PS: do you have any of Ornette with teh original Prime Time Band . . . you know, with Jaamaldeen Tacumeh et al.?!
I'm really ashamed to admit it but I've only got one of Ornette Coleman's albums. I've got 'This is Our Music' (which might even be his first, I think) but none of the electric harmolodic stuff, which I do like a lot all the same. James Ulmer rules. I've got three or four of his.
But I think he really made his name with "the Shape Of Jazz To Come" in 1959
and of course: "Free Jazz" in '1960
I have the vynil of "This is Our Music" and I gotta say: that is THE picture!!
You can see what I mean by "The Coolest" guys in the world . . . they are so hip!
You gotta get a copy of teh Ornette and James Blood Ulmer (with Jamaaldeen too) it is the most intense hard driving album that I own (mainly because it is both intense and very non-conventional(aka:weird)) . . . and I have a fair amount of old-school hardcore punk ala "Land Speed Record" & Maximum R&R stuff and etc . . .
Louis Armstrong also made the cut for music to leave our Solar System on Voyager's Golden Record, but "Melancholy Blues" might be considered more Blues than Jazz... YMMV
If it's good enough for Carl Sagan to compile and send to aliens...
Wow, AO has pretty damn good taste in Jazz. There's nothing I could add to the above posts except in response to DefJef. If you are looking for truly out there weirdness or the hardcore equivalent of jazz, see if you can get hold of...
Naked City - Torture Garden Bebop / hardcore / surf / country / noise / punk / R&B fusion...insanely great. Amazing line-up included John Zorn, Bill Frisell, Wayne Horvitz, Fred Frith, Joey Baron and Boredoms' frontman Eye Yamataka (Mike Patton also guested on a few Naked City tracks from other releases). The entire Torture Garden LP is currently available on a 2 CD set called Black Box. The original release might cost a bit, so this is the one to go for.
Spy vs. Spy - Spy vs. Spy More Zorn. Another amazing line-up. Two alto sax, two drums, one bass. Stripped down, hardcore speed re-interpretations of the music of Ornette Coleman. Mastered so you can cancel out one stereo channel and just listen either to Zorn or Tim Berne on sax.
Peter Brötzmann - Machine Gun Classic 1968 free jazz / noise album from a crazy German with too much energy (and several of his friends).
Die Like A Dog - Little Birds Have Fast Hearts Peter Brötzmann doing more crazy noisy shit 30 years later.
Contortions - Buy Contortions Not really Jazz per-se, but heavily Jazz and Funk influenced Post-Punk that was instrumental in my starting to listen to Jazz in the first place. Check it out if you want to hear how a saxophone can be twice as aggressive as a guitar or screamed vocal.
Ken Burns documentary was good in what it covered. what it didn't cover,
and what it ignored was a huge dissapointment. a documentary with this breadth of scope shouldn't have a point of view, unfortunately ken burns had too much of Wynton Marsalis's and Stanley Crouch's point of view.
agreed.
yet your top ten list includes Wynton Marsalis "Majesty of the Blues"
Tracks 3, 4, and 5 are collectively titled "The New Orleans Function",
and include "The Death of Jazz", a Stanley Crouch Sermon titled "Premature Autopsies", and a rousing Happy Feet Blues.
20+ minutes of 'Album listening' exploration of Jazz/Culture via the Wynton/Stanley sound.
One of my favourite jazz pieces, incidentally, but they hit a threshold of STFU some days
If I had only one Jazz track for my desert island (or spaceflight), I'd have to choose
Wow, AO has pretty damn good taste in Jazz. There's nothing I could add to the above posts except in response to DefJef. If you are looking for truly out there weirdness or the hardcore equivalent of jazz, see if you can get hold of...
Naked City - Torture Garden Bebop / hardcore / surf / country / noise / punk / R&B fusion...insanely great. Amazing line-up included John Zorn, Bill Frisell, Wayne Horvitz, Fred Frith, Joey Baron and Boredoms' frontman Eye Yamataka (Mike Patton also guested on a few Naked City tracks from other releases). The entire Torture Garden LP is currently available on a 2 CD set called Black Box. The original release might cost a bit, so this is the one to go for.
Spy vs. Spy - Spy vs. Spy More Zorn. Another amazing line-up. Two alto sax, two drums, one bass. Stripped down, hardcore speed re-interpretations of the music of Ornette Coleman. Mastered so you can cancel out one stereo channel and just listen either to Zorn or Tim Berne on sax.
Peter Brötzmann - Machine Gun Classic 1968 free jazz / noise album from a crazy German with too much energy (and several of his friends).
Die Like A Dog - Little Birds Have Fast Hearts Peter Brötzmann doing more crazy noisy shit 30 years later.
Contortions - Buy Contortions Not really Jazz per-se, but heavily Jazz and Funk influenced Post-Punk that was instrumental in my starting to listen to Jazz in the first place. Check it out if you want to hear how a saxophone can be twice as aggressive as a guitar or screamed vocal.
YEAH . . of course ! excellent suggestions for the guy who likes metal intensity . . that whole NY Kitchen scene stuff . . . super loud distortion craziness . . . excellent experimental musicianship
and John Zorn in general is interesting: 'Kristallnacht' is a dark dark meditation on the evening that is now known as by that name, and it has one of the most intense profound guitar solos ever . .. by Mark Ribot
Up there with Hendrix Live Machine Gun at Isle Of White and 'Are You Experienced' from the Concerts album . . . well . . . maybe not THAT good
Weird, I was just reading about them today...never heard their stuff, but the line-up sounds interesting (Bill Laswell certainly gets around). I'll have to check them out...
you've got to give wynton and stanley their due, but i'm with you, they should shut up.
they only speak well of the dead, if your alive and not part of the lincoln center cognoscenti you are screwed. it seems that they are only critical of jazz musicians currently trying to break ground, if you worship the past they'll give you a pass.
their sway has diminished in the last few years and i've heard wynton is not crouch's puppet any longer, so we'll see. but just the other day downbeat ran a piece about diana krall and elvis costello's marriage and how it would effect them musically, and wynton just tore elvis a new asshole. he's seems to relish tearing people down, i wish he had any of his brother's personalities, but he doesn't.
wynton (and crouch) should have won the Pulitzer for "The New Orleans Function" instead of the dreadful "Blood on the Fields"
oh, and at my wedding the walk-out music was to "Oh, But On the Third Day."
"Majesty of the Blues" is a perfect album.
I love Marcus as well, my favorite is "Alone With Three Giants." (Monk, what can i say?) he came in my store once and autogreaphed my copy of "Deep in the Shed,"
While I have to say that I'm impressed with all the suggestions given, I thought I'd offer a few choice gems of contemporary jazz, which really hasn't been represented on this thread so far.
Not that I'm too surprised why. Most contemporary jazz these days is crap. Aural wallpaper at the very best. It is my contention that the advent of the compact disc killed the creativity of contemporary jazz by prompting artists to concentrate almost solely on perfecting the sound quality of the presentation, not the creativity of the music. Since that time, much of contemporary jazz has become empty and soulless. Hence, the almost unlistenable "Smooth Jazz" genre.
However, before that time, the late 70's gave rise to some great contemporary jazz performers and albums, and with the passage of time, many of these are now considered classics, and deservedly so. Here are some of my favorites:
The Pat Metheny GroupThe Pat Metheny Group
While most people look to their later album Offramp as their true creative breakthrough, I am very partial to their "white album," released in 1978. There is something beautiful and haunting about these tracks, and if you like your jazz more ethereal (yet with rhythm), you can't go wrong with this album. And yes, it was originally released on ECM.
Joe SampleCarmel
The second album from the Crusaders' former pianist remains the best thing he ever recorded. Wonderfully written material with a wide range of emotional feeling. And considering all songs were inspired by places in and around Monterey, California, he absolutely captured the area perfectly through his music.
Jean-Luc PontyCosmic Messenger
Violinist Ponty created his own contemporary jazz sub-genre, but he pretty much started repeating himself in the 1980s. This is his last album before his slow downhill slide, and it includes more rock textures than anything else he ever recorded, so if you like jazz fusion, you'll really appreciate this album. Aurora and Upon the Wings of Music are also very highly recommended.
yoh, and at my wedding the walk-out music was to "Oh, But On the Third Day."
On my wedding the dance song was Naima . . . . best song EVAR!
It was played by a band with an ex girlfriend playing sax . .
. .
as far as the Ken Burns things: I lost respect for the whole series when he allowed Branford Marsalis to call Cecil Taylor's outside-mastery 'indulgent bullshit' . . . I mean . . . talk about indulgent bullshit, he indulges in his own quicksand staid ideology of jazz, and self-important image to the point that he doesn't recognize a form of creative brilliance . . .
when it isn't some lame rehashed, NOrleans, Jazz-Poster, clean and clever mallarky he doesn't know what to do with it super-lame!
Though I did see Wynton play with Elvin Jones and he played ALL Coltrane middle period stuff (which surprised me completely) and did it perfectly . . . sounding very much like a saxophone . . . and even like Coltrane's sax . . . I was impressed.
In Branford's defense he says the quote was taken out of context, he says in fact he was responding to a tape played to him of Cecil Taylor making a specific comment on something.
He says it was edited and slipped in to the piece as if he was commenting on his music.
I think Branford deserves the benefit of the doubt because he is rarely condescending of anyone.
Wow! I had no idea you guys were into jazz so much. That's great because I grew up with jazz. My dad was a musician and played piano, trumpet, and trombone.
He was really into Oscar Peterson and Bill Evans.
I really can't add much to what everybody else has listed here except for maybe Chick Corea or Herbie Hancock. If you can find an album with both ( they did some really great duet albums with just 2 grand pianos ) that would be something you might like. I saw them in concert once together and to this day I haven't seen anything like it since.
Both of them have done separately many kinds of jazz over the years ( electric or acoustic ) so there alot of material out there by both.
A friend of mine told me a very funny story about Wynton Marsalis. The wanker.
Wynton was once button-holed by former Funkadelic keyboard player (and genius) Bernie Worrell at a party. Bernie got up him against against a wall and told him not to be so regressive and generally sniffy about modern music ('indulgent bullshit' indeed.)
What's funny is that Bernie Worrell kept on calling him 'Winston'. About thirty times.
OK. Not that funny.
But there was also the time Wynton came up on stage at the end of a Miles Davis concert. He came up to Miles after the latter had just taken a solo; the conversation, according to Miles, went like this.
one night coltrane is playing in chicago during a horrible blizzard.
a fan is driving from milwaukee to chicago in the blizzard only to get to the club to find the patrons filing out and the band packing up.
the fan doesn't really care, it was worth the drive just to see trane in the flesh
even if he is packing his horn away.
he goes up and introduces himself and explains the drive through the blizzard and says how he just wanted to meet him.....colytrane sits him down pulls out his soprano and does a twenty minute "favorite things" for an audience of one.
I don't know if perhaps this is not what you were asking suggestions for, but noone's mentioned Sarah Vaughan. "Desert Island Disks" is a wonderful album, as well as anything else from her collection. A lot of people rank her second next to Ella F., but it doesn't really matter a whole lot to me. She had some incredible improv jazz artists with her for "Desert Island."
Comments
Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah
Anything by Roland Kirk.
I just listened to I Talk With the Spirits last night. What a beauty.
If you like Kirk and don't mind Jazz made in the last decade, try T.J. Kirk.
Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah
Oh oh oh: 'Brown Rice' by Don Cherry.
Anything by Roland Kirk. The Music Revelation Orchestra (James Blood Ulmer, Jamaaladeen Tacuma) are good. Funky.
i like these latter suggestions Hassan . . . seems we have listened to some of the same people.
BTW, I used to live in the same neighborhood as Don Cherry in SF and would see him on the sidewalk often . ..
PS: do you have any of Ornette with teh original Prime Time Band . . . you know, with Jaamaldeen Tacumeh et al.?!
Originally posted by pfflam
PS: do you have any of Ornette with teh original Prime Time Band . . . you know, with Jaamaldeen Tacumeh et al.?!
I'm really ashamed to admit it but I've only got one of Ornette Coleman's albums. I've got 'This is Our Music' (which might even be his first, I think) but none of the electric harmolodic stuff, which I do like a lot all the same. James Ulmer rules. I've got three or four of his.
Henry Threadgill, pflamm: yes.
But I think he really made his name with "the Shape Of Jazz To Come" in 1959
and of course: "Free Jazz" in '1960
I have the vynil of "This is Our Music" and I gotta say: that is THE picture!!
You can see what I mean by "The Coolest" guys in the world . . . they are so hip!
You gotta get a copy of teh Ornette and James Blood Ulmer (with Jamaaldeen too) it is the most intense hard driving album that I own (mainly because it is both intense and very non-conventional(aka:weird)) . . . and I have a fair amount of old-school hardcore punk ala "Land Speed Record" & Maximum R&R stuff and etc . . .
but mostly Rock and some slightly eclectic stuff.
Louis Armstrong also made the cut for music to leave our Solar System on Voyager's Golden Record, but "Melancholy Blues" might be considered more Blues than Jazz... YMMV
If it's good enough for Carl Sagan to compile and send to aliens...
Naked City - Torture Garden Bebop / hardcore / surf / country / noise / punk / R&B fusion...insanely great. Amazing line-up included John Zorn, Bill Frisell, Wayne Horvitz, Fred Frith, Joey Baron and Boredoms' frontman Eye Yamataka (Mike Patton also guested on a few Naked City tracks from other releases). The entire Torture Garden LP is currently available on a 2 CD set called Black Box. The original release might cost a bit, so this is the one to go for.
Spy vs. Spy - Spy vs. Spy More Zorn. Another amazing line-up. Two alto sax, two drums, one bass. Stripped down, hardcore speed re-interpretations of the music of Ornette Coleman. Mastered so you can cancel out one stereo channel and just listen either to Zorn or Tim Berne on sax.
Peter Brötzmann - Machine Gun Classic 1968 free jazz / noise album from a crazy German with too much energy (and several of his friends).
Die Like A Dog - Little Birds Have Fast Hearts Peter Brötzmann doing more crazy noisy shit 30 years later.
Contortions - Buy Contortions Not really Jazz per-se, but heavily Jazz and Funk influenced Post-Punk that was instrumental in my starting to listen to Jazz in the first place. Check it out if you want to hear how a saxophone can be twice as aggressive as a guitar or screamed vocal.
Originally posted by superkarate monkeydeathcar
Ken Burns documentary was good in what it covered. what it didn't cover,
and what it ignored was a huge dissapointment. a documentary with this breadth of scope shouldn't have a point of view, unfortunately ken burns had too much of Wynton Marsalis's and Stanley Crouch's point of view.
agreed.
yet your top ten list includes Wynton Marsalis "Majesty of the Blues"
Tracks 3, 4, and 5 are collectively titled "The New Orleans Function",
and include "The Death of Jazz", a Stanley Crouch Sermon titled "Premature Autopsies", and a rousing Happy Feet Blues.
20+ minutes of 'Album listening' exploration of Jazz/Culture via the Wynton/Stanley sound.
One of my favourite jazz pieces, incidentally, but they hit a threshold of STFU some days
If I had only one Jazz track for my desert island (or spaceflight), I'd have to choose
- 28 minutes of Gershwin that gives chills.
Not just genius. Pure genius.
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
Wow, AO has pretty damn good taste in Jazz. There's nothing I could add to the above posts except in response to DefJef. If you are looking for truly out there weirdness or the hardcore equivalent of jazz, see if you can get hold of...
Naked City - Torture Garden Bebop / hardcore / surf / country / noise / punk / R&B fusion...insanely great. Amazing line-up included John Zorn, Bill Frisell, Wayne Horvitz, Fred Frith, Joey Baron and Boredoms' frontman Eye Yamataka (Mike Patton also guested on a few Naked City tracks from other releases). The entire Torture Garden LP is currently available on a 2 CD set called Black Box. The original release might cost a bit, so this is the one to go for.
Spy vs. Spy - Spy vs. Spy More Zorn. Another amazing line-up. Two alto sax, two drums, one bass. Stripped down, hardcore speed re-interpretations of the music of Ornette Coleman. Mastered so you can cancel out one stereo channel and just listen either to Zorn or Tim Berne on sax.
Peter Brötzmann - Machine Gun Classic 1968 free jazz / noise album from a crazy German with too much energy (and several of his friends).
Die Like A Dog - Little Birds Have Fast Hearts Peter Brötzmann doing more crazy noisy shit 30 years later.
Contortions - Buy Contortions Not really Jazz per-se, but heavily Jazz and Funk influenced Post-Punk that was instrumental in my starting to listen to Jazz in the first place. Check it out if you want to hear how a saxophone can be twice as aggressive as a guitar or screamed vocal.
YEAH . . of course ! excellent suggestions for the guy who likes metal intensity . . that whole NY Kitchen scene stuff . . . super loud distortion craziness . . . excellent experimental musicianship
and John Zorn in general is interesting: 'Kristallnacht' is a dark dark meditation on the evening that is now known as by that name, and it has one of the most intense profound guitar solos ever . .. by Mark Ribot
Up there with Hendrix Live Machine Gun at Isle Of White and 'Are You Experienced' from the Concerts album . . . well . . . maybe not THAT good
and also : the band Last Exit . . .
Originally posted by pfflam
and also : the band Last Exit . . .
Weird, I was just reading about them today...never heard their stuff, but the line-up sounds interesting (Bill Laswell certainly gets around). I'll have to check them out...
Originally posted by curiousuburb
agreed.
yet your top ten list includes Wynton Marsalis "Majesty of the Blues"
Tracks 3, 4, and 5 are collectively titled "The New Orleans Function",
and include "The Death of Jazz", a Stanley Crouch Sermon titled "Premature Autopsies", and a rousing Happy Feet Blues.
20+ minutes of 'Album listening' exploration of Jazz/Culture via the Wynton/Stanley sound.
One of my favourite jazz pieces, incidentally, but they hit a threshold of STFU some days
If I had only one Jazz track for my desert island (or spaceflight), I'd have to choose
- 28 minutes of Gershwin that gives chills.
Not just genius. Pure genius.
you've got to give wynton and stanley their due, but i'm with you, they should shut up.
they only speak well of the dead, if your alive and not part of the lincoln center cognoscenti you are screwed. it seems that they are only critical of jazz musicians currently trying to break ground, if you worship the past they'll give you a pass.
their sway has diminished in the last few years and i've heard wynton is not crouch's puppet any longer, so we'll see. but just the other day downbeat ran a piece about diana krall and elvis costello's marriage and how it would effect them musically, and wynton just tore elvis a new asshole. he's seems to relish tearing people down, i wish he had any of his brother's personalities, but he doesn't.
wynton (and crouch) should have won the Pulitzer for "The New Orleans Function" instead of the dreadful "Blood on the Fields"
oh, and at my wedding the walk-out music was to "Oh, But On the Third Day."
"Majesty of the Blues" is a perfect album.
I love Marcus as well, my favorite is "Alone With Three Giants." (Monk, what can i say?) he came in my store once and autogreaphed my copy of "Deep in the Shed,"
he's not as serious as he makes out to be.
Not that I'm too surprised why. Most contemporary jazz these days is crap. Aural wallpaper at the very best. It is my contention that the advent of the compact disc killed the creativity of contemporary jazz by prompting artists to concentrate almost solely on perfecting the sound quality of the presentation, not the creativity of the music. Since that time, much of contemporary jazz has become empty and soulless. Hence, the almost unlistenable "Smooth Jazz" genre.
However, before that time, the late 70's gave rise to some great contemporary jazz performers and albums, and with the passage of time, many of these are now considered classics, and deservedly so. Here are some of my favorites:
The Pat Metheny Group The Pat Metheny Group
While most people look to their later album Offramp as their true creative breakthrough, I am very partial to their "white album," released in 1978. There is something beautiful and haunting about these tracks, and if you like your jazz more ethereal (yet with rhythm), you can't go wrong with this album. And yes, it was originally released on ECM.
Joe Sample Carmel
The second album from the Crusaders' former pianist remains the best thing he ever recorded. Wonderfully written material with a wide range of emotional feeling. And considering all songs were inspired by places in and around Monterey, California, he absolutely captured the area perfectly through his music.
Jean-Luc Ponty Cosmic Messenger
Violinist Ponty created his own contemporary jazz sub-genre, but he pretty much started repeating himself in the 1980s. This is his last album before his slow downhill slide, and it includes more rock textures than anything else he ever recorded, so if you like jazz fusion, you'll really appreciate this album. Aurora and Upon the Wings of Music are also very highly recommended.
GTSC
Originally posted by superkarate monkeydeathcar
yoh, and at my wedding the walk-out music was to "Oh, But On the Third Day."
On my wedding the dance song was Naima . . . . best song EVAR!
It was played by a band with an ex girlfriend playing sax . .
. .
as far as the Ken Burns things: I lost respect for the whole series when he allowed Branford Marsalis to call Cecil Taylor's outside-mastery 'indulgent bullshit' . . . I mean . . . talk about indulgent bullshit, he indulges in his own quicksand staid ideology of jazz, and self-important image to the point that he doesn't recognize a form of creative brilliance . . .
when it isn't some lame rehashed, NOrleans, Jazz-Poster, clean and clever mallarky he doesn't know what to do with it
Though I did see Wynton play with Elvin Jones and he played ALL Coltrane middle period stuff (which surprised me completely) and did it perfectly . . . sounding very much like a saxophone . . . and even like Coltrane's sax . . . I was impressed.
He says it was edited and slipped in to the piece as if he was commenting on his music.
I think Branford deserves the benefit of the doubt because he is rarely condescending of anyone.
He was really into Oscar Peterson and Bill Evans.
I really can't add much to what everybody else has listed here except for maybe Chick Corea or Herbie Hancock. If you can find an album with both ( they did some really great duet albums with just 2 grand pianos ) that would be something you might like. I saw them in concert once together and to this day I haven't seen anything like it since.
Both of them have done separately many kinds of jazz over the years ( electric or acoustic ) so there alot of material out there by both.
Wynton was once button-holed by former Funkadelic keyboard player (and genius) Bernie Worrell at a party. Bernie got up him against against a wall and told him not to be so regressive and generally sniffy about modern music ('indulgent bullshit' indeed.)
What's funny is that Bernie Worrell kept on calling him 'Winston'. About thirty times.
OK. Not that funny.
But there was also the time Wynton came up on stage at the end of a Miles Davis concert. He came up to Miles after the latter had just taken a solo; the conversation, according to Miles, went like this.
Wynton: They told me to come up here.
Miles: Fück off.
And Wynton did.
John Coltrane talking to miles in between songs
Coltrane: I don't know what it is man, but when I'm soloing I just don't know how to stop
Miles: Take the horn out of your mouth
a fan is driving from milwaukee to chicago in the blizzard only to get to the club to find the patrons filing out and the band packing up.
the fan doesn't really care, it was worth the drive just to see trane in the flesh
even if he is packing his horn away.
he goes up and introduces himself and explains the drive through the blizzard and says how he just wanted to meet him.....colytrane sits him down pulls out his soprano and does a twenty minute "favorite things" for an audience of one.