Apple pulls products from government-backed 'green electronics' list

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  • Reply 181 of 197
    habihabi Posts: 317member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post



    Amusingly, if you search for "remove glue" on Google, it returns 19.6 million results.



    Maybe it's not such a big deal after all.


     


     


    Quote:





    Google also shows 15.7 million results for "remove nuclear weapons" so that might not be the best evidence



     


    And it depends on the answers aswell. You can find a lot of problemsolving on the net with no good answers! image

     


    Sorry didnt use quote function...

  • Reply 182 of 197
    hiker275hiker275 Posts: 53member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple || 


     


    They should mind their own business. They have no business dictating their extremist religious beliefs unto others. If somebody wants to be all green and go live in a tree for the rest of their lives and never use toilet paper ever again, then good for them, as long as they keep their distance from me. But these loons have no right to impose their beliefs unto others. 



    Well, it is their own business as well as everyone else's business. The year isn't 1600, and today, how everyone conducts their business has an effect on everyone else. Also, while you are correct in saying their position is extremist, they don't get to dictate much of anything to anybody. Sure, they can lobby the government with their limited budgets, and they can try to sway popular opinion. I doubt they really have that much effect in the grand scheme of things.

  • Reply 183 of 197

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post





    Okay, bye.


     


    Proving the point of the previous posters. Skil, you are the biggest tool on here (quite a feat given some of the competition I've read today) and you're a moderator. Yet you never exercise even a modicum of restraint in any of your posts, which, as pointed out, are often nothing more than personal insults to anyone who does not have the blinkers on.

  • Reply 184 of 197
    kotatsukotatsu Posts: 1,010member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    Good. I've always felt that Apple spends too much time talking up the whole green angle during their keynotes, and it has zero effect on my eventual purchase of any Apple product. That's probably the least important feature of any Apple device, in my opinion. And it doesn't really matter anyway, because Apple will still get the imbeciles from Greenpeace attacking them, no matter what they do.


     


    I also usually view products labelled with "green" as a negative thing, and I try to stay away from "green" products, such as certain hard drives. In the case of the hard drives, "green" is practically synonymous with inferior, slower and worse.



    Wow, what a nice person you must be! I bet when you're shopping for food you intentionally pick up the factory farmed meat instead of the free range, because you'll never have to live in a cage so small you can't move, so why should you care? Heck why even care about Chinese slave labour because you'll never be a Chinese slave and all you want are cheaper prices.


     


    We only have one planet, and it's resources are running out far, far quicker than the planet can replenish them. Every company should make their products with as little energy as possible, and ensure they can be repaired and recycled easily and quickly. 


     


    You need to grow up and read up about the terrible state the planet is in and how big companies are largely to blame. 

  • Reply 185 of 197
    macbook promacbook pro Posts: 1,605member
    I have been an Apple fan for a while, and i have been directly or indirectly been responsible for quite a few Apple purchases, through friends, family or work. I am however starting to have a problem with what Apple is becoming. Put simply, I think the bean counters are gaining control of the company. They are getting too greedy and complacent. The glued in batteries, non upgradeable memory, and proprietary ssd hard drives are really just the last straw. I also find that my iPad feels like a controlled prison. I have al ready purchased an Android phone and I will likely find other alternatives for my next laptop purchase. I am angry at Apple.

    I would like to note that you have established a false dichotomy.

    System 76 does not offer products that compete directly with MacBook Air, MacBook Pro or MacBook Pro with Retina Display. The target demographics are vastly different; ultraportable, powerful portable and powerful ultraportable (for Apple) versus portable (for System 67). System 76 does not offer a laptop under 4.5 pounds, no dedicated graphics, no integration with Apple services (iCloud and iTunes).

    System 76 is functionally no more upgradeable or repairable than Apple MacBook Air or MacBook Pro with Retina Display. I was unable to find readily available make and model information for RAM upgrades or battery replacements.

    "Importantly, this limited product warranty does not cover:

    non-System 76 branded hardware products and accessories e.g., monitors, speakers, printers, portable devices, etc.; software, including the operating system and software as well as any third party software; product that has been damaged by actions that are beyond System 76's control, including for example, impacts, fluids, fire, flood, wind, earthquake, lightning or similar disaster, war, strike, lockout, epidemic, destruction of production facilities, riot, insurrection, or material unavailability; product that has been damaged through misuse, abuse or mishandling, including without limitation the unauthorized modification of the system as a whole or any individual component, and/or the attachment of peripheral devices; product for which System 76 has not received payment; or paint or finish." (1)

    Further, I am surprised that you would succumb to the logical fallacy of "proprietary systems." Virtually every company in the Information Management product sand services sector provides proprietary solutions; Adobe, Amazon, AMD, Apple, Cisco, eBay, Google, Intel, Microsoft, Oracle. The only important factors for consumers to consider about "proprietary systems" are; is product service and support readily available, is product training readily available? The emphatic answer for Apple aficionados is an emphatic, Yes! In fact, as previously stated, Apple provides market leading customer service and support in every major market in which they compete. With hundreds of retail stores worldwide and thousands of authorized service providers, service and support is also readily available.


    1. Unattributed. No Published DAte provided. Warranty and Returns. System 76. Retrieved 9 July 2012.
  • Reply 186 of 197


    This is unfortunate.  Apple needs to be proactive in this field.  Speak up, Tim Cook!

  • Reply 187 of 197

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post







    I am not convinced that this will signal the end for Apple:


     


     


     


    I've not heard any predictions that this signals the end for Apple.  

  • Reply 188 of 197
    hungoverhungover Posts: 603member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by kotatsu View Post


    Wow, what a nice person you must be! I bet when you're shopping for food you intentionally pick up the factory farmed meat instead of the free range, because you'll never have to live in a cage so small you can't move, so why should you care? Heck why even care about Chinese slave labour because you'll never be a Chinese slave and all you want are cheaper prices.


     


    We only have one planet, and it's resources are running out far, far quicker than the planet can replenish them. Every company should make their products with as little energy as possible, and ensure they can be repaired and recycled easily and quickly. 


     


    You need to grow up and read up about the terrible state the planet is in and how big companies are largely to blame. 



     Indeed, even worse, he seems to get some kind of sexual gratification from the idea that people have suffered making his beloved Apple products. The first post of his that I had the misfortune to read mocked the suicides of the Chinese Foxconn workers. I instantly concluded that he is a very flawed person. As a result of reading other posts of his I now have a mental picture of a teenager living with his mother in a large conurbation, he lives fairly close to his high school, he is a virgin (he really believes that only attractive women own iPhones) and socially awkward. As a loner he spends all of his free time at home. His father may have been absent for sometime, hence he feels it is necessary to over compensate and try to appear to be macho and dispassionate. His inability to make real friends explains his desire to be part of the "apple family", treating it as a credo that must not be questioned.. Naturally I am not saying that any of the above is true but some of his posts have been some of the most offensive I have ever read.


     


    If I am correct I guess we can hope that when he matures he will become a more rounded person. If i am wrong then I am gald that he only has one vote.

  • Reply 189 of 197
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,733member
    A brilliant move of course removing all products from the register. There can be no drip drip of complaints when it gets to the day when Apple can prove they have not one screw loose. You don't need to be highly clued to know Apple's future is all glued.

    And while I laud the original goals of EPEAT to allow consumers to use "common tools" to facilitate recycling, how many consumers have really done that? I've tried to harvest batteries from rechargeable devices before tossing them, and some devices are downright impossible despite the laughable "instructions" for battery removal that many such products have.

    I think Apple dramatically pulling out of EPEAT is their somewhat clumsy attempt to point out that in this day and age, the emperor has no clothes. Consumers aren't the ones that need to actively reclaim materials for recycling - qualified recyclers are.

    The original goals of EPEAT were nobel, if not a bit naive and impractical. Apple has already shown their current approaches are far more effective - approaches that don't need nor benefit from the arbitrary EPEAT certification.

    BTW - EPEAT is a bit of a scam. Manufacturers self certify - there is no independent verification of their claims. And vendors have to pay. So let's review - a questionable standard that was well intentioned but proven impractical, that really has no weight behind it and to top it off you have to pay for. Hmm - I see no reason for Apple to want to get out of that :P
  • Reply 190 of 197
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,733member
    This is unfortunate.  Apple needs to be proactive in this field.

    Who is more proactive than Apple "in this field".

    Seriously - show us one company that focuses on and does more than Apple - not just talking about it, but showing it through their actions?
  • Reply 191 of 197
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,733member
    I would like to note that you have established a false dichotomy. [...] I was unable to find readily available make and model information for RAM upgrades or battery replacements. [...] Further, I am surprised that you would succumb to the logical fallacy of "proprietary systems." Virtually every company in the Information Management product sand services sector provides proprietary solutions

    Excellent points. I always shake my head when people criticize the 30 pin iPod connector when praising Europe for "standardizing" mini-USB - while conveniently overlooking that USB is in, itself, a proprietary connection.
  • Reply 192 of 197
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

     

     

    I've not heard any predictions that this signals the end for Apple.  

     

    Certainly not.


    But the faster they move to 100% non user serviceable products means they guarantee impressive long term income even after any decline..
  • Reply 193 of 197
    I would think this now means that all United States Federal agencies will stop buying Apple products.
  • Reply 194 of 197
    http://www.apple.com/environment/

    Best to read it while you can?

    "be as energy efficient and recyclable as possible."

    1 out of 2 ain't bad.
  • Reply 195 of 197
    jupiteronejupiterone Posts: 1,564member
    hungover wrote: »
     Indeed, even worse, he seems to get some kind of sexual gratification from the idea that people have suffered making his beloved Apple products. The first post of his that I had the misfortune to read mocked the suicides of the Chinese Foxconn workers. I instantly concluded that he is a very flawed person. As a result of reading other posts of his I now have a mental picture of a teenager living with his mother in a large conurbation, he lives fairly close to his high school, he is a virgin (he really believes that only attractive women own iPhones) and socially awkward. As a loner he spends all of his free time at home. His father may have been absent for sometime, hence he feels it is necessary to over compensate and try to appear to be macho and dispassionate. His inability to make real friends explains his desire to be part of the "apple family", treating it as a credo that must not be questioned.. Naturally I am not saying that any of the above is true but some of his posts have been some of the most offensive I have ever read.

    If I am correct I guess we can hope that when he matures he will become a more rounded person. If i am wrong then I am gald that he only has one vote.

    From his very first post, the image that comes to my mind is Eric Cartman.
  • Reply 196 of 197

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post


    Oh, look.  More government.  This is exactly why we can't build anything in this country anymore.   



    More government is not the problem, at least not in the sense you mean. It is too much government when the government subsidizes and encourages companies to send work abroad. It has nothing to do with environmental protections. In addition, government policies always favor the big guy over the little guy even though 75% of jobs are the little guy.


     


    In addition, investors, in cahoots with the big bankers, contribute nothing to the US economy and in fact are actively engaged in its destruction. 


     


    Investors want high returns on their investments -- don't we all?. So instead of investing in productive activities (like businesses that make things), they invest in money and debt. If you don't know, you need a review. If you as an investor want to make a lot of money (as opposed to product) your best bet is to invest in money. Payday loans are great with 400% interest earned, but high risk. Or investment in credit card debt, which earns 18 to 24% interest -- no longer high risk because Congress got bribed like they always do by making credit card debt non-dischargeable in bankruptcy. If an investor invests in small companies (or banks that give loans to smaller and local companies), then you will not be making any 18%. Small businesses support the local economies and the local economies remain viable because of the multiplier effect of local employees and local businesses buying local,  supporting locally-built homes, farms, local schools and teachers, etc. Investors in these businesses might make 3% on their investments, but that 3% supports entire communities and not some Bain Capital or JP Morgan billionaires. It's the same 3% if you invest in infrastructure, or generic drugs, or any industry that is stable and long term -- think water supply, family farms, maintenance services like electrical, plumbing, home maintenance, nuts, bolts, nails, fabric, shoes, etc.


     


    You also have to remember, if you ever knew it, that the average US economic growth is 3% per year, of which 1% is due to 1% growth in population, leaving about 2% for actual economic growth. Of course, there will be industries and companies doing much better than 3%, and one can try investing in these companies for relatively short term gains. Investment in the stock markets have little to do with adding to productivity. Except for the initial IPO companies don't directly benefit from their stock valuations. If companies hold some of their own stock, then it can be used as collateral for debt incurred to improve and increase production and R&D. Other than that, companies get no benefit from stock evaluations. If an investor wants to support a company's productivity, they have to purchase a company's private bonds. 


     


    Basically, the big investors today, and for decades now, make their money the old fashioned way: "rape and pillage". If you can buy up a company, you put some marginal amount in, borrow the rest, and shift the debt load to the company you just bought. For the investors, these are non-recourse loans -- an investor cannot lose any more than his initial marginal investment, and if you can shift even that marginal amount to the purchased company, all the better. Now, that previously viable company is loaded with debt, often far greater than they can pay off. In order to pay off that debt, the company is downsized, parts sold off, wages slashed, or moved offshore, products cheapened by buying from cheaper suppliers. And if the big banks can do better by bundling and selling the new debt as CDO's (collateralized debt obligations) and selling it to other investors, all the better. The initial investors can make a second bundle of money off this mechanism.


     


    This is how the bubble economy works. Housing, big banking, savings and loans in the 1980's -- all bubble. Health care industries is another bubble industry for which substantial debt is being incurred and is unsustainable in the long term and has been for at least a couple of decades. When the housing and financial bubble collapsed, the government propped up the bubble economy with bailouts. Because the financial industry is about 40% of the economy, the economy took a close to 40% hit. At that time, the financial folks advising both Bush and Obama indicated that the economy would take about 12 years to return to "normal". There is nothing magical about this 12 years. That is about the value of 3% growth compounded annually over 12 years -- that is, 1.03^12 gives 1.426. 

  • Reply 197 of 197

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


     


    This is a very short-sighted and almost certainly false picture you're painting here.  It adheres to currently accepted thought on the matter but doesn't take the future into account.  


     


    The garbage piles and city dumps of today will certainly not be (paraphrased) "lifeless forever."  It's far more likely that the dumps of the 20th and 21st centuries will actually be a wonderful benefit to the resource starved people of the future.  Today's dumps will also be the future's archaeological goldmines as well.  


     


    The idea that the city dump is some sad, lifeless, scar that will "never be healed" is ridiculous.  



    Wishful thinking. What I described is today, and for the foreseeable future. Yes, in the generations to come, maybe these mountains will be dug up and the fetid materials reused, and somewhere in academia, scientists (or maybe just philosophers) are considering how this might be done, but at this time, your vision is too similar to a dream sequence. A more likely scenario is the one proposed in the movie "Idiocracy". 

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