so what Sammy's saying is that we don't know how to move mobile design/innovations forward without Apple showing us the way. Even though we've been in the biz longer than Apple has, we don't know anything.
I depends. Were the findings against parts that were Samsung unique or Android core? I don't know enough about Android to answer that - I'm sure someone will do an analysis...
I think we saw some of that analysis during the trial. Samsung actually did change the default iconography to be more iOS like from the standard android set. But, it does make sense that the other suits that are outstanding will have some interesting landmines to cross.
Sure sammy, delfect the bad press off of you. Then again the loss to the consumer probably means sammy will raise it's prices to pay for the settlement.
I think on an Apple centric news aggregator like this it is worth noting that Samsung is more than just a copy cat. They make high quality products, especially components in cellphones, and they take pride in the quality of the products they make. Culturally, they do not "see" that copying the "best" in a competitors product is anything more than competition. You need to do more than just dismiss Samsung as "Samesung". You need to realize that there are a lot of people who honestly believe we would be better off if Samsung could make their high quality knock offs. Many of those people feel that technology improvements and small businesses would benefit if IP rules made it much harder to obtain a patent. If you think that it is okay to download stolen software, music, or porn then you probably shouldn't be angry at Samsung. I actually think the price Samsung paid is in line with what should be reasonable for the actions they took. I don't think suing some kid for tens of thousands of dollars for downloading a few songs is reasonable. People that run servers that actively benefit from showing stolen products should be hit much harder. That is my view and it is pretty consistent with what I believe to be fair and reasonable.
Apple still needs Samsung to make the high quality parts that are used in the iPhone. There is an extensive class of patents which Samsung uses to make those products which Apple has been benefiting from. If you have been paying attention to the news you would realize that Apple has had big quality issues with the LG panels being used to build the new retina macbook pro. Apple should be willing to settle this dispute with Samsung without hanging all of their business on the results from this one case. One of the best bloggers on the web, Asymco's Horace Deidu, made the point that suing your competitor for IP infringements like this is not a good business plan. When pressed to comment on the odds of Apple winning this lawsuit Horace replied: "Again, I don’t have an opinion on legal matters. Broadly speaking, IP litigation is similar to playing the lottery." Apple has now made the point that it should not be copied directly and protected their intellectual property rights. The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
[This statement from Samsung is even more pathetic, whiny and bitchy than I expected. I love how they still think its cute using the 'rounded rectangles' line, after a jury convicted them of willful infringement of many patents and trade dress. A jury, not Apple, or iSheep.
Pathetic. Go home and cry Samsung. Maybe now you will understand that actions have consequences.
Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
*snort* You should have made this your first sentence.
Congratulations to Apple. They don't steal, they innovate, create, purchase when needed and have a high degree of ethics. While imitation is a form of flattery, copying and theft of intellectual property is not flattery, but theft. Unfortunately, many do not see it this way and theft of IP will continue. Many in the business world to not possess the degree of ethics that Apple has and they do not even aspire to be ethical - it is what ever it takes to get ahead and make a $ at anyone's expense. Thank you Apple for hanging in there and I know Steve Jobs is proud of the People that make up Apple. I know I am.
This will not be a loss for the American Consumer as you will learn.
I depends. Were the findings against parts that were Samsung unique or Android core? I don't know enough about Android to answer that - I'm sure someone will do an analysis...
I believe the strategy is to go after the profits... Google makes none on the Android code, therefore the OEMs are the target, since they are the final 'coders' of the device, and build the HW and UI. Don't know how that plays in the Moto Mobility side of the game.
My guess is that any actively sold device with this IP will be C&Ded in the US immediately, With Apple using a suit for damages as leverage. With this Case Law, it will be stupid to 'fight' as the smaller vendors don't have the war chest and can look at PsyStar as an example of fighting to the grave with Apple's Legal team.
and all of Apple's other patents just increased in perceived validity as well. Apple acting to defend it's patents (and not compromise out of court) basically says tells all that now that Apple plays the game to win. That said, Samsung had every opportunity to save face before this trial started.
1 Billion may not be much ($1 per share) in the Apple Ledger, but it funds the legal warchest, and also defines the risk to all other Android OEMs.
The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
Yes I think they will cross-license, they already offered to do that before the case I believe. When Microsoft copied the Mac and made "Windows" (a nice generic name for a generic copy), Apple sued them and won too, but later cross-licensed.
I believe the strategy is to go after the profits... Google makes none on the Android code, therefore the OEMs are the target, since they are the final 'coders' of the device, and build the HW and UI. Don't know how that plays in the Moto Mobility side of the game.
My guess is that any actively sold device with this IP will be C&Ded in the US immediately, With Apple using a suit for damages as leverage. With this Case Law, it will be stupid to 'fight' as the smaller vendors don't have the war chest and can look at PsyStar as an example of fighting to the grave with Apple's Legal team.
and all of Apple's other patents just increased in perceived validity as well. Apple acting to defend it's patents (and not compromise out of court) basically says tells all that now that Apple plays the game to win. That said, Samsung had every opportunity to save face before this trial started.
1 Billion may not be much ($1 per share) in the Apple Ledger, but it funds the legal warchest, and also defines the risk to all other Android OEMs.
That's my feeling. I'd bet anything that Samsung offered Apple a lot more for a settlement than they ever hoped to win from the court but by making a precedent there will be a lot less companies infringing and Apple could finally get some licenses paid for that they tried to do before all this took place.
I suspect Motorola may find itself on the wrong end of one of these suits soon, especially given their abuse of FRAND patents in courts all over the world. That $12B investment is looking worse and worse for Google.
I am curious to know where this leaves Android? Surely Apple can now go after all the iOS IP Google stole covered by this trial.
If Apple's win can prevent manufacturers from feeling safe from litigation when they power up their phones and tablets using Android, then Apple can dry up the support for Android-based devices. Alternately, this can force Android to drop any UI features that will get the manufacturers into litigation, thus making the Android OS less enjoyable to use.
Additionally, several court cases, including this one, have shown that Google is not capable of protecting the manufacturers as once thought. Therefore, choosing the "FREE" Android as an OS is proving to be very very expensive.
Finally, with this court win, Apple is able to finally show and monetize the lose of profits. That may finally open up Google to be liable for each copy of Android they gave away.
I think on an Apple centric news aggregator like this it is worth noting that Samsung is more than just a copy cat. They make high quality products, especially components in cellphones, and they take pride in the quality of the products they make. Culturally, they do not "see" that copying the "best" in a competitors product is anything more than competition. You need to do more than just dismiss Samsung as "Samesung". You need to realize that there are a lot of people who honestly believe we would be better off if Samsung could make their high quality knock offs. Many of those people feel that technology improvements and small businesses would benefit if IP rules made it much harder to obtain a patent. If you think that it is okay to download stolen software, music, or porn then you probably shouldn't be angry at Samsung. I actually think the price Samsung paid is in line with what should be reasonable for the actions they took. I don't think suing some kid for tens of thousands of dollars for downloading a few songs is reasonable. People that run servers that actively benefit from showing stolen products should be hit much harder. That is my view and it is pretty consistent with what I believe to be fair and reasonable.
Apple still needs Samsung to make the high quality parts that are used in the iPhone. There is an extensive class of patents which Samsung uses to make those products which Apple has been benefiting from. If you have been paying attention to the news you would realize that Apple has had big quality issues with the LG panels being used to build the new retina macbook pro. Apple should be willing to settle this dispute with Samsung without hanging all of their business on the results from this one case. One of the best bloggers on the web, Asymco's Horace Deidu, made the point that suing your competitor for IP infringements like this is not a good business plan. When pressed to comment on the odds of Apple winning this lawsuit Horace replied: "Again, I don’t have an opinion on legal matters. Broadly speaking, IP litigation is similar to playing the lottery." Apple has now made the point that it should not be copied directly and protected their intellectual property rights. The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
Before initiating the lawsuits, Jobs went to Samsung and requested that they stop copying Apple's designs. Samsung refused. Apple has offered to license at least some of its patents to Samsung. Samsung has said no. Apple has taken the high road. But, you cannot expect them to roll over and play dead when their intellectual property is being stolen.
I have a high regard for Horace Deidu, but suing your competitor for IP infringements is a perfectly good business plan when all attempts at reaching an amicable solution have failed.
I think on an Apple centric news aggregator like this it is worth noting that Samsung is more than just a copy cat.
..."
I agree that Samsung do make good quality parts. I would rather see them settle indeed than having lawsuit after lawsuit all over the world. Apple is trying to get rid of Samsung as a suppliers but apparently its no picnic.
Imo Samsung should do like microsoft and make a deal with Apple if they want to use there patents.
That's my feeling. I'd bet anything that Samsung offered Apple a lot more for a settlement than they ever hoped to win from the court but by making a precedent there will be a lot less companies infringing and Apple could finally get some licenses paid for that they tried to do before all this took place.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
so what Sammy's saying is that we don't know how to move mobile design/innovations forward without Apple showing us the way. Even though we've been in the biz longer than Apple has, we don't know anything.
I vote this for best comment
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42
I depends. Were the findings against parts that were Samsung unique or Android core? I don't know enough about Android to answer that - I'm sure someone will do an analysis...
I think we saw some of that analysis during the trial. Samsung actually did change the default iconography to be more iOS like from the standard android set. But, it does make sense that the other suits that are outstanding will have some interesting landmines to cross.
Sure sammy, delfect the bad press off of you. Then again the loss to the consumer probably means sammy will raise it's prices to pay for the settlement.
I think on an Apple centric news aggregator like this it is worth noting that Samsung is more than just a copy cat. They make high quality products, especially components in cellphones, and they take pride in the quality of the products they make. Culturally, they do not "see" that copying the "best" in a competitors product is anything more than competition. You need to do more than just dismiss Samsung as "Samesung". You need to realize that there are a lot of people who honestly believe we would be better off if Samsung could make their high quality knock offs. Many of those people feel that technology improvements and small businesses would benefit if IP rules made it much harder to obtain a patent. If you think that it is okay to download stolen software, music, or porn then you probably shouldn't be angry at Samsung. I actually think the price Samsung paid is in line with what should be reasonable for the actions they took. I don't think suing some kid for tens of thousands of dollars for downloading a few songs is reasonable. People that run servers that actively benefit from showing stolen products should be hit much harder. That is my view and it is pretty consistent with what I believe to be fair and reasonable.
Apple still needs Samsung to make the high quality parts that are used in the iPhone. There is an extensive class of patents which Samsung uses to make those products which Apple has been benefiting from. If you have been paying attention to the news you would realize that Apple has had big quality issues with the LG panels being used to build the new retina macbook pro. Apple should be willing to settle this dispute with Samsung without hanging all of their business on the results from this one case. One of the best bloggers on the web, Asymco's Horace Deidu, made the point that suing your competitor for IP infringements like this is not a good business plan. When pressed to comment on the odds of Apple winning this lawsuit Horace replied: "Again, I don’t have an opinion on legal matters. Broadly speaking, IP litigation is similar to playing the lottery." Apple has now made the point that it should not be copied directly and protected their intellectual property rights. The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
Pathetic. Go home and cry Samsung. Maybe now you will understand that actions have consequences.
Originally Posted by Macnewsjunkie
Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
*snort* You should have made this your first sentence.
LMAO
Samsung can be replaced with any other lousy Android OEM and no one would miss a beat.
Congratulations to Apple. They don't steal, they innovate, create, purchase when needed and have a high degree of ethics. While imitation is a form of flattery, copying and theft of intellectual property is not flattery, but theft. Unfortunately, many do not see it this way and theft of IP will continue. Many in the business world to not possess the degree of ethics that Apple has and they do not even aspire to be ethical - it is what ever it takes to get ahead and make a $ at anyone's expense. Thank you Apple for hanging in there and I know Steve Jobs is proud of the People that make up Apple. I know I am.
This will not be a loss for the American Consumer as you will learn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42
I depends. Were the findings against parts that were Samsung unique or Android core? I don't know enough about Android to answer that - I'm sure someone will do an analysis...
I believe the strategy is to go after the profits... Google makes none on the Android code, therefore the OEMs are the target, since they are the final 'coders' of the device, and build the HW and UI. Don't know how that plays in the Moto Mobility side of the game.
My guess is that any actively sold device with this IP will be C&Ded in the US immediately, With Apple using a suit for damages as leverage. With this Case Law, it will be stupid to 'fight' as the smaller vendors don't have the war chest and can look at PsyStar as an example of fighting to the grave with Apple's Legal team.
and all of Apple's other patents just increased in perceived validity as well. Apple acting to defend it's patents (and not compromise out of court) basically says tells all that now that Apple plays the game to win. That said, Samsung had every opportunity to save face before this trial started.
1 Billion may not be much ($1 per share) in the Apple Ledger, but it funds the legal warchest, and also defines the risk to all other Android OEMs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macnewsjunkie
The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
Yes I think they will cross-license, they already offered to do that before the case I believe. When Microsoft copied the Mac and made "Windows" (a nice generic name for a generic copy), Apple sued them and won too, but later cross-licensed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips
I am curious to know where this leaves Android? Surely Apple can now go after all the iOS IP Google stole covered by this trial.
Yes,
this was just the opening battle/shot across the bow of a much larger target - if I were Google - I'd be lawyering up right now...
YOU'RE NEXT GOOGLE!
That's my feeling. I'd bet anything that Samsung offered Apple a lot more for a settlement than they ever hoped to win from the court but by making a precedent there will be a lot less companies infringing and Apple could finally get some licenses paid for that they tried to do before all this took place.
I suspect Motorola may find itself on the wrong end of one of these suits soon, especially given their abuse of FRAND patents in courts all over the world. That $12B investment is looking worse and worse for Google.
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips
I am curious to know where this leaves Android? Surely Apple can now go after all the iOS IP Google stole covered by this trial.
If Apple's win can prevent manufacturers from feeling safe from litigation when they power up their phones and tablets using Android, then Apple can dry up the support for Android-based devices. Alternately, this can force Android to drop any UI features that will get the manufacturers into litigation, thus making the Android OS less enjoyable to use.
Additionally, several court cases, including this one, have shown that Google is not capable of protecting the manufacturers as once thought. Therefore, choosing the "FREE" Android as an OS is proving to be very very expensive.
Finally, with this court win, Apple is able to finally show and monetize the lose of profits. That may finally open up Google to be liable for each copy of Android they gave away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macnewsjunkie
I think on an Apple centric news aggregator like this it is worth noting that Samsung is more than just a copy cat. They make high quality products, especially components in cellphones, and they take pride in the quality of the products they make. Culturally, they do not "see" that copying the "best" in a competitors product is anything more than competition. You need to do more than just dismiss Samsung as "Samesung". You need to realize that there are a lot of people who honestly believe we would be better off if Samsung could make their high quality knock offs. Many of those people feel that technology improvements and small businesses would benefit if IP rules made it much harder to obtain a patent. If you think that it is okay to download stolen software, music, or porn then you probably shouldn't be angry at Samsung. I actually think the price Samsung paid is in line with what should be reasonable for the actions they took. I don't think suing some kid for tens of thousands of dollars for downloading a few songs is reasonable. People that run servers that actively benefit from showing stolen products should be hit much harder. That is my view and it is pretty consistent with what I believe to be fair and reasonable.
Apple still needs Samsung to make the high quality parts that are used in the iPhone. There is an extensive class of patents which Samsung uses to make those products which Apple has been benefiting from. If you have been paying attention to the news you would realize that Apple has had big quality issues with the LG panels being used to build the new retina macbook pro. Apple should be willing to settle this dispute with Samsung without hanging all of their business on the results from this one case. One of the best bloggers on the web, Asymco's Horace Deidu, made the point that suing your competitor for IP infringements like this is not a good business plan. When pressed to comment on the odds of Apple winning this lawsuit Horace replied: "Again, I don’t have an opinion on legal matters. Broadly speaking, IP litigation is similar to playing the lottery." Apple has now made the point that it should not be copied directly and protected their intellectual property rights. The real question now is will Apple take the high road, and lock in the win they have made in this case and offer to cross license technology with their partner, Samsung. There is plenty of money to be made by both parties. The smartphone and tablet markets taken together is the largest market by gross product that has ever been conceived of. Hundreds of billions of Dollars of profits are on the table at this point. A simple effort to avoid infringing on each other's trade dress, and a cross license of all technical and software patents would be a huge win for both Apple and Samsung. Please remember that Apple never made any great products until they quit fighting Microsoft and put the heart and soul of the company into the effort to make new products for the "digital life"
Before initiating the lawsuits, Jobs went to Samsung and requested that they stop copying Apple's designs. Samsung refused. Apple has offered to license at least some of its patents to Samsung. Samsung has said no. Apple has taken the high road. But, you cannot expect them to roll over and play dead when their intellectual property is being stolen.
I have a high regard for Horace Deidu, but suing your competitor for IP infringements is a perfectly good business plan when all attempts at reaching an amicable solution have failed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by amoradala
"It is unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to give one company a monopoly over rounded corners and rectangles."
What incredible arrogance and ignorance.
A disgusting company !
Arrogant, ignorant, and disgusting is exactly right.
Kind of ironic too, since the one Apple claim with which the jury did not agree was the one relating to "rectangle with rounded corners!"
It's hard to loose face isn't it Samsung?
I agree that Samsung do make good quality parts. I would rather see them settle indeed than having lawsuit after lawsuit all over the world. Apple is trying to get rid of Samsung as a suppliers but apparently its no picnic.
Imo Samsung should do like microsoft and make a deal with Apple if they want to use there patents.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
That's my feeling. I'd bet anything that Samsung offered Apple a lot more for a settlement than they ever hoped to win from the court but by making a precedent there will be a lot less companies infringing and Apple could finally get some licenses paid for that they tried to do before all this took place.
Very good point and I completely agree with you!