I don't mind plastic. It's quality plastic. It is a quality product.
Logically, they'd can the iPod Touch and just add a phone receiver and price it for another £100 at the low end and another £150-ish at the high end. Children and teens would have a great phone...in alu colours. The 5C is in some ways bemusing.
The iPod touch is the best designed mobile product they have. It's slim, beautiful and trumps even the 5S design. The Touch is light and curved alu back. For me, it's a far better design.
You'd have phones in the £200-£350 range.
How much would it cost to add a phone receiver to the iPod Touch? No, seriously, I'm asking. Anyone know?
Lemon Bon Bon.
Firstly you are right about the touch. It is fantastic. Extremely light. Looks great.
To add a 3G radio chip needs a bigger battery which needs a redesign of the chassis as would the new antenna. So not so easy.
The problem with this reasoning is simple - it doesn't explain why Apple didn't continue with the old strategy and created two models. Despite what you say the two models strategy is not the same at all - for instance the iPhone 5S will be updated as long as the 5S is with new OS releases. As the release is the same year.
Clearly apple expected higher sales from this, hence the cut in orders. Would orders have to be cut were the iPhone 5 C $200 cheaper than the 5S. Probably not.
If the high price of the 5C is driving higher than expected 5S sales apple will be happy enough for now, for Christmas and Chinese New Years. They can offer discounts in
Feb.
However unless these reports are wrong Apple miscalculated, and having too much inventory in the Channel is not a good thing.
Why did they miscalculate? That should be the question bug it seems critics if the price were correct v
"The problem with this reasoning is simple - it doesn't explain why Apple didn't continue with the old strategy and created two models. Despite what you say the two models strategy is not the same at all - for instance the iPhone 5S will be updated as long as the 5S is with new OS releases. As the release is the same year."
They did.
They just wanted to say the new phone will come in different colours...anything wrong??
"Clearly apple expected higher sales from this, hence the cut in orders. Would orders have to be cut were the iPhone 5 C $200 cheaper than the 5S. Probably not."
It's $99 on contract.
You want them to give you $101 for taking it??Why??It isn't that bad....
Firstly you are right about the touch. It is fantastic. Extremely light. Looks great.
To add a 3G radio chip needs a bigger battery which needs a redesign of the chassis as would the new antenna. Do not so easy.
Aye. It's a classy design alright.
But design wise it's very similar to the 5C except it's slimmer and in alu. There's not a massive difference in size...but the touch is more svelte, yes...and it is noticeable.
You could argue the iPhone is just a touch with a phone chipset and antenna.
The question is. How much would it cost to add one to the Touch? If the Touch costs £199 or £250 for the low end or mid range options.
Would it cost £150s to add an antenna to the entry model? Would it cost £100 to add an antenna and phone chipset to the mid range model?
I'm just curious. How much do these parts cost.
Obviously, Apple isn't going to make a £99 phone and make any money out of it? But with the debate being about the iPhone 5C being price contentious in plastic at that...how much of a discount could Apple make?
Remember when Steve Jobs dropped the price of the original iPhone?
Perhaps by lopping off £100 off the UK price would make a huge difference. £350 isn't cheap. But it's far more reasonable than £465 for last year's phone.
...if they can make a 4S at £350 why not the 5C?
I guess if they bring out the 'Maxi' iPhone next year...I wonder if it will push the 5C and 5S into more affordable price brackets?
The 5C in a year's time may look a far better deal if they keep the spec but drop it into the 4S position at £350?
WSJ. Enough said. A tiny bit better than Digitimes. Anything sourced from this is not worth a discussion IMO.
The same Wall Street Journal that reported in January that Apple was cutting iPhone 5 production because of weak demand. How'd that story turn out (other than driving Apple's stock price down). This always happens when we get close to an earnings call.
So far none of these rumors have negatively impacted the stock. Even today the stock is up a bit in pre market trading. Even if this WSJ story is true we don't know if it's because of weak sales or something Apple planned all along. Maybe there's plenty of 5C in the channel to meet demand so they're switching production to the 5S. Or maybe there were supply constraints with the 5S that no longer exist so they're ramping up production of that to meet demand. We don't know. And posing umpteen articles about it doesn't make any sense because there's no new information to add to the conversation.
"The problem with this reasoning is simple - it doesn't explain why Apple didn't continue with the old strategy and created two models. Despite what you say the two models strategy is not the same at all - for instance the iPhone 5S will be updated as long as the 5S is with new OS releases. As the release is the same year." They did.
They just wanted to say the new phone will come in different colours...anything wrong??
"Clearly apple expected higher sales from this, hence the cut in orders. Would orders have to be cut were the iPhone 5 C $200 cheaper than the 5S. Probably not." It's $99 on contract. You want them to give you $101 for taking it??Why??It isn't that bad....
I have no idea what you are doing here. You quoted my entire post then used your own quoting system and even allowing for that its still unreadable and/or nonsensical. The iPhone 5C does not sell for $99 - the contract price is not the price of the device.
Now people dont hang yourself on the numbers they are just for demo purposes to quantify instead of looking at percentages that dont say much:
But apple could have sold 3M 5S units and 9 million 5C units instead of 2,5M 5S units and 1M 5C units (per time sequence). That is if Apple had decided it was happy with the same margin as iphone 5 and not increase their margin like they did. Now many just bought the Samsung galaxy line of products to save 100-200 Euros. That is just a fact at least here in Europe.
Only Apple tech gets more valuable as time passes...
This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'.
What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?
What it also says it that there is little reason to buy the 5C. Which is evidently true if the newspaper is to be believed and production is being cut back.
BTW, the touch id is pretty cool, but I find it's rejecting my fingerprints more often after a week or so of use. Initially it was spot on.
"This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'."
Err No. You obviously don't know how retailing, especially premium products, are marketed and sold. Why do you think BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche, Ferrari etc. all have more affordable models? It's to entice would be customers into their showrooms, with the objective of moving the customers to the more upmarket Models....LOL
"What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?"
Yes, of course, very seriously. According to Canaccord Genuity's survey of the 4 largest US carriers, BOTH the iPhone 5S and 5C are outselling the the Galaxy S4.
Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should not make and sell 5C model, which OUTSELLS their main competitor's best selling model?....LOL
The fact is that Apple make a far higher margins on the 5C than Samsung's makes on the Galaxy S4. In September Samsung had to start heavily discounting the Galaxy S4 in order to try and compete (unsuccessfully) with the new iPhones.
If Apple is selling 2 to 3 times more of their flagship, state of the art 5S than the 5C, then that means altogether Apple's nrew model iPhones are outselling their main rival Galaxy S4 by 3 or 4 times. - Yep that really is a lousy strategy NOT.
They should have either gave it the 64 bit SoC or made it another $100 bucks cheaper. I would have gone the 64bit route.
Ok so say its $200 cheaper and you pay $50/mo for your phone (likely more).
5S 24 months: $1399 (199 on contract)
5C 24 months: $1200 (free on contract)
Ignoring aluminum vs plastic, look at what that %15 increase gets you:
Much improved low light camera with two-tone LED flash
Slow motion video (oh man is this fun)
64-bit CPU 2x perf over 5C
New GPU 2x perf over 5C
M7
TouchID
Why not pop for the badass model? I think to make the 5C attractive they need to push the price even lower for off-contract or for countries where phones are not subsidized.
"This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'."
Err No. You obviously don't know how retailing, especially premium products, are marketed and sold. Why do you think BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche, Ferrari etc. all have more affordable models? It's to entice would be customers into their showrooms, with the objective of moving the customers to the more upmarket Models....LOL
"What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?"
Yes, of course, very seriously. According to Canaccord Genuity's survey of the 4 largest US carriers, BOTH the iPhone 5S and 5C are outselling the the Galaxy S4.
Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should not make and sell 5C model, which OUTSELLS their main competitor's best selling model?....LOL
The fact is that Apple make a far higher margins on the 5C than Samsung's makes on the Galaxy S4. In September Samsung had to start heavily discounting the Galaxy S4 in order to try and compete (unsuccessfully) with the new iPhones.
If Apple is selling 2 to 3 times more of their flagship, state of the art 5S than the 5C, then that means altogether Apple's nrew model iPhones are outselling their main rival Galaxy S4 by 3 or 4 times. - Yep that really is a lousy strategy NOT.
Hey, I've got no problems about the 5C selling well. If you believe the reports it's not selling nearly as well as expected. Hence production being cut back.
The only issue I have is with the reasoning you offered. There's zero reason why Apple introduced what is essentially a new product line as a draw to sell the premium model. Clearly Apple thought this model would squeeze gangbusters sales from old hardware. It seems the reality is not the case. Otherwise they would have done the same thing they did last year and repackage last year's model, in the same form factor, with a fixed capacity.
I still submit your reasoning is flawed. Apple doesn't display its feathers as an inducement to buy another of its products instead. It wants you to buy as many of whatever it is offering as possible.
In the Apple online store for the USA I see the following: - 4s: All options available to ship in 24 hours - 5c: All options available to ship in 24 hours - 5s: All options available to ship in 2 - 3 weeks
If these shipping times apply to other markets, then, yeah, Apple probably wants to shift production to make more of the 5s. Duh.
Just because everyone is reporting the same rumor doesn't make the rumor true. The media, especially when it comes to Apple is a bit of an echo chamber. Especially if the rumors are negative, they fall over each other to be the first to report it.
Are we talking about the same Wall Street Journal that wrote about Apple cutting orders for parts due to weak demand for the iPhone 5 last year? Last year, it was right before earnings as well. Of course, it turned out to be false. This is nothing more than an attempt to manipulate the price of the stock before earnings. Tim Cook then at the earnings call said you can't predict what we are doing based on a few data points from our supply chain. It is funny how lots of people on this board hate analysts in all matters except negative reports concerning the iPhone 5C perhaps because it supports their dislike for the phone.
I do not get all the hate for the iPhone 5C. It is not supposed to be as great as the 5S. It, however, is a good choice for many people. It has a better radio, Facetime camera, and improved radio then last years model at a cheaper price point. The only downside is a plastic case, which just about every other phone on the planet is made from including top phones by Samsung. Apple's top selling iBooks and iMacs used to be made from plastic as well.
Comments
Firstly you are right about the touch. It is fantastic. Extremely light. Looks great.
To add a 3G radio chip needs a bigger battery which needs a redesign of the chassis as would the new antenna. So not so easy.
Pretty sure the 32gb iPhone C has the highest margin of the bunch, so if people choose the S instead, that's going to impact their bottom line.
The problem with this reasoning is simple - it doesn't explain why Apple didn't continue with the old strategy and created two models. Despite what you say the two models strategy is not the same at all - for instance the iPhone 5S will be updated as long as the 5S is with new OS releases. As the release is the same year.
Clearly apple expected higher sales from this, hence the cut in orders. Would orders have to be cut were the iPhone 5 C $200 cheaper than the 5S. Probably not.
If the high price of the 5C is driving higher than expected 5S sales apple will be happy enough for now, for Christmas and Chinese New Years. They can offer discounts in
Feb.
However unless these reports are wrong Apple miscalculated, and having too much inventory in the Channel is not a good thing.
Why did they miscalculate? That should be the question bug it seems critics if the price were correct v
"The problem with this reasoning is simple - it doesn't explain why Apple didn't continue with the old strategy and created two models. Despite what you say the two models strategy is not the same at all - for instance the iPhone 5S will be updated as long as the 5S is with new OS releases. As the release is the same year."
They did.
They just wanted to say the new phone will come in different colours...anything wrong??
"Clearly apple expected higher sales from this, hence the cut in orders. Would orders have to be cut were the iPhone 5 C $200 cheaper than the 5S. Probably not."
It's $99 on contract.
You want them to give you $101 for taking it??Why??It isn't that bad....
Firstly you are right about the touch. It is fantastic. Extremely light. Looks great.
To add a 3G radio chip needs a bigger battery which needs a redesign of the chassis as would the new antenna. Do not so easy.
Aye. It's a classy design alright.
But design wise it's very similar to the 5C except it's slimmer and in alu. There's not a massive difference in size...but the touch is more svelte, yes...and it is noticeable.
You could argue the iPhone is just a touch with a phone chipset and antenna.
The question is. How much would it cost to add one to the Touch? If the Touch costs £199 or £250 for the low end or mid range options.
Would it cost £150s to add an antenna to the entry model? Would it cost £100 to add an antenna and phone chipset to the mid range model?
I'm just curious. How much do these parts cost.
Obviously, Apple isn't going to make a £99 phone and make any money out of it? But with the debate being about the iPhone 5C being price contentious in plastic at that...how much of a discount could Apple make?
Remember when Steve Jobs dropped the price of the original iPhone?
Perhaps by lopping off £100 off the UK price would make a huge difference. £350 isn't cheap. But it's far more reasonable than £465 for last year's phone.
...if they can make a 4S at £350 why not the 5C?
I guess if they bring out the 'Maxi' iPhone next year...I wonder if it will push the 5C and 5S into more affordable price brackets?
The 5C in a year's time may look a far better deal if they keep the spec but drop it into the 4S position at £350?
Lemon Bon Bon.
http://www.vogue.com/vogue-daily/article/match-your-outfit-to-your-apple-iphone-5c/#1
Personally I dislike the front face in black. I would love if it had the same color as the back, making it with just one tone.
The price of 5c is not right.
Personally I dislike the front face in black. I would love if it had the same color as the back, making it with just one tone.
that would look ugly..
seriously I don't think even apple can make something like THAT look nice.
just my opinion
The same Wall Street Journal that reported in January that Apple was cutting iPhone 5 production because of weak demand. How'd that story turn out (other than driving Apple's stock price down). This always happens when we get close to an earnings call.
[Url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324235104578241051730364998.html][SIZE=4][B]Apple Cuts Orders for iPhone Parts[/B][/SIZE][/url]
So far none of these rumors have negatively impacted the stock. Even today the stock is up a bit in pre market trading. Even if this WSJ story is true we don't know if it's because of weak sales or something Apple planned all along. Maybe there's plenty of 5C in the channel to meet demand so they're switching production to the 5S. Or maybe there were supply constraints with the 5S that no longer exist so they're ramping up production of that to meet demand. We don't know. And posing umpteen articles about it doesn't make any sense because there's no new information to add to the conversation.
I have no idea what you are doing here. You quoted my entire post then used your own quoting system and even allowing for that its still unreadable and/or nonsensical. The iPhone 5C does not sell for $99 - the contract price is not the price of the device.
But apple could have sold 3M 5S units and 9 million 5C units instead of 2,5M 5S units and 1M 5C units (per time sequence). That is if Apple had decided it was happy with the same margin as iphone 5 and not increase their margin like they did. Now many just bought the Samsung galaxy line of products to save 100-200 Euros. That is just a fact at least here in Europe.
Only Apple tech gets more valuable as time passes...
This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'.
What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?
What it also says it that there is little reason to buy the 5C. Which is evidently true if the newspaper is to be believed and production is being cut back.
BTW, the touch id is pretty cool, but I find it's rejecting my fingerprints more often after a week or so of use. Initially it was spot on.
"This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'."
Err No. You obviously don't know how retailing, especially premium products, are marketed and sold. Why do you think BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche, Ferrari etc. all have more affordable models? It's to entice would be customers into their showrooms, with the objective of moving the customers to the more upmarket Models....LOL
"What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?"
Yes, of course, very seriously. According to Canaccord Genuity's survey of the 4 largest US carriers, BOTH the iPhone 5S and 5C are outselling the the Galaxy S4.
Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should not make and sell 5C model, which OUTSELLS their main competitor's best selling model?....LOL
The fact is that Apple make a far higher margins on the 5C than Samsung's makes on the Galaxy S4. In September Samsung had to start heavily discounting the Galaxy S4 in order to try and compete (unsuccessfully) with the new iPhones.
If Apple is selling 2 to 3 times more of their flagship, state of the art 5S than the 5C, then that means altogether Apple's nrew model iPhones are outselling their main rival Galaxy S4 by 3 or 4 times. - Yep that really is a lousy strategy NOT.
They should have either gave it the 64 bit SoC or made it another $100 bucks cheaper. I would have gone the 64bit route.
Ok so say its $200 cheaper and you pay $50/mo for your phone (likely more).
5S 24 months: $1399 (199 on contract)
5C 24 months: $1200 (free on contract)
Ignoring aluminum vs plastic, look at what that %15 increase gets you:
Why not pop for the badass model? I think to make the 5C attractive they need to push the price even lower for off-contract or for countries where phones are not subsidized.
"This reasoning is just as made up as any 'analysts'."
Err No. You obviously don't know how retailing, especially premium products, are marketed and sold. Why do you think BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Porsche, Ferrari etc. all have more affordable models? It's to entice would be customers into their showrooms, with the objective of moving the customers to the more upmarket Models....LOL
"What it says is that Apple quite happily developed tooling for, and produced, millions of 5Cs so that it would sit on shelves and entice people to buy the 5S instead. Seriously?"
Yes, of course, very seriously. According to Canaccord Genuity's survey of the 4 largest US carriers, BOTH the iPhone 5S and 5C are outselling the the Galaxy S4.
Are you seriously suggesting that Apple should not make and sell 5C model, which OUTSELLS their main competitor's best selling model?....LOL
The fact is that Apple make a far higher margins on the 5C than Samsung's makes on the Galaxy S4. In September Samsung had to start heavily discounting the Galaxy S4 in order to try and compete (unsuccessfully) with the new iPhones.
If Apple is selling 2 to 3 times more of their flagship, state of the art 5S than the 5C, then that means altogether Apple's nrew model iPhones are outselling their main rival Galaxy S4 by 3 or 4 times. - Yep that really is a lousy strategy NOT.
Hey, I've got no problems about the 5C selling well. If you believe the reports it's not selling nearly as well as expected. Hence production being cut back.
The only issue I have is with the reasoning you offered. There's zero reason why Apple introduced what is essentially a new product line as a draw to sell the premium model. Clearly Apple thought this model would squeeze gangbusters sales from old hardware. It seems the reality is not the case. Otherwise they would have done the same thing they did last year and repackage last year's model, in the same form factor, with a fixed capacity.
I still submit your reasoning is flawed. Apple doesn't display its feathers as an inducement to buy another of its products instead. It wants you to buy as many of whatever it is offering as possible.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/10/16/uk-apple-5c-idUKBRE99F08K20131016
http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/mobiles/australian-telcos-struggle-to-sell-iphone-5c-20130924-2ubc5.html
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101110056
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2013/10/15/apparently-apples-iphone-5c-is-a-failure-already/
Disappointing is a relative term but from reports it seems pretty clear that sales have not met expectations.
- 4s: All options available to ship in 24 hours
- 5c: All options available to ship in 24 hours
- 5s: All options available to ship in 2 - 3 weeks
If these shipping times apply to other markets, then, yeah, Apple probably wants to shift production to make more of the 5s. Duh.
Are we talking about the same Wall Street Journal that wrote about Apple cutting orders for parts due to weak demand for the iPhone 5 last year? Last year, it was right before earnings as well. Of course, it turned out to be false. This is nothing more than an attempt to manipulate the price of the stock before earnings. Tim Cook then at the earnings call said you can't predict what we are doing based on a few data points from our supply chain. It is funny how lots of people on this board hate analysts in all matters except negative reports concerning the iPhone 5C perhaps because it supports their dislike for the phone.
I do not get all the hate for the iPhone 5C. It is not supposed to be as great as the 5S. It, however, is a good choice for many people. It has a better radio, Facetime camera, and improved radio then last years model at a cheaper price point. The only downside is a plastic case, which just about every other phone on the planet is made from including top phones by Samsung. Apple's top selling iBooks and iMacs used to be made from plastic as well.