Rule number one. NEVER buy new. NEVER. A car is a depreciating asset. The more money you pump into it, the more you lose. Buy only what you need -- sometimes this varies according to travel time, business purposes, etc etc.
Does this apply to computers? Especially Macintosh computers?
Rule number one. NEVER buy new. NEVER. A car is a depreciating asset. The more money you pump into it, the more you lose. Buy only what you need -- sometimes this varies according to travel time, business purposes, etc etc.
Rule number two. NEVER lease. NEVER. Forget the always be in a new car mumbo jumbo, leases costs more over any given term, and even though the asset depreciates, you don't even get to own it.
Grover, and others, you're all doing very well to this point.
But I was surprised that some even had to ask about rule 3:
Rule number three. ALL car dealers are scumbag, piece of shit, good for nothing weasels that would bite off their mothers' nipples if they thought they'd get more milk for their efforts. They were born that way, some with the teeth already showing.
What to do?
Don't even finance.
Do you have 4-5K lying around?
Now look at the market. You don't want a 4 cylinder machine, forget about it. You don't want anything marketted to youthful people, you don't want an SUV, or sport cute. Just forget about them.
You want a more geriatric offering. They're big, they're comfortable, the gas mileage is surprisingly good, and sensiors rarely rack up big miles or drive in less than perfect conditions.
Your choices should be '95-'97
LeSabre
Park Avenue
Regal
The 3800 V6 is that good, the thing never breaks. Might need to get the lock converter changed on OD trannies, but that's it. I wouldn't even take the Regal unless it's in absolutely pristine low mileage condition, just because of who the drivers tend to be, like some of the pontiac products (which are ugly beyond words to boot). The body of the Park Avenue and the LeSabre is more comfortable, and the cars are better built and often very well cared for. You can find plenty of examples that are very clean at 100 000K (60 000M) for 4000-5000. Excellent comfortable anonymous motoring for peanuts. Actually the Park Avenue is quite a handsome large car once you get past the target market and anti-american bias of the less informed.
Crown Victoria, if you can get it before the cabbies do. Not as good on gas, but very reliable, and very safe.
One key item to remember. Low compression is your friend.
EPA fuel economy ratings don't reflect how you drive. Unless an engine is really small, under two liters, and city driven, the savings over a larger car often don't materialize. If you want the car for long commutes, I can tell you that the large V6's will run just about equal to a a standard 4. It'll last longer too.
If you want to go a bit higher, there's a selection of excellent Olds, Caddy and Lincoln products to choose from.
Good show! The only thing I will disagree a bit about is the gas mileage. If you don't have a lead foot, the 4's do get better gas mileage if driver appropriately.
But all the rest about not spending more than $5,000, dealers being scumbags, not financing, you are a man after my own heart in that regard.
I rented one of those once (a Park Avenue Ultra, actually), and it's a real pimpin' ride. You have to be careful, though. I was just coasting up I-55 when it occurred to me that I was steering through traffic as if I was in one of those old videogames. So I looked down at the speedometer.
95.
So that's why those oldsters fly down the highway all the time. It feels like you're going 35.
Another big recommendation for the American steel. The 3800 is a f-ing rock, and if you're going automatic, American trannies seem to still be a lot better than the rest. All in all, big GM sedans are THE BEST deals if you don't mind the style.
I've been considering getting a big, ugly car to ride around and I looked at them. The build quaility is really good. Of course, when i found out I was moving from jersey to Florida I canned that idea in favor of getting a bike. Damn near zero practicality, but really good on gas and super cheap. (I not buying a Ducati here). If I need practicality I can, um. . . take my RX-7. . . .
Beware Buicks....I wouldn't personally buy one unless whoever selling it has all the service records (so that you know if something hasn't gone wrong that might happen soon -- check websites about particular model/year problems). Generally they're great cars, though; the engines will chug for many, many miles. But just be cautious about little things that might be begin to slip up (and cost more that you would like in the end).
I have seen 3 motorcycle accidents in my life and all 3 were the biker's fault. Yesterday he tried to pop out in front of a car turning left, he was running a red light. *crunch* He takes out the guys bumper from the front left and cartwheels off the bike and into a parking lot.
He seemed to have been alright, his Beamer flew apart (gas tank spewing gasoline into the street, I had fun picking that up and putting it away from heavy traffic) but he was all-right. Had he been wearing jeans at least (instead of shorts) he may not have even had the leg scratch.
I have seen a biker collide with a lane-changing car as it was going between lanes (don't know the result, looked bad). I have also seen a biker do a header over a low bridge into a creek after underestimating the closing speed of oncoming traffic as he tried to cut against it (broken leg).
I am not saying that bikers are pricks or that they deserve to die, but they, by and large, do not obey the laws they are supposed to because they feel more quick and nimble than the big lumbering car beasts. But guess who wins that battle?
Back on topic:
Has anyone used CarFax or one of those other web services where you can enter the VIN# to check it out? Useful at all?
For your car I would recommend gettin a 99 or 00 Civic Si....that would be good enough for moi, my dream car is only a Toyota Supra. You could pick a nice for way under 20k, then just save up the rest of the money....invest it. What the Subaru WRX or whatever its called? I dunno how good those cars are.
Where's that Car Talk article about buying $2000 cars that are six years old, dump another grand into repairs, and it still ends up cheaper than any other option.
I tried searching for it, but couldn't find it anywhere.
That Park Avenue is really slick -- with that mileage, too!!! Wow! I was seriously considering replacing my Tahoe last year with a big nice Buick or Impala (provided they had most repairs done already), but the trade in value on the Tahoe is not what I had hoped. You should get really nice fuel efficiency with the V6.
My wife and I went to test drive cars at our local Toyota place today. She's pretty set on a Rav-4, and I wanted to see what the Tacoma was all about (I've developed an interest in getting a truck, since at the moment I can't even haul my leaves to the dump).
I have one thing to say about this experience:
WHAT AN ASS-BLOWING SUCKTASTIC TIME WE HAD.
First off, neither of us has ever bought a new car, or even a car from a dealer. All we wanted to do was pop down there, drive the two cars and see whether we liked them, and see what kind of money we were talking about.
So the guy wants to have us fill out some financial paperwork so that he can check our credit. We do. We're going to trade in her 12 year-old 4-Runner, and so we give them the keys so they can check it out. An hour later we're starting to get a little pissed at all of this. It becomes clear to me that the guy thinks we're going to buy the car on the spot, despite the fact that when I asked him how much they can move off the list price, he said "None."
We start to be very clear that we're ready to go. We've driven the car and like it, but if he thinks we're buying it on the spot, he's an fool. I step out to smoke and stew a little (since we've been there for FAR too long at this point and the damned tactic of guilting us into buying it since he's taken soooo much time to help us). It must've been clear that I was unhappy, because the next thing I know, the manager is out there with us (both of these salesmen are, of course, 12, and by their own admission, neither owns a new car), apologizing all over himself for taking all this damned time.
When we finally get some numbers back (how F*CKING long does this take?!?!), we get some sob story about their markup being $1200-1400 per car, with the implication being, of course, that we'll go easy on the poor kids.
Ugh. We finally asked that we GET OUR KEYS BACK and left. Not after they offered to call us in the morning.
Ugh.
Why oh WHY does buying a bloody car have to be like this?!?! Is this how it always is?!?!
Comments
Originally posted by Matsu
The car buying rules:
Rule number one. NEVER buy new. NEVER. A car is a depreciating asset. The more money you pump into it, the more you lose. Buy only what you need -- sometimes this varies according to travel time, business purposes, etc etc.
Does this apply to computers? Especially Macintosh computers?
Originally posted by Matsu
The car buying rules:
Rule number one. NEVER buy new. NEVER. A car is a depreciating asset. The more money you pump into it, the more you lose. Buy only what you need -- sometimes this varies according to travel time, business purposes, etc etc.
Rule number two. NEVER lease. NEVER. Forget the always be in a new car mumbo jumbo, leases costs more over any given term, and even though the asset depreciates, you don't even get to own it.
Grover, and others, you're all doing very well to this point.
But I was surprised that some even had to ask about rule 3:
Rule number three. ALL car dealers are scumbag, piece of shit, good for nothing weasels that would bite off their mothers' nipples if they thought they'd get more milk for their efforts. They were born that way, some with the teeth already showing.
What to do?
Don't even finance.
Do you have 4-5K lying around?
Now look at the market. You don't want a 4 cylinder machine, forget about it. You don't want anything marketted to youthful people, you don't want an SUV, or sport cute. Just forget about them.
You want a more geriatric offering. They're big, they're comfortable, the gas mileage is surprisingly good, and sensiors rarely rack up big miles or drive in less than perfect conditions.
Your choices should be '95-'97
LeSabre
Park Avenue
Regal
The 3800 V6 is that good, the thing never breaks. Might need to get the lock converter changed on OD trannies, but that's it. I wouldn't even take the Regal unless it's in absolutely pristine low mileage condition, just because of who the drivers tend to be, like some of the pontiac products (which are ugly beyond words to boot). The body of the Park Avenue and the LeSabre is more comfortable, and the cars are better built and often very well cared for. You can find plenty of examples that are very clean at 100 000K (60 000M) for 4000-5000. Excellent comfortable anonymous motoring for peanuts. Actually the Park Avenue is quite a handsome large car once you get past the target market and anti-american bias of the less informed.
Crown Victoria, if you can get it before the cabbies do. Not as good on gas, but very reliable, and very safe.
One key item to remember. Low compression is your friend.
EPA fuel economy ratings don't reflect how you drive. Unless an engine is really small, under two liters, and city driven, the savings over a larger car often don't materialize. If you want the car for long commutes, I can tell you that the large V6's will run just about equal to a a standard 4. It'll last longer too.
If you want to go a bit higher, there's a selection of excellent Olds, Caddy and Lincoln products to choose from.
Remember, big, low compression, geriatric. Equals, comfortable, safe, cheap, reliable.
Good show! The only thing I will disagree a bit about is the gas mileage. If you don't have a lead foot, the 4's do get better gas mileage if driver appropriately.
But all the rest about not spending more than $5,000, dealers being scumbags, not financing, you are a man after my own heart in that regard.
Nick
My grandfather (dad's dad) is a Buick man.
I can't believe I forgot about the "buy an old person's car" advice!
I have pictured myself driving a 1997 Buick Park Avenue and the words "Big" and "Pimping" came to mind.
Get that bitch painted burnt orange.
Bench seats? Oh no you didn't!
I like it.
95.
So that's why those oldsters fly down the highway all the time. It feels like you're going 35.
I've been considering getting a big, ugly car to ride around and I looked at them. The build quaility is really good. Of course, when i found out I was moving from jersey to Florida I canned that idea in favor of getting a bike. Damn near zero practicality, but really good on gas and super cheap. (I not buying a Ducati here). If I need practicality I can, um. . . take my RX-7. . . .
fred:
I'll probably take whatever car I get by a mechanic before I buy it.
Matsu:
What do you think this bad boy
haha, too cool.
Originally posted by groverat
I witnessed a motorcycle accident yesterday, I do not understand why people ride those. It is like they are asking for death.
They'd be fine if auto drivers would freaking learn to *LOOK*.
He seemed to have been alright, his Beamer flew apart (gas tank spewing gasoline into the street, I had fun picking that up and putting it away from heavy traffic) but he was all-right. Had he been wearing jeans at least (instead of shorts) he may not have even had the leg scratch.
I have seen a biker collide with a lane-changing car as it was going between lanes (don't know the result, looked bad). I have also seen a biker do a header over a low bridge into a creek after underestimating the closing speed of oncoming traffic as he tried to cut against it (broken leg).
I am not saying that bikers are pricks or that they deserve to die, but they, by and large, do not obey the laws they are supposed to because they feel more quick and nimble than the big lumbering car beasts. But guess who wins that battle?
Back on topic:
Has anyone used CarFax or one of those other web services where you can enter the VIN# to check it out? Useful at all?
Originally posted by groverat
I witnessed a motorcycle accident yesterday, I do not understand why people ride those. It is like they are asking for death.
fred:
I'll probably take whatever car I get by a mechanic before I buy it.
Matsu:
What do you think this bad boy
haha, too cool.
I'm not a GM expert but the mix of mileage, features and most of all price seem really good.
I think Matsu has a good price about some non-sexy American iron. You mentioned you might want a V6 and also you know it will fit your big guy size.
Nick
At that price I could probably swing buying it w/out financing.
I tried searching for it, but couldn't find it anywhere.
I have one thing to say about this experience:
WHAT AN ASS-BLOWING SUCKTASTIC TIME WE HAD.
First off, neither of us has ever bought a new car, or even a car from a dealer. All we wanted to do was pop down there, drive the two cars and see whether we liked them, and see what kind of money we were talking about.
So the guy wants to have us fill out some financial paperwork so that he can check our credit. We do. We're going to trade in her 12 year-old 4-Runner, and so we give them the keys so they can check it out. An hour later we're starting to get a little pissed at all of this. It becomes clear to me that the guy thinks we're going to buy the car on the spot, despite the fact that when I asked him how much they can move off the list price, he said "None."
We start to be very clear that we're ready to go. We've driven the car and like it, but if he thinks we're buying it on the spot, he's an fool. I step out to smoke and stew a little (since we've been there for FAR too long at this point and the damned tactic of guilting us into buying it since he's taken soooo much time to help us). It must've been clear that I was unhappy, because the next thing I know, the manager is out there with us (both of these salesmen are, of course, 12, and by their own admission, neither owns a new car), apologizing all over himself for taking all this damned time.
When we finally get some numbers back (how F*CKING long does this take?!?!), we get some sob story about their markup being $1200-1400 per car, with the implication being, of course, that we'll go easy on the poor kids.
Ugh. We finally asked that we GET OUR KEYS BACK and left. Not after they offered to call us in the morning.
Ugh.
Why oh WHY does buying a bloody car have to be like this?!?! Is this how it always is?!?!