Job listing reveals Apple Maps will become available cross-platform via the Web

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  • Reply 21 of 37
    danielswdanielsw Posts: 906member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post





    There is a lot of emphasis in using maps on mobile devices (including, phones, tablets and cars).



    However, there are some map activities easiest done on a computer as opposed to a touch device. Many of these same activities require data not usually considered (or included) in a mapping application. Most of this data is readily available on the web.



    Just, yesterday we used Apple Maps running on a Jeep Cherokee (via connected Apple Watch and iPhone) to navigate to a new (to us) location in a different town ...  pretty common stuff, eh -- starting point, ending point, route selection, navigation directions -- no big challenge for the Watch/iPhone ... Tap-tap turn left at the next ....



    But, consider a different mapping activity -- one where there are many more options and variables involved ... Consider a travel agent who is planning an itinerary for that trip to NYC. The agent wants to maximize the use of your time and allow you to visit desired POIs ... This involves creating routes with multiple planned stops, involving walking, public transportation, private car, etc. In addition, the timing of the stops is important -- including:  weather;  public and private transportation schedules… tour and tour guide schedules;  show times;  event schedules;  etc. ... and the availability of all these in concert with the needs of the client. In fact, the agent may create an itinerary with several options for the client to select.



    The end result of this will be an itinerary, a bit more involved (multiple way points), but not too different than our trip yesterday to a new place in a new town.



    But the creation process is much more involved because of the need to coordinate with data (schedules, availability, weather, etc.) not usually part of a maps app.



    During the creation process, the agent may use 3D Flyover and Street View to help the client select among several options.



    Once the itinerary is created, the 3D Flyover and Street View, likely, will be included in the package for the client for use on his iPad or iPhone to plan ahead, follow along, and review the planned activities. Or, maybe AirPlayed to the HDTV to show famly and friends.



    After return, the agent (or client) can integrate photos and videos you take -- with the visual components (Flyover and Street View) of the itinerary ... for your future personal enjoyment.



    BTW, with the right combination of native and web apps the client can do this all himself -- if so desired.



    Good post!

  • Reply 22 of 37
    mike1mike1 Posts: 3,328member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    You could... but if you already have an iPhone why not just do your charting there?

    Personally, when I go somewhere new in an unfamiliar area for the first time, I always map the route on my computer ahead of time. I like to know what roads I am looking for etc. Also every map program does stupid things. For example, they all try to take you through Manhattan when going to or from Long Island. You always need to drag the route to one of the bridges around Manhattan. I always tell first timers to not trust their GPS and give them directions.

  • Reply 23 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member

    Apple's future plans were revealed in an advertisement seeking a "Maps JavaScript Engineer" posted by the company in the last month. The full-time position based at the company's Cupertino, Calif., headquarters seeks a Web technology expert "to help make maps work seamlessly on the web."

    The Web development position requires "deep knowledge" of JavaScript, as Apple unsurprisingly plans for its Web-based Maps service to be a "cross-platform" solution.


    Hmm ... Maps ... Web-based ... JavaScript ...

    After rereading the article I was reminded that Apple bought a mapping company named PlaceBase in 2009:

    http://appleinsider.com/articles/09/10/01/apple_purchased_google_maps_competitor_placebase_report

    One of the unusual capabilities provided by PlaceBase was access to demographic data from many different sources. It would use this demographic data to create overlays for standard maps yielding maps showing things like:
    • crime statistics in NYC
    • voter registration by party in Los Angeles County
    • average income per household in Chicago suburbs

    Besides, the 3rd-party demographic data, PlaceBase provided access to 3rd-party map data (e..g. Naivety).

    To tie this all together, PlaceBase provided an SDK based on JavaScript. The SDK is named PushPin.

    A subscriber to the PlaceBase service could use the PushPin SDK to generate standard maps overlaid with custom demographic data (as described above). The maps were interactive with panning, zooming, scrolling, drill-down, etc.

    PlaceBase provided a Demo web site showing examples of maps and the JavaScript apps that generated the maps.

    It was quite impressive!

    Unfortunately, all those web sites are gone now ...

    Ah, but ... I played with the site for a while, and, as luck would have it I saved the doc page for the demo site ... sorry, no actual maps though.


    Here is the top of the PushPin docs page:


    1000


    Open the image in a new window to get a readable page ...


    On the right side of the page is a sample of a PushPin app -- HTML and JavaScript ...

    On the left side of the page it shows some of docs, examples and some of the SDK classes used by PushPin ...


    Not too bad, eh?
  • Reply 24 of 37
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post



    Beyond cross-platform Web access and public transportation, other potential additions could include crowdsourced traffic information

    I never understood the crowd sourced traffic scenario like Waze. Doesn't this just encourage people to text while driving?

  • Reply 25 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    Hmmm ... Apple Maps ... Web-based ... JavaScript ... plus Apple tech:  3D Flyover;  Street View;  Indoor Mapping;  AR, Route Planning;  PushPin Interactive Mapping ...


    How can Apple do all this on the web and provide acceptable performance -- without giving away the store and Apple's competitive advantage???


    Not too long ago, a solution would be to use HTML/CSS/JavaScript around the edges -- but to use something like a proprietary Flash or Java runtime (Browser Plugin) to do the heavy lifting.

    Paraphrasing Steve Jobs: Flash? Java? ... NNyah!


    What then?

    How can Apple protect the corporate goodies while providing a cross-platform service available to all???

    It needs some sort of Apple proprietary Language/SDK that is performant, easy to learn, to use ...


    Why it already has that -- It's called Swift! Swift is a proprietary language/SDK and has a proprietary runtime.


    Apple would need to write browser plugins including the runtime for the 3 or 4 major browsers.


    Voila!


    Even better, as part of the Apple Map site/service Apple could implement Playgrounds for Interactive mapping use.


    So, all the maps, etc. created on the cross platform site would be downloaded as compiled -- to run natively on Apple devices -- and run through a browser on competitive devices.
  • Reply 26 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    mstone wrote: »
    Beyond cross-platform Web access and public transportation, other potential additions could include crowdsourced traffic information
    I never understood the crowd sourced traffic scenario like Waze. Doesn't this just encourage people to text while driving?

    I suspect that most drivers wouldn't contribute while moving ... maybe stalled in traffic, though. A passenger would be more likely to contribute.

    In many cases, using something like Siri to generate a short text would not be too distracting.
  • Reply 27 of 37
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post



    How can Apple protect the corporate goodies while providing a cross-platform service available to all???



    It needs some sort of Apple proprietary Language/SDK that is performant, easy to learn, to use ...





    Why it already has that -- It's called Swift! Swift is a proprietary language/SDK and has a proprietary runtime.





    Apple would need to write browser plugins including the runtime for the 3 or 4 major browsers.

    I seriously doubt they will write any browser plugins. I believe they, or Steve, has publicly said that browser plugins are no good.

     

    They already have some seriously complex productivity apps running on the web in Javascript. Apps like those are nearly impossible to copy due to the obfuscated programming and for anyone to make use of it they would have to already be a major player. Google and Microsoft aren't going to bother disassembling Apple's code. That would be harder than writing your own code from scratch. They have plenty of good programmers on staff. 

     

    The way it is usually done is you have well commented and properly nested, and indented source code and then you run an optimizer on it where all the vars are reassigned to single letters and all the line breaks and white space is removed. Almost impossible to read. 

  • Reply 28 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    mstone wrote: »
    How can Apple protect the corporate goodies while providing a cross-platform service available to all???


    It needs some sort of Apple proprietary Language/SDK that is performant, easy to learn, to use ...



    Why it already has that -- It's called Swift! Swift is a proprietary language/SDK and has a proprietary runtime.



    Apple would need to write browser plugins including the runtime for the 3 or 4 major browsers.
    I seriously doubt they will write any browser plugins. I believe they, or Steve, has publicly said that browser plugins are no good.

    They already have some seriously complex productivity apps running on the web in Javascript. Apps like those are nearly impossible to copy due to the obfuscated programming and for anyone to make use of it they would have to already be a major player. Google and Microsoft aren't going to bother disassembling Apple's code. That would be harder than writing your own code from scratch. They have plenty of good programmers on staff. 

    The way it is usually done is you have well commented and properly nested, and indented source code and then you run an optimizer on it where all the vars are reassigned to single letters and all the line breaks and white space is removed. Almost impossible to read. 

    Yeah, browser plugins aren't ideal ...

    How do others (MS and Adobe) handle their proprietary software (Office and Photoshop) that are accessable online for a monthly subscription?
  • Reply 29 of 37
    d4njvrzfd4njvrzf Posts: 797member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post





    Yeah, browser plugins aren't ideal ...



    How do others (MS and Adobe) handle their proprietary software (Office and Photoshop) that are accessable online for a monthly subscription?

    By having users sign in to use the service.

  • Reply 30 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    d4njvrzf wrote: »
    Yeah, browser plugins aren't ideal ...


    How do others (MS and Adobe) handle their proprietary software (Office and Photoshop) that are accessable online for a monthly subscription?
    By having users sign in to use the service.

    Does that mean that the app cannot be used if Internet access is not available?

    Wouldn't it be better to have an offline (downloaded app) capability that expired after a month (or whenever the subscription ended)?

    As you can guess -- I don't use any subscription apps except Apple iCloud -- and those apps are available off line.
  • Reply 31 of 37
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post





    Yeah, browser plugins aren't ideal ...



    How do others (MS and Adobe) handle their proprietary software (Office and Photoshop) that are accessable online for a monthly subscription?



    Basically online browser based software as a service use one of two models to get around using plugins such as Flash. One, they use Javascript to do the actual work or two they use Javascript to display in the browser window the work that has been done behind the scenes by a Java app and/or database running on the server or some combination of the two methods.

  • Reply 32 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    mstone wrote: »
    Yeah, browser plugins aren't ideal ...


    How do others (MS and Adobe) handle their proprietary software (Office and Photoshop) that are accessable online for a monthly subscription?


    Basically online browser based software as a service use one of two models to get around using plugins such as Flash. One, they use Javascript to do the actual work or two they use Javascript to display in the browser window the work that has been done behind the scenes by a Java app and/or database running on the server or some combination of the two methods.

    So, I infer that you must have an online connection to use the software.

    If so, are there companion apps that can be used when no Internet connection is available -- or when only cell is available and it would be too slow or costly to stay connected for a long time?

    To my mind, I would expect a subscribed service would allow me to:
    • validate my subscription online (monthly, annually)
    • work online when available and practical
    • work offline when necessary

    If the app is compute intensive, I suspect it would be written in Java or some other complied language. If the user wanted the ability to work offline he would need to download the app, then authorize it online, for the current subscription period (or monthly). Then, if the subscription period had expired the offline app would not function until resubscribed.
  • Reply 33 of 37
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,953member
    clemynx wrote: »

    What I wonder is how they will monetize this, because they will need to. Google's approach, where ads aren't clearly visible, could be a solution.

    Id be a little, ok, actually a lot surprised if Apple put ads in Maps. It's not like they're having to pay royalties & fees to artists & record labels. It's just going to be a slick advertisement for the platform.
  • Reply 34 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    cornchip wrote: »
    clemynx wrote: »

    What I wonder is how they will monetize this, because they will need to. Google's approach, where ads aren't clearly visible, could be a solution.

    Id be a little, ok, actually a lot surprised if Apple put ads in Maps. It's not like they're having to pay royalties & fees to artists & record labels. It's just going to be a slick advertisement for the platform.

    I don't think they'll put ads in maps. Rather, I suspect they'll provide some quality, free mapping services -- which requires/assumes up-to-date, reliable map data.

    In addition, Apple could offer some compelling paid mapping options -- there's more to mapping than just maps and navigation.

    For example, I would expect tourist destinations with poor economies, like Greece, to be falling all over each other to pay Apple to gather and create 3D Flyover maps of their country. There are tourist $ to be made by promoting the visual attractions in a destination.

    So far, the most proactive country is France ... Maybe Apple Maps and Guide Michelin can work out an arrangement where they feature the best, and the best reasonable-priced restaurants in France and other major countries.

    Le Boom!

    For grins, I picked a random Guide Michelin restaurant from Lyon France and visited it with Apple Maps 3D Flyover -- search for:

    “Trois Dômes” restaurant lyon france


    Here's one view:


    1000


    And, another:


    1000



    Now imagine that with a 3D FlyAround, some 3D Street View, some 3D Indoor shots -- combined with the menu and video of the meal prep and service ...

    That's $$$


    And there're are many Guide Michelin restaurants in Lyon, France!

     
  • Reply 35 of 37
    deanbardeanbar Posts: 113member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wood1208 View Post

     



    Yes, but it is much more convenient to chart route on desktop while in office or home before start driving(send to iphone). Also, on desktop easier one could drag move around route( POI ) and set it the way you like/familiar and than boom, just send to iphone. Currently, I print my route on paper when driving to far unknown places and than use iphone to let it route but make sure I still follow that paper route.  I can avoid to print on paper if I can map route on any popular desktop using Apple Maps software and than send to my device to follow the same route. Much less stressful while driving and knowing to follow the known route.




    Totally agree. This is by far the best way to plan an unknown route, and so much easier. The only problem I find with this is that all too often, Apple Maps selects a ridiculous route and I cannot easily find a way to change for a better route. Unless I am using it wrong, I cannot get Waypoints to work all the way to the final destination. On a very old mapping app I had years ago - "Route 66" - you could keep setting waypoints until it selected the ideal route you wanted. Maybe Apple Maps has this function, but I can't seem to make it work like this.

  • Reply 36 of 37
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    deanbar wrote: »
    wood1208 wrote: »
     


    Yes, but it is much more convenient to chart route on desktop while in office or home before start driving(send to iphone). Also, on desktop easier one could drag move around route( POI ) and set it the way you like/familiar and than boom, just send to iphone. Currently, I print my route on paper when driving to far unknown places and than use iphone to let it route but make sure I still follow that paper route.  I can avoid to print on paper if I can map route on any popular desktop using Apple Maps software and than send to my device to follow the same route. Much less stressful while driving and knowing to follow the known route.


    Totally agree. This is by far the best way to plan an unknown route, and so much easier. The only problem I find with this is that all too often, Apple Maps selects a ridiculous route and I cannot easily find a way to change for a better route. Unless I am using it wrong, I cannot get Waypoints to work all the way to the final destination. On a very old mapping app I had years ago - "Route 66" - you could keep setting waypoints until it selected the ideal route you wanted. Maybe Apple Maps has this function, but I can't seem to make it work like this.

    Apple Maps will often show a recommended route and several alternate routes ... You can select a different route to make it the current route.


    As for constructing a route by creating waypoints: Apple maps does not provide the user with this route creation capability.

    However, an Apple Map can be made to plot or follow a route created externally.

    It is rather an involved process involving several apps ... I haven't done this in 2 years and the world (maps, OSes, apps) has changed -- so it may not be doable today.

    AIR, the process went something like this:
    1. create a route with with waypoints using any of several web mapping apps
    2. convert this route to a .gpx file using another web app
    3. manually edit the .gpx file to provide additional information such as timing/speed -- how long to stay at each way point
    4. create/modify an iOS mapping app to read and process the .gpx file
    5. play the map/on, say, on an iPad while recording the iPad display as a video on a Mac
    6. adjust the .gpx file as necessary
    7. rinse and repeat.

    After doing all this, you will, likely, want to add titles or special effects to the video using iMovie or FCPX.

    IMO, this all could be easily incorporated within the Apple Map app web version -- or native Mac version -- maybe an iPad with a stylus.


    Tomorrow, I'll see if I can recreate some of the videos with the way things stand today.

    Edit: the process above still works ... kinda' ... The routes are plotted incorrectly with the current OSes and apps. I don't think I will pursue this any further until after WWDC next week. I expect some new Maps APIs, Xcode and iOS versions!



    Here are some samples created using the process, above -- pardon the quality. Several of the Videos use a technique called Tilt-Shift -- where the video is shot from above, over-saturated focal point and blurred at the edges. It is supposed to give the impression of a toy scene:



    [VIDEO]



    [VIDEO]



    [VIDEO]



    [VIDEO]



    [VIDEO]

     
  • Reply 37 of 37
    inklinginkling Posts: 773member
    Why is Apple pouring huge sums into maps when there are a number of quite effective map apps and web pages available from others. I must have at least a dozen I could install on my iPhone. it strikes me as little more that an ego game by corporate executives. Think of grade school boys engaging in who can piss the furtherest contests.

    In fact, I had someone on Microsoft's Bing team tell me that was precisely the reason Microsoft developed Bing. The company's top executives were upset that Google dominated that market and insisted that Microsoft get into the game.

    Meanwhile, the Hunspell spell-checker in OS X is grossly underfunded and almost worthless. I edit science texts and for that it is useless. It's not just that it does not have technical terms. It's that its vocabulary is that of a college sophomore. It also doesn't know even the most basic rules of English grammar, such is that -ly words are never hyphenated. It's tacky, tasteless and more trouble than it is worth.

    Maybe someone should point out the Apple's executives that their spell checker's misspelled word lookup is so dreadful, it fails about a third the time. And to get their envy juices going, point out that if you paste that same wrongly spelled word into a Google search, Google will give the correct spelling about 98% of the time. Translated into something the corporate world will understand: Apple's spell checker is like pissing on your shoes. That from Google splashes into a wall ten feet away.

    I've often wished someone would add a most helpful new feature to OS X apps, a "Get correct spelling from Google" control-click option. It'd certain save users a lot of time.
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