This is the most disappointing thing ever!! If I'm correct there have been 3 MacBook Pro Haswel refreshes. Hopefully this means skylake is coming soon, maybe in time for the fall.
Yes, they've used the same generation processors 3 times now.
Intel did a Haswell-refresh instead of Broadwell in 2014. The GPU manufacturers do this too - the Nvidia 950M is pretty much the same as the 850M and the 750M the same as the 650M, they just clock them differently. At least the 2013 refurbs will be good value for money as it's largely the same CPU/GPU in the entry model.
The MBP has a note on the spec page saying that with the new AMD GPU, 5K displays are supported at 60Hz over Thunderbolt 2 but not HDMI. That means they can put out a 5K TB display whenever they want. The next Mac Pro will likely support this too.
Apple's benchmarks only show 50-70% increase over the 750M but still a decent enough boost. The 950M would have been over 100% but NVidia upped the power usage. AMD maybe has better performance-per-watt, although Apple has an odd habit of switching between them every year or two.
I know Apple didn't upgrade the MacBook Pro 15 inch's cpu but there are some bright spots for the base model. The faster ssd, force touch, and 9 hr battery life are decent upgrades. Yet it looks like last year's model will probably be the best purchase since it will be discounted and have the same cpu.
There's simply no reason to trade my Early 2011 17" for a newer version. It has plenty of connectors, it's big, it's matte, it's still frickin' fast, I could put in a 1TB SSD if I wanted to, it's a thing of a few minutes to swap the SSD into another machine if something breaks again (looking at you dGPU!) and it also runs Yosemite (whether that can be considered an upside is a totally different matter but unlike with the newer devices I actually have a choice...). The retina devices really are a sidegrade for me, no upgrade. So I'll keep using it until it breaks and then I'll consider my options including going Hackintosh...
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
This is the most disappointing thing ever!! If I'm correct there have been 3 MacBook Pro Haswel refreshes. Hopefully this means skylake is coming soon, maybe in time for the fall.
What are you going to do with Skylake that can't be done with Haswell?
What are you going to do with Skylake that can't be done with Haswell?
I need to verify before I buy.
Software and hardware need to work well with OpenGL and Windows 10 for 3D CAD design and animation.
That goes for the existing models and the next generation. The combination of Mac OSX, Video HDwr/Sftwr, Boot Camp, Windows, CAD software & addons, Windows utilities all need to run fast and smooth.
When I can verify first hand that everything is smooth, I'll move up.
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
That's the one I have sitting here beside me (with matte screen & SSD upgrade). Great machine, just getting a bit sluggish for my needs.
That's amazing! Are there any other laptops out there with an SSD so fast?
Umm if we are talking about the Samsung 951 SSD.. then my two month old 2015 13" rMBP has the same SSD. This drive (along with ForchTouch trackpad) debuted in the 13" retina MBP's the first week of March.
I'm not a spec-whore.. but I believe it is capable of up to 2.2GB/s.. or three times as fast as SATA-3. Its been real world tested to around 1.5GB/s with various file transfer programs.
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
That's the one. However Apple has meanwhile stepped up and put up a repair/reimbursement program for those so if it breaks (again!) in the next year the fix is on the house.
Haswell chips came out in 2013 then a slight speed bump in 2014, I'd rather wait for a new architecture then get one I could have bought 2 years ago. It's not about what skylake can do vs. Haswell now rather then when it can do 2-3 years from now. I don't need an immediate upgrade and can afford to wait another 200 days for a bigger update
Still maxes out at a lousy 16GB of RAM; one heavy Safari Session with Mail.app and Finder open gobbles up that much; then try opening some virtual machine like Parallels, Fusion, VirtualBox and you're in swap-hell.
how strange -- my 2014 rMBP w/ 16gb performs kickass, and yes, im running Windows 8 VMs for SQL Server and Visual Studio. ive not once felt i was in swap-hell. what am i doing wrong? could mine be defective?
also, not sure if you realize it -- but you *want* your machine to use your available ram. thats its point.
.
I get the increased battery consumption of RAM, but massive swapping gobbles up power, too.
I don't want the machines reduced to something that is essentially a slightly more sophisticated single-tasking machine with a somewhat enhanced multifinder, particularly as long as Safari doesn't cache open web pages content and layout without reloading each page upon relaunch and while it doesn't remember which space a window was in and keeps tossing all windows back in its default space, which makes (auto)quitting and reactivating Safari a total no-go.
If Apple can switch between integrated and discrete GPUs on the fly, it should be able to limit and shut off RAM based on power management preferences, thus lowering power consumption by reducing RAM e.g. from 64GB down to 16GB on the fly.
It increases power consumption somewhat. In a notebook it shouldn't be that critical. Graphics switching probably involves some duplication of back buffer and whatever other stuff, but in shutting down ram, you would have to copy everything down to unused blocks in the lower chips and update any applicable virtual address space. It sounds like a terrible idea to me. I don't think power consumption was the issue here, especially as memory requires a small fraction of the power required to run a GPU. Last look at graphics switching. Sometimes discrete graphics are enabled unnecessarily. They cannot be restored until an application or plugin quits. It often lags on switches. It's only useful if you're using a notebook when one really isn't the ideal solution, and the presence of discrete graphics makes it just quick enough to be viable for certain tasks.
This is the most disappointing thing ever!! If I'm correct there have been 3 MacBook Pro Haswel refreshes. Hopefully this means skylake is coming soon, maybe in time for the fall.
People always hope another update is right around the corner when they're disappointed. It is definitely possible, but I doubt it. This just confirms that Broadwell would have been too short a release, which doesn't make that much sense to me in spite of recent details. I figured intel's release of Broadwell H type cpus (which seems to be happening) would mean that those specific cpus wouldn't be out before next year in skylake form. It's not very typical of Apple to implement new gpus without new cpus. The trackpad update seems nice though.
The 15-inch update was delayed because Intel staggered the release of the next generation (Broadwell) processors. The 2-core processors used by the 13-inch MBPro were released in February. The 4-core processors used by the 15-inch MBPro were due to be released about now.
You have to imagine that Apple is a bit upset with Intel right about now.
Edit: it appears these updated MBPros do not have Broadwell processors. Evidence from the configuration page on the store is that they are still the same Haswell processors as before ("fourth generation" vs "fifth generation" for the 13-inch models). If that isn't an oversight, it means Intel probably cancelled the Broadwell 4-core release because the next generation (Skylake) is due relatively soon, or Apple got tired of waiting.
Tired would be the polite way to put it.
The AMD Radeon GPU might have been another factor delaying the 15-inch update.
Actually it will be pretty interesting to see how these new chips work.
If this really is Haswell, I'm impressed they achieved another hour of battery life with the same processor.
Probably new screen technology. The GPU might be more power efficient too.
Yeah, it would have been nice to get a bit of a speed boost with Broadwell + 1866MHz RAM, so in that regard I'm a bit disappointed. However, having 4 cores is more important to me than a modest speed bump. My main interest in waiting to upgrade was getting the force touch trackpad, so I went ahead and pulled the trigger.
You will like the track pad. Force touch seems to work really well for me on the 13" MBP
And yeah, I'm wondering too if Intel is just skipping the 4-core Broadwell and going straight to Skylake...
Rumors to that effect have been active for months now. However those SkyLake chips where expected mid year but it looks like Apple could wait that long. I suspect they wanted the best upgrade they could manage for the back to school shopping crowd as that starts right about now.
I could imagine a few VP's at Apple getting extremely heated under the collar over Intels long drawn out chip release schedule.
This could be one of the shortest released MBP's in history if they upgrade to SkyLake later this year.
Still maxes out at a lousy 16GB of RAM; one heavy Safari Session with Mail.app and Finder open gobbles up that much; then try opening some virtual machine like Parallels, Fusion, VirtualBox and you're in swap-hell.
The point of a 64-bit CPU is to be able to have massive amounts of RAM both for pro apps that require a lot of in-memory (vs. on-storage) data (e.g. 32-bit deep 60-megapixel HDR images and their undo edit history, massive sample libraries for Logic, in-memory rather than on-disk database architectures, etc.)
16 GB is a joke, the machines have been stagnating at this level for years now, MBAir stagnating at an even more ridiculous 8 GB.
I get the increased battery consumption of RAM, but massive swapping gobbles up power, too.
I don't want the machines reduced to something that is essentially a slightly more sophisticated single-tasking machine with a somewhat enhanced multifinder, particularly as long as Safari doesn't cache open web pages content and layout without reloading each page upon relaunch and while it doesn't remember which space a window was in and keeps tossing all windows back in its default space, which makes (auto)quitting and reactivating Safari a total no-go.
If Apple can switch between integrated and discrete GPUs on the fly, it should be able to limit and shut off RAM based on power management preferences, thus lowering power consumption by reducing RAM e.g. from 64GB down to 16GB on the fly.
Comments
Yes, they've used the same generation processors 3 times now.
2013:
http://ark.intel.com/products/76087/Intel-Core-i7-4750HQ-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_20-GHz
2014 & 15:
http://ark.intel.com/products/83505/Intel-Core-i7-4770HQ-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_40-GHz
Intel did a Haswell-refresh instead of Broadwell in 2014. The GPU manufacturers do this too - the Nvidia 950M is pretty much the same as the 850M and the 750M the same as the 650M, they just clock them differently. At least the 2013 refurbs will be good value for money as it's largely the same CPU/GPU in the entry model.
The MBP has a note on the spec page saying that with the new AMD GPU, 5K displays are supported at 60Hz over Thunderbolt 2 but not HDMI. That means they can put out a 5K TB display whenever they want. The next Mac Pro will likely support this too.
These GPUs were launched a couple of weeks ago:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9236/amd-announces-radeon-m300-series-notebook-video-cards
Apple's benchmarks only show 50-70% increase over the 750M but still a decent enough boost. The 950M would have been over 100% but NVidia upped the power usage. AMD maybe has better performance-per-watt, although Apple has an odd habit of switching between them every year or two.
I was hoping they would introduce a redesigned model ... Hope they do it around September this year with intel skylake.
Yup, not a great leap here. Think I'll get an Apple Refurb and look at it as a backup for the next Skylake generation out around Christmas.
There's simply no reason to trade my Early 2011 17" for a newer version. It has plenty of connectors, it's big, it's matte, it's still frickin' fast, I could put in a 1TB SSD if I wanted to, it's a thing of a few minutes to swap the SSD into another machine if something breaks again (looking at you dGPU!) and it also runs Yosemite (whether that can be considered an upside is a totally different matter but unlike with the newer devices I actually have a choice...). The retina devices really are a sidegrade for me, no upgrade. So I'll keep using it until it breaks and then I'll consider my options including going Hackintosh...
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
What are you going to do with Skylake that can't be done with Haswell?
What are you going to do with Skylake that can't be done with Haswell?
What are you going to do with Skylake that can't be done with Haswell?
I need to verify before I buy.
Software and hardware need to work well with OpenGL and Windows 10 for 3D CAD design and animation.
That goes for the existing models and the next generation. The combination of Mac OSX, Video HDwr/Sftwr, Boot Camp, Windows, CAD software & addons, Windows utilities all need to run fast and smooth.
When I can verify first hand that everything is smooth, I'll move up.
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
That's the one I have sitting here beside me (with matte screen & SSD upgrade). Great machine, just getting a bit sluggish for my needs.
That's amazing! Are there any other laptops out there with an SSD so fast?
Umm if we are talking about the Samsung 951 SSD.. then my two month old 2015 13" rMBP has the same SSD. This drive (along with ForchTouch trackpad) debuted in the 13" retina MBP's the first week of March.
I'm not a spec-whore.. but I believe it is capable of up to 2.2GB/s.. or three times as fast as SATA-3. Its been real world tested to around 1.5GB/s with various file transfer programs.
Isn't the early 2011 model the one with solder problems? I'd get rid of it and buy a MC024LL/A instead - that was the last 17" with good solder connections.
That's the one. However Apple has meanwhile stepped up and put up a repair/reimbursement program for those so if it breaks (again!) in the next year the fix is on the house.
Haswell chips came out in 2013 then a slight speed bump in 2014, I'd rather wait for a new architecture then get one I could have bought 2 years ago. It's not about what skylake can do vs. Haswell now rather then when it can do 2-3 years from now. I don't need an immediate upgrade and can afford to wait another 200 days for a bigger update
how strange -- my 2014 rMBP w/ 16gb performs kickass, and yes, im running Windows 8 VMs for SQL Server and Visual Studio. ive not once felt i was in swap-hell. what am i doing wrong? could mine be defective?
also, not sure if you realize it -- but you *want* your machine to use your available ram. thats its point.
.
I get the increased battery consumption of RAM, but massive swapping gobbles up power, too.
I don't want the machines reduced to something that is essentially a slightly more sophisticated single-tasking machine with a somewhat enhanced multifinder, particularly as long as Safari doesn't cache open web pages content and layout without reloading each page upon relaunch and while it doesn't remember which space a window was in and keeps tossing all windows back in its default space, which makes (auto)quitting and reactivating Safari a total no-go.
If Apple can switch between integrated and discrete GPUs on the fly, it should be able to limit and shut off RAM based on power management preferences, thus lowering power consumption by reducing RAM e.g. from 64GB down to 16GB on the fly.
It increases power consumption somewhat. In a notebook it shouldn't be that critical. Graphics switching probably involves some duplication of back buffer and whatever other stuff, but in shutting down ram, you would have to copy everything down to unused blocks in the lower chips and update any applicable virtual address space. It sounds like a terrible idea to me. I don't think power consumption was the issue here, especially as memory requires a small fraction of the power required to run a GPU. Last look at graphics switching. Sometimes discrete graphics are enabled unnecessarily. They cannot be restored until an application or plugin quits. It often lags on switches. It's only useful if you're using a notebook when one really isn't the ideal solution, and the presence of discrete graphics makes it just quick enough to be viable for certain tasks.
Figures. I just got a new MBP at work a month ago. I really wanted to wait for the new trackpad. Now I have to wait another three years. *sigh*
This is the most disappointing thing ever!! If I'm correct there have been 3 MacBook Pro Haswel refreshes. Hopefully this means skylake is coming soon, maybe in time for the fall.
People always hope another update is right around the corner when they're disappointed. It is definitely possible, but I doubt it. This just confirms that Broadwell would have been too short a release, which doesn't make that much sense to me in spite of recent details. I figured intel's release of Broadwell H type cpus (which seems to be happening) would mean that those specific cpus wouldn't be out before next year in skylake form. It's not very typical of Apple to implement new gpus without new cpus. The trackpad update seems nice though.
Probably new screen technology. The GPU might be more power efficient too.
Rumors to that effect have been active for months now. However those SkyLake chips where expected mid year but it looks like Apple could wait that long. I suspect they wanted the best upgrade they could manage for the back to school shopping crowd as that starts right about now.
I could imagine a few VP's at Apple getting extremely heated under the collar over Intels long drawn out chip release schedule.
This could be one of the shortest released MBP's in history if they upgrade to SkyLake later this year.