Both are welcome but I have a my doubts about magsafe coming back. Removing an unpopular feature (apologies to the touch bar aficionados) is one thing. Bringing back an old port in my opinion is no Apple style....
What is this based on? Did you conduct a survey of the 30 million or so people who own a touchbar Mac? Please share the results with us.
30 Million is a drop in the bucket of even Mac users let alone iPhone.
30 million would be around 25% of the installed Mac user base (total was around 110 million in May of 2019). Hardly "a drop in the bucket".
Both are welcome but I have a my doubts about magsafe coming back. Removing an unpopular feature (apologies to the touch bar aficionados) is one thing. Bringing back an old port in my opinion is no Apple style....
What is this based on? Did you conduct a survey of the 30 million or so people who own a touchbar Mac? Please share the results with us.
30 Million is a drop in the bucket of even Mac users let alone iPhone.
30 million would be around 25% of the installed Mac user base (total was around 110 million in May of 2019). Hardly "a drop in the bucket".
The TouchBar was meant as a substitute for touch screen displays. Apple not only lost that battle but, the industry has already moved on from that primitive configuration.
The future is in 2 in 1's.
My 8th grade grandson needs either a 2 in 1 or both a laptop and a separate tablet if he is going to complete his school work.
A MacBook can't do it by itself and neither can an iPad do it by itself (although it can come closer!) -- and that's for an 8th grade student!
It's yet to be determined if the iPad will fill the role of the 2 in 1 or if it will be the MacBook -- or maybe a brand new third product. But Apple has fallen too far behind the times and, one way or another needs to catch back up.
Yep, this is just another sign that Apple is rethinking a lot of the their design mistakes. I like USB-C but still hope they add MAGSafe, HDMI, SD Card reader back. Ideally the MBP would have 2 USB-C on each side, MAGSafe on back display using the iPhone MAGSafe, and HDMI on one side and SD card reader on the other.
I also expect this to indicated that we will have touch based MACS within 3 years with the new M1 macs being able to run iPhone and iPad apps. Right now it's like the Macs are stuck in the 1950's .
After using it for 2 ½ years on my MBP the Touch Bar is a big Meh. Occasionally it's helpful, most often it's a big gimmick. Save the money and leave it out.
I still miss MagSafe on a regular basis. The magsafe connector was far easier to connect and also had a convenient LED to know when you were done charging. Considering that charging is the one thing that EVERY laptop user does, it makes sense to have a dedicated connection for it. (I've tried a 3rd party USB C magnetic charging adapter and it was garbage - I want apple quality on this!)
I still miss USB A ports. Just last week I got a Logitech wireless mouse that had... a USB A connector! This week I got a new BT keyboard, and it also came with a USB A cord! If they're are obsolete, Apple really needs to tell the rest of the world that's still using them. Honestly, an HDMI port would be nice, too. Yes, you can use USB C for video, but I just bought a new 4k monitor and pretty much every monitor on the market has HDMI. I only found a handful that had USB C. The other problem with using TB/USB C for the monitor is that any other USB connection through it is significantly slowed so you end up having to use 2 ports anyway.
I think that Apple thought switching to USB C would help the world switch over to it, but because they dropped SD Card Reader and HDMI port which many still used it was easier and cheaper for everyone to just go out and buy one multi-port dock and continue using their old peripherals. Also should have come out with wired USB-C keyboard. I look forward to these new machines finally coming out instead of the crap designs they have had the last 5 years. Till then I'll keep using my 2015 MBP (wish I could upgrade it someway but will wait).
I think that Apple thought switching to USB C would help the world switch over to it
The big problem here is the massively elongated refresh cycles for laptops and desktops compared to prior to about 2010. It used to be that a three-year old laptop was barely useable for newer software, with new machines dramatically faster and more capable in every way, often whilst being smaller and/or lighter and/or having longer battery life. This made it relatively easy to shift a very large % of the installed base to a new I/O solution. That just hasn't happened with USB-C.
I'm still using a six-year old MacBook Pro, and for the most part it is plenty fast and capable for everything I want to do with it, and I don't feel I'm missing out on much by not having USB-C. However, if I moved to a machine with USB-C only, that would be sure to frustrate me with the number of peripherals out there that still use USB-A, and the number of displays that support HDMI.
I can't quite see "more ports" coming to Mac notebooks, but if I may fantasize a bit...
What if there was a "MagSafe" connection that incorporated both power and optical data connections?
This would allow a magnetically attached dock (preferably Apple designed, but open to 3rd parties) that transferred both power and data.
I can't be the first person to think of this and maybe it's not really practical, but I just thought it would be fun to put it out there.
Thunderbolt was originally conceived as an optical technology (remember, Intel originally called it "Lightpeak"), so the data interface should be straightforward. If held magnetically, it better be a strong one and I guess there ought to be some other provision to deal with the potential of an unwanted data disconnect. Also, I would prefer this connection on the rear of the notebook. This could lead to a better integrated port expansion concept than the glorified dongles that are out there now. (The small docks that attach directly to the side of the Mac are OK but I worry about the force on the USB-C connectors).
PS: Speaking of docks, the other day, I came across a 15-in-1 dock that actually integrated wireless charging (for a phone) into its case in addition to the many connections. It was kinda scary cheap but it is a clever idea.
I can only hope the MagSafe rumor is bogus. I like being able to plug in power from either side -- I've also been looking forward to being able to standardize completely on USB-C power supplies -- I do not want to have minor pressure go on knocking out the MagSafe plug from the mandatorily left side of my computer.
I like the TouchBar. I do not want to see that go. I also am fine with the USB-C port standardization -- going back to USB-A likely will mean returning to a thicker case, unless they want to have case deformation like they used to for a while there around Ethernet and FireWire ports that were really too wide for the aluminum sides of the computer.
They've hit the sweet spot in case and keyboard design with the latest 16" Intel Macs and with the M1 MacBook Pro. Don't wreck this, Apple.
Both are welcome but I have a my doubts about magsafe coming back. Removing an unpopular feature (apologies to the touch bar aficionados) is one thing. Bringing back an old port in my opinion is no Apple style....
I see you have a small number of posts, did you use a different screen name when MagSafe was first removed? It was an extremely well loved “old port”.
No, I just don't post that much. No disagreements on "well loved" part, I had it in my previous MBP. But another comment about bringing it back in a different form factor seems to make more sense given Apple's history with ports.
I can only hope the MagSafe rumor is bogus. I like being able to plug in power from either side -- I've also been looking forward to being able to standardize completely on USB-C power supplies -- I do not want to have minor pressure go on knocking out the MagSafe plug from the mandatorily left side of my computer.
I like the TouchBar. I do not want to see that go. I also am fine with the USB-C port standardization -- going back to USB-A likely will mean returning to a thicker case, unless they want to have case deformation like they used to for a while there around Ethernet and FireWire ports that were really too wide for the aluminum sides of the computer.
They've hit the sweet spot in case and keyboard design with the latest 16" Intel Macs and with the M1 MacBook Pro. Don't wreck this, Apple.
They could retain USB-C power and just put the magnetic part on the charger like how Griffin did it:
It would have been better done like that originally to keep all the cost in the charger and make it optional. If they improve the design, people can upgrade the charger cable and would benefit from it with existing laptops.
The touchbar is ok but it's like 3D touch on the iPhone. It's not a feature that needs to be there and it makes some interaction less efficient. I think it makes sense to put the best use cases of the touchbar into the trackpad like on the Asus laptop:
The calculator is a good example. Another use case is for developers because the ARM chips let developers run iOS apps natively but there's still no touch input so when debugging an app, it's still better to use a device. With a display under the trackpad, that pad can behave like an iPhone with touch interaction and there can be a key or gesture to switch it between app mode and trackpad mode (developers would likely use an external mouse anyway). They can add a Swype type keyboard option to it if people type faster on those.
I think that Apple thought switching to USB C would help the world switch over to it
The big problem here is the massively elongated refresh cycles for laptops and desktops compared to prior to about 2010. It used to be that a three-year old laptop was barely useable for newer software, with new machines dramatically faster and more capable in every way, often whilst being smaller and/or lighter and/or having longer battery life. This made it relatively easy to shift a very large % of the installed base to a new I/O solution. That just hasn't happened with USB-C.
I'm still using a six-year old MacBook Pro, and for the most part it is plenty fast and capable for everything I want to do with it, and I don't feel I'm missing out on much by not having USB-C. However, if I moved to a machine with USB-C only, that would be sure to frustrate me with the number of peripherals out there that still use USB-A, and the number of displays that support HDMI.
I have a 2015 MBP and have purposely not upgraded due to the ButterFly keyboard and lack of HDMI.
It's like Victoria Principal has woken up and Bobby is back.
To me, MagSafe & Touch Bar are minor issues, they don’t hurt sells either way. Add: unless the MagSafe makes the charger proprietary again, that sucks.
I’m more concerned about how many cores in the processor. If 8+4 is the highest it could go, that’s way too little for the new architecture, not competitive at all.
I can only hope the MagSafe rumor is bogus. I like being able to plug in power from either side -- I've also been looking forward to being able to standardize completely on USB-C power supplies -- I do not want to have minor pressure go on knocking out the MagSafe plug from the mandatorily left side of my computer.
I like the TouchBar. I do not want to see that go. I also am fine with the USB-C port standardization -- going back to USB-A likely will mean returning to a thicker case, unless they want to have case deformation like they used to for a while there around Ethernet and FireWire ports that were really too wide for the aluminum sides of the computer.
They've hit the sweet spot in case and keyboard design with the latest 16" Intel Macs and with the M1 MacBook Pro. Don't wreck this, Apple.
I think that Apple thought switching to USB C would help the world switch over to it
The big problem here is the massively elongated refresh cycles for laptops and desktops compared to prior to about 2010. It used to be that a three-year old laptop was barely useable for newer software, with new machines dramatically faster and more capable in every way, often whilst being smaller and/or lighter and/or having longer battery life. This made it relatively easy to shift a very large % of the installed base to a new I/O solution. That just hasn't happened with USB-C.
I'm still using a six-year old MacBook Pro, and for the most part it is plenty fast and capable for everything I want to do with it, and I don't feel I'm missing out on much by not having USB-C. However, if I moved to a machine with USB-C only, that would be sure to frustrate me with the number of peripherals out there that still use USB-A, and the number of displays that support HDMI.
I have a 2015 MBP and have purposely not upgraded due to the ButterFly keyboard and lack of HDMI.
It's like Victoria Principal has woken up and Bobby is back.
To those who’s hoping for for the USB-A: no. Otherwise there’ll be rumors for it. I think there might be alternatives to Thunderbolt, but Apple portables are done with any legacy port.
Also, if MagSafe is returning, it could only means to be better than you regular USB-PD, or there’s no reason for it to exist.
It's quite infuriating when people refer to USB-A as a "legacy" port. It is not legacy, it is a ubiquitous, industry-standard connector that is just not going away like people thought it would (mainly for the reason I outlined earlier). iMacs, Mac minis, and Mac Pros all still have USB-A, although ironically it's the portables that need USB-A more (to save having to carry around a dongle/adaptor).
I can only hope the MagSafe rumor is bogus. I like being able to plug in power from either side -- I've also been looking forward to being able to standardize completely on USB-C power supplies -- I do not want to have minor pressure go on knocking out the MagSafe plug from the mandatorily left side of my computer.
I like the TouchBar. I do not want to see that go. I also am fine with the USB-C port standardization -- going back to USB-A likely will mean returning to a thicker case, unless they want to have case deformation like they used to for a while there around Ethernet and FireWire ports that were really too wide for the aluminum sides of the computer.
They've hit the sweet spot in case and keyboard design with the latest 16" Intel Macs and with the M1 MacBook Pro. Don't wreck this, Apple.
They could retain USB-C power and just put the magnetic part on the charger like how Griffin did it:
It would have been better done like that originally to keep all the cost in the charger and make it optional. If they improve the design, people can upgrade the charger cable and would benefit from it with existing laptops.
The touchbar is ok but it's like 3D touch on the iPhone. It's not a feature that needs to be there and it makes some interaction less efficient. I think it makes sense to put the best use cases of the touchbar into the trackpad like on the Asus laptop:
The calculator is a good example. Another use case is for developers because the ARM chips let developers run iOS apps natively but there's still no touch input so when debugging an app, it's still better to use a device. With a display under the trackpad, that pad can behave like an iPhone with touch interaction and there can be a key or gesture to switch it between app mode and trackpad mode (developers would likely use an external mouse anyway). They can add a Swype type keyboard option to it if people type faster on those.
Maybe in between: a proprietary port with third-party cable option, PD still retained for legacy charging. IMO the only reason for MagSafe is to be better than PD, the magnetic part is low-tech and easily doable.
Most people don’t care about the Touch Bar, doesn’t mean they hate it but it remains just an add-on and won’t hurt anyone when it’s gone. No big deal.
My main concern is how many cores we’ll get or will we see better cooling. Since board size likely to shrink with more processors inside the SoC, it’s likely that we’ll see larger heat sink/fans with a relatively shorter heat pipe. Speakers likely to elongated too. The bottom may get flatter but not flat as the iPads/iPhones.
It's quite infuriating when people refer to USB-A as a "legacy" port. It is not legacy, it is a ubiquitous, industry-standard connector that is just not going away like people thought it would (mainly for the reason I outlined earlier). iMacs, Mac minis, and Mac Pros all still have USB-A, although ironically it's the portables that need USB-A more (to save having to carry around a dongle/adaptor).
What about LightningBolt?
Lightning upgraded to have an Optical line embedded in the tongue to carry a Thunderbolt channel out to 50m.
Port then allows one set of Apple-approved accessories to cover legacy ports across all devices, so the ones that work with iPhone work with your Macbook.
Apple now has its own Thunderbolt chips so just need the lasers from intel or someone else to make the next new thing they want in the market to push the standards the way they want.
Team up with Corning for the cabling.
Not fully Magsafe but would be more robust than USB-c for primary connection to a monitor or dock.
Just a question if the pins on 2 sided can handle 100w power delivery.
It's quite infuriating when people refer to USB-A as a "legacy" port. It is not legacy, it is a ubiquitous, industry-standard connector that is just not going away like people thought it would (mainly for the reason I outlined earlier). iMacs, Mac minis, and Mac Pros all still have USB-A, although ironically it's the portables that need USB-A more (to save having to carry around a dongle/adaptor).
The fastest Type-A you can get is 10Gbps, after that it’s all Type-C. In that essence, it is “legacy.” This doesn’t mean it’ll go away, I got tons of Type-A stuff too, then again Apple isn’t known for retaining legacy, like it or not.
And what about more powerful Mac mini. There is no single rumor about it.
You mean the one that just came out a couple months ago?
Hahaha. No. I mean one that will will have more ports and more powerful M1variant and will replace current Intel version. Apple could easily stick 4x M1 into these chassis without thermal issue.
I love the Touch Bar, especially the version with a discrete esc key.
The only issue with it: it doesn’t default to function keys during boot, but is blacked out. This makes dealing with booting a boot-camp partition in Windows recovery mode problematic without external USB keyboard. And that’s a problem the ARM based Macs won’t have to worry about until M$ officially releases Win10-ARM. So, yeah, I’d miss the Touch Bar!
Also: who needs a stupid proprietary MagSafe power cable, when there are plenty aftermarket USB-C MagSafe-like cables?
The reason why people like the MagSafe connector is that the laptop disconnects if you accidentally trip over the power cable. I know first hand that it happens quite often and having the MagSafe does come to the rescue.
Maybe you're putting your power cord in a stupid location if this happens "quite often"?
I have a feeling MS will have no choice but to reinvest itself in to a Win 10 ARM version. Now that it sees what Apple has done to its operating system under ARM, they really don’t have a choice. Might take 2-3 years, but it will come.
Comments
https://www.aboveavalon.com/notes/2019/5/30/apples-billion-users
I'm not sure where that "30 million or so" number comes from, though.
I also expect this to indicated that we will have touch based MACS within 3 years with the new M1 macs being able to run iPhone and iPad apps. Right now it's like the Macs are stuck in the 1950's .
I think that Apple thought switching to USB C would help the world switch over to it, but because they dropped SD Card Reader and HDMI port which many still used it was easier and cheaper for everyone to just go out and buy one multi-port dock and continue using their old peripherals. Also should have come out with wired USB-C keyboard. I look forward to these new machines finally coming out instead of the crap designs they have had the last 5 years. Till then I'll keep using my 2015 MBP (wish I could upgrade it someway but will wait).
I'm still using a six-year old MacBook Pro, and for the most part it is plenty fast and capable for everything I want to do with it, and I don't feel I'm missing out on much by not having USB-C. However, if I moved to a machine with USB-C only, that would be sure to frustrate me with the number of peripherals out there that still use USB-A, and the number of displays that support HDMI.
What if there was a "MagSafe" connection that incorporated both power and optical data connections?
This would allow a magnetically attached dock (preferably Apple designed, but open to 3rd parties) that transferred both power and data.
I can't be the first person to think of this and maybe it's not really practical, but I just thought it would be fun to put it out there.
Thunderbolt was originally conceived as an optical technology (remember, Intel originally called it "Lightpeak"), so the data interface should be straightforward. If held magnetically, it better be a strong one and I guess there ought to be some other provision to deal with the potential of an unwanted data disconnect. Also, I would prefer this connection on the rear of the notebook. This could lead to a better integrated port expansion concept than the glorified dongles that are out there now. (The small docks that attach directly to the side of the Mac are OK but I worry about the force on the USB-C connectors).
PS: Speaking of docks, the other day, I came across a 15-in-1 dock that actually integrated wireless charging (for a phone) into its case in addition to the many connections. It was kinda scary cheap but it is a clever idea.
I like the TouchBar. I do not want to see that go. I also am fine with the USB-C port standardization -- going back to USB-A likely will mean returning to a thicker case, unless they want to have case deformation like they used to for a while there around Ethernet and FireWire ports that were really too wide for the aluminum sides of the computer.
They've hit the sweet spot in case and keyboard design with the latest 16" Intel Macs and with the M1 MacBook Pro. Don't wreck this, Apple.
It would have been better done like that originally to keep all the cost in the charger and make it optional. If they improve the design, people can upgrade the charger cable and would benefit from it with existing laptops.
The touchbar is ok but it's like 3D touch on the iPhone. It's not a feature that needs to be there and it makes some interaction less efficient. I think it makes sense to put the best use cases of the touchbar into the trackpad like on the Asus laptop:
https://www.engadget.com/2018-06-05-asus-zenbook-pro-screenpad-touchpad-touchscreen.html
The calculator is a good example. Another use case is for developers because the ARM chips let developers run iOS apps natively but there's still no touch input so when debugging an app, it's still better to use a device. With a display under the trackpad, that pad can behave like an iPhone with touch interaction and there can be a key or gesture to switch it between app mode and trackpad mode (developers would likely use an external mouse anyway). They can add a Swype type keyboard option to it if people type faster on those.
It also gives the two level click feedback. A swipe down from the top of the trackpad could bring the bar down and tap a close icon to dismiss it. It would probably look better if the idle state of the pad was the same color as the laptop rather than black but it would be easy to adjust to it looking like a display. It would be even better if it got Apple Pencil support as people could illustrate in Photoshop and iPad apps.
https://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2020/05/apple-wins-patent-for-next-gen-magic-trackpad-that-allows-apple-pencil-input-and-acts-as-a-wireless-charger-for-idevices.html
It's like Victoria Principal has woken up and Bobby is back.
I’m more concerned about how many cores in the processor. If 8+4 is the highest it could go, that’s way too little for the new architecture, not competitive at all.
Also, if MagSafe is returning, it could only means to be better than you regular USB-PD, or there’s no reason for it to exist.
Most people don’t care about the Touch Bar, doesn’t mean they hate it but it remains just an add-on and won’t hurt anyone when it’s gone. No big deal.
My main concern is how many cores we’ll get or will we see better cooling. Since board size likely to shrink with more processors inside the SoC, it’s likely that we’ll see larger heat sink/fans with a relatively shorter heat pipe. Speakers likely to elongated too. The bottom may get flatter but not flat as the iPads/iPhones.
This doesn’t mean it’ll go away, I got tons of Type-A stuff too, then again Apple isn’t known for retaining legacy, like it or not.
Hahaha. No. I mean one that will will have more ports and more powerful M1variant and will replace current Intel version. Apple could easily stick 4x M1 into these chassis without thermal issue.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/arm/