Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Russia is a part of Europe, and they are our friends. What the nutcases in the US congress think is a completely different issue...
Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Russia is a part of Europe, and they are our friends. What the nutcases in the US congress think is a completely different issue...
They attacked us. They ARE ATTACKING us right now. All available evidence shows that they plan to keep attacking us. No loyal American would consider them a friend.
Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Russia is a part of Europe, and they are our friends. What the nutcases in the US congress think is a completely different issue...
They attacked us. They ARE ATTACKING us right now. All available evidence shows that they plan to keep attacking us. No loyal American would consider them a friend.
Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Russia is a part of Europe, and they are our friends. What the nutcases in the US congress think is a completely different issue...
They attacked us. They ARE ATTACKING us right now. All available evidence shows that they plan to keep attacking us. No loyal American would consider them a friend.
You have to be pretty paranoid to think that.
No, just informed. Or, maybe it's just not being blinded by right wing propaganda.
Shocking news from the bastion of freedom, fairness, and openness. What's next, Russia will want a backdoor into iOS security to protect their citizens against criminals and terrorists?
They already do.
Most fully encrypted messaging services who refuse to share a key with the Russian government are banned or in the process of it, tho iMessage seems to be acceptable at least for now.
Like China the Russians are requiring user data to be stored on Russian owned servers as well. Apple has already complied and again like China, Russian law requires the data be de-crypted or otherwise made available to Russian security forces on demand. Their law of course applies to other techs as well, with both Twitter and Facebook now being investigated for failing to comply with Russian security laws. Google initially resisted but also coming into compliance from what I can tell.
Of particular interest is the specific wording Mr. Cook gave when asked about storing user data on foreign owned servers: “We have servers located in many different countries in the world,” he told Vice News in an October interview. “They are not easier to get data from being in one country versus the next. The key question is how does the encryption process work and who owns the keys if anyone? IN MOST CASES (emphasis) for us, you and the receiver own the keys.”
Note that he avoids saying all cases so yes there is obviously a backdoor way of accessing Apple-encrypted messaging and data, perhaps the reason iMessage is still OK there?
Most European countries, including Russia, have laws for storing certain types of data on own country soil, something US companies just have to get used to and comply with if they want to stay in that market. The advantage for Europeans is there is far less possibility for the US alphabet agencies to snoop on their data.
Ownership of the servers is an important detail. A server owned and operated by Apple or Google or whoever would presumably be the better option but there are a couple of countries that will not allow that, China and Russia being two.
Agreed that if companies want to do business in a country (they don't have to of course but where there's profit there's reason) they have to comply with that countries current laws. Zero debate about that.
It is not like the European countries owns and points to the specific server to use. The servers are owned by subsidiaries of say Apple in the countries in question. What you spout about Russia is blatantly wrong. Russia has an open economy. For China the communist party owns everything, so it is different.
The Apple datacenter(s) in Russia ia absolutely Russian owned, Apple has zero ownership of it, and the law requires techs to store user data in facilities controlled by Russian companies. No idea what part of that you are claiming is "blatantly wrong" unless you've read something I've missed, and that's always possible.
They may very well use Russian data centers, but they don't have to.
I have worked for two companies that both use and have large data centers also in Russia. I know what the requirements are.
Fair enough, experience counts. Seems as tho the laws are changing and perhaps those server requirements along with it. You should check with your contacts as that would be helpful info.
No comment on the Cook statement concerning foreign data centers?
No. If you operate in a market other than your own (legislation) there are just a number of factors you have to observe, follow and factor into the equation.
True, and as mentioned earlier no company has an obligation to do business in a country whose terms for doing so don''t mesh with the company's own values and/or goals. There's always the choice of whether to comply or not.
Europe is a 755 million people market, of which about 153 million in Russia. The entire continent have comparable legislation and business rules, so unless Apple (and other US companies) are better off without Europe, good luck to them!
Are all the other EU countries using laws demanding that Apple de-crypt otherwise private user data including text and call on demand of security services? Are all other EU countries trying to establish their own mini Chinese-style "Great Firewalls" to separate themselves from the rest of the continent? I think not.
The only reason why Russia is establishing their own Internet infrastructure is because of US aggression, and so they don't will sit there with a dark net if the US decides to pull the plug on them (which is highly likely given the instability of US decision makers these days).
The EU is about to pass legislation which mandates decryption for access to information by security services. I don't like the development at all.
But those "decision makers" claim that Russia is our friend!
Russia is a part of Europe, and they are our friends. What the nutcases in the US congress think is a completely different issue...
They attacked us. They ARE ATTACKING us right now. All available evidence shows that they plan to keep attacking us. No loyal American would consider them a friend.
You have to be pretty paranoid to think that.
Nope. It's a fact that Russia has, is, and will continue their attacks on the US, as demonstrated by the continue meddling in our elections. Denying this is denying gravity or the sun. Either you're delusional, or pushing an agenda.
Russians should punish Apple just like they punished Google for disrespecting Russian laws about personal information! Fine them for $10,000! (700,000 RUR)
Russians should punish Apple just like they punished Google for disrespecting Russian laws about personal information! Fine them for $10,000! (700,000 RUR)
It was $11,000 and had nothing to do with "disrespecting personal information ". (Where do posters come up with this stuff?) Google was allowing citizens to access websites that the Roskomnadzor decided should be blacklisted, failing to remove hyperlinks. In fact it was their second violation, the first costing them $7500.
You were probably thinking of Facebook and got confused. They actually were fined by the Russians for data privacy violations, the massive amount of... $50.
But yeah point made. So far Russian fines against companies violating internet access and security laws has been pretty insignificant. The laws require search engines to delete some search results, messaging services to share encryption keys with security services, and social networks to store personal information about Russian users on servers within Russia.
So I wouldn't expect Apple to be monetarily punished all that much either.
Comments
Google was allowing citizens to access websites that the Roskomnadzor decided should be blacklisted, failing to remove hyperlinks. In fact it was their second violation, the first costing them $7500.
You were probably thinking of Facebook and got confused. They actually were fined by the Russians for data privacy violations, the massive amount of... $50.
But yeah point made. So far Russian fines against companies violating internet access and security laws has been pretty insignificant. The laws require search engines to delete some search results, messaging services to share encryption keys with security services, and social networks to store personal information about Russian users on servers within Russia.
So I wouldn't expect Apple to be monetarily punished all that much either.