detail/0,1958,568_322_23,00.html)" target="_blank">http://www.motorola.com/mediacenter/news/detail/0,1958,568_322_23,00.html)</a> says nothing of the sort.
have you ever though about the fact, that the 8540 may well NOT be the chip Apple is going to use as the "G5" chip in the end?
Aparently the 8540 is aimed at the embedded market anyway, so it's likely that Apple would use a modified version without all the ethernet stuff etc to use as their host processor. And exactly WHO said that "our" G5 is "their" 8540?
Maybe "our" G5 is the yet unannounced and secretly developped 8550 or even different, and maybe it's ready for MWNY (FORGET about MWTY, that's powerbook time there), maybe it's not.
You're emphasizing far too much on totally unconfirmed stuff to build up your "Confirmed: blabla" statements.
We know nothing. And I know that I know nothing. And that is already a lot.
G-News
6xx, 7xx, 7xxx - high performance microprocessor targeting computing and high end embedded.
8xx, 8xxx - integrated processor targeting the communications and consumer markets.
5xx, 5xxx - integrated processor targeting the transportation market.
The G5, otherwise known as 85xx, is targeted towards the communications market, NOT the desktop computing one. Instead expect Apple to use faster and upgraded 74xx chips well into next year.