Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
Rubbish. Working conditions in US factories were improving at a faster rate in the late 19th century and very early 20th century before the legalization of unions. The introduction of unions in the US put the brakes on and dramatically slowed down the rate of improvement in factory working conditions. The unions were corrupt and controlled by the mafia before the first strike. Unions have never been anything other than a protection racket, sucking union dues from the workers, so that the mafia fat-cats who run the unions can live high on the hog. The last thing Chinese workers need is US-style labor unions.
No. I also didn't listen to a "radio show;" I saw it in person. Please tell me which parts were made up, I'd love to know.
Saying you know how it is in China because you saw some guy's one man show about it is like saying you understand the complexities of baseball because a guy who went to a game explained it to you.
You're claiming to understand the nuances of the Chinese employment structure, payroll methods, and reward/punishment structure because a guy who went there for a matter of days saw it, interpreted it through his own biases, wrote and performed a piece based on it, you interpreted his words and actions, and now you understand their system? My friend, that's blowhardy on many levels.
Human rights abuses are happening everywhere across Asia by many organizations in construction and manufacturing in Asia. A division of Samsung is supported by the Singapore government to abuse foreign workers by paying them a lowly S$270 per month. Thats approximately USD216 per month.
Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
You must be dreaming by saying this absurd remark especially in China!You are talking about a communist country not a democratic one like we have here in the states.
I have no doubt that Tim is honest in making these remonstrations, but often the General does not know everything that happens to the troops in the trenches.
Also, periodic checks are worthless. Nada.
e.g. there was a recent outcry in Australia when a TV investigative team uncovered barbaric slaughterhouse practices on Australian cattle shipped to Indonesia. If you have the stomach for it, here's the youtube video. http://youtu.be/6baDhDWxlpI
So naturally there was a national outcry, and Australia sent inspectors to Indonesia. While the inspectors are there, everyone in the factories are at their best behaviour, then when the inspectors depart, the workers go back to old habits.
If Apple is serious, it will station permanent observers in each plant. Periodic inspections are just to salve the conscience of politically-correct Westerners, but do nothing to change the daily problems.
Let me state it clearly. Once the Western inspectors go home, the atrocities keep going, and then are hidden when the next inspectors arrive. Please, be realistic.
Unfortunately social and environmental responsibility are not easily resolved in the China market. The suggestion of unions is a no go because the Chinese government does not allow unions and would actively prevent such an organization from being formed. Also, it is difficult for individual factories to change their policies when the Chinese government doesn't help or in some cases works actively against them.
There are also competitive concerns if all the companies in China don't work to change in unison. There have been situations where factories tried to restrict overtime for their workers and the workers just went to a competitors company that would give them overtime. There is definitely an issue with worker conditions in China but it will take the concerted effort of many companies working in cooperation with each other to fix it.
I think progress is starting to be made through the industry groups like the EICC and Fair Labor Association but these things aren't fixed overnight. For an interesting look at what a Chinese factory for someone other than Apple can be like, the video "A Decent Factory" gives an informative look at Nokia's auditing of Chinese suppliers. It is hard to find but they do show it on cable now and again.
Cook's response is exactly spot on. (i) Don't waste time calling call a press conference; talk to your employees; (ii) Deal with the scurrilous accusations; ignore the messenger; (iii) Carry on with what you think is the right thing to do.
The timing of this article is suspicious at best, it reminds me of that article about Apple board searching for CEO.
Apple report a blowout quarter and the accusation come in. I don't say the reports completely false, but targeting Apple only is completely wrong, partial truth is worst than a lie. That bad situation is in most of the third world factories, people need to put food in the table and they will endure every thing for that, and always there will be some one to exploit their need.
I would like a comparison with other companies as well.
Its always good to look who will benefit from a certain situation .
The shorts plant a few negative stories about Apple. The stock goes down for a few weeks. Then come a few positive stories about iPad 3, and the stock goes to a new high.
It's the typical up and down cycle. Rise into earnings and product announcements, then down again. Meanwhile Apple keeps raking it in. $100 per share in cash.
While I read through Tim's email....those are the words that came to mind.
As a consumer and shareholder I am more than happy with Tim's statement and his style of handling the hubbub. Very Apple and very Jobs-like, which is why I saved it for the last word in my list.
I thought the same thing! He brings fire and conviction to the job. Apple is truly in good hands here.
The shorts plant a few negative stories about Apple. The stock goes down for a few weeks. Then come a few positive stories about iPad 3, and the stock goes to a new high.
It's the typical up and down cycle. Rise into earnings and product announcements, then down again. Meanwhile Apple keeps raking it in. $100 per share in cash.
It sounds like you live in a world where the stock market is everything. That's fine if it makes you happy. But you're living in denial if you don't think any of the stories the NYT reported yesterday are genuine.
NYT didn't just bash Apple. They admitted others are guilty of turning a blind eye to many of the same activities from overseas suppliers. But that doesn't condone what Apple allows to happen with its suppliers in pursuit of increasing margins.
As for Tim Cook's impressive employee email that somehow magically leaked out, he said what I would expect him to say. I'm sure he got what he wanted out of it which is a whole lot of press covering Apple's positive spin on the story.
Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
Right. The Chinese shoot people in the open streets for voicing their views. A better idea, would be not to do business in those places, and make the playing field fair through US intervention.
Right. The Chinese shoot people in the open streets for voicing their views. A better idea, would be not to do business in those places, and make the playing field fair through US intervention.
Kent State, Waco, etc. don't justify boycotting American firms any more than similar incidents in China justify boycotting Chinese firms.
Comments
Glad Cook didn't take the bait and bash the NYT. That would just feed their ego. Instead he bashed the accusations. Great response.
I will bash the NYT and also dump their paper. WSJ is a much better paper.
All iPad newspaper readers should dump the NYT.
Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
Rubbish. Working conditions in US factories were improving at a faster rate in the late 19th century and very early 20th century before the legalization of unions. The introduction of unions in the US put the brakes on and dramatically slowed down the rate of improvement in factory working conditions. The unions were corrupt and controlled by the mafia before the first strike. Unions have never been anything other than a protection racket, sucking union dues from the workers, so that the mafia fat-cats who run the unions can live high on the hog. The last thing Chinese workers need is US-style labor unions.
No. I also didn't listen to a "radio show;" I saw it in person. Please tell me which parts were made up, I'd love to know.
Saying you know how it is in China because you saw some guy's one man show about it is like saying you understand the complexities of baseball because a guy who went to a game explained it to you.
You're claiming to understand the nuances of the Chinese employment structure, payroll methods, and reward/punishment structure because a guy who went there for a matter of days saw it, interpreted it through his own biases, wrote and performed a piece based on it, you interpreted his words and actions, and now you understand their system? My friend, that's blowhardy on many levels.
At least Samsung isn't blowing smoke. Apple (and every tech company) could do far, far more than they are.
Lets bash Apple - Samsung not blowing smoke?
http://twc2.org.sg/2012/01/25/how-low-can-a-salary-go/
Human rights abuses are happening everywhere across Asia by many organizations in construction and manufacturing in Asia. A division of Samsung is supported by the Singapore government to abuse foreign workers by paying them a lowly S$270 per month. Thats approximately USD216 per month.
Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
You must be dreaming by saying this absurd remark especially in China!You are talking about a communist country not a democratic one like we have here in the states.
Also, periodic checks are worthless. Nada.
e.g. there was a recent outcry in Australia when a TV investigative team uncovered barbaric slaughterhouse practices on Australian cattle shipped to Indonesia. If you have the stomach for it, here's the youtube video. http://youtu.be/6baDhDWxlpI
So naturally there was a national outcry, and Australia sent inspectors to Indonesia. While the inspectors are there, everyone in the factories are at their best behaviour, then when the inspectors depart, the workers go back to old habits.
If Apple is serious, it will station permanent observers in each plant. Periodic inspections are just to salve the conscience of politically-correct Westerners, but do nothing to change the daily problems.
Let me state it clearly. Once the Western inspectors go home, the atrocities keep going, and then are hidden when the next inspectors arrive. Please, be realistic.
It's like you being accused of low wages in Walmart because you have shopped there before.
I think it's great that Apple are bothering at all.
Glad Cook didn't take the bait and bash the NYT. That would just feed their ego. Instead he bashed the accusations. Great response.
I would've loved it if he had concluded with "And EFF you, NYT."
Seriously tho. as much as I like the professionalism of the response, someone needs to give a harsh reply to those accusing Apple in a biased manner.
There are also competitive concerns if all the companies in China don't work to change in unison. There have been situations where factories tried to restrict overtime for their workers and the workers just went to a competitors company that would give them overtime. There is definitely an issue with worker conditions in China but it will take the concerted effort of many companies working in cooperation with each other to fix it.
I think progress is starting to be made through the industry groups like the EICC and Fair Labor Association but these things aren't fixed overnight. For an interesting look at what a Chinese factory for someone other than Apple can be like, the video "A Decent Factory" gives an informative look at Nokia's auditing of Chinese suppliers. It is hard to find but they do show it on cable now and again.
Cheers.
Actions speak louder than words.
In your case, user names speak louder than comments.
The rest will take care of itself.
The timing of this article is suspicious at best, it reminds me of that article about Apple board searching for CEO.
Apple report a blowout quarter and the accusation come in. I don't say the reports completely false, but targeting Apple only is completely wrong, partial truth is worst than a lie. That bad situation is in most of the third world factories, people need to put food in the table and they will endure every thing for that, and always there will be some one to exploit their need.
I would like a comparison with other companies as well.
Its always good to look who will benefit from a certain situation .
The shorts plant a few negative stories about Apple. The stock goes down for a few weeks. Then come a few positive stories about iPad 3, and the stock goes to a new high.
It's the typical up and down cycle. Rise into earnings and product announcements, then down again. Meanwhile Apple keeps raking it in. $100 per share in cash.
Professional.
Assertive.
Eloquent.
Direct.
Open.
Jobs.
While I read through Tim's email....those are the words that came to mind.
As a consumer and shareholder I am more than happy with Tim's statement and his style of handling the hubbub. Very Apple and very Jobs-like, which is why I saved it for the last word in my list.
I thought the same thing! He brings fire and conviction to the job. Apple is truly in good hands here.
Slaves picked cotton in the South
Slaves make all these fancy gadgets we love so much?
Jeeeeesh, I dunno the answer to that question.
But probably not.
Though all you haters would LOVE to think so.
Whether or not you love/hate Apple, Android. Who cares?!!!!!
It is what it is.
Grow up.
Slaves built the pyramids
No they didn't.
The shorts plant a few negative stories about Apple. The stock goes down for a few weeks. Then come a few positive stories about iPad 3, and the stock goes to a new high.
It's the typical up and down cycle. Rise into earnings and product announcements, then down again. Meanwhile Apple keeps raking it in. $100 per share in cash.
It sounds like you live in a world where the stock market is everything. That's fine if it makes you happy. But you're living in denial if you don't think any of the stories the NYT reported yesterday are genuine.
NYT didn't just bash Apple. They admitted others are guilty of turning a blind eye to many of the same activities from overseas suppliers. But that doesn't condone what Apple allows to happen with its suppliers in pursuit of increasing margins.
As for Tim Cook's impressive employee email that somehow magically leaked out, he said what I would expect him to say. I'm sure he got what he wanted out of it which is a whole lot of press covering Apple's positive spin on the story.
No they didn't.
No they didn't.
Aliens did.
Back in the early part of the 20th century workers in the US were mistreated until they formed unions. Of course the unions became corrupt and problems arose from that as well. But the workers got better treatment. Maybe what the workers need in these factories is a union. Probably won't happen any ways.
Right. The Chinese shoot people in the open streets for voicing their views. A better idea, would be not to do business in those places, and make the playing field fair through US intervention.
Right. The Chinese shoot people in the open streets for voicing their views. A better idea, would be not to do business in those places, and make the playing field fair through US intervention.
Kent State, Waco, etc. don't justify boycotting American firms any more than similar incidents in China justify boycotting Chinese firms.