I agree with this. There was a time when getting around the site was quick and easy. While I haveno trouble navigating the site, I know plenty of people that do.
just curious why you think people have a hard time navigating the site. To me it seems a lot easier than most retail websites I've used.
Amazon website works because Amazon is an online warehouse/catalog. They aren't in the business of advertising their products, since they don't have any of their own products to sell, except the Kindle.
Apple's site exists to sell their products only. However, the same "rich" interface exists for the sale of books, apps, music, which I think is a hindrance. No question, Apple needs to improve both.
I find the website to be a mess. Finding relevant accessories is painful, the line between the store and website is blurred and runs you in circles, some items don't list prices (OS X Server), but instead send you to the app store, reliability is poor.
Likewise, Express Pickup isn't, and Express Checkout is slow, murky, or ineffective depending on your perspective.
On the plus side, you can actually get useful information such as dimensions and weights that other stores (such as Amazon) often leave out.
All it means is that it is an area Apple can (and presumably will) improve in. Hopefully their next retail chief can better integrate things.
Perhaps Apple's online store experience has gone down, but I don't feel Amazon's is superior at all. I often find myself confused and lost on that site. Not easy to browse, you need to know what you're looking for. When you find something, details are scattered on the page. It isn't sectioned off very well. I prefer sites like Newegg and Sonic Electronix. But hey, I'm just one amoeba in a sea of creatures.
I agree Amazon's site is terrible and has been for years. I don't know why they haven't attempted to make it easier to navigate? What they have on their side is the sheer variety of products including many products you can't buy in stores. Also over the holidays they're free shipping on most items was a huge benefit.
Only way Apple's rank could improve is if they magically had their product appear on your front door right as your order it...
That will never happens, Amazon it's in a good standing economically so they don't need to merge with anyone. The one that I would like Apple to buy its Blackberry that is almost dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
Probably the only benefit would be patents and whatever contracts Blackberry still has with businesses.
Apple's site exists to sell their products only. However, the same "rich" interface exists for the sale of books, apps, music, which I think is a hindrance. No question, Apple needs to improve both.
Selling Apple's products requires building the ecosystem around them. For one customer, the skin might make the iPhone, and another the stand is what sells the iPad, or the software is what sells the Mac.
For me, the Humanscale M8 is an absolute necessity for an iMac; for someone else it might be different. Not offering these things through the Apple web store is silly. The stuff gets drop-shipped anyway!
You act like one offensive jerk who does not seem to understand reality. Brainwashed by spending too much time with Apple? I guess so. Stop being blind pundit.
It happens that I have been with Apple products much longer than iPhone and iPad exists (my first iPod was 2nd gen and at that time I ran Mac OS X and OS 9 home).
However I always now find that Amazon is way better experience in shopping than Apple for number of reasons. One of them is the fact that when I submit review somewhat negative I get a call or e-mail within 2 hours to straigthen the issue. Have we ever get that from Apple? Also I can easily search for products that I need rather than products that company wants to sell to me. And currently Apple wants to promote iPad and iPhone while I may be looking for some display or Mac Pro. Yes I know how to find it with number of clicks, but not everybody does. Similarily, Apple forgets naming iLife its name and sells them as separate apps for number of months even not calling them iLife on their web site (it used to be different) and then correcting this, but people wonder if their computer breaks are they eligible for iLife rebuild (models 2011)... or not as there is no iLife... or there is, but branded differently and apps are separate.
Things like that confuse customers and there is no clear vision in Apple online store.
Also I would add regular Apple Stores to dropping in quality. I walk to major one in state of NJ where I live and I stray as much as I want looking for some specific technical help, but no help. I can only play with all that equipment that I already know or I am not interested in. I waste 15-30 minutes untill geek comes to me... and he cannot answer my tech question sending me somewhere else. So what quality is this?
So instead of being blind and offending people of being from different camp (while they may be not) listen, watch so you will learn about facts.
On top of this many Apple products are overpriced due to licensing and patenting madness rather than to actual cost of manufacturing so Amazan offers knockoffs and sometimes they even work the same way as original once from Apple? How is this possible? Not all merchandise fell of the truck. Com'n.
It lost it's super simple point and click feature of old. Plus, I miss the RECENTLY ADDED section that was in the upper right hand corner. It was nice to use that on a release day to see if anything else like an Airport had an update.
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
I find it very offensive. How many companies did you work for that you have this kind of conclusions? I happen to work with 12 so I can write a book on mergers, take overs, leaving, consulting, employment, ups, downs being VP and a regular employee e.t.c. I may even write a book on offensive people who do not know first thing and base their knwoledge on popular opinions from social circles rather than facts.
The choices people make (or have to make) vary so much that you have no idea. Talented people sometimes stay long... very long and you will not understand why unless you get more life experience.
You act like one offensive jerk who does not seem to understand reality. Brainwashed by spending too much time with Apple? I guess so. Stop being blind pundit. ... So instead of being blind and offending people of being from different camp (while they may be not) listen, watch so you will learn about facts.
On top of this many Apple products are overpriced due to licensing and patenting madness rather than to actual cost of manufacturing so Amazan offers knockoffs and sometimes they even work the same way as original once from Apple? How is this possible? Not all merchandise fell of the truck. Com'n.
You sort of undermine any point you might have had when you wrap it in "political" statements that have no bearing on the subject. All your post tells us is that you wanted to vent some of your anger against Apple, most of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
I find it very offensive. How many companies did you work for that you have this kind of conclusions? I happen to work with 12 so I can write a book on mergers, take overs, leaving, consulting, employment, ups, downs being VP and a regular employee e.t.c. I may even write a book on offensive people who do not know first thing and base their knwoledge on popular opinions from social circles rather than facts.
The choices people make (or have to make) vary so much that you have no idea. Talented people sometimes stay long... very long and you will not understand why unless you get more life experience.
Ok, you still work at RIM and you're offended, we get it.
I agree Amazon's site is terrible and has been for years. I don't know why they haven't attempted to make it easier to navigate?
Familiarity breeds satisfaction. The site can be the biggest pain in the world but folks have adjusted to it. Change it and they have to relearn it. Which immediately makes it 'harder'
Same as when Microsoft changed from the start menu to the start screen, etc.
Apples site is easier than before. For the common person. It's more step by step, or question at a time. And that's the issue. Before it was us, the techno geeks, that went to the site. We didn't need human assistance we just wanted our stuff. The site was terrible but we are the folks that figured out Mac OS etc before there were books, lynda.com and so forth. We relished the challenge. And grew accustomed to it.
Now traffic in stores is insane and they can't snap fingers and fix it. So they need an online store that isn't so scary. But it means what we know is gone and we are hampered with the traffic jam of more steps. We lash against this. Same as iOS being too common, same as iOS like features being put in Mac OS. We are 'losing' are exclusive stomping ground piece by piece.
I always find it amusing that when people want to criticize Apple they need to tell us how long they've been using their products and how many Apple devices they own or have owned in the past. And usually the ones that complain the loudest are the ones that claim they own the most Apple devices. I guess it confuses me that people who dislike Apple so much would own so many of their products.
I don't find Apple's site all that confusing, it's certainly more simple than Amazon or eBay - and I don't find those confusing, either. Just a bit...chaotic, sometimes.
This must have more to do with frustration over delayed shipping, etc.
I always find it amusing that when people want to criticize Apple they need to tell us how long they've been using their products and how many Apple devices they own or have owned in the past. And usually the ones that complain the loudest are the ones that claim they own the most Apple devices. I guess it confuses me that people who dislike Apple so much would own so many of their products.
I don't find that strange at all. I'll complain long and hard if I think Apple is slipping in any way. In my opinion, anyone who says they care about Apple should be the first one to let Apple know that there is a problem.
I don't find that strange at all. I'll complain long and hard if I think Apple is slipping in any way. In my opinion, anyone who says they care about Apple should be the first one to let Apple know that there is a problem.
Well, but, almost without exception, no one who isn't planning to bash Apple in their post states things like, "I own 3 of every Apple product ever released."
It's done to inoculate themselves from being accused of trolling. "How can I be a troll if I own all these Apple products?" It's a variation of concern trolling.
I agree Amazon's site is terrible and has been for years. I don't know why they haven't attempted to make it easier to navigate? What they have on their side is the sheer variety of products including many products you can't buy in stores. Also over the holidays they're free shipping on most items was a huge benefit.
Only way Apple's rank could improve is if they magically had their product appear on your front door right as your order it...
I ordered a Refurb MBP 13" on Dec. 17th. Apple shipped it to me for FREE PRIORITY OVERNIGHT on Dec. 19th and it arrived late Dec. 20th. What company does this but maybe Zappos.com?
The only real problem I had with the purchase was trying to get the AppleCare and One-to-One both in the order. Once you added one, the other disappeared from the list of options. Other than that, my only dissatisfying experience of the whole process was the box it came in. I know refurbished don't include the nice shinny Apple Boxes, but this one looked like it had come from and Ebay seller. I've had better packaging from Dell.
I agree with others, the APPLE BRAND accessories are not intuitive to find, they kind of lump them in with other 3rd party accessories...like the Airports and the Thunderbolt Display. They should have their own tab at the top. They also moved the Apple TV from the iPod section to a small bit of text at the top of the left-hand bar reading "Popular Accessories". So now Apple thinks the ATV is just another accessory? That's Odd, could mean something in the future to come but who knows.
Comments
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
Apple's site exists to sell their products only. However, the same "rich" interface exists for the sale of books, apps, music, which I think is a hindrance. No question, Apple needs to improve both.
Likewise, Express Pickup isn't, and Express Checkout is slow, murky, or ineffective depending on your perspective.
On the plus side, you can actually get useful information such as dimensions and weights that other stores (such as Amazon) often leave out.
All it means is that it is an area Apple can (and presumably will) improve in. Hopefully their next retail chief can better integrate things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by emig647
Perhaps Apple's online store experience has gone down, but I don't feel Amazon's is superior at all. I often find myself confused and lost on that site. Not easy to browse, you need to know what you're looking for. When you find something, details are scattered on the page. It isn't sectioned off very well. I prefer sites like Newegg and Sonic Electronix. But hey, I'm just one amoeba in a sea of creatures.
I agree Amazon's site is terrible and has been for years. I don't know why they haven't attempted to make it easier to navigate? What they have on their side is the sheer variety of products including many products you can't buy in stores. Also over the holidays they're free shipping on most items was a huge benefit.
Only way Apple's rank could improve is if they magically had their product appear on your front door right as your order it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by maclancer
That will never happens, Amazon it's in a good standing economically so they don't need to merge with anyone. The one that I would like Apple to buy its Blackberry that is almost dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
Probably the only benefit would be patents and whatever contracts Blackberry still has with businesses.
Both could be huge for Apple.
Selling Apple's products requires building the ecosystem around them. For one customer, the skin might make the iPhone, and another the stand is what sells the iPad, or the software is what sells the Mac.
For me, the Humanscale M8 is an absolute necessity for an iMac; for someone else it might be different. Not offering these things through the Apple web store is silly. The stuff gets drop-shipped anyway!
You act like one offensive jerk who does not seem to understand reality. Brainwashed by spending too much time with Apple? I guess so. Stop being blind pundit.
It happens that I have been with Apple products much longer than iPhone and iPad exists (my first iPod was 2nd gen and at that time I ran Mac OS X and OS 9 home).
However I always now find that Amazon is way better experience in shopping than Apple for number of reasons. One of them is the fact that when I submit review somewhat negative I get a call or e-mail within 2 hours to straigthen the issue. Have we ever get that from Apple? Also I can easily search for products that I need rather than products that company wants to sell to me. And currently Apple wants to promote iPad and iPhone while I may be looking for some display or Mac Pro. Yes I know how to find it with number of clicks, but not everybody does. Similarily, Apple forgets naming iLife its name and sells them as separate apps for number of months even not calling them iLife on their web site (it used to be different) and then correcting this, but people wonder if their computer breaks are they eligible for iLife rebuild (models 2011)... or not as there is no iLife... or there is, but branded differently and apps are separate.
Things like that confuse customers and there is no clear vision in Apple online store.
Also I would add regular Apple Stores to dropping in quality. I walk to major one in state of NJ where I live and I stray as much as I want looking for some specific technical help, but no help. I can only play with all that equipment that I already know or I am not interested in. I waste 15-30 minutes untill geek comes to me... and he cannot answer my tech question sending me somewhere else. So what quality is this?
So instead of being blind and offending people of being from different camp (while they may be not) listen, watch so you will learn about facts.
On top of this many Apple products are overpriced due to licensing and patenting madness rather than to actual cost of manufacturing so Amazan offers knockoffs and sometimes they even work the same way as original once from Apple? How is this possible? Not all merchandise fell of the truck. Com'n.
Plus, I miss the RECENTLY ADDED section that was in the upper right hand corner. It was nice to use that on a release day to see if anything else like an Airport had an update.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
I find it very offensive. How many companies did you work for that you have this kind of conclusions? I happen to work with 12 so I can write a book on mergers, take overs, leaving, consulting, employment, ups, downs being VP and a regular employee e.t.c. I may even write a book on offensive people who do not know first thing and base their knwoledge on popular opinions from social circles rather than facts.
The choices people make (or have to make) vary so much that you have no idea. Talented people sometimes stay long... very long and you will not understand why unless you get more life experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciekskontakt
@blitz1
You act like one offensive jerk who does not seem to understand reality. Brainwashed by spending too much time with Apple? I guess so. Stop being blind pundit. ... So instead of being blind and offending people of being from different camp (while they may be not) listen, watch so you will learn about facts.
On top of this many Apple products are overpriced due to licensing and patenting madness rather than to actual cost of manufacturing so Amazan offers knockoffs and sometimes they even work the same way as original once from Apple? How is this possible? Not all merchandise fell of the truck. Com'n.
You sort of undermine any point you might have had when you wrap it in "political" statements that have no bearing on the subject. All your post tells us is that you wanted to vent some of your anger against Apple, most of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciekskontakt
I find it very offensive. How many companies did you work for that you have this kind of conclusions? I happen to work with 12 so I can write a book on mergers, take overs, leaving, consulting, employment, ups, downs being VP and a regular employee e.t.c. I may even write a book on offensive people who do not know first thing and base their knwoledge on popular opinions from social circles rather than facts.
The choices people make (or have to make) vary so much that you have no idea. Talented people sometimes stay long... very long and you will not understand why unless you get more life experience.
Ok, you still work at RIM and you're offended, we get it.
14th is a good rating considering the number of online companies.
Still, it is a serious bump down from last year's rating and one more thing that gets read in the news as a negative towards Apple.
Tim better get someone on this because the last thing he wants is for this rating to do go down even further next year.
... and I agree... this probably has a lot to do with wait times.
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
We know this already after TS pointed us to the extra click needed to choose a MBP model, and that was months ago. Months I tell ya!
Ha! I totally forgot about that. And all joking aside, that is probably part of this.
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Do you think talented people are still there? Usually the smartest ones get out first.
Well, I think talented patents are still there.
Familiarity breeds satisfaction. The site can be the biggest pain in the world but folks have adjusted to it. Change it and they have to relearn it. Which immediately makes it 'harder'
Same as when Microsoft changed from the start menu to the start screen, etc.
Apples site is easier than before. For the common person. It's more step by step, or question at a time. And that's the issue. Before it was us, the techno geeks, that went to the site. We didn't need human assistance we just wanted our stuff. The site was terrible but we are the folks that figured out Mac OS etc before there were books, lynda.com and so forth. We relished the challenge. And grew accustomed to it.
Now traffic in stores is insane and they can't snap fingers and fix it. So they need an online store that isn't so scary. But it means what we know is gone and we are hampered with the traffic jam of more steps. We lash against this. Same as iOS being too common, same as iOS like features being put in Mac OS. We are 'losing' are exclusive stomping ground piece by piece.
I don't find Apple's site all that confusing, it's certainly more simple than Amazon or eBay - and I don't find those confusing, either. Just a bit...chaotic, sometimes.
This must have more to do with frustration over delayed shipping, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
I always find it amusing that when people want to criticize Apple they need to tell us how long they've been using their products and how many Apple devices they own or have owned in the past. And usually the ones that complain the loudest are the ones that claim they own the most Apple devices. I guess it confuses me that people who dislike Apple so much would own so many of their products.
I don't find that strange at all. I'll complain long and hard if I think Apple is slipping in any way. In my opinion, anyone who says they care about Apple should be the first one to let Apple know that there is a problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit
I don't find that strange at all. I'll complain long and hard if I think Apple is slipping in any way. In my opinion, anyone who says they care about Apple should be the first one to let Apple know that there is a problem.
Well, but, almost without exception, no one who isn't planning to bash Apple in their post states things like, "I own 3 of every Apple product ever released."
It's done to inoculate themselves from being accused of trolling. "How can I be a troll if I own all these Apple products?" It's a variation of concern trolling.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook
I agree Amazon's site is terrible and has been for years. I don't know why they haven't attempted to make it easier to navigate? What they have on their side is the sheer variety of products including many products you can't buy in stores. Also over the holidays they're free shipping on most items was a huge benefit.
Only way Apple's rank could improve is if they magically had their product appear on your front door right as your order it...
I ordered a Refurb MBP 13" on Dec. 17th. Apple shipped it to me for FREE PRIORITY OVERNIGHT on Dec. 19th and it arrived late Dec. 20th. What company does this but maybe Zappos.com?
The only real problem I had with the purchase was trying to get the AppleCare and One-to-One both in the order. Once you added one, the other disappeared from the list of options. Other than that, my only dissatisfying experience of the whole process was the box it came in. I know refurbished don't include the nice shinny Apple Boxes, but this one looked like it had come from and Ebay seller. I've had better packaging from Dell.
I agree with others, the APPLE BRAND accessories are not intuitive to find, they kind of lump them in with other 3rd party accessories...like the Airports and the Thunderbolt Display. They should have their own tab at the top. They also moved the Apple TV from the iPod section to a small bit of text at the top of the left-hand bar reading "Popular Accessories". So now Apple thinks the ATV is just another accessory? That's Odd, could mean something in the future to come but who knows.