When did Samsung say they shipped 86 million smartphones last quarter? I'm sorry but that number is so bogus it isn't even funny. If Samsung really shipped that many phones how is it that their profits came nowhere near Apple's &13B.
I was in Target yesterday and many of the cheap prepaid phones were Samsung. The profit on those phones is close to nil.
Samsung and Apple have more or less divvied up the existing market. Mostly the rich areas of the world. All the rich peeps have their phones now and growth is growing considerably.
Samsung also took the time to deliver smartphones to the low end of the market and pretty much dominated that with little competition.
That is the market that is expanding and has the future growth (despite low margins).
Both Apple and Samsung are likely to get a beating in market share numbers this year. Apple chose not to release a product that will compete in the segment, and Samsung for the first time is going to counter serious competition. China is by far the biggest market with the most growth and the homefield teams of Huawei and Lenova are likely to just keep cleaning house.
This is pretty much right on the ball. There's two cycles the Wall St. people tend to ignore:
Carrier Upgrade cycle (2 yrs) vs Device Lifetime (7 years)
Consumer pocket depth
This is the lifetime of an iPhone:
Year 1: Original Owner
Year 2: Hand-me-down or sold to a friend
Year 3: unlocked and hocked on eBay
Year 4: Likely kept around as the Kids phone/iPod replacement/backup
Year 7: Recycled or thrown out.
Where as a Samsung phone:
Year 1: Original owner
Year 2: Original owner/Kids phone.
Year 3: Recycled or landfilled.
The cheap feature-phone replacements that are Android devices are usually not attached to Data plans, and only use WiFi, if the user is competent enough to setup WiFi. Most of these free chinese-brand phones will likely just be prepaid/burner/MVNO phones in the US and Europe. That is the "Other" in the image above.
People who want to stay cutting edge will replace their phone every 18 months on the dot. Carriers will only subsidize a phone if it's within the last 6 months of their contract. Wealthy people will replace their device whenever it's convenient to, contract or not. Everyone else in North America can't afford to replace their 1000$ smartphone every year, and are usually SOL for two years if they break the device on the first day. This is why 3 year contracts were something of a Joke in Canada, because even if you could get an iPhone or a Samsung S series, it was obsolete before the contract was up. US carriers never used to even subsidize smartphones (unless you worked for Microsoft.)
Like I'd be surprised if in 5 years that Samsung still has it's lead. Apple isn't concerned about making cheap devices, because those would be poor products nobody wants, just look at how well the 5c" did. Apple would have to seriously cripple the device to make it affordable. Samsung has more leverage in doing this since it owns more of the production line for their devices.
I'll tell it to you all from behind the (not-so-great) firewall. Those who can afford it have BOTH an iPhone and Samsung in hand or sitting on the table in front of them wherever I look. iPhone is the high end accessory to flaunt, whereas the Samsung Phablets has the, let's face it, screen real estate that people do want instead of having to squint at the lame'o screen of the iPhone (hey, I am an Apple gear whore, but I use the iPad for ALL my mobile computing needs and a POS, cheapo function phone for the basic nessessity of calling people)...that is why I gave up the iPhone, because of the shitty ass eye f---ing screen. Apple needs a wake up call in two departments: bigger phablet screen for their iPhone (or maybe a telephone functioning iPad mini) & REMOVABLE media slot ALL their superb mobile devices.
When did Samsung say they shipped 86 million smartphones last quarter? I'm sorry but that number is so bogus it isn't even funny. If Samsung really shipped that many phones how is it that their profits came nowhere near Apple's &13B.
Samsung shipped 13 million Galaxy S4 according to some report. This is far smaller than the 51 million iPhones Apple sold. You can see that the media always pick the fact they like to exaggerate and not telling you the full story.
I'll tell it to you all from behind the (not-so-great) firewall. Those who can afford it have BOTH an iPhone and Samsung in hand or sitting on the table in front of them wherever I look. iPhone is the high end accessory to flaunt, whereas the Samsung Phablets has the, let's face it, screen real estate that people do want instead of having to squint at the lame'o screen of the iPhone (hey, I am an Apple gear whore, but I use the iPad for ALL my mobile computing needs and a POS, cheapo function phone for the basic nessessity of calling people)...that is why I gave up the iPhone, because of the shitty ass eye f---ing screen. Apple needs a wake up call in two departments: bigger phablet screen for their iPhone (or maybe a telephone functioning iPad mini) & REMOVABLE media slot ALL their superb mobile devices.
But iPad is considered a replacement for the laptop. Apple has been sued for the iPhone. Because the Texas patent holder thinks he has a patent of putting the phone capability on a computer. He did not sue all the other Android phablet makers like Samsung and he lost the suit to Apple. Could Apple start putting the phone function to the iPad? Do we have a legal expert on this forum?
That logic only goes so far. If Samsung consistently shipped more than it sold, its financials would suffer. Samsung's not a money-laundering operation; they have to report to their investors.
If we never know how many of the shipped phones actually sell to a customer then there is limited value in a shipped metric. 75% of Samsung's smartphone sales are low-end (non-Galaxy). How many of those phones languish on the shelves of carriers and retailers before being discontinued and sent back to a warehouse to become warranty stock? Its not a guarantee that every shipped phone will eventually become a sold phone.
<div class="quote-container" data-huddler-embed="/t/161782/samsung-widens-lead-in-worldwide-smartphone-marketshare-smaller-oems-rising#post_2463758" data-huddler-embed-placeholder="false">Quote:<div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>Rogifan</strong> <a href="/t/161782/samsung-widens-lead-in-worldwide-smartphone-marketshare-smaller-oems-rising#post_2463758"><img alt="View Post" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" /></a><br /><br />When did Samsung say they shipped 86 million smartphones last quarter? I'm sorry but that number is so bogus it isn't even funny. If Samsung really shipped that many phones how is it that their profits came nowhere near Apple's &13B.</div></div><p>Samsung shipped 13 million Galaxy S4 according to some report. This is far smaller than the 51 million iPhones Apple sold. You can see that the media always pick the fact they like to exaggerate and not telling you the full story. </p>
Out of the 51 mil iphones maybe 50% are 5s.
Samsung also shipped something like 15mil note3 during that quarter. That's like 25 - 30mil high end phones which is more than the 5s. And this is during apple highest sales quarter.
Out of the big manufacturers apple has the lowest yoy growth which doesn't bode well for Apple.
Samsung also shipped something like 15mil note3 during that quarter. That's like 25 - 30mil high end phones which is more than the 5s. And this is during apple highest sales quarter.
Out of the big manufacturers apple has the lowest yoy growth which doesn't bode well for Apple.
No, 5S to 5C ratio is like 3 to 1. If they are equal why the street think 5C is a failure?
Samsung also shipped something like 15mil note3 during that quarter. That's like 25 - 30mil high end phones which is more than the 5s. And this is during apple highest sales quarter.
Out of the big manufacturers apple has the lowest yoy growth which doesn't bode well for Apple.
So where are the actual numbers from the other manus?
It's a bit like being the busiest restaurant in town. It doesn't mean you're the most profitable. You can be sure if Gordon Ramsay opened shop in your town and made the launch week entirely free to dine there you can only imagine how busy the restaurant would be. But a lot of money would be lost in the process. Like the way selling the most of anything doesn't make you the most profitable in your market segment. One of the exceptions probably being Coca Cola. But then, in their case there product doesn't cost any less than the competition. Once again in the phone space the company with the highest margin will make the most profit. And as usual we know who that company is. I'll be interested to see Apple's lineup this year.
The dearth of funds indicate that of the 86 million shipped, the majority that Samsung sold were cheaper, smaller low powered phones...
Comments
I was in Target yesterday and many of the cheap prepaid phones were Samsung. The profit on those phones is close to nil.
Well did you consider the iPhone 3GS a smartphone? They use tech that's a few years old but still enough to be a smartphone.
Sammy doesn't report numbers. Apple reports shipped and estimates inventory.
Who gets to decide what a smart phone is? Analysts? Marketers? There is no smart phone market, just a cellular phone market.
This is pretty much right on the ball. There's two cycles the Wall St. people tend to ignore:
Carrier Upgrade cycle (2 yrs) vs Device Lifetime (7 years)
Consumer pocket depth
This is the lifetime of an iPhone:
Year 1: Original Owner
Year 2: Hand-me-down or sold to a friend
Year 3: unlocked and hocked on eBay
Year 4: Likely kept around as the Kids phone/iPod replacement/backup
Year 7: Recycled or thrown out.
Where as a Samsung phone:
Year 1: Original owner
Year 2: Original owner/Kids phone.
Year 3: Recycled or landfilled.
The cheap feature-phone replacements that are Android devices are usually not attached to Data plans, and only use WiFi, if the user is competent enough to setup WiFi. Most of these free chinese-brand phones will likely just be prepaid/burner/MVNO phones in the US and Europe. That is the "Other" in the image above.
People who want to stay cutting edge will replace their phone every 18 months on the dot. Carriers will only subsidize a phone if it's within the last 6 months of their contract. Wealthy people will replace their device whenever it's convenient to, contract or not. Everyone else in North America can't afford to replace their 1000$ smartphone every year, and are usually SOL for two years if they break the device on the first day. This is why 3 year contracts were something of a Joke in Canada, because even if you could get an iPhone or a Samsung S series, it was obsolete before the contract was up. US carriers never used to even subsidize smartphones (unless you worked for Microsoft.)
Like I'd be surprised if in 5 years that Samsung still has it's lead. Apple isn't concerned about making cheap devices, because those would be poor products nobody wants, just look at how well the 5c" did. Apple would have to seriously cripple the device to make it affordable. Samsung has more leverage in doing this since it owns more of the production line for their devices.
When did Samsung say they shipped 86 million smartphones last quarter? I'm sorry but that number is so bogus it isn't even funny. If Samsung really shipped that many phones how is it that their profits came nowhere near Apple's &13B.
Samsung shipped 13 million Galaxy S4 according to some report. This is far smaller than the 51 million iPhones Apple sold. You can see that the media always pick the fact they like to exaggerate and not telling you the full story.
I'll tell it to you all from behind the (not-so-great) firewall. Those who can afford it have BOTH an iPhone and Samsung in hand or sitting on the table in front of them wherever I look. iPhone is the high end accessory to flaunt, whereas the Samsung Phablets has the, let's face it, screen real estate that people do want instead of having to squint at the lame'o screen of the iPhone (hey, I am an Apple gear whore, but I use the iPad for ALL my mobile computing needs and a POS, cheapo function phone for the basic nessessity of calling people)...that is why I gave up the iPhone, because of the shitty ass eye f---ing screen. Apple needs a wake up call in two departments: bigger phablet screen for their iPhone (or maybe a telephone functioning iPad mini) & REMOVABLE media slot ALL their superb mobile devices.
But iPad is considered a replacement for the laptop. Apple has been sued for the iPhone. Because the Texas patent holder thinks he has a patent of putting the phone capability on a computer. He did not sue all the other Android phablet makers like Samsung and he lost the suit to Apple. Could Apple start putting the phone function to the iPad? Do we have a legal expert on this forum?
That logic only goes so far. If Samsung consistently shipped more than it sold, its financials would suffer. Samsung's not a money-laundering operation; they have to report to their investors.
If we never know how many of the shipped phones actually sell to a customer then there is limited value in a shipped metric. 75% of Samsung's smartphone sales are low-end (non-Galaxy). How many of those phones languish on the shelves of carriers and retailers before being discontinued and sent back to a warehouse to become warranty stock? Its not a guarantee that every shipped phone will eventually become a sold phone.
Out of the 51 mil iphones maybe 50% are 5s.
Samsung also shipped something like 15mil note3 during that quarter. That's like 25 - 30mil high end phones which is more than the 5s. And this is during apple highest sales quarter.
Out of the big manufacturers apple has the lowest yoy growth which doesn't bode well for Apple.
Out of the 51 mil iphones maybe 50% are 5s.
Samsung also shipped something like 15mil note3 during that quarter. That's like 25 - 30mil high end phones which is more than the 5s. And this is during apple highest sales quarter.
Out of the big manufacturers apple has the lowest yoy growth which doesn't bode well for Apple.
No, 5S to 5C ratio is like 3 to 1. If they are equal why the street think 5C is a failure?
The 5c is a high-end phone. Its not a low-end phone in the same way that Samsung's non-Galaxy phones are low end.
No one said they’re equal. Apple sells THREE phones.
No one said they’re equal. Apple sells THREE phones.
The person I quoted said. He is called No one?
Absolutely nothing whatsoever about the iPhone 5C. He spoke of the 5S. The 5S can be 50% of the market without the 5C being 50%.
Absolutely nothing whatsoever about the iPhone 5C. He spoke of the 5S. The 5S can be 50% of the market without the 5C being 50%.
He is wrong about the 5S.
Is he? How much did it sell, then?
There's still new iPhone4's being sold, particularly by some of the pre-paids. No idea if Apple is maintaining some stock or if these are old unsold carrier inventory.
https://www2.virginmobileusa.com/phones/catalogPurchase.do?quantity=1&sku=885909630738
So where are the actual numbers from the other manus?
Is he? How much did it sell, then?
5S is the number one US smartphone sales in Nov. 5C is number three. Number two is GS4.
Are you saying you don't believe that number?
It's a bit like being the busiest restaurant in town. It doesn't mean you're the most profitable. You can be sure if Gordon Ramsay opened shop in your town and made the launch week entirely free to dine there you can only imagine how busy the restaurant would be. But a lot of money would be lost in the process. Like the way selling the most of anything doesn't make you the most profitable in your market segment. One of the exceptions probably being Coca Cola. But then, in their case there product doesn't cost any less than the competition. Once again in the phone space the company with the highest margin will make the most profit. And as usual we know who that company is. I'll be interested to see Apple's lineup this year.
The dearth of funds indicate that of the 86 million shipped, the majority that Samsung sold were cheaper, smaller low powered phones...
...with small screens.