I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
Apple just wants to prevent an app from streaming malware all over their ecosystem, that’s all.
Do you have evidence that xCloud is malware? Yeah. I didn't think so.
I didn't say that xCloud was malware.
The problem is that Apple can't check the apps that are being streamed through xCloud. They could be malware.
Clear enough?
Clear enough. But to give credit to MS, a) they're a major player in gaming & b) they do a pretty good job of curating their own service.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
Apple just wants to prevent an app from streaming malware all over their ecosystem, that’s all.
As I asked in a different thread but you seemed unable to answer, how do you stream malware through video? There is no executable code streamed. If video malware is such an issue, why is it iOS happily streams Netflix, YT, Hulu, BBC etc?
Microsoft is basically trying to create a gaming app store within Apple's App Store. Why is it so complicated to understand that is not allowed?
Android is 85% of the WW market. Let's see how their launch goes there. I'll bet you it goes down in flames
No they're not. What they created is nothing like an app store. In an app store, you buy and download things. XCloud is a subscription streaming service like Netflix. Ironically, Netflix will let you download whereas XCloud is streaming only. But you get the point. XCloud is nothing like an app store. Netflix lets you stream thousands of programs. XCloud lets you stream approx 100 games.
————-
This is nothing more than a sad attempt to equate playing a highly interactive game with watching a passive video stream
Let’s see if this service is even viable after its big Android launch. We’ll all know in 6 months
What, you mean like the popular Geforce Go does, sending a video stream to the user and sending the keyboard and mouse input to a server?
Everyone knows it's nothing to do with verification around the video of the apps being streamed, it's all about Apple not getting their 30%. I can run a multitude of VNC apps from the App Store and hell if I want to I can play games over VNC too, those aren't sanctioned by Apple. So why is it such a big issue when it's centred solely on gaming?
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
Apple just wants to prevent an app from streaming malware all over their ecosystem, that’s all.
Do you have evidence that xCloud is malware? Yeah. I didn't think so.
Microsoft is basically trying to create a gaming app store within Apple's App Store. Why is it so complicated to understand that is not allowed?
Android is 85% of the WW market. Let's see how their launch goes there. I'll bet you it goes down in flames
This isn't any different than Netflix trying to create a video content store or Amazon trying to create a Kindle book store on Apple's App Store. Yet they're allowed.
Netflix doesn't have a video content store and you can't buy books on the Kindle app.
Microsoft is basically trying to create a gaming app store within Apple's App Store. Why is it so complicated to understand that is not allowed?
Android is 85% of the WW market. Let's see how their launch goes there. I'll bet you it goes down in flames
No they're not. What they created is nothing like an app store. In an app store, you buy and download things. XCloud is a subscription streaming service like Netflix. Ironically, Netflix will let you download whereas XCloud is streaming only. But you get the point. XCloud is nothing like an app store. Netflix lets you stream thousands of programs. XCloud lets you stream approx 100 games.
————-
This is nothing more than a sad attempt to equate playing a highly interactive game with watching a passive video stream
Let’s see if this service is even viable after its big Android launch. We’ll all know in 6 months
Microsoft will cave eventually. iKnockoff users are cheap bastards who love to steal and hate to pay.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Exactly. Microsoft is being a hypocrite when one realizes Microsoft is (arguably) even more stringent about the Xbox Live store. InspiredCode said:
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
I own an Xbox One X, a custom built high end Windows 10 gaming PC. Also in our 3 person household there are 4 iPhones, 3 iPads, 1 MacBook Pro, 2 AppleTVs, and a fully decked out smart home based on HomeKit. I am and have always been platform agnostic, not a “fanboy” of any company.
FACT: Apple has been pushing the iPad as a replacement for personal computers. So by Apple’s own assertion, the iPad is a general purpose platform. FACT: Comparing the iPad to an Xbox is ridiculous. Apple has nothing analogous to an Xbox. The closest similar product would be Windows tablets which ARE fully open, or by Apple’s own assertion, WIndows laptops. Windows tablets and Laptops allow installation of any software a user wants.
It’s painfully obvious that Apple here is interested in protecting only 1 thing. Their 30% cut of anything used in any way on the iPad.
Apple also whined and complained, more specifically Steve Jobs was very upset Apple was not doing great, and Adobe’s support of the Mac platform fell behind Adobe’s Windows support.
Apple has in fact benefitted greatly from Microsoft’s willingness to create Mac specific software, especially Microsoft office. It’s not hard to argue that Apple would not even exist today without Microsoft’s early software support, especially after Adobe giving Apple the cold shoulder when Apple was not doing well.
I think this is also a huge strategic error on Apple’s part. There is so much untapped gaming opportunity on the iPad and iPhone. Apple badly messed this up with in-app purchases which should be abolished, and replaced with free trials, and fully paid games. Apple Arcade is a step in the right direction but the best games there are at best mediocre compared to AAA console and PC games.
If Apple wants iOS devices to become major gaming devices, they should be welcoming Microsoft’s cloud gaming service. Anything that drives more gamers to the platform will increase overall gaming revenue. Sort of like how car dealerships often locate together in the same place. As a gamer who has both MS and Apple platforms, Apple has done an extremely poor job of developing iOS devices as gaming machines. Apple Arcade was a good product had it come out about 7 years ago. Today the games on it are pretty pathetic overall. They have their niche market, but the relatively lame games on AA aren’t going to have people switching away from a Nintendo switch for example.
I would not be too worried about streaming games compromising on device games. I have a FTTH symmetrical gigiabit connection to the home with very low latency, and a highly optimized WiFi network. Even my optimal home network results in a less ideal than on device experience. Streaming games could stimulate more demand for on device versions of popular games that can run better locally.
Microsoft also dominates Apple completely when it comes to gaming peripherals. A relatively paltry assortment off poorly promoted gaming peripherals is also something that has been drastically holding Apple back as a gamer’s destination. Apple has a LOT to gain by MS promoting their gaming peripherals as iOS compatible, and xCloud compatible on iOS.
Apple is shooting itself in the foot here. The reality is when it comes to gaming, Apple needs Microsoft far more than Microsoft needs Apple.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
I think Apple knows that Microsoft's streaming games may not really be malicious by intent (bad seeds can come into play, though), but if they allow xCloud, then they would need to open the floodgates to all players, some of who may not be as "clean".
So, for better or worse, Apple is saying "no" to all. In Microsoft's own words, at least Apple is "consistent" in this regard.
I said this yesterday. Why do people think Apple giving Microsoft unfair treatment is good?
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
*except Amazon and a few other big names.
Which only makes Apple's stance more solid. I don't know the details but if Apple did this it would only give them more reason to stand their ground as these dealings were supposed to be secret.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Exactly. Microsoft is being a hypocrite when one realizes Microsoft is (arguably) even more stringent about the Xbox Live store.
That's provably wrong.
You are 100% correct here. Right now, XBox does horribly in Japan, China and South Korea. Were Sony to come to them and say "hey, we want to do a JRPG subscription service on XBox, how much do we have to pay for access?" Microsoft would respond "you don't have to pay us ... we'll pay you!" in a heartbeat. And as I stated earlier, EA offers a subscription gaming service on XBox anyway. So these people are just flat wrong. They are showing that they really don't know anything about the tech world beyond Apple products. As usual.
EA is a software company that provides titles to users of Xbox. They did so with physical media and will do so with software subscriptions. I’m not sure that’s the same as allowing a platform competitor to do the same. Don’t really care tho, I’m no longer a gamer and don’t really care how these corps run their businesses.
The end of your paragraph is just silly bullshit tho. You may think only DIY neckbeaders know tech, but if you spend a few years on these forums you’ll realize that’s an ignorant position. Some of us have spent decades in software & enterprise.
For instance the reason Apple doesn’t let other app stores exist or emulate other platforms is a lesson learned decades ago and repeated every so often by those who ignore history... If a product allows devs to write for a broader platform and offers compatibility for it alongside their own native platform, devs will write for the broader platform and ignore the native (because why would you target the smaller if you don’t have to?). Then the native platform withers on the vine, before vanishing into obscurity. Old lesson.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
*except Amazon and a few other big names.
Which only makes Apple's stance more solid. I don't know the details but if Apple did this it would only give them more reason to stand their ground as these dealings were supposed to be secret.
Either way, THEIR Store, THEIR invention.
Don't like it? Create your own store.
Since you know Apple won't allow app 3rd party app stores, don't you think that would be better Apple if improved their App Store rules to allow new technologies, as cloud gaming?
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
You agree with Microsoft on this?
I asked McDonald's if I could set up a hot dog stand in their dining room in all their restaurants, and they refused. I think this is unfair because otherwise I would need to build my own restaurant, spend money to advertise, and pay for the overhead of running the store.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Exactly. Microsoft is being a hypocrite when one realizes Microsoft is (arguably) even more stringent about the Xbox Live store.
That's provably wrong.
You are 100% correct here. Right now, XBox does horribly in Japan, China and South Korea. Were Sony to come to them and say "hey, we want to do a JRPG subscription service on XBox, how much do we have to pay for access?" Microsoft would respond "you don't have to pay us ... we'll pay you!" in a heartbeat. And as I stated earlier, EA offers a subscription gaming service on XBox anyway. So these people are just flat wrong. They are showing that they really don't know anything about the tech world beyond Apple products. As usual.
EA is a software company that provides titles to users of Xbox. They did so with physical media and will do so with software subscriptions. I’m not sure that’s the same as allowing a platform competitor to do the same. Don’t really care tho, I’m no longer a gamer and don’t really care how these corps run their businesses.
The end of your paragraph is just silly bullshit tho. You may think only DIY neckbeaders know tech, but if you spend a few years on these forums you’ll realize that’s an ignorant position. Some of us have spent decades in software & enterprise.
For instance the reason Apple doesn’t let other app stores exist or emulate other platforms is a lesson learned decades ago and repeated every so often by those who ignore history... If a product allows devs to write for a broader platform and offers compatibility for it alongside their own native platform, devs will write for the broader platform and ignore the native (because why would you target the smaller if you don’t have to?). Then the native platform withers on the vine, before vanishing into obscurity. Old lesson.
xCloud, and for that matter Stadia, are not app stores. They're gaming streaming services. Their business model isn't different from Netflix except for the type of content they offer. And Apple's treatment of these services are app stores is out of date. And if they don't change their dogmatic stance voluntarily, I hope the government steps in and does something about it.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
When you have 1.7 million apps on your platform, you don't get the pleasure or the privilege of saying you're not a general purpose platform. If they did, that would be a BS argument. MS is the only competitor that has the size and economic clout to go after Apple on this and I'm glad that they're raising the issue regarding Apple's dogmatic handling of the App Store.
Apple is on point here. If you want to play on our platform play by our rules. I may be wrong, but I’m sure Microsoft is not letting Sony games stream to Xbox. Microsoft can’t be trusted. Why would they undermine their own development platform? If game developers were wooed to this and stopped developing for iOS directly, it would make us dependent on Microsoft like we were for the first Macintosh. Then when Microsoft looses interest like the tend to do, the platform would suffer.
Microsoft wants special treatment that is all.
MS just want their service in iOS devices, that is all.
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
*except Amazon and a few other big names.
Which only makes Apple's stance more solid. I don't know the details but if Apple did this it would only give them more reason to stand their ground as these dealings were supposed to be secret.
Either way, THEIR Store, THEIR invention.
Don't like it? Create your own store.
Since you know Apple won't allow app 3rd party app stores, don't you think that would be better Apple if improved their App Store rules to allow new technologies, as cloud gaming?
Maybe. But that's for Apple to decide, not some armchair CEOs on forums.
I agree with Microsoft on this, but Apple (if they say anything) will probably argue they are not a general purpose platform and instead compare themselves to the Xbox store. I really wish Apple would see iOS as the post-PC platform for everything.
You agree with Microsoft on this?
I asked McDonald's if I could set up a hot dog stand in their dining room in all their restaurants, and they refused. I think this is unfair because otherwise I would need to build my own restaurant, spend money to advertise, and pay for the overhead of running the store.
Who do you agree with?
The App Store does not belong to the users of this forum so it's easy for them to make demands and not deal with consequences.
Why doesn't Amazon provide links to competitors on their products? How anti-competitive of Amazon to run their store their way.
Comments
With SPECIAL treatment. Apple has the SAME rules for EVERYONE.
Everyone knows it's nothing to do with verification around the video of the apps being streamed, it's all about Apple not getting their 30%. I can run a multitude of VNC apps from the App Store and hell if I want to I can play games over VNC too, those aren't sanctioned by Apple. So why is it such a big issue when it's centred solely on gaming?
It's made by Microsoft.
Netflix doesn't have a video content store and you can't buy books on the Kindle app.
Microsoft will cave eventually. iKnockoff users are cheap bastards who love to steal and hate to pay.
I said this yesterday. Why do people think Apple giving Microsoft unfair treatment is good?
Which only makes Apple's stance more solid. I don't know the details but if Apple did this it would only give them more reason to stand their ground as these dealings were supposed to be secret.
Either way, THEIR Store, THEIR invention.
Don't like it? Create your own store.
The end of your paragraph is just silly bullshit tho. You may think only DIY neckbeaders know tech, but if you spend a few years on these forums you’ll realize that’s an ignorant position. Some of us have spent decades in software & enterprise.
For instance the reason Apple doesn’t let other app stores exist or emulate other platforms is a lesson learned decades ago and repeated every so often by those who ignore history... If a product allows devs to write for a broader platform and offers compatibility for it alongside their own native platform, devs will write for the broader platform and ignore the native (because why would you target the smaller if you don’t have to?). Then the native platform withers on the vine, before vanishing into obscurity. Old lesson.
You agree with Microsoft on this?
I asked McDonald's if I could set up a hot dog stand in their dining room in all their restaurants, and they refused. I think this is unfair because otherwise I would need to build my own restaurant, spend money to advertise, and pay for the overhead of running the store.
Maybe. But that's for Apple to decide, not some armchair CEOs on forums.
The App Store does not belong to the users of this forum so it's easy for them to make demands and not deal with consequences.
Why doesn't Amazon provide links to competitors on their products? How anti-competitive of Amazon to run their store their way.