New Lightning dock connector capable of hosting USB devices - report

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  • Reply 21 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post





    That's pointless without context. If you compare the things those people use Bluetooth for to the things people use Bluetooth for on all other phones, including some dumb phones, you will realize that, yes, Bluetooth on the iPhone is borderline useless as you can only use it for audio (and a keyboard on the iPad). File exchanging, Internet connectivity, SIM sharing, etc. are all unavailable features.


    I use my jailbroken iPad to do file exchange and internet connectivity. My jailbroken iPhone supports internet connectivity but the USB host mode should provide for better file exchange.


     


    ... and before you go on about having to jailbreak an iPhone for these features, please tell me how many Android owners are rooting their phones to remove manufacturing customization just to make the phone even usable ...

  • Reply 22 of 45
    elehcdn wrote: »
    I use my jailbroken iPad to do file exchange and internet connectivity. My jailbroken iPhone supports internet connectivity but the USB host mode should provide for better file exchange.

    ... and before you go on about having to jailbreak an iPhone for these features, please tell me how many Android owners are rooting their phones to remove manufacturing customization just to make the phone even usable ...

    A jailbroken iPhone is no longer providing the Apple experience. Regarding Android, I couldn't care any less about people rooting their devices, Android is crap for a lot of other reasons, too, but that's not what I came here to debate. I only posted here to demonstrate to the people who were already flaming those who, like me, have reasons to disapprove the new connector that this functionality is nothing new (as it was already available in the Dock Connector) and thus they shouldn't expect anything to change. My Bluetooth remark was merely an example of how unwilling Apple is to extract the full potential of interoperating technologies, providing further evidence that USB host on the Lightning Connector doesn't mean anything special.
  • Reply 23 of 45
    [VIDEO][/VIDEO]
    What's the point of that? Put them directly on the phone. Powering a spinning hard drive will kill your battery faster than it could play even half a movie.

    Several thoughts. First, you would download the films(s) you need off the drive to your iDevice, rather than run them off the drive. In this model, the drive would be merely storage.

    Second, you could run them off the drive if it had it's own battery; therefore not sucking juice from the device. And I was thinking more of the iPad anyway, not the iPhone (more oomph).

    The challenge, of course, would be to convert the rips on-the-fly to avoid the transcoding process. Hence the right app is needed for that job. A rip only takes about 10 minutes; transcoding can sometimes take hours, or even all night!
  • Reply 24 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SWS View Post



    I am REALLY hoping that since the new connector is all digital, we can hook the iPhone up to our own DAC/Amps and bypass the phone's equipment.

    Not that the iPhone puts out bad sound. But for an audiophile, this may be a dream come true!!!!!!

    I am REALLY looking forward to what the accessory market brings!!!!!


    That is already possible with the iPhones. I use a Pure i-20 doc and a FiiO DAC/Amp right now. There are several other options from Cambridge Audio and others as well.

  • Reply 25 of 45


    Originally Posted by DeeGee48 View Post

    Second, you could run them off the drive if it had it's own battery; therefore not sucking juice from the device. And I was thinking more of the iPad anyway, not the iPhone (more oomph).


     


    Ah, you said 'pocket HD', so I assumed the standard 2.5" port-powered drive.


     




    The challenge, of course, would be to convert the rips on-the-fly to avoid the transcoding process. Hence the right app is needed for that job. A rip only takes about 10 minutes; transcoding can sometimes take hours, or even all night!



     


    Why wouldn't all your movies already be MP4 (or HEVC)?

  • Reply 26 of 45
    Folks

    Why is that port called Lightning?

    What is Lightning associated with?

    Thunderbolts!

    Have you heard of Thunderbolt and Apple mentioned together?

    Thunderbolt has expensive cables because there are micro chips in the cables.

    Lightning has cables that cost more than previous versions of Apple products.

    Thunderbolt can offer you a cable that converts to HDMI, I know that because I have one before they were banned in the USA.

    Thunderbolt can convert to USB 3 and a whole raft of other technologies.

    Lightning can... Who knows?

    It is only now you are beginning to hear of what is possible with the new iPhone 5 and the Lightning port. I am certain more surprises are to come from Apple and their partners in due time.

    Meanwhile check out this URL and this quote about Thunderbolt technology.

    https://thunderbolttechnology.net

    Thunderbolt technology is a breakthrough in I/O technology and represents the future of mobile computing. Soon you will be able to carry all the power and functionality of desktop environments in compact devices.

    — Philippe Spruch, Chairman and General Manager, LaCie

    or this one

    Technology like this only happens about once a decade. We are thrilled about the performance and simplicity Thunderbolt technology will bring to our award-winning UAD Powered Plug-Ins platform.

    — Bill Putnam, CEO, Universal Audio

    How close is Lightning to Thunderbolt, you tell me.
  • Reply 27 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post





    A jailbroken iPhone is no longer providing the Apple experience. Regarding Android, I couldn't care any less about people rooting their devices, Android is crap for a lot of other reasons, too, but that's not what I came here to debate. I only posted here to demonstrate to the people who were already flaming those who, like me, have reasons to disapprove the new connector that this functionality is nothing new (as it was already available in the Dock Connector) and thus they shouldn't expect anything to change. My Bluetooth remark was merely an example of how unwilling Apple is to extract the full potential of interoperating technologies, providing further evidence that USB host on the Lightning Connector doesn't mean anything special.


    Well, the functionality is a more generic, fully digital connector. As I understand it, the port can now be configured specifically for functionality since it is more generic (of course, this may also require more backend support from Apple as well.)


     


    Like Thunderbolt, this is a new direction for connections that won't be fully utilized until it gets released and developers begin exploring the possibilities. Maybe you can question the timing, but unfortunately, it is also a case that until you actually release it in a real shipping product, developers aren't going to start working on products for it. I understand that it sucks that Apple has removed the analog outputs, but their D-A has only been passable at best, and most consumer electronics companies are moving more and more to digital connections between audio and video peripherals.


     


    Moving analog out of a digital connector is a big deal in many ways - reducing engineering complexity due to reducing the need to shelter analog signals from digital signals and digital transmission technologies that are a part of all wireless devices.


     


    I am excited by the Lightning connector although I do believe it will take time before we truly see people exploiting the advantages it brings.

  • Reply 28 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by DeeGee48 View Post



    Second, you could run them off the drive if it had it's own battery; therefore not sucking juice from the device. And I was thinking more of the iPad anyway, not the iPhone (more oomph).


     


    Actually, with the Camera Kit with the SD slot, I just use SD cards. Power requirements are a lot less ...

  • Reply 29 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by DeeGee48 View Post



    Ooooh, devices like a pocket HD full of our DVD's?!




    Apple (and shareholders) would prefer you pay more to get an iDevice with more storage. Phone company would prefer you use the cloud or Air Video.

  • Reply 30 of 45
    The iPad was not the only device capable of USB hosting. the iPhone 4 can also. I connected a usb keyboard to my phone.

    The new dock connector is pretty sweet, I am a hardware developer for it so I have access to the documents. However I cannot share any information about it. But I will say that the features it has now are not new as the phones and iPads have had the same functionally on the 30 pin dock connector. They just work a little differently.
  • Reply 31 of 45
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    vaelian wrote: »
    A jailbroken iPhone is no longer providing the Apple experience. .

    That's quite misleading.

    I had to jailbreak my phone to get MMS working on StraightTalk and I haven't noticed that I'm missing anything. I can still buy apps from the Apple Store and run all of my existing apps. If I want to upgrade to iOS 6, I simply restore iOS 5 onto the device and upgrade it.

    So what part of the Apple experience am I missing?
  • Reply 32 of 45
    vaelian wrote: »
    Where did you hear that?

    38m:20s.
  • Reply 33 of 45
    The previous dock connector could already do all of this. This is not news.

    How do you think previous devices connected via the dock connector? USB.

    If you look around, you can find quite a few accessories that use the dock connector, such as MIDI keyboards / controllers. Those all connect via USB, just using the dock connector instead of a standard USB plug.
  • Reply 34 of 45
    Well, I can see the signs stating "iPod, Internet, mobile phone and one more thing... " Looks like we get rid of the desk- and laptops altogether. Dock the phone on your terminal client. I miss Jobs, but still love watching Apple.
  • Reply 35 of 45
    jragosta wrote: »
    That's quite misleading.

    I had to jailbreak my phone to get MMS working on StraightTalk and I haven't noticed that I'm missing anything. I can still buy apps from the Apple Store and run all of my existing apps. If I want to upgrade to iOS 6, I simply restore iOS 5 onto the device and upgrade it.

    So what part of the Apple experience am I missing?

    Not missing anything doesn't mean you're using the hardware the way Apple intended to. The point of the jailbreak is t add, not to remove functionality, but the moment you start using a jailbroken implementation as argument your point has been invalidated because the jailbreak does not express Apple's intentions whereas the stock firmware does, and those intentions were my argument.

    elehcdn wrote: »
    Well, the functionality is a more generic, fully digital connector. As I understand it, the port can now be configured specifically for functionality since it is more generic (of course, this may also require more backend support from Apple as well.)

    Dude, the old port was just as generic as this one, everything you can do with a digital port you could already do with the Dock Connector, but the analog stuff you could output from the Dock Connector is no longer available, neither is the RS-232 port. This is a disadvantage because it makes the development of new accessories a lot less trivial.as now you have to stream stuff through USB that previously you got from analog pins for free, unless there is a way to make the connector output analog signals somehow, but with so few conductors, I seriously doubt it, especially since the adapter does not support those things.

    Until I see composite, component, HDMI, RS-232, and analog audio adapters for the new connector, I will remain skeptical about this.
  • Reply 36 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post





    That's quite misleading.

    I had to jailbreak my phone to get MMS working on StraightTalk and I haven't noticed that I'm missing anything. I can still buy apps from the Apple Store and run all of my existing apps. If I want to upgrade to iOS 6, I simply restore iOS 5 onto the device and upgrade it.

    So what part of the Apple experience am I missing?[/quote]

    Not missing anything doesn't mean you're using the hardware the way Apple intended to. The point of the jailbreak is t add, not to remove functionality, but the moment you start using a jailbroken implementation as argument your point has been invalidated because the jailbreak does not express Apple's intentions whereas the stock firmware does, and those intentions were my argument.

    Dude, the old port was just as generic as this one, everything you can do with a digital port you could already do with the Dock Connector, but the analog stuff you could output from the Dock Connector is no longer available, neither is the RS-232 port. This is a disadvantage because it makes the development of new accessories a lot less trivial.as now you have to stream stuff through USB that previously you got from analog pins for free, unless there is a way to make the connector output analog signals somehow, but with so few conductors, I seriously doubt it, especially since the adapter does not support those things.

    Until I see composite, component, HDMI, RS-232, and analog audio adapters for the new connector, I will remain skeptical about this.


    ... and my point was that in a comparison to the competition, many Android phones have to be rooted just to get basic functionality and reliability. I agree that I am working outside of Apple's design, but the jailbreaking community is providing a very stable experience. I look at jailbreaking as a situation similar to Red Hat and Centos - Red Hat knows that Centos exists and actually condones their experimentation to be able to field test extending the operating system without having to support possibly unstable releases to the general public. It's not that they don't want to offer the functionality, as much as they don't want to support it in experimental stages.


     


    As far as the digital port, because it is a more intelligent port, the possibilities of using it in different configurations is greater. Sorry, but everything, including consumer electronics is moving away from analog signals. To carry it would simply provide legacy support for standards that are quickly disappearing with the convergence of the consumer media marketplace.


     


    I expect that when the iTV comes out, we will see that the dock connector will allow for remote control as well as signal transmission, and possibly more interactive ability. 


     


    Actually, thinking about it, I have to wonder if Lightning will become a "hub" technology like Thunderbolt ...

  • Reply 37 of 45
    Do you really think its an 8 pin( ground) connector by chance? What other digital connector uses 8 pins and will be standard in the future? Duh USB 3!
    Apple updated the connector to be able to use USB 3 in the future.
  • Reply 38 of 45
    mytdave wrote: »
    An early picture of the 'Lightning' cable showed a chip in it, so yea, I'm guessing that is the case.

    That chip could be relatively dumb. It might just be the easiest way to fork the pins for the reversible plug since the plug has 8 pins on each side and the device only has the 8 straight pins on one side.

    They could add an additional level of sophistication to the chip to have it identify itself to the device so even if you don't have the other end plugged in the device will know that it's a USB-to-Lightening cable, but I don't think that's needed.

    The real sophistication comes with the adaptive port that can use those same pins to do what 30 pins did in the past... and more. I even read yesterday they will have an HDMI and VGA cable coming which seems most likely to be signal processing on the device itself. That's impressive!
  • Reply 39 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post



    Dude, the old port was just as generic as this one, everything you can do with a digital port you could already do with the Dock Connector, but the analog stuff you could output from the Dock Connector is no longer available, neither is the RS-232 port. 


     


         The serial port is still there, it just works differently.

  • Reply 40 of 45

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post





    Not missing anything doesn't mean you're using the hardware the way Apple intended to. The point of the jailbreak is t add, not to remove functionality, but the moment you start using a jailbroken implementation as argument your point has been invalidated because the jailbreak does not express Apple's intentions whereas the stock firmware does, and those intentions were my argument.

    Dude, the old port was just as generic as this one, everything you can do with a digital port you could already do with the Dock Connector, but the analog stuff you could output from the Dock Connector is no longer available, neither is the RS-232 port. This is a disadvantage because it makes the development of new accessories a lot less trivial.as now you have to stream stuff through USB that previously you got from analog pins for free, unless there is a way to make the connector output analog signals somehow, but with so few conductors, I seriously doubt it, especially since the adapter does not support those things.

    Until I see composite, component, HDMI, RS-232, and analog audio adapters for the new connector, I will remain skeptical about this.


     


    Do you enjoy eating sour grapes? 


     


    The old port was dated. You really think technology hasn't changed in 10 years? The old port was large and easily damaged, as well. 


     


    Did you complain when Apple dropped serial ports on their computers? How about the floppy disk? 


     


    New technology is always slightly painful at first, as it isn't as convenient right away and can't be used with all the accessories you've accumulated over the years. But that passes with time. Would you rather be stuck in the past?


     


    Complaining about the lack of analog output is pretty dumb. If you absolutely need to stay in the past, don't upgrade. Your current device will continue to work. Or you could follow industry trends and start doing things wirelessly. An Apple AV cable was $50. And AppleTV (which is FAR more useful and convenient) is only $50 more. If you can afford an iPhone 5, I think you can afford an AppleTV (which is nearly as portable as the cable set; it's the size of a hockey puck).


     


    Technology advances, and over the next few months and years, we'll likely see more clearly the benefits of the new port. While uncomfortable in the short term, sometimes you have to (in my best Edward James Olmos impression) roll the hard six. 


     


    Sheesh, you've been posting these complaints over and over since the announcement. Does it really affect you that much? If so, do you need to be an early adopter on the iPhone 5? 

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